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Yes, I’m A Liberal

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Conservatives have it easy. Every time something happens to confuse their world, they just open their maws and swallow it up, claiming it was conservative orthodoxy all the time. Even neo-cons, whatever the hell they are. "Oh yeah, we always believed that."

But liberals? Nooooooo. We get accused of the most absurd stuff by the Busherinas — Neville Chamberlin-like appeasement to the murdering scum terrorist sons of bitches in the Middle East. (How'z that for sounding like a tough liberal?) The damn conservatives have made "liberal" a dirty word, so now we're "progressive," we're Clinton "centrists," we're pragmatists. (And how did we liberals ever let those Republican word-meisters pin the liberal tail on Clinton's ass? If he's a liberal, I'm a porcupine.)

I love the attacks on the ACLU, the one organization that conservatives should be pouring money into. The ACLU has one purpose — to protect the Constitution and the Bill of Rights. But the conservatives only agree with that when it suits their purposes. Equal rights for women, blacks, gays. Shit, ain't nothing written about that in the stupid Constitution. In fact, the Constitution institutionalizes slavery. Goddamn, ma'am. You gotta stand up for what you believe even if it's based on bias, bigotry, and brain aneurysms.

So what do I mean when I say I'm a liberal?

Equality of opportunity — not equality of the spoils. Clarence Thomas and his ilk notwithstanding, people who think that blacks and Hispanics and other minorities have equal opportunities have their head up their asses. You think racism and sexism aren't alive and well in America today, join Justice Thomas for his oreos and milk. Segregation, school funding, housing, medical care, and basic necessities are so skewed against minorities that I'm amazed they put up with us white devils.

I am my brother's keeper. One of my best friends is a semi-conservative Republican who recently said to me that she's so frustrated by the whole mess this country's in that she can only worry about her family and friends. No, I say. No, and a thousand times no. Injustice done to any is injustice done to me — done to us all. I am responsible — powerless, but responsible. When one person suffers because of intolerance or neglect or bigotry, I suffer — we all suffer whether we know it or not.

Our souls, whatever they are, (and this from an agnostic) are precious and delicate things. Every child who dies from war or hunger or disease has a call on my soul, rips a part of it away forever unless I do something, I don't know what, to make up for that sin. And it rips at your soul, whether you can feel it or not.

Edmund Burke said, "The only thing necessary for the triumph [of evil] is for good men to do nothing."  More prosaic but no less powerful is Winston Churchill's statement: "There is no finer investment for any community than putting milk into babies.”

Ask not what your country can do for you, ask what you can do for your country. I am so sick of the "me" generation talk, of people desperately accumulating things as a substitute for their spiritual selves. Conservatives have somehow convinced too many Americans that taxes are bad, especially "death" taxes, even though the tax system is so skewed to favor the rich that it's embarrassing. AARP fights any move to fix Medicare, Medicaid, and Social Security even though those programs are going to bankrupt the country. I'm sorry, you old farts — and I'm not too far away from you — if your income is over $100,000 a year, kiss off Social Security; pay something for your Medicare. Help the goddamn country out of this mess. You helped create it. At the very least, you should help fix it.

But nooooooo. "I paid into Social Security and Medicare. They're my rights." Despite the fact that most people get tons more out of both than they ever put in.

We have become a nation of selfish, self-centered people concerned only with those issues that affect us directly. That is not liberalism. Liberalism says that we have a responsibility to our country, to our world, that transcends our pitiful little lives.

Love America for what it can be. Patriotism isn't constitutional amendments against flag burning — can conservatives really be that stupid, that blind, that ignorant of what makes this country great? America used to represent opportunity, freedom, liberty, justice. When the Bush Supreme Court emasculates the 4th Amendment (hey, who needs search warrants?) and his administration blows the 5th Amendment into ashes (habeus corpus), when the NSA/CIA and who else can spy on Americans, when Americans can be arrested, held in confinement, and not allowed lawyers or visits from families… when… when… when… it’s the conservatives who are demonstrating a hatred of America.

When Katherine Harris becomes Florida's Republican senatorial candidate, can anyone wonder why this country is such a disaster? "A vote for a non-Christian is a vote for sin." If I believed in the devil, I would believe that he had taken over Harris's body.

My personal life is my own business. Someone explain to me why conservatives have so distorted his concept. The Right of Privacy in general is not a constitutional guarantee, which I’ve always thought odd, but conservatives are always saying, “Get government off my back.” Of course, what we don’t hear is them muttering, “but put it on the backs of gays, blacks, Hispanics, women, and anyone else who ain’t like me.”

If you think God is somehow weakened by two gays getting married, you don’t think very much of God.

To be fair, liberals have abused this concept, too. Perhaps it’s a natural human instinct to be bossy, to try to get everyone to conform. But it ain’t my definition of liberal.

Do unto others as you would have them do unto you. Fairness, dignity, honesty, integrity, tolerance, justice, kindness. Slamming welfare moms violates all of those. Trickle down economics is an insult to every one of these values. Tolerating substandard schools, hunger in America, almost 50 million uninsured, racism, sexism, bigotry… all make a mockery of this country.

These aren’t all… but they’re enough. Yes, I’m a liberal. I’m proud of it. I believe that liberalism is the best hope for the future of America. I know that we liberals have made mistakes — some of them lulus — but you don’t condemn the theory because it’s occasionally misapplied. The divisive negativity of Bush and his ultra-conservative ilk are tearing the country apart. It’s time to see what a liberal can do. For one thing, he or she wouldn’t have abandoned Afghanistan just when we had bin Laden in our sights.

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About Mark Schannon

Retired crisis & risk manager/communications expert; extensive public relations experience in most areas over 30 years. Still available for extraordinary opportunities of mind-numbing complexity. Life-long liberal agnostic...or is that agnostic liberal.
  • steve

    I am such a conservative! When we elect a liberal president next time around; could you help compensate my diminished wages and increased taxes? Actually… I think I might quit my job…file for section 8 housing and pick up a welfare check. Let the gov’t pick up the tab! =)

  • Mark Schannon

    I’d love to see you survive on that, Steve. In fact, I wouldn’t wait. Do it now so you can see what a cushy life it is.

    In Jameson Veritas

  • Arch Conservative

    To be fair MArk…….

    everytime you hear someone whining about us being too rough at abu gharib or gitmo or spying on terrorists phone calls who’s doing the whining?


    i think not…….

    2. Yes racism still exists today but we have come along way and not every minority needs a liberal promising them an entitlement to succeeed. If we want better race relations we also don’t need liberal race baiters injecting racism into every issue of the day when they don’t get their way.

    3. Injustice done to one is done to us all? Where is the liberal compassion for the millions of babies they serve a heaping helpful of unjustice to every year when they murder them?

    4. What americans have been held in confinement and denied lawyers? I think you’re confuing american citizens with terrorists.

    5. It’s not about gay marriage weaking straight marriage. it’s about the majority of society getting to decide what it’s cultural practices and norms will be and the majority of our society does not wish gay marriage to be legal. But i guess you’d prefer that small minorities dictate to the rest of us what cultural norms ought ot be aginst our will huh?

    6. We live on planet earth…not some social utopia. And we never will. There will always be misery that people must go through. Most normal people realize this, do the best they can to help others, and try to enjoy their own lives while they last.

    You sound liek the typical liberal so I have one last phrase for you that is definitely not part of your vocabulary. So maybe if you look it up and understand it you might be a little better off here it is:


  • Dave Nalle

    Interesting. I’ve been working on a piece with the same title – but not surprisingly we don’t agree 100% on what defines us as liberals.


  • Arch Conservative

    Shark says…..

    “I’m stickin’ with the GOP’s implicit mantra: “Fuck you: I got mine.”

    Yes as ooposed to the Democrats/liberal mantra “Fuck you: what’s your is mine!”

  • Mark Schannon

    Shark, love your post. But why give in? The conservatives have fucked up every war we’ve ever fought. Who won WWI & WWII: Wilson, Roosevelt, Truman. who got us into Vietnam? Eisenhower. Who so valiently beat all those Cuban custodians in whatever Island that was–Reagan. Who lost all those Americans in Lebanon and then snuck away with his tongue up his ass? Reagan. Who went to war to save Kuwait and then chickened out when we could have easily taken out Sadam? Bush 1.

    Liberals don’t have to be pansies. Those of us who are tough ass, mother fucker, kick their ass liberals have been too quiet.

    Archie, welcome to my world. Read what I said to Shark. It’s a typical conservative ploy to paint liberals as weak and gutless. Come one, I’ll take you on with one paw tied behind my back. I’ll fight you with one eye closed. (Cowardly Lion.)

    and if you don’t know about the American citizens being held incommunicado, then you’re not reading all the same scandal sheets I am (Men in Black.)

    Most important: Personal Responsibility? No, you mean, personal acquisition. Responsibility implies an obligation to others. Read my lips (Reagan): Equal opportunity, not equal spoils; I am my brother’s keeper (Bible); ask what you can do for your country–your responsibility as a citizen, and the Golden Rule (bible?).

    No one owes anyone anything except a fair chance. That the conservatives would deny to anyone not born to wealth or lucky enough to stumble into it. Fair chance. No restrictions.

    Abortion? (You didn’t say, but it’s what you meant.) I can’t say. I’ve very troubled by the whole issue. I can see both sides and I wish to hell we could make birth control available to fetuses so there’d never again be an abortion.

    And Dave. I knew you’d say that. As I was struggling with this — because the very phrase liberal has become so distorted as has conservative — I knew I was slipping from libertarian to conservative in my opinions. But, what the hell, I was hoping you wouldn’t read this, LOL.

    In Jameson Veritas

  • Arch Conservative

    You need a little prespective Shannon. You imply that just because FDR and Truman were democrats that they are akin to todays democrats and that this somehow has a relationship to the differences between conservatives/liberals and republicans/democrats today. This is bullshit of course. If truman and FDR could see what there party has become they’d probably be pretty upset.

    Also it was LBJ not eisenhower who escalated vietnam into what it became and was responsible for thousands of american deaths. It was Nixon, a republican who got us out of the war.

    You mention regaan and the 83 bombings in lebanon but you failed to mention how that incapable fuckwit jimmy carter couldn’t get the iranians to free american hostages in 1979 and 1980. it was only when regan came onto the scene as president that they were freed. ALso Reagan stared the USSR in the eye and did not blink.

    You forgot to mention what a bangup job Clinton did in somalia too.

    I am sorry but I don’t read whatever left wing online fictiocious news sources you do about american citizens being held captive.

    Personal responsibility means accepting your own shortcomings and failures in life and not constantly blaming others. That is play number one in the liberal playbook. Blame someone else. Personal responsibility does not obligate you to ensure the welfare of others.

  • chantal

    Liberalism says that we have a responsibility to our country, to our world, that transcends our pitiful little lives.

    Amen….I applaud you Mark, for writing this….I’m with you 100%

  • Clavos


    In your litany of US presidents screwing up wars big and small, you forgot JFK authorizing and funding the training of all those luckless Cubans in Central America; after which he sent them to the Bay of Pigs, then withdrew their promised support after the operation was already underway.

  • Jet in Columbus

    The long and short of it Mark is that Bush invaded Afghanistan for only one reason. He knew the people would be behind him all the way, and figured after a few token battles, he could expand to where he really wanted to be in the first place…Iraq.

    Bush counted on us being so trusting of him (and we were) that the could pile any load of bullshit on us he wanted and we’d fall for it, and we did.

    He went to Iraq for only one reason, to appease his father’s failure to capture Saddam when he went there the first time.

  • Baronius

    “Read my lips” was Bush Senior.

    The Korean War began under a Democrat and ended under a Republican. Chester Arthur’s presidency was peaceful, and he was a Republican. That’s just as relevant as the example of Wilson.

    Do Jet and Mark really believe that the First Gulf War was a failure? That we should have gone after Saddam, and that it would have been easy? That taking out Saddam would have been moral in 1991, but less so after he continually violated UN resolutions and the conditions of the cease fire, fired on US aircraft, and tortured and killed thousands? That there would have been no danger of sectarian violence fifteen years ago, and that Iran would have respected its borders?

  • Jet in Columbus

    Nixon’s presidency was peaceful, that’s a good example too

  • Dave Nalle

    if you’re income is over $100,000 a year, kiss off Social Security; pay something for your Medicare. Help the goddamn country out of this mess. You helped create it. At the very least, you should help fix it.

    But nooooooo. “I paid into Social Security and Medicare. They’re my rights.” Despite the fact that most people get tons more out of both than they ever put in.

    You’re just wrong on this, Mark. The problem is not people greedily accepting these benefits, the problem is their existence in the form they are in from the get-go. If the systems were fair and equitable those with high incomes would not be in a position to be resentful of them and insist on getting back what they can from the system.

    Better not to have done it in the first place, but once you make the decision that government is going to be the nation’s nanny then it becomes incumbent upon government, not individuals to determine how to make the system fair.


  • Nancy

    I believe the first gulf war was a failure. If Bush 1 had finished it to begin with, instead of just doing a half-assed job from the start, we wouldn’t be where we are now … and possibly we wouldn’t be saddled with Junior in the WH, which would have prevented a lot of grief & trouble for all Americans in the present & future, considering how inept he is & all he’s done to destroy this country. All this demonstrates to me is that Dubya came by his incompetence honestly – about the only thing he ever HAS acquired honestly.

    I’m fairly on the left, but Mark, I don’t see where “slamming welfare moms” – or any other group of freeloaders – is a violation of anything except allowing people to sponge off the state who are (for the most part) perfectly capable of working; and I should know, because to my shame my own sister is one of them. IMO, if they want state support, they can certainly take state-assigned jobs a la the 1930’s public works programs (addressed in another thread, currently). There are damned few of them who for health reasons just can’t work. Nor should these same people be breeding additional kids while they’re on the dole. Again, I’m talking from personal knowledge of people who use (and IMO abuse) the system.

    Not all ‘liberals’ are wimps, Mark is absolutely right. Depending on the issue, some of us are pretty kick ass – and the first ass I’d start with is Dubya Bush. He and his coterie are NOT true conservatives. I don’t know what they are (the term “neo-nazis” comes to mind, especially pertaining to Cheney) but they sure as hell don’t hold or practice the true, traditional conservative values of smaller, less intrusive government, lower taxes (except for the rich), etc. The current GOP has gotten so far away from these values, they no longer can claim that mandate, and when they do, they lie – as ususal. That seems to be about the only thing the current GOP leadership does well these days. But they aren’t the Real Thing. They’re a fake, masquerading as the Real Thing.

  • Maurice

    “…tons more out of both than they ever put in.”

    Jesus help me. The cap is always going up but I will use todays cap in my example:

    I pay $5580 and my employer matches that amount. I work for 40 years. Total paid in is $446400. If I receive 15K per year I would have to live to 97 years of age to BREAK EVEN. I plan on dying at 77.

    Also, please quit telling me about prejudice.

  • Nancy

    Why do you plan on dying at 77? Do you figure you’re going to be senile by then, or does that just strike you as a good age to cash out? I personally hope you live in good health & prosperity to be 97 & break even.

  • Ruvy in Jerusalem


    You are not talking about liberalism, you are talking about social justice. Look at the eight degrees of tzedaká that Maimonides describes in his writings. The highest level of tzedaká is helping a fellow get a job – do that on a large enough scale, and you have wiped out poverty.

  • Mark Schannon

    Where to begin, where to begin? Archie, what a clever game you conservatives play. Democrats you like wouldn’t like the Democrats of today, ergo, the Democrats of today aren’t worthy of consideration. Unless you commune with the dead and FDR & HST have told you something…then you should share.

    Johnson had Vietnam dumped on him. Ike took over from the French–the first stupid mistake; Kennedy escalated but Kennedy was no liberal; and Johnson was trapped. And I wouldn’t bring up the Iran hostage situation–I’ve never been a conspiracist, but how remarkable the timing. The release of the hostages was probably the greatest political trick in history. Also, the USSR was on the brink of disaster long before Reagan. Giving him credit for that breakup is like giving the Pope credit for the breakup of my first marriage. (??? I don’t understand that either.)

    Clavos, the Bay of Pigs was planned by Ike & delivered to JFK who stupidly listened.

    Let’s face it…virtually every president since Washington’s been a jerk, so this argument’s going to get us nowhere.

    Dave, how dare you call me wrong!? The gov’t can’t fix the system. IF they try, the old fogeys and AARP go balistic.

    Nancy, because some abuse a system doesn’t make the system bad. Anyone who wants to try living on welfare and living where welfare moms are forced to live, be my guest.

    Government’s completely screwed up most social services over the years but the basic concepts are still legitimate.

    And Ruvy, to me liberalism and social justice are very close. Unlike those rotten conservatives who believe in social injustice, LOL.

    And Chantal & Jet, thanks.

    In Jameson Veritas

  • Ruvy in Jerusalem

    Nark, I tend to agree with European classical liberals in providing a definition, whether I like the definition or not. I suspect that our friend Mr. Nalle will write about that definition himself. No, boychick, go straight to the Holiness Code in Leviticus and to the writings of the Jewish prophets on social justice. That is the source of what you are talking about, whether you realize it or not.

    Selected from Vayikrá/Leviticus, Chapter 19

    “When you reap the harvest of your land, you shall not complete your reaping to the corner of your field, and the gleanings of your harvest you shall not take. You shall not pick the underdeveloped twigs of your vineyard; and the fallen fruit of your vineyard you shall not gather; for the poor and the proselyte shall you leave them – …..

    You shall not steal, you shall not deny falsely, and you shall not lie to one another. You shall not swear falsely by My Name…

    You ahall not cheat your fellow and you shall not rob; a workers wage shall not remain with you till morning. You shall not curse the deaf and you shall not place a stumbling block before the blind…

    You shall not commit a perversion of justice; your swhall not favor the poor and you shall not honor the great; with righteousness…

    …You shall not stand aside while your brother’s blood is shed… You shall not hate your brother in your heart…You shall not take revenge and you shall not bear a grudge against the members of you people; you shall love your brother as yourself…

    In the presence of an old person you shall rise and you shall revere a sage…

    The proselyte who dwells among you shall be like a native among you, and you shall love him like yourself, for you were aliens in the land of Egypt…

    You shall not commit a perversion in justice, in measures of length, weight, or volume. You shall correct scales, correct weights, correct dry meansures and correct liquid measures…”

    Tzédek tzédek tirdóf – justice, justice shall you pursue!

  • Arch Conservative

    And Ruvy, to me liberalism and social justice are very close. Unlike those rotten conservatives who believe in social injustice, LOL.”

    That’s not it. Liberals have the tendency so to see social injustice where there is none, but rather just individual incomptency. They also have the tendency to grossly overexaggetrate real instances of social injustice, claiming it is the norm when it is not.

    I’m not exactly sure what you mean by social injustice. To me you seem to think that unless everyone enjoys the same quality of life there is social injustice. This is just not so. We conservatives believe in helping our fellow man. We realize that society has an obligation to those who cannot help themselves ie the elderly, the hanidcapped, children…. However you liberals call us callous because we will not tolerate those able bodied individuals who are too stupid or lazy to make their own way in the world.

    One last thing. If liberals are so caring and conservatives don’t give a shit about anyone but themselves how do you explain the fact that red states, which are mostly dominated by conservatives, give far more in charitable donations each year than blue states, which are dominated mostly by liberals? This little piece of truth doesn’t quite fit into your liberals love everyone conservatives only love themselves paradigm.

  • Dave Nalle

    Dave, how dare you call me wrong!? The gov’t can’t fix the system. IF they try, the old fogeys and AARP go balistic.

    So you’re suggesting forced extermination by revolutionary brigades as a solution to the threat of the elderly?


  • zingzing

    hey archie–if you are going by the Catalogue for Philanthropy Generosity Index, that’s a skewed result, as it gets its data from tax records, which only reflects about 1% of actual giving.

    adjusted for reality, the top ten states are:
    1. Utah (red)
    2/3. Maryland/New York (tie) (blue/blue)
    4. Connecticut (blue)
    5. California (blue
    6. Hawaii (blue)
    7. New Jersey (blue)
    8. Georgia (red)
    9. South Carolina (red)
    10. North Carolina (red)

    so that means that utah (a red state) gives the most per person, but who the fuck lives in utah? now look at #’s 2-7. that’s some people. blue people. liberal people.

    the Catalogue for Philanthropy Generosity Index does accurately reflect the people that give to charity so that they can itemize it and get a tax refund (ahh, so very conservative). greedy fucks just want to look good. and the winners there are:
    1. Mississippi
    2. Arkansas
    3. Oklahoma
    4. Louisiana
    5. Alabama
    6. Tennessee
    7. South Dakota
    8. Utah
    9. South Carolina
    10. Idaho

    red the whole way down! yippee!

  • Nancy

    Zing, do you think the blues don’t take it off on their returns? Just playing devil’s advocate here. Remember, the Clintons used to deduct the value of their used underwear they gave to Goodwill (ick!).

  • Nancy

    Zing, do you think the blues don’t take it off on their returns? Just playing devil’s advocate here. Remember, the Clintons used to deduct the value of their used underwear they gave to Goodwill (ick) }:P

  • zingzing

    i’m sure they do. just obviously not in the numbers that the reds do. i don’t claim anything here except what the numbers say.

    and the numbers say: archie is a liar.

  • Arch Conservative

    i don’t know where you got your info but it’s wrong zingzing here is a link to the catalogue for philanthropy and how they ranked the states in 2004 as you can see the top states are red states and the bottom states are blue states

    you ought to stop making stuff up zingzing

  • zingzing

    now i just told you that the catalogue for philanthropy only gets their info from tax returns, and are therefore only showing about 1% of actual charitable donations.

    here’s a link for

    not making it up. you’re using useless data.

  • Arch Conservative

    Your study is what’s useless. not just catalogue for philnathropy, but all other sources show that red states give more in overalll charitable donations no matter how it is measured.

    Sorry to break it to you.

  • Mark Schannon

    Dave, I’d never suggest anything that drastic, especially considering my age…don’t throw me into that briar patch.

    Ruvy, I love the passages from Leviticus. Maybe I’m not a liberal, I’m a social justarian. The truth is that stiff-necked liberals are as annoying as stiff-necked conservatives. If you weighed the mistakes of liberals and conservatives over the years, the balance might be perfectly at zero.

    Archie, you exaggerate, and therein lies our inability to find any common ground.

    We realize that society has an obligation to those who cannot help themselves ie the elderly, the hanidcapped, children…. However you liberals call us callous because we will not tolerate those able bodied individuals who are too stupid or lazy to make their own way in the world.

    I got news for you. You fail on the first part; we fail on the second.

    Maybe Dave will solve the problem with his definition. The terms liberal and conservative have lost all meaning, yet we keep harping on them. Hell, I just wrote a whole article on it. I should delete the title and call it social justarian. We’re all so inconsistent and contradictory, I’m not sure there are any real categories any more. Except stupid.

    In Jameson Veritas

  • pleasexcusetheinterruption12

    RE Arch # 3

    3. Injustice done to one is done to us all? Where is the liberal compassion for the millions of babies they serve a heaping helpful of unjustice to every year when they murder them?

    hmm.. the term baby ussually implies, at least to me, some sort of recognizable human form, or at least a NERVOUS SYSTEM and AWARENESS of its own EXISTENCE or at the absolute least I CAN ACTUALLY FUCKING SEE IT WITHOUT A MICROSCOPE. Do you usually refer to little invisible specks floating around in your house as babies or just online?

    4. What americans have been held in confinement and denied lawyers? I think you’re confuing american citizens with terrorists.

    Several American citizens have been held in confinement and denied lawyers, appearance in court, or any trial at all. Trusting you will fullfill your obligation to be an informed citizen, I will not go through each individual case for you, as if you were a child.

    it’s about the majority of society getting to decide what it’s cultural practices and norms will be and the majority of our society does not wish gay marriage to be legal.

    funny thing, I always thought putting a napkin on your lap was the cultural norm, but I can’t seem to find that particular law written in the constitution, or any book of law, can you point me to the right passage? All I can find is this right to privacy and all this other nonsense…

  • Jet in Columbus

    Bravo #30 Mark… Injured Viscosity

  • Arch Conservative


    At week 10 of a pregnancy limbs have begun to develop and the nervous system is already formed and functional.

    Is that what you refer to as i visible specks? or are you going to tell me that all abortions are done before the tenth week.

    Whatever you need to tell yourself to assuage your subconcious guilt at advocating infanticide is fine by me please.

  • pleasexcusetheinterruption12

    A large majority of abortions are performed before the 10th week, yes. There certainly are not millions performed after the 10th week as you plainly state in the above quote. Saying so is either a gross misuse of the term baby OR a flat out lie about how many abortions are performed after the 10th week.

  • zingzing

    you just don’t want to believe it archibald. liberals, all things considered, give more of what they have to charity.

  • JustOneMan

    Zing…please a typical liberal believes that giving the Spanish guy at StarBucks a 25 cent tip for their $3 latte is doing charitable work…

  • zingzing

    better than spitting in his face and telling him to go back to mexico…

    but yer funny.

  • Arch Conservative

    Who spits? i throw the hot coffee in his face and make sure to get it in his eyes.

  • Jet in Columbus

    Spoken like the next head of Bush’s diplomatic corps Arch. We haven’t missed you at all.

  • Arch Conservative

    Don’t like it Jet?

    Too fucking bad.

    I wasn’t put on this earth to please you or all the other pretentious, big city, latte drinking, liberal moonbats!

  • Jet in Columbus

    Foam at the mouth all you like Arch, you hetrosexuals are all alike.

  • Clavos

    H..e…t…e…r…o…s…e…x…u…a…l…s, please, Jet.

    If you’re going to take our sexual orientation in vain, common courtesy dictates you at least spell it right :>)

    You don’t see us writing humosexuals (pun intended), do you?

  • Jet in Columbus

    Oh THAT’S why the call it a Hummer!!!

  • Clavos

    I’ve always wondered about that guy down the street with two of ’em…

  • Nancy

    Clavos, rotflmao!

  • zingzing

    we’re “big city, latte drinking, liberal moonbats!”

    awright! “big city…” <–how fuckin cute is that? hey bingbat! i like soy lattes! they’re better for you! and creamy! you just try to make a soy cappuccino, though! that’s tough! shit won’t stay foamy. it’s silly, really. “big city…” alright, you backwards, buttfuck new england, bud swilling, conservative moron, we’ll take ours over yours any day of the week.

  • Jet in Columbus

    In spades Zing-Bravo

  • Mark Schannon

    O.k., archie, I’m getting tired of this. First, latte is the most stupid drink ever invented. The french call it cafe au lait, which simply warm the milk before you put it in the coffee. Real liberals comme moi drink espresso & an occassional cappucino. So let’s get that part right, o.k. Only Republican Venus Birds drink lattes.

    And what the hell is a moonbat and should I be insulted or proud?

    Let’s face it guys, we can’t talk about any of this because our labels have fallen off or gotten all grungy. We’re just throwing around tired, old cliches.

    hell, Ruvy, I, Jet, Gonzo, and others do a better job talking about religion.


    In Jameson Veritas

  • Nancy

    I think he’s thinking of Archie Bunker’s “dingbat”, but he screwed it up or invented his own riff on it.

  • Just Livin

    Wow, you guys let that devolve in a hurry didn’t you? But isn’t that what it’s all about today? Conservatives soak the poor and liberals are baby killers, heh? Come on guys get your shit together.I used to be an American but now unfortunately I have been labeled a liberal while most people think I am a conservative. All these silly labels need to be put aside and the debate needs to be more productive and less personal.

    It’s time to start telling the truth. Some of you whipper snappers probably don’t even remember what the truth is like. Before the laser fast spin of today, things were a little more civil. Unfortunately you have grown up in a society that thinks being able to shout down the other guy makes you a winner. Sorry to tell that’s not true.

    We are embroiled in a struggle for the survival of our democracy. Those on the conservative side will tell you that we must defeat all of the enemies of freedom, stop killing babies, put gays in their place (whatever that means)and give all of the tax breaks possible; primarily to the very rich in order to put this country right with God.

    Liberals will tell you that conservatism is actually a plutocracy. Big business and special interests are running this country and be damned with the little people. If conservatives are really concerned about unborns what about those that are born. How many conservatives do you suppose adopt poor white or poor black or latino children every week?

    Even with abortion there are thousands of unwanted children born every week to parents who are drug addicts, low lifes, underage, etc. Hell you pick the circumstance. But there aren’t any demonstrations outside the human services offices asking for the right to raise those unwanted children. In fact, children in this country are abused to death every day. What’s worse, taking a RU486 pill or killing a 2 year old?

    While we are sidelined by multiple topics designed to take our attention off the things that really need action we fall further from a goal of bringing all of society to better place. Conservative “Christians” hate gays, tell the poor to get jobs (minimum wage anyone?)talk tough on how everyone else on the planet should bow to our will. Liberals think that government is the answer to everything. We should just start a new government entity for that and solve the world’s problems. It doesn’t work. No, our success depends on public/private partnership. We need to reach out people in need and be a little more Christian. We need sweep up around our backdoor before we go telling everyone else how to be a democracy.

    Take a deep breath boys and see if you can find some common ground. The next terrorist attack in this country will happen to all of us. The next natural disaster will be all of our problems. We need to get a handle on how to solve the problems that are staring us in the face before we worry about the other ones.

    Remember, abortion happened before Roe v. Wade and it will continue to happen even if it is outlawed. Just in dark unclean places. The rich get richer, but we need to make sure they pay their fair share as should we all. We had enemies before Al Queda and we will have them long after the generation that does not have anyone who remembers 9/11. How do we create our best and most free country now? Do you really want the majority to rule? Me too! Let’s abolish the electoral college! If people want to get married let’em. YOU DO NOT HAVE TO ANSWER TO GOD FOR THEIR SINS! They do and if they are good with that, get over yourself. Give comfort to the poor, take care of the prisoners and feed the hungry and meek. Now who else said something like that, oh yeah, Jesus! Imagine that a liberal who believes in God! Miracles never cease.

  • Ruvy in Jerusalem

    Just Livin;

    I’d rise before you out of respect, but that kind of thing is hard to do on the internet. Mark Schannon, my fellow Jew, wrote an aricle that he thought was about “liberalism.” It wasn’t. He wrote about social justice. I provided the basic concepts that inspired his article, because his sense of social justice is very similar to mine and comes from the same roots – the Book of VaYikrá, what you know as Leviticus. Go check comment #20 where I accidentally typed in Nark, instead of Mark.

    So just keep on livin’ and spreading your understanding and wisdom.

    “In the presence of an old person you shall rise and you shall revere a sage…” VaYikrá/Leviticus, Chapter 19

    Sabbath peace to you from the Hill of Frankincense (Ma’aléh Levoná) in the mountains north of Jerusalem, the Eternal Capital of the Jewish People

  • pleasexcusetheinterruption12

    God probably doesnt even exist so what’s the point of talking about him/her.

  • Mark Schannon

    Ruvy, I’ve already admitted that the labels are meaningless. Conservatives act like liberals snooping into everyone’s business and liberals respond by demanding budget cuts and kicking people off welfare.

    I’ll be a social justinian. I like the ring of that.

    And PETI, I’m a hard-core agnostic, but some of my most cherished moments here have been discussing God with Ruvy and others. Whether there is or isn’t a God, there is great wisdom in the words and ideals attributed to Him/Her/It.

    And now…

    In Jameson Veritas

  • Ruvy in Jerusalem

    Mark, I wasn’t sure tha out friend “Just Livin'” had seen that back and forth. I wasn’t trying to repeat things unnecessarily.

    Just so you know; Justinian was the name of a Roman emperor. Personally, “justician” sounds better to me – or “believer in social justice”.

    Shabbat Shalom,

  • pleasexcusetheinterruption12

    There’s also some pretty shitty “wisdom” associated with him/her/it. Selective choosing of which wisdom to follow ultimately means the wisdom is not so much associated with him/her/it but rather, us. Morality created religion, not the other way around.

  • Dave Nalle

    i like soy lattes! they’re better for you! and creamy!

    And they make you grow breasts!

    Which every soyswilling moonbat needs…


  • Clavos

    Morality created religion, not the other way around.

    Mankind created religion and god out of fear of the unknown.

  • Matthew T. Sussman

    Mark Schannon is not your most devout follower of God, but you gotta hand it to him, he has a firm believe in his ceiling.

  • Dave Nalle

    Conservatives soak the poor and liberals are baby killers

    No, Conservatives kill adults and liberals (sic) exploit the poor.

    Or if you prefer, Conservatives give the poor a hand-up and liberals (sig) kill cell clusters so that society can have fewer poor, abandonned and neglected children.


  • pleasexcusetheinterruption12

    Mankind created religion and god out of fear of the unknown.

    Isn’t that exactly what I said? Morality (made by mankind) made religion…mankind made religion. Our statements are not mutually exclusive. We say the same thing except yours contains more information, namely that the motivation to create religion from morality was fear of the unkown.

  • Nancy

    Exactly how do conservatives give the poor a hand up? Conservative are the ones that oppose most if not all social programs or aid programs. In addition, while they refuse to allow women the choice to breed or not, ironically by doing so, they keep ensuring that the number of poor children dependent on said welfare programs that are such anathema to them (conservatives) continues to increase. If they don’t want to increase the numbers of the poor, why don’t they encourage & allow birth control & abortion? Their mental divide on this is illogical and senseless, as well as cruel.

  • Mark Schannon

    Suss, very few got your reference to the ceiling, but I just about choked on my coffee. It’s true, my ceiling and I have a special, spiritual kind of thing going on.

    Dave N: You’re growing very weird as well as breasts. You’re scaring me. Cut it out.

    And it’s “conservatives kill everyone (what you think conservativs don’t get abortions) and liberals fuck everyone over trying to help.”

    Ruvy, I knew Justinian was a Roman emperor…but it sounded good. I suppose I’ll settle for Justician. Although I’m still confused about what’s a liberal, conservative, libertarian then.

    Oh well,

    In Decaf Veritas

  • Spurwing Plover

    You liberals dont fool ol SPURWING PLOVER im a craft ol shorebird and i have a attatude and im very defiant as well BACK OFF GREENPEACE