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Will a Better Warhead Help Our Troops at Walter Reed or Get Hillary & Barack off the Bridge?

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Dateline: Yokohama, March 2, 2006

Where've you been, many have asked your intrepid reporter. Well, I've been working on the railroad, all the live long day. And a quick stop in Yokohama to see how my friends, John and Betty Abernathy are doing teaching Dutch to Japanese who think they're learning English. Oy, are the Japanese in for a surprise when they come to the U.S. But the news awaits… as it always does.

They're our troops? They deserve the best we can scrounge up. The bodies are continuing to fall in the latest Bush scandal regarding the treatment of veterans at Walter Reed Medical Hospital. Army Secretary Francis J. Harvey abruptly stepped down just hours ago, but, in truth, it wasn't so much stepping as getting thrown down the stairs. But, not to worry, Bush is setting up a bipartisan commission to look into the treatment of war vets. The fact that complaints have been made by fairly senior D.C. know-it-alls for the past three years hasn't been addressed yet.

Big deal. Here you've got a scandal the size of Missouri, and they fire a secretary. Typical. They need to go after generals, and morons such as Lt. Gen. Kevin Kiley, who took command when the scandal broke — this is the same putz who had earlier appeared to play down the problems at Walter Reed, where he was in command until 2004. Can this administration do nothing right? (Serious question. No rhetoric by your venerable reporter.)

We got us a new warhead design for the big ones. Today, the Bush administration dropped another bomb, announcing they'd selected a design Friday for a new generation of atomic warheads. This is important because we haven't had any new designs since the end of the Cold War nearly two decades ago. In trying to convince Congress that this is a good thing, one of the assurances given by defense officials was that the new warhead will not have to undergo actual testing.

Okay, your enterprising reporter admits the need of some assistance here. Congress says, "Hey, what's so good about these new warheads that the old warheads didn't have? And how do we know it?"  Answer from Department of Defense (Motto: I Wracked Iraq) was, "Hey these are so good, we don't even have to test them. We're letting a computer do that for us with math and code and cool stuff like that."

Are they out of their fucking minds, your intrepid reporter asks with deep respect for the military's intelligence? We're going to replace all those aging nukes that we know could blow a hole in the earth as big as Jupiter with new bombs that haven't been tested. Call me crazy, but my sense of national security just dropped to the cellar. Where do they find these people? And why do we allow them to run our government?

Is nothing sacred any more? Nope. Presidential hopefuls Hillary (I Do Not Bake Cookies) Clinton and Barack Obama are hard at work in Selma trying to figure out how to out-Black the other one in the 40-year celebration of the famous march that eventually led to the passage of the voting rights act. But when it looked like Obama was climbing in the polls, Hillary pulled out the big gun — Billary, who's going to be joining her. Why are they doing this? Simple.

"This is an opportunity for her to show her respect for what was accomplished in Selma and the civil rights movement," said Mo Elleithee, spokesman for the Clinton campaign. 

Jen Psaki, spokeswoman for the Obama campaign, said the senator — who was three years old when the historic march took place — wanted to make a "personal trip" to the famed civil rights site. "His hope is that this is not something that is overly politicized."

Obi Wan Obama, put a lid on your spokespeople. You don't want to overly politicize the event? Don't go. Send a postcard. "Hey, have a great parade, thinking of you, Obi Wan." Can you see Martin Luther King, Gandhi, Mother Teresa, and the other saints looking down and bursting out laughing, rolling around in the clouds with hysteria? I can. 

What a great time to be an American. Or a Canadian. Or French or Dutch. But not a Lithuanian. This is so much fun. Who'll get us first? Marauding icebergs, fanatical inmates at Walter Reed, Billary and Hillary, or these new bombs that don't need testing?

Come on, one and all, even you Germans who still hate us. Stand up, put your left hand… no, your right hand… I forget… well, put something over your heart and sing along with your intrepid reporter that great American anthem from Country Joe and the Fish:

Well it's one, two, three, what're we fightin' for?
Don't ask me I don't give a damn,
Next stop is Vietnam.
And it's five, six, seven, open up the Pearly gates.
Well there ain't no time to wonder why,
Whoopie, we're all gonna die.

To which I can only add — In Jameson Veritas.

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About Mark Schannon

Retired crisis & risk manager/communications expert; extensive public relations experience in most areas over 30 years. Still available for extraordinary opportunities of mind-numbing complexity. Life-long liberal agnostic...or is that agnostic liberal.
  • http://www.roblogpolitics.blogspot.com RJ Elliott

    “In trying to convince Congress that this is a good thing, one of the assurances given by defense officials was that the new warhead will not have to undergo actual testing.”

    Actually, that’s complete and utter bulls**t.

    These “new” warheads had already been tested in the 1980s, so no NEW tests are required. That’s why they were chosen over the competing design, which was the actual untested one, and therefore would have necessitated real-world underground nuclear tests before being approved. And since you liberals/leftists/moonbats would have strenuously objected to that, the current administration decided to choose the warheads that had already been tested.

    Has there ever been a single “Mark My Words” post that was actually based on reality and didn’t offer bogus “facts” ???

  • http://www.roblogpolitics.blogspot.com RJ Elliott

    From your own link:

    The military and the Energy Department selected a design developed by the Lawrence Livermore National Laboratory in California over a competing design by the Los Alamos National Laboratory in New Mexico.

    D’Agostino said that both the Los Alamos and Lawrence Livermore designs were contingent on not requiring nuclear testing. If tests were required in a design, “We were not going to go forward,” he said.

    The two facilities submitted separate designs nearly a year ago. Lawrence Livermore’s design is based on a warhead actually tested in an underground detonation in the 1980s. Los Alamos had a design based on a fresh approach that has not undergone testing.

    One of the assurances given by defense officials to Congress is that the new warhead will not have to undergo actual testing.

    Of overriding concern to members of Congress has been that the warhead be developed without the need for underground tests. The administration has sought to assure Congress that the design would not require such testing.

  • http://www.roblogpolitics.blogspot.com RJ Elliott

    I eagerly await your witty retort/personal attack…

  • troll

    ‘what are we waiting for’…

    watch the revisionism – that’s like adding ‘under god’ to the Pledge

    the (improperly so-called and failed) anti-war anthem

  • http://www.diablog.us Dave Nalle

    I imagine we could find someplace to test a new warhead.

  • http://blogcritics.org/writer.php?name=gonzo%20marx jaz

    just a thought for RJ….you will note in the quoted part you put up where it says “based on”…this means modifications and/or changes have been made to the design, changing technical parameters in some what/shape/form

    this IS “rocket science” you realize?

    one would think that something that is supposed to defend us, and has such a high potential for destruction should be tested before usage?

    not too mention, as has been pointed out…we already HAVE more warheads than are needed to blow up the entire world, many times over

    why the fuck should we need more? and what to do with the old ones?

    it’s not like they go bad, or spoil or something, maintenance on the delivery systems…checking and possibly upgrading components…sure…but new ones?

    even better, as you yourself point out, the basic design is 27years old…so how are these supposed to be “new”?

    i smell bullshit, who is getting paid for these new warheads if implemented?

    oh yeah…fun Article, Mark…good to see you writing.

  • troll

    since we cannot use them as more than a threat – virtually that is – why test them other than virtually

    if we encourage this enlightened devolution perhaps we can turn war into an arcade game

  • http://adreamersholiday.blogspot.com Lee Richards

    Our government has become show business, a production of smoke and mirrors, illusions and special effects, bread and circuses. As Tevye said, “When you’re rich, they think you really know…”

  • http://www.diablog.us Dave Nalle

    Jaz, I believe the plan is to replace old warheads with new ones so that we don’t end up like the Russians with a bunch of missiles which are unreliable and potentially unsafe. Our total warhead count will likely stay the same overall. Hell, it might even go down.

    Dave

  • http://blogcritics.org/writer.php?name=gonzo%20marx jaz

    Communique to Mark:
    from the Weird Affairs Desk;

    One pertinent Story that appears to have been drowned out this week is the whole bit about Federal Prosecutors getting fired. At least 7 got the axe from the WH, which is unusual only in that there had been only 3 fired in the years previous.

    Some are saying that there are political shenanigans involved, but it’s still far too early to tell, though there are investigations scheduled to begin with Congressional hearing on Thursday.

    First link – rumblings and undertow.

    Second link – turns out we were misinformed, the WH did know about it all.

    “lawyers, guns and money”.

  • http://blogcritics.org/writer.php?name=gonzo%20marx jaz

    Nalle in #9 – i understand your point…but this is a tech issue, and the Russians have the problem from not failing to up date their tech, but failure to maintain the readiness of what they have

    bit of a difference, don’t you agree?

    the systems we have in place are perfectly functional, and were designed and built in an era of quality first, and “i tell you three times” for failsafes

    a tiny fraction of what is being proposed on spending for these 27 year old “new” designs being spent on maintenance and evaluation of the multiple systems already in place appears to be a much saner and more cost efficient use of taxpayer funds…especially considering the amount of warheads, and the fact that there are more than enough already to destroy the entire world over multiple times

    i merely fail to understand why “new” ones are required…and why so much should be spent on them, rather than maintaining what we have at a much cheaper cost

    hence my asking “who gets paid”…since that appears to be the only rational explanation for such outlays of tax dollars under the circumstances due to reason i’ve cited

  • http://www.diablog.us Dave Nalle

    Jaz, American Workers get paid, that’s who.

    Is that a problem?

    Dave

  • http://blogcritics.org/writer.php?name=gonzo%20marx jaz

    Not in principle, of course.

    But so do the folks who would perform the maintenance.

    And this is about waste of tax dollars, compare and contrast the costs.

    My concern about who gets paid is to check that it’s not some kind of back room pork deal,which is how it appears…as opposed to proper funding of military specialists whose job it is to test and maintain our nuclear arsenal.

    Also, i would like to be certain that it would indeed be American workers who benefit, and not something outsourced to places like China, in the same way much of our fighter plane/bombers are.

  • http://parodieslost.typepad.com Mark Schannon

    Sorry to be late to my own party.

    O.k. RJ, you asked for it. You doodoo head. (What the hell is a “moonbat?”) Typical pseudo intellectual, using facts to destroy a perfectly good argument. I’m reporting you to someone.

    O.k., so I didn’t read enough of the source article. It was late, and I was pleased to be able to write at all. I fucked up, o.k., so sue me. It’s not my fault.

    Although Jaz (how many names to do you need?) came to my rescue, it does leave the question open, “how different” from the tested version, and when did Richard Nixon know about it?

    Has there ever been a single “Mark My Words” post that was actually based on reality and didn’t offer bogus “facts” ???

    Of course. Jeeze, one mistake, and you’re a forger for life. It’d be a helluva lot simpler to make up the facts, as you see from my momentary lapse in the first article. Booger head. (You know, some of us confused liberals take offense at being called liberals…)

    Troll, I didn’t understand your post, although thanks for putting the song up. I can do pictures, but still learning anything else.

    Jaz, I just read about those prosecutors this morning, but I couldn’t figure out why they were fired…either the Post was particularly lame or my brain was still on rem-less sleep.

    Keep those canards and canaries coming, folks.

    In Jameson Veritas

  • duane

    Glenn Mara, principal associate director for weapons programs at Los Alamos, says,

    Revamping the nation’s warheads will nurture a new generation of nuclear scientists and engineers.

    This is a key aspect of the work. It’s a concept that’s been around for awhile, and is known as ‘maintenance of capability.’ I’ll let you guys argue about whether or not the training of young physicists, chemists, and engineers to design and tend to nukes is worth the money, and whether or not it’s politically wise at this time.

  • http://blogcritics.org/writer.php?name=gonzo%20marx jaz

    duane raises a very good Point, as usual…

    here’s the thing, i’d have to be shown this benefits those up and coming engineers and scientists rather than the staff of whomever is going to get the contract alone

    to me, far better to take the difference between maintenance cost, and this proposed “development” of a 27 year old design and spend it by giving scholarships to students willing to enter the field, and grants to Universities for such students to develop them further

    i’ll leave the comparison of the cost analysis up to those more qualified

    oh yeah..Mark…about the “names”…
    {8^P~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

  • MCH

    Re comment #1;

    “And since you liberals/leftists/moonbats would have strenuously objected to that, the current administration decided to choose the warheads that had already been tested.”

    Yes, by all means…those liberals/leftists/moonbats are far worse than those conservative/rightists/chickenhawks.

  • MCH

    “Has there ever been a single “Mark My Words” post that was actually based on reality and didn’t offer bogus “facts” ???”

    This from the same weasel who called Max Cleland a “gigantic thalidamide baby.”

  • http://parodieslost.typepad.com Mark Schannon

    Now, now, no personal attacks, with all due respect to weasels. Did RJ really say that? My dear fellow, talk about tasteless humor. Yuk.

    Duane, ah, the voice of reason. Does this training include messing with warheads that worked fine in the 80s, but have been used for pillows in the white house since then? I mean, if they do tinker with, then RJ’s wrong, I am accidentally right, and Jaz is, as always right.

    And what the hell is {8^P~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Is that a clue? Or did your fingers slip on the keyboard.

    In Jameson Veritas

  • http://blogcritics.org/writer.php?name=gonzo%20marx jaz

    Mark, ye silly heathen philistine…

    it’s the ASCII version of a bronx cheer, the raspberry…you know….

    /sigh

    the Tao of D’oh.

  • http://parodieslost.typepad.com Mark Schannon

    Is that supposed to be an insult–of course I’m a silly heathen philistine…that’s part of my charm. And, dear sir, how the hell am I supposed to know ASCI signs for anything. Next time turn around and fart at your screen, LOL.

    Ta.

    In Jamesons Veritas

  • Lumpy

    Even the Post article which is desperately rummaging for a conspiracy uiltimately comes down to the fact that these prosecutors weren’t doing their jobs. As defined by the DoJ which employs them. The fact that the WH signed off on the firings just sounds like normal responsible oversight.

  • http://blogcritics.org/writer.php?name=gonzo%20marx jaz

    incorrect Lumpy, as my links show

    one of the prosecutors in question just had his review…stellar points and high praise, a few months later…fired

    now…the Admin is well within it’s rights to fire these folks…they serve at the pleasure of…blah blah blah..also to note, most are Republicans, also to note that many have ongoing corruption/scandal investigations going on

    you might want to take a moment, read the articles i linked, and take it from there…not trying to say that there is definitely something fishy going on…too early to tell that

    but the full circumstances and some of the concerns are laid out in the articles

    like the simple fact that these firings will be replaced by the WH with whomever they want, and due to a provision in the Patriot Act…they don’t require Congressional approval (as these appointments have always required up until the Patriot Act) for quite awhile after they have been made

    the Congressional committee tasked with oversight in these matters are concerned about possible obstruction of Justice issues, as well as conflict of interest on top of possible chicanery

    sounds to me like that is oversight

  • MCH

    “Now, now, no personal attacks, with all due respect to weasels. Did RJ really say that? My dear fellow, talk about tasteless humor. Yuk.”

    1) True, moonbats are far worse than weasels; and 2) yep.

  • MCH

    “Jaz, I believe the plan is to replace old warheads with new ones so that we don’t end up like the Russians with a bunch of missiles which are unreliable and potentially unsafe. Our total warhead count will likely stay the same overall. Hell, it might even go down.”
    – Dave Nalle

    I’ve seen figures similar to the ones Vox Populi quotes.

  • http://parodieslost.typepad.com Mark Schannon

    Whoa, MCH–Not on this thread! No mentions of Vox etc. or I’ll, I’ll…oh yeah, I’m an editor, I’ll edit the damn comments out and free speech be damned. We were having a nice time making fun of each other in perfectly acceptable ways.

    It’s my article & I’ll party like I want to.

    Don’t like that rule…bye.

    And still no one has explained what a moonbat is.

    In Jameson Veritas

  • Aku

    As t the testing issue. From what I understand, they have enough data from tests to do computer testing of bombs (the open testing of nukes is banned by treaty I think), so it is not a actual test, it is a virtual one. I am working out of the depths of memory here, so I could be wrong.

  • http://blogcritics.org/writer.php?name=gonzo%20marx jaz

    you remember correctly…

    the problem is in reliance on virtual tests alone

    those tests are only as good and accurate as the programming involved, and do you really want to trust the capabilities of a thermonuclear device in the hands of some outsourced programmers contracted out by the lowest bidder to the government?

    sounds like a bad idea right there, doesn’t it?

    the Question goes far beyond that, and into asking why the sudden need to resurrect a 27 year old design(not something new, or even better for those with duane’s earlier expressed concern…something …:::gasp:::new!) at this time….hence my earlier question of who would get paid if this plan is put into effect

  • http://blogcritics.org/writer.php?name=gonzo%20marx jaz

    you asked, Mark…and we all know i live ta serve…

    Moonbat definition

    ain’t ya felt like this sometimes?

  • Les Slater

    Not a hint of any substance in this whole thread!

    So, there’s a problem at Walter Reed. Has anyone lately had any indications that anyone in the government, or those hovering around that pile of shit, have any concern for anyone? From wounded soldiers, to ex New Orleans residents, to those who work for a living in this country or anywhere else in the world? Come on, get real, and it did not start with Bush either.

    On the missiles, Mark is a liberal, right? No one has substantively disagreed with him. All assume the missiles are necessary. The only bone of contention is ‘new’, or ‘old’, and the technical and infrastructure issues that go along with each option.

    It’s like the so-called anti-war Democrats, a total fraud. There’s a howl about the 21,000-troop increase. Kerry suggested 40 in his campaign. The Senate UNANOMOUSLY confirmed Gen. Petraeus. In confirmation hearings he clearly indicated he was for the troop increase. He was explicit and said that if the Senate confirmed him it would be endorsing his positions. And they did. Not one dissent!

    These missiles and other hardware are not for defending anyone. They are part of an escalation that increasingly threatens to use them, even as first strike.

    Mark gets bent all out of shape about what the U.S. government has become. But it has not become so recently. It’s been over a hundred years. It just becomes more obvious sometimes. The patriotic stance that Mark puts forward and defends is misplaced.

    We have to disarm these fiends and put them in a tropical cage with manicured golf course and other amenities they’re accustomed to. But take away all their power.

  • http://blogcritics.org/writer.php?name=gonzo%20marx jaz

    and here i was opting for feet first into a woodchipper broadcast on pay per view…

    acoustics

  • http://www.gwbush.blogspot.com RJ

    just a thought for RJ….you will note in the quoted part you put up where it says “based on”…this means modifications and/or changes have been made to the design, changing technical parameters in some what/shape/form

    this IS “rocket science” you realize?

    Actually, it’s not. It’s nuclear physics. They aren’t talking about testing “rockets” are they? No, they’re talking about testing NUCLEAR WARHEADS. Somewhat different, don’t you think?

    one would think that something that is supposed to defend us, and has such a high potential for destruction should be tested before usage?

    Funny thing about physics: what worked 20 years ago is about 99.999999% certain to work today, or 20 years from now. Physics has these things called “laws” that tend not to change, unless you’re within spitting distance of a black hole or moving at near the speed of light.

    And when they talk about testing, they don’t mean the individual missile warhead. (If that was the case, then I suppose our entire nuclear arsenal is “untested” since the only way to “test” an individual warhead is to detonate it.) Instead, they talk about testing the design of the warhead, to make sure that a nuclear chain reaction (explosion) will occur.

    not too mention, as has been pointed out…we already HAVE more warheads than are needed to blow up the entire world, many times over

    why the fuck should we need more? and what to do with the old ones?

    Did you even read the article? These new warheads are going to replace the old ones, due to the high costs of maintaining warheads that are decades old.

    it’s not like they go bad, or spoil or something, maintenance on the delivery systems…checking and possibly upgrading components…sure…but new ones?

    You’re think you’re a regular Enrico Fermi, don’t ya?

    even better, as you yourself point out, the basic design is 27years old…so how are these supposed to be “new”?

    Well, it’s certainly newer than the current design, or any other design that we’ve been allowed to test.

    i smell bullshit, who is getting paid for these new warheads if implemented?

    Uh…the taxpayer? Who did you think? The Warhead Fairy?

  • http://www.gwbush.blogspot.com RJ

    Oops. I misread “who is getting paid for these new warheads if implemented?” as “who is gonna pay for these warheads if implemented?” … mea culpa …

  • http://blogcritics.org/writer.php?name=gonzo%20marx jaz

    oh RJ…someday you might pass reading comprehension, until then…i’ll just hold your hand a little bit until the training wheels come off…

    this IS “rocket science” you realize?

    Actually, it’s not. It’s nuclear physics. –

    did you notice the quotation marks?…meant to convey a certain amount of sarcasm, equating the difficulties and complexities of rocket science to those of the involved nuclear physics… both pretty advanced stuff, and not the kind of thing that can be adequately modelled easily or completely…in both cases (rockets and nukes) you can never be sure until you actually go ahead and do it…even then it’s not always certain…

    perhaps it’s escaped you that rocket science has been around since the first Chinese set off a bottle rocket, but we still have problems with the shuttle

    one more to show just how silly your entire comment is…

    who is getting paid for these new warheads if implemented?

    Uh…the taxpayer? Who did you think? The Warhead Fairy? –

    IS getting paid, not who is doing the paying

    figure out the difference yet?

    breathe…try reading it, even if your lips keep moving, it’s ok…we won’t tell…exhale

    then type

    something for RJ.

  • http://www.gwbush.blogspot.com RJ

    “MCH” is the master of the non sequitur.

  • http://www.gwbush.blogspot.com RJ

    Still having difficulty mastering the shift key, are we “jaz”/”gonzo marx” ???

  • http://blogcritics.org/writer.php?name=gonzo%20marx jaz

    nah..i use it as i like..

    and ya missed it on another thread, “jaz” are my initials…fair enough?

    nyah nyah…

    a typical BC “discussion”.

  • duane

    jaz says: “to me, far better to take the difference between maintenance cost, and this proposed “development” of a 27 year old design and spend it by giving scholarships to students willing to enter the field, and grants to Universities for such students to develop them further.”

    Students are rarely ‘willing’ to enter the field of nuke design. Such a vulgar use of their talents, and a real conversation killer at cocktail parties. Moreover, they are not able to enter the field at that stage of their training, since universities have little to do with the actual nuts and bolts of weapons physics, for reasons that I trust are obvious.

    By the way, in case I wasn’t clear, ‘maintenance of capability’ doesn’t refer to the hardware. It refers to the maintenance of a workforce with the knowledge to design and ‘test.’ Unless the U.S. is set for a total nuclear disarmament a couple of decades down the road, young blood is required. Old men and women retire with secrets locked up in their heads.

    Dumping money into this program is a bit a a ‘public works project.’ There has to be something for designers to work on, and there has to be money to pay their salaries (the sum of which is chicken feed compared to the conventional military budget), or they will go work on rocket science or enter the private sector. Some would be happy to have that happen. Some are scared shitless by that prospect.

  • http://blogcritics.org/writer.php?name=gonzo%20marx jaz

    duane…fully understood, i failed to add the final bit to my thoughts previously

    you have that “newblood”..every year, year after year..ever since Admiral Zumwalt created the “nuclear navy”.

    Air Force and Navy personnel deal with it, take courses at their Academies , run reactors with a flawless record (navy), handle learn about , maintain and upkeep our entire arsenal (air force & navy).

    what i was trying to do was help create more scientists in the civilian sector…but due to us talking about weapons here…the military are the ones who have been, and continue to provide those “next generations”

    for new work in the theoretical end…well, that was my suggestion…

    hope that helps…. hmMMmmm…ah yes…

    for duane… something different from some guys i used to know.

  • http://theglenblog.blogspot.com Glen Boyd

    This article has just been submitted for BC News promotions to Digg, Netscape, and Reddit.

    Now go vote!

  • duane

    jaz, how is it that you knew Fishbone? I know you’re a bass player. Were you a pro?

  • http://blogcritics.org/writer.php?name=gonzo%20marx jaz

    was semi-pro at best, but it was the area i played in and around

    my drummer spent a lot of time at Rutgers (eventually gaining a PhD in psychiatry, residency at Mt Sinai during 9/11), and we played all over the Shore, N Jersey and NYC…some of Fishbone came from New Brunswick/Rutgers, and played many of the venues we did… my “time” on the 4 string was off and on between ’76 and ’96

    i was Lucky to be favored by being graced to play with real Musicians who put up with my limited ability because they liked having me around (them being teeny, scrawny, wiry musician types)

    heh

  • duane

    Nothing to do with warheads, but what style of music did you play? Originals? What kind of bass do (did) you play, and why?

  • http://blogcritics.org/writer.php?name=gonzo%20marx jaz

    (heavy, originals,hotrodded Peavey T-40, GK head, Hartke 4×10 cab, thrashmaster pedal{before that came out an old electro harmonix “big muff” guitar pedal form the 70’s} towards the end, did a lot of detuning to bring the whole instrument lower, heaviest strings i could find…and the last few years…a steel thumbpick to allow for fingerpicking,pickthrashing,or just fingers as required in any song)

    sounds like…

    but we digress…

  • Clavos

    I showed, but didn’t sell Mr. (can’t remember his first name) Peavey (the amp guy) a boat, once.

    Nice guy.

  • http://parodieslost.typepad.com Mark Schannon

    Shit. I forgot; leave the page, your comments get trashed. Rats. I was absofuckinglutly brilliant too.

    Les, first of all, you called me a liberal, which am fighting words…or would be if I knew what a liberal was. Ruvy from Jerusalem calls me a Social Justician…anyway, an apology with chocolates would be great.

    But: The patriotic stance that Mark puts forward and defends is misplaced.

    I defy you to demonstrate a patriotic stance of mine. Or, on the other hand, maybe it’ll be helpful.

    Jaz, Duane, Clavos–I can’t claim the pedigree of our one and only “Jaz,” but I did play tenor sax in bands in high school & actually made money. Then in the 60s-70s, I went to guitar (naturally) and actually made money at that. Not enough to eat regularly, but to claim I was a musician…hahahahahahahahah.

    This is a weird thread…thanks all.

    In Jameson Veritas

  • http://blogcritics.org/writer.php?name=gonzo%20marx jaz

    ah Mark me boyo, sure’n now ye’ve no objections to a bit o’ the blather twixt the sound and fury of it all…

    now, more imbibing and less whining, fellow me lad
    (FYI..the band is Irish..just to keep it all in idiom, cuz i’m silly like that)

  • http://parodieslost.typepad.com Mark Schannon

    whining??? i was trying to join the festivities talkin’ about jazz & all that & music…

    but this be one of them bad days…so I’ll leave the cavorting to you lads…just remember to cavort a wee bit for me.

  • http://blogcritics.org/writer.php?name=gonzo%20marx jaz

    always , me boyo

    tipple a wee dram, and sit back

    yer such the sensitive laddie

    fer Mark.

  • Methuselah

    I’m just glad the editors of BC are mature enough and wise enough to not allow an inflammatory article about the w*lt*r r**d malcontents because that would make the president look bad.

  • http://www.diablog.us Dave Nalle

    Meth, once again, are you actually reading the things you respond to? This article IS about Walter Reed – at least in part.

    If you want a more in-depth article, someone needs to write it. We’ve got plenty of left-wing writers who would love to hammer on Bush, but none have written it yet. I might write a straight news story on it, but you’re not going to like the slant.

    Hey, here’s an idea. Write it up yourself. Why not?

    Dave

  • Clavos

    Nah, he’d rather sit on the sidelines and carp.

  • http://parodieslost.typepad.com Mark Schannon

    Who is Meth…new to me as I’m just getting back on the boards. But he’s weird, so that’s good.

    In Jameson Veritas

  • http://www.diablog.us Dave Nalle

    Ok, I now take back what I wrote earlier on Walter Reed. Thinking I might write an article on the subject I have now gone and read multiple stories on the ‘scandal’. It’s a pile of crap. Two WaPo reporters got hold of a pissed off soldier who had a sub-standard room in an otherwise pretty respectable facility, and inflated it into enough of a story that some opportunistic congress weasels jumped on it.

    But what we’re basically talking about here is a few rooms in a single building in a huge facility which have some damage which can be fixed for a few thousand dollars.

    I’ve stayed in hotel rooms I paid good money for which were worse than the main room in question.

    Because there is no actual story here, subsequent WaPo articles have focused on the general theme of bureaucratic inefficiency in the army, which creates the complacency and indifference which didn’t get this particular facilility cleaned up and repaired when it should have been.

    They’ve got a point there, but as scandals go the whole thing is pretty feeble. It’s going nowhere. It can’t be used to effectively tar the administration so the media is going to lose interest. The army bureaucracy sucks. Big news.

    Dave

  • Clavos

    There has to be a reason Presidents and other senior officials are treated there…

  • http://www.diablog.us Dave Nalle

    Parts of the facility are absolutely state of the art, and that’s where presidents and seriously injured servicemen are treated.

    Other parts are less impressive. The building in question, Building 18, is an unimpressive thing, built in the 70s and in need of some maintenance. It’s mostly used for recovering, non-critical patients. It’s essentially an inpatient/outpatient minimal care unit – a dorm with nurses. I’ve seen video of it. It looks like every second-tier hospital I’ve ever seen – rather reminiscent of the student health center at our local university. Generally clean and decent, but nothing fancy.

    Dave

  • http://blogcritics.org/writer.php?name=gonzo%20marx jaz

    it is not about the main facility, or primary care at all

    if you read many of the articles, including the initial WaPo…what’s talked about are after care facilities…what some folks have dealt with AFTER the primary care at main facilities

  • http://www.diablog.us Dave Nalle

    Right, like I said in #56 – dormitories for recovering patients with minimal actual medical tech.

    But regardless of how that one room was, even the whole of Building 18 isn’t disreputable. They were able to immediately move the complaining patient to an acceptable room down the hall.

    This rather reminds me of living in an apartment building or a hotel. You have no idea what kind of state of disrepair a neighboring room or apartment is in. Yours looks fine even if the person next door to you has smeared feces on the walls and is dancing around naked.

    The main mistake here was administrative. Every facility has some rooms that are undergoing repair or have problems. They should just never have put anybody IN one of those rooms. From the video which you can find on the Voice of America site, the rest of the facility looks perfectly adequate.

    Dave

  • http://blogcritics.org/writer.php?name=gonzo%20marx jaz

    we will see when all is said and done

    this is NOT a time where i give a fuck about blame, who is/was responsible…or ANYTHING other than ensuring that those who are injured while serving in our military get the best care humanly possible completely funded by the military

    from accounts, this is not always occurring in various ways, for various reasons

    i don’t give a shit why…just demand it gets fixed

    our military people deserve at least that much

  • http://www.elitebloggers.com Dave Nalle

    Jaz, I think blame is important here. This is a problem that could have been fixed by a bit of due diligence and a relatively small amount of money. The person immediately in charge of that facility ought to be punished appropriately because it was his pure laziness which created this situation and embarassed the military. He ought to be hanging in the wind and made an example of.

    Dave

  • http://blogcritics.org/writer.php?name=gonzo%20marx jaz

    fix the Problems first…then look into it and correct the systemics

    what i think will come out later, is that much of the substandard facilities and care are mostly from outsourced providers for aftercare…just going by what info my sources supply on the topic, again…i just don’t give a shit…all i want is for these soldiers who paid with their wounds to get every bit of top notch care humanly possible for as long as they need it without going out of pocket for one thin fucking dime

  • Methuselah

    …but only for dental work.

  • http://www.elitebloggers.com Dave Nalle

    Meth, no one else gets dental anymore, either.

    Jaz, I agree that top notch care is the priority, but what better way to assure it than to make an example or two?

    Dave

  • http://blogcritics.org/writer.php?name=gonzo%20marx jaz

    no harm in making an “example or two”..with one caveat….that it doesn’t distract from fixing the problem OR from digging deep into the why AFTERwards

    that’s my concern with the politically expedient “examples”….that later, when the dust settles…someone will say “oh, we got rid of that guy”, and no one will take a clear look at the underlying causes

    this is a secondary concern…fix it, that’s the Important thing

  • http://www.elitebloggers.com Dave Nalle

    I see it a bit differently. It’s a hell of a lot of work to go through every facility and check every room and every piece of equipment. But if you put the fear of god into the management with some examples, then maybe they start to do their jobs properly and solve the problem. Plus, they know where the problems are, they just need some motivation to fix them.

    dave

  • http://blogcritics.org/writer.php?name=gonzo%20marx jaz

    as i said…concern over covering up larger problems later, and distraction from underlying systemic flaws…

    but hell, not anywhere near as important as solving the problem and providing the care

  • http://www.elitebloggers.com Dave Nalle

    BTW, isn’t there supposed to be some sort of oversight agency which checks up on this sort of stuff? I’m not the god of all military knowledge, but last I checked there was an Inspector General of the Army with a staff that’s supposed to check up on how facilities like this are being run and follow up on complaints. Reports are these problems have been known about for several years, so if the IG system was working something ought to have been done.

    Dave

  • http://blogcritics.org/writer.php?name=gonzo%20marx jaz

    correct…the IG would have reported it to the Pentagon, and the SecDef…with further oversight and a copy of any pertinent report to the Armed Services committees

    see how well that worked out the last few years?

    another solid argument for divided government to checkup on each other

  • Clavos

    I think Dave had a good point upthread when he mentioned that the war has probably sucked up lots of DoD money that might have gone to places like Reed.

    To which I would add that it probably has sucked up the most competent personnel, including commanders of all corps, as well. Lord knows that guy Kiley wasn’t competent.

  • troll

    gimme ah P
    gimme ah R
    gimme ah O
    gimme ah F
    gimme ah I
    gimme ah T

    whats that spell – ?…mold
    whats that spell – ?…neglect
    whats that spell – ?…heartlessness

  • MCH

    “I’m not the god of all military knowledge…”
    – Dave (Vox populi) Nalle

    Oh, really? Duh…

  • http://www.elitebloggers.com Dave Nalle

    Clavos, I think your second point is the really telling one. My earlier point about money falls short because the necessary repairs at Building 18 weren’t all that costly – really just routine maintenance. But the shortage of competent personnel and the retention of idiots beyond their point of usefulness is likely a really serious problem.

    Dave

  • Methuselah

    Thank hevvins we’ve got Dave Nalle to set us right! There’s nothing wrong. But how come Gates and those guys didn’t get the message? Why did they fire all those high-levels? What happened?

    Dave Nalle for Secretary of Defense! He’ll bring back the halcyon era of Rumsfeld.

  • MCH

    “Dave Nalle for Secretary of Defense!”

    Why not? He’d fit right in with the rest of the “Perfumed Princes,” as the late Col. David “Hack” Hackworth called them.

  • http://parodieslost.typepad.com Mark Schannon

    Dave, your original claim that this was a tempest in a teapot is shaken by your own calls for reform. More to the point, look at how the administration has responded. If it were just two or three rooms, you’d find a camera crew and some media and walk them through the whole place. It’s an easy proof…

    But the Post today and other sources I can’t figure out how to link to make it clear it wasn’t just one or two rooms splitting a cockroach.

    With Bush cutting benefits for vets, it’s a lousy time to find out his senior people treat them like…cockroaches.

    I think you’re wrong on this, one, Dave ol’ boy.

    In Jameson Veritas

  • http://blogcritics.org/writer.php?name=gonzo%20marx jaz

    did ya hear…

    Scooter convicted on 4 of 5 counts

    “another one bites the dust” – Queen

    “and there was much rejoicing” – Monty Python and the Holy Grail

  • Nancy

    I did – Oh, frabjous day-! Now if only Cheney & Dubya were next….

  • http://www.diablog.us Dave Nalle

    Dave, your original claim that this was a tempest in a teapot is shaken by your own calls for reform. More to the point, look at how the administration has responded. If it were just two or three rooms, you’d find a camera crew and some media and walk them through the whole place. It’s an easy proof…

    Nah, it’s still not much of a scandal, Mark. I’ve seen the additional reports. There’s a bit of bureaucratic neglect, but nothing that’s on an outrageous level. And they DID do a walk-through with a camera crew on Building 18 right after the story broke. I’ve seen the video. Not that shocking.

    Dave

  • Clavos

    Mark writes in #75:

    With Bush cutting benefits for vets

    I’m gonna keep repeating this until it sinks in:

    Those cuts are to the budget requests, not the budget itself, and they happen every year, to every Federal department.

    In point of fact, during the Bush administration, the VA budget has grown from $50B a year to more than $80B for FY 2007.

  • Clavos

    Here’s info on the VA budget being requested by Bush for 2008:

    VA Requests $87 Billion for Veterans in Landmark FY ’08 Budget
    February 5, 2007

    Nicholson: “Right Resources for Right People” Working for Veterans

    WASHINGTON – Continuing to honor the nation’s commitment to meet the needs of America’s veterans, Secretary of Veterans Affairs Jim Nicholson announced today that President Bush will seek a landmark budget of nearly $87 billion in fiscal year 2008 for the Department of Veterans Affairs (VA), with health care and disability compensation for veterans receiving the majority of the spending.

    The FY ’08 proposal represents an increase of $37.8 billion, or 77 percent, from the budget in effect when the President took office.

  • http://parodieslost.typepad.com Mark Schannon

    Ah you’re all cheating because I don’t have the energy to racing around trying to find the facts. If you’re right…and I refuse to believe that because I can…let’s fight about the rest of my story…the stupid warheads or Hillary Billary Dock & Obama.

    It’s good to be brain damaged.

    In Jameson Veritas

  • Clavos

    OK, Mark, a temporary cease fire.

    I prefer a fair fight, too.

    Feel better, my man.

    Clavos

  • http://www.diablog.us Dave Nalle

    I think I have the definitive word on this. My 82 year old Mom who lives in DC and worked for the federal government most of her life and is the most rabid democrat in the world, watched the footage of Walter Reed and has followed the story, and thinks the hearings currently being held on the subject are an offensive waste of time. She was so offended by the democrats opportunism on this nothing story that for the first time I’ve ever seen, she actually turned against her own party and condemned them as ‘worthless’.

    Dave

  • http://blogcritics.org/writer.php?name=gonzo%20marx jaz

    oh yeah?

    well the gnomes that come around at night and fix my shoes say some people are poopy heads.

    the Tao of D’oh.

  • http://blogcritics.org/writer.php?name=gonzo%20marx jaz

    oh yeah?

    well, the pixies that come around at night, bake the break and handle the cobbling say that some people are poopyheaded dolts who eat paste…

    i’m just saying…

    heh

    the Tao of D’oh

  • troll

    this iceberg of abuse in the treatment of our wounded points to the basic problem….and it’s not simply lack of funding

    neither centralized government planning nor organization around the profit principle work well (as in ‘if it works at all then it works for all’)…both socialism and capitalism lead to bureaucratic blindness and undermine corrective measures

    we need a new foundation for our productive activity and interaction –

  • http://www.diablog.us Dave Nalle

    Good news. Bob Dole is on the job with a bipartisan commission. He ought to get to the bottom of things.

    Walter Reed in and of itself is small potatoes, but I bet we see the same small problems and generalized neglect repeated in facilities all over the country, and that adds up.

    Dave

  • Clavos

    Problems at the Seattle ARMY (not VA) hospital have already been reported…

  • Clavos

    I’ve been doing a little research on the W Reed problem.

    One thing I’ve found out is that the Army is holding these soldiers as active duty (i.e., they’re not discharged) pending medical discharges, which is why they are being treated at Army hospitals rather than VA facilities.

    That reminded me that, when I was rotated back to The World from Nam, as I was being processed for discharge at Oakland, I raised a couple of medical issues. The Army’s response (40 years ago) was to advise me that, if I insisted on those issues I would be retained (not discharged) for an indefinite period, and thus be unable to go home right away, but if I signed a waiver, I would be discharged that same day. Guess which option I took?

    Later, when the problems worsened and I went to the VA, the waiver presented problems toward getting treatment. Thankfully, and a major reason I’m so enthusiastic about the VA and its people, their attitude was much more sympathetic than the Army’s, and eventually I began to get the treatments I still receive today.

    But I digress. Back to the research:

    The bipartisan commission mentioned by Dave will also be investigating VA outpatient facilities nationwide. The other, Democratic, chair is Donna Shalala, whose most recent success is/has been running (and greatly improving) the University of Miami. She and Dole (who is a wounded WWII vet, as everyone knows) should be a good team.

    jaz is right; some of the VA’s outpatient clinics HAVE been outsourced to private providers. The sources I’ve been looking at are unclear as to whether ALL outpatient clinics will be investigated, or just those that are outsourced.

    Ironically, the outpatient facilities are a relatively recent phenomenon (most of them). The VA has been opening them at a rapid clip for several years now, in an effort to make access more convenient for vets who don’t have a VAMC (VA Medical Center) nearby.

  • http://blogcritics.org/writer.php?name=gonzo%20marx jaz

    well Clavos, now you can see the part of the iceberg above water…

    symptomatic of some of the problems with outsourcing military functions

    you want to get really scared, check out the descendants of Executive Outcomes, and see how much our modern military relies on mercenaries like, DynCorp, MPRI, Sandline, and of course KBR…to name a few

    if you look hard enough, you will find the Beginning of the phenomena, look at Cheney’s position under Reagan…things from mid-air refueling to the horrible botched assault on Tora Bora, to billions in Iraq…and of course….so many health facilities and every PX in the country

    Cheney and Rumsfeld have been the tip of the spear for the neocons as well as the mercenary “private military forces”..these PMFs have NO desire to resolve conflict , but rather to achieve limited objective (Mission Accomplished!) and to keep all conflicts going to extend the profit making contracts with out end

    this whole aftercare fiasco is just a tiny tip of the problem…but a VERY crucial one, since it deals with the care our wounded vets receive

    (also Clav, take a look at how many seriously wounded folks are stuck and waiting for final status determination and their disability…not to mention these servicemen being forced to pay out of pocket…)

    for the Purple Hearts and Honored Dead…

    the Tao of D’oh.

  • http://blogcritics.org/writer.php?name=gonzo%20marx jaz

    crap…i have a lengthy comment, but it doesn’t appear to want to put it up…i’ll try again in a bit

  • http://blogcritics.org/writer.php?name=gonzo%20marx jaz

    dreck..it stripped out the link…

    here it is

  • Clavos

    jaz:

    if you look hard enough, you will find the Beginning of the phenomena, look at Cheney’s position under Reagan…things from mid-air refueling to the horrible botched assault on Tora Bora, to billions in Iraq…and of course….so many health facilities and every PX in the country

    It began long before that, jaz. The consortium of RMK-BRJ was a HUGE contractor in Nam. I was actually offered a job by them near the end of my tour. The money they offered, which was substantial AND tax-free by government order, was very tempting. Fortunately, I came to my senses and came back to go to college with the GI bill.

    RMK-BRJ, consisted of three firms: Raymond, Morris & Knudsen, and Brown & Root, and J.A. Jones; collectively, the Halliburton of the sixties.

  • http://blogcritics.org/writer.php?name=gonzo%20marx jaz

    i know Clav…then they were Company contractors forth emost part

    i differentiate between the pre and post EO era due to the new things EO brought to the PMF industry

    the definitive work on the subject of modern mercs, imo.

    (hope ya liked the music link)

  • Nancy

    It would seem from what I’ve seen, read, & heard that vets are being held as slave labor of a sort. It makes absolutely no sense to hold them as ‘active’ when they’re not, & never going to be, either. Why are they doing that?

  • http://www.diablog.us Dave Nalle

    Given the condition of the vets in question I have to assume they’re holding them as active so they can be redeployed when they heal up, either into combat – since many of them aren’t that badly wounded, or into support positions.

    Being kept on active duty also guarantees them full salary and benefits. I’m not sure if that’s a consideration. I’d think that in many cases that would be a reason to turf them as soon as they were able, purely from a fiscal standpoint.

    Dave

  • http://parodieslost.typepad.com Mark Schannon

    Clavos, not to worry. I’m beginning to feel that this obnoxious sleep problem will neither be diagnosed nor fixed…although everyone has lots of treatment ideas. For example, I’m currently suspended upside down from the ceiling, writing this by holding a pencil in my mouth.

    I think the idea is that if I hang long enough, all my guts will spill out and that’s easier than exploratory surgery.

    SO fight on valiently…I’ll throw in my two cents when I can think of something useless to say.

    In Jameson Veritas

  • Clavos

    Nancy asks:

    It makes absolutely no sense to hold them as ‘active’ when they’re not, & never going to be, either. Why are they doing that?

    And Dave replies:

    Given the condition of the vets in question I have to assume they’re holding them as active so they can be redeployed when they heal up, either into combat – since many of them aren’t that badly wounded, or into support positions.

    Being kept on active duty also guarantees them full salary and benefits. I’m not sure if that’s a consideration.

    Based on my experience noted upthread when I returned from Nam, I think that, for whatever reason, the Army cannot release a soldier while s/he is still actively sick or injured, but that’s just a WAG.

  • Clavos

    jaz,

    Pls specify who here?

    not to mention these servicemen being forced to pay out of pocket…

    Because, if it’s the VA (as opposed to the Army), not all vets are guaranteed free care from the VA, nor have they ever been. Only those who have medical problems incurred as a result of their service get varying degrees of free care.

    Lifers have always (and still do) have the right to free treatment.

    For the rest of us, there’s a rating system based on the severity of your condition AND your ability to pay. Categories are 1-8, with 1 being the most privileged; they don’t pay regardless of income. Until recently, a category 8 COULD get treatment on a low priority basis, after means testing and paying accordingly. However, recently, this category, which also is not service-connected, no longer can get treated at VA facilities (I believe, not sure).

    If they are still able to get treatment, the non service-connected vets have always been so far down the totem pole in priority, that it’s impractical.

    Appointments have always been slow, but the last couple of years have seen good improvement in that area.

    All vets who are destitute can get treatment.

    Dishonorably discharged vets don’t get squat.

  • Clavos

    Mark writes:

    For example, I’m currently suspended upside down from the ceiling, writing this by holding a pencil in my mouth.

    Despite that, you do better than some on BC do right side up, using their fingers.

    Hang in there…

    Heh.

  • http://blogcritics.org/writer.php?name=gonzo%20marx jaz

    thought it had been apparent…i’m talking about those injured in the line of duty

    many are now stuck in the paperwork limbo as officials drag their feet over disability claims, as well as being forced into co-pays for aftercare

    it’s out there, and more coming…glad to see you are looking into this further, hope the material i provided helps out

    remember where ya heard it first, weeks before the WaPo article

  • Clavos

    Sorry, my bad; I wasn’t clear: I was asking who was giving the care, but you just cleared that up.

    The people you’re speaking of are still in the Army, so it’s the Army that’s making them pay, which is unconscionable.

  • Clavos

    many are now stuck in the paperwork limbo as officials drag their feet over disability claims, as well as being forced into co-pays for aftercare

    If they are in the VA system, that’s SOP, and always has been, depending on the severity of their injuries and their means.

  • Clavos

    jaz:

    It’s also (in the VA) always taken months to get initial approval (it’s a bureaucracy!), but the good side of it is that when you’re approved, the pay is retroactive.

    I pay copays and mine is line of duty. It’s still a hell of a lot better than civilian health insurance, and with some exceptions, the quality is VERY superior to civilian hospitals.

  • http://blogcritics.org/writer.php?name=gonzo%20marx jaz

    Clavos..i understand your desire to defend what works for you, and for the most part…my problem is NOT with the VA, itself…

    like i said when i first brought this up, weeks ago, more will come out, and it’s worse than most think

    but as you have seen, nothing i’ve said has turned out to be anything other than truth so far

    “time wounds all heels”Heinlein

  • sr

    We can only hope they test them on California. Remember the movie Dr. Strangelove? Major Kong (Slim Pickens) rides on top of the nuclear bomb like a cowboy on a horse down to the target. Gitty up cowboys.

  • Methuselah

    According to some troublemaker: “It’s still a hell of a lot better than civilian health insurance, and with some exceptions, the quality is VERY superior to civilian hospitals.”

    Better than private health insurance? Government hospitals better than private enterprise hospitals?

    Are you trying to destroy Capitalism?

    Somebody, like Clavos maybe, better step up and refute this bomb throwing radical!

  • Clavos

    Meth: “Clavos, Clavos! Bomb alert, Clavos! Hurry, Clavos, get the bastard!”

    Clavos: “ZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZ”

  • http://www.preferedforms.com Leopold

    Every American should have affordable health insurance.

  • http://blogcritics.org/writer.php?name=gonzo%20marx jaz

    Captain America is Dead.

    a bit of me appears to have passed away today

    1966, a dyslexic young lad uses a bit of change from a trip to the store and buys a comic book…this Incident, and the subsequent library card opened up the worlds of Literature, Myth, Learning and Inspiration

    Steve Rogers aka Captain America was a scrawny art student at the outbreak of WW2 , tapped for the experimental Super Soldier project, he became the only successful product. The creator of the process, killed by a spy just after the Metamorphosis…the Secret going with him, the spy the first to be brought down by the man who was to become….Captain America.

    Fighting and winning the War (not all by himself mind you), Cap was on ice until Stan Lee had the Avengers find his frozen self after Namor tossed the chunk of ice into the ocean…the two having known each other in the War (yep, the Sub-Mariner is that old)

    Through the sixties, seventies and eighties…Cap presented a dual Mirror of American society, the Ideal embodied by the Symbol…made Real by the commitment of the Man bearing that indestructible Shield… the Day to Day mundania of what was “happening” in the times viewed through the eyes of that Art student displaced in Time.

    I stopped collecting comics in ’92…a ton of boxes(30something long boxes) in my attic the tiny fractional remainder of that endeavor, but every bit of our uniquely American living Mythology remains ingrained indelibly in the hinterlands of my Psyche where a young boy learns gung fu and reads…and really wants that Shield…

    I can’t think of any better Homage to honor this Icon than a line from the Living Myth of comics….”I am Thor, Son of Odin and God of Thunder. I bend my knee to no one, but this Man would I follow into the very depths of Hell. Any who wouldst question shall answer to me.”

    i don’t have the Issue that hit the stands yesterday, i found out about it online…i have no idea of the plot or whatever..all i know is that he was shot, in handcuffs …on trial for failure to comply with the government wanting him to reveal himself…to “register”..the Metaphor clear in this day of terror and the “PATRIOT” act…Cap protesting against government violations of the Constitution…always the Ideal made manifest.

    but i Know, that in the Fabric of the Myth…the Symbol of the Greatest Generation died yesterday

    nuff said…

    When a Leader speaks, that Leader dies.

    Excelsior?

  • Clavos

    jaz: This one’s for you.

    A kindred soul.

    Clavos