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Stealing Elections the Old Fashioned Way

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At a time when there's a great deal of concern over the vulnerability of electronic voting machines to potential fraud and manipulation, a group of Democratic voter recruiters working for ACORN have reminded us that some people are still trying to steal elections the old fashioned way.

On Wednesday, the U.S. Attorney's office in Kansas City handed down indictments against four paid voter recruiters who were part of a project run by left-leaning advocacy groups Project Vote and the Association of Community Organizations for Reform Now (ACORN), which had claimed to have registered 35,000 new voters in low income and minority neighborhoods in the Kansas City area in the past month.

It seems they met their registration quota by filling out false registrations, registering people multiple times — one person was registered seven times — and registering dead people. Kwaim A. Stenson, Dale D. Franklin, Brian Gardner, and Stephanie L. Davis were each charged with two counts of "knowingly and willingly" committing election fraud. Each charge carries a potential five years in prison and $250,000 fine.

ACORN is cooperating with the FBI and local officials in the investigation. Election officials suspect that up to half of these new registrations are fraudulent and they have already thrown out thousands of duplicates and sent letters to 5,000 new registrants to verify their existence.

Missouri has a long history of voter fraud and election problems going back centuries, but more recently, in the 2000 election, where tens of thousands of votes were thrown out, there were registration irregularities, some polling places were left entirely unattended for hours when anyone could have accessed the ballots, and other polling locations were kept open for hours after the official closing time. The 2004 election was even worse, with 16 Democratic party agents and officials in St. Louis alone convicted for a variety of election-related crimes — from buying votes to attempting to kill a witness in a vote fraud case. The Missouri Democratic party was fined by the Federal Election Commission for promoting fraud.

Attempts have been made to reform the electoral system in Missouri, consistently opposed by lawsuits from Democratic party groups. Clearly, Missouri is an electoral disaster and there's no reason to believe it's getting any better, but it's only the tip of the iceberg. The larger concern should be that ACORN and Project Vote are nationwide groups and there's every reason to assume that, in their zeal to impose political change on the country, they may be trying to bring the same kind of fraud and corruption they've practiced in Missouri to the rest of the country as well.

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About Dave Nalle

Dave Nalle is Executive Director of the Texas Liberty Foundation, Chairman of the Center for Foreign and Defense Policy, South Central Regional Director for the Republican Liberty Caucus and an advisory board member at the Coalition to Reduce Spending. He was Texas State Director for the Gary Johnson Presidential campaign, an adviser to the Ted Cruz senatorial campaign, Communications Director for the Travis County Republican Party and National Chairman of the Republican Liberty Caucus. He has also consulted on many political campaigns, specializing in messaging. Before focusing on political activism, he owned or was a partner in several businesses in the publishing industry and taught college-level history for 20 years.
  • Clavos


    How come Florida gets all the bad press?

    These guys in Missouri have election fraud down to a science.


    George W. Bush and the Republican way of cover-ups, lies, and more!
    Bush will get what he wants no matter what.
    Break the law.
    Then come up with reasons why he is right.
    Well guess what?
    Bush is wrong!
    You do not spy on Americans without legal permission.
    That is KGB like.
    The courts are starting to agree.
    You do not go to war with another country without proof of the need for war.
    Iraq was no threat to the United States.
    Yes, Saddam Hussein was evil and had a lot of people killed, but how many Iraqi citizens have been killed since this war started?
    How many of our brave service men and women have been killed in Iraq?
    How many more will die?
    Iraq right now, is in the worst mess it has ever been in.
    This was not the case before Bush started this war.
    Hey Bush: This war is against terrorists, not with countries.
    WMD? Not there!
    Did you know that George W. Bush once made fun of the issue of Weapons of Mass Destruction?
    He did, and in front of some shocked people during a black-tie event in 2004.
    He said…. (While looking under a piece of furniture) “Those weapons of mass destruction have got to be here somewhere.”
    Then, while pretending to look out of a window, Bush laughed as he said….. “Nope, no weapons over there.”
    While he was laughing, there were men and women fighting and dying in Iraq because of WMD.
    George W. Bush should be removed from office because of that alone.
    Face it, Bill Clinton lied about having sex, and was impeached because of it.
    George W. Bush however, did far worse, as he laughed at the very people who are fighting for the United States of America!
    Bush laughs at a lot of things.
    While we were under attack, he just sat there.
    He has no clue about how to run things.
    Speaking of running, that is what many Republicans are doing right now.
    Running from their own corruption.
    How many are in trouble now?
    From Nixon/Agnew to Scooter and Cheney, all we get from Republicans are cover-ups, lies, and more.
    Even President Reagan’s defense secretary, Caspar W. Weinberger, who recently passed away, was so bad, that George H. W. Bush had to bail him out with a pardon to help save the Republican name.
    Face it…. the Republican Party is a disgrace.
    Time for a change.
    It is also time for us to take back our country from the Republican mess that YOU are paying for.

    I am,

    * Here are some tidbits of note:

    President Clinton left us SO MUCH money.
    Bush spent it all.
    The United States is now in debt.
    In fact, we have borrowed money from China!
    Think about that.
    We owe money to China.
    A country that sides with North Korea.
    That is the Bush spending policy.
    Spend, and then owe.
    Bush is an idiot.

    Did you know that some Republicans will not have their pictures taken with Bush?
    They fear being seen with him.
    The GOP is falling apart.

    Mark Foley, a Republican member (now ex-member) of Congress, has sent many e-mails with perverted sexual content to a sixteen year old boy.
    This is the same man who while in Congress, backed a bill that was meant to protect children from child predators.
    Foley himself, is a man who preyed on a child with lust.
    What is also incomprehensible, is the fact that many Republicans knew of Foley’s behavior, and yet, did not take a hard stand against this until it became public news.
    If I had a teenage son and/or daughter, I would not want them to go near any Republican leader for fear of either or both becoming a victim of a sick Republican pervert.

    Dennis Hastert, is a typical Republican who thirsts for power.
    If he knew of Foley’s perverted actions with underage kids before they became public, then he must step down.
    However, since he thinks in terms of power more than helping people, he will not step down from his position.
    This is the Republican way.
    Personal power over the people.
    Hunger for money combined with cover-ups, lies, tricks, and more so they can keep their power.

    It is sad to see the total mess in Washington and overseas that these Republicans blame on others.
    Blame the kids who run errands for them as if to say…..”If if it were not for the page program, then those kids would not have been here for Foley and others to exploit them.”
    Blame Clinton for not doing enough with terrorists, while Bush keeps sending troops to Iraq while North Korea and Iran build massive weapon’s programs.
    Hey Republicans: If you did not like the job Bill Clinton did, then do something about it.
    After all, you have had six years to do it.
    Blame, blame, blame.
    The real blame is on the Republican Party.
    If they do not take responsibility and handle things, then maybe they should all step down.

    Ever since Bush has been in office, North Korea has been very busy with their missile and nuke programs.
    Because of this, they are now a grave threat to the world.
    Iran is also busy doing the same things, only they are more vocal about what they want to do with their weapons.
    What has Bush been doing during all of this?
    Sending troops to Iraq.
    Ha ha, that is real bright.
    There were no WMD in Iraq, but we are there anyway instead of going to where the WMD really are.
    If Bush just sits there like he did during 9/11, then we will have a catastrophic event somewhere in the world, or a nuke at the doorstep of Los Angeles.
    Bush has lost total control of things, and like Iraq, he has no clue how to deal with it.

    Our Republican leaders have failed to catch bin Laden, even though Bush said that his capture was a top priority.
    When it became evident that bin Laden was not going to be caught any time soon, Bush then said that it did not matter if we capture him.
    Say what?
    The fact is that Bush changed his mind to save face.

    We have left our borders open to let millions of rapists, thieves, loafers, and killers enter our country.
    These numbers are since 9/11.
    Much of California’s bad economy was blamed on Gray Davis, but the fact is, that illegals broke California.
    Why was that not stopped?

    In New Hampshire, during the 2002 election for the U.S. Senate seat being vacated by Robert C. Smith, the New Hampshire GOP hired GOP Marketplace of Virginia, to jam another phone bank being used by the state Democratic Party in an effort to turn out voters on behalf of then-governor Jeanne Shaheen on Election Day.
    John E. Sununu, the Republican candidate, won a narrow victory.
    Wikipedia, a free on-line encyclopedia, states that three men have been convicted of, or pled guilty to, federal crimes and sentenced to prison for their involvement as of 2006. A fourth is under indictment.
    However, investigators and those who have followed the scandal closely believe that there were more people involved at the national level.
    It has been suggested that some high-ranking Republican Senate leaders were aware, and more recently records showing phone calls from the political operative convicted of engineering the scheme have raised questions as to whether officials in the Bush Administration were involved as well.
    According to The Raw Story, the fourth man indicted in this phone-jamming scheme, will argue at trial that the Bush Administration and the national Republican Party gave their approval to the plan, so says a motion filed by his attorney.

    CIA leaks.

    Bush giving the finger to people.
    Would FDR have done that?

    Most of us have heard of Rush Limbaugh, the Republican wacko who can’t keep his foot out of his mouth.
    Limbaugh has been busy questioning the severity of the disease that Michael J. Fox is suffering from, known as Parkinson’s.
    Limbaugh based his knowledge on the matter by comparing the condition of Fox to a couple of people who also have Parkinson’s disease.
    Limbaugh is not a doctor, but thinks that he is an expert on Parkinson’s because of what he has seen.
    The fact is that Michael J. Fox supports Democrats and stem cell research, and Limbaugh is trying to make a fool out of him, thus making another voice for the Democrats look small.
    Limbaugh even mimicked the actions of Parkinson’s disease in front of a camera.
    Think about that!
    Limbaugh made fun of Parkinson’s disease.
    He did that to make the Democrats look small, and the Republicans look big and brave.
    Limbaugh, like other Republicans who have questioned the severity of Fox’s condition, are very sick people.
    They laugh at those who are sick if they are Democrats.
    Limbaugh has now blamed the media for the story after millions of people thought his actions to be repulsive.
    This is the same Rush Limbaugh who once make racial comments about Philadelphia Eagles quarterback, Donovan McNabb, who is African-American.
    Limbaugh is obviously an athletic supporter, except he is the kind you wear.
    Limbaugh is a typical Republican who will hurt other people to get what he wants.

    When Arnold Schwarzenegger ran for office, he said that he would fund his campaign with his own money, and not accept money from outside interests.
    Well, as we now know, he took MILLIONS from others while running for office.
    These “other” special interest people have more interest in their pockets and their own standing, than in the interests of California.
    Arnold’s interests are with wealth and fame.
    These “others” and Arnold go hand in hand.
    I think we also need an answer from Arnold as to why he took two jobs with muscle magazines so soon after taking office.
    This was at a time when California needed him the most.
    After all, he said he would be there for the people.
    Again, it seems that Arnold put himself ahead of California.

    Of course we can’t forget that when it gets close to election time, we always see many road signs that support Democrats start to disappear.
    Hum, I wonder what side the sign thieves are on?
    Is this the Republican way of gaining the edge?

    Republicans can’t stand the truth.
    When a topic comes up that exposes them, these cowards will discredit the reporter or change the subject in order to made themselves look good.
    Their tactics no longer work.
    The people are on to these Republican cowards who can’t fess up.

    My thoughts on Iran:
    Iran may be a threat in the future, but it is not a threat now.
    We have time to think about what to do with Iran.
    We need to start thinking about the best ways to solve problems in the Middle East, and not create new ones.
    Because Bush and the Republican Party have no clue how to fix the mess we are in with Iraq, it is best that he and they do nothing with Iran.
    Wait until the voters pick better leaders, and believe me, that will not be a hard thing to do.
    George Vreeland Hill

  • Clavos


    FYI I Googled Hill. Among other things, he operates a girlie site called George’s Top 100 Models.

    A wingnut/moonbat.

    And a spammer–this is already on another thread.

  • George, perhaps you should write that up as an article and submit it.

    As it stands it has little to do with this article, except to point out a common logical fallacy. Pointing the finger at the crimes of one group doesn’t excuse the crimes of another. No matter how awful the GOP may be, that does nothing to mitigate the crimes of the democratic party.

    Every crime you catalog in your marginally schizophrenic way has a matching crime on the other political side. How do you pick between black and black?


  • It’s worse than that, Clavos. He’s spammed it 459 times on different blogs, mostly regional newspaper blogs. Seems like he has more time on his hand than good sense.


  • Wow, four voting recruiters and a nutty organization called Acorn.

    My hat’s off to you Dave, you’ve certainly trumped my hand; all I had was a Florida Attorney General who just happened to be in charge of the Florida 2000 election results and by odd coincodence Florida’s reelect GW Bush Campaign, An Ohio Attorney General who just happened to be in charge of the 2004 Ohio election results and by odd coincodence Ohio’s reelect GW Bush Campaign… and a measly CEO of a major voting machine manufacturer who pledged to give Ohio to Bush.

    That beats my hand, I fold.


  • By the way I agree about nutjob Hill, he even embarrasses me.

  • Jet, see my comment to George above. The fact that other people do things wrong doesn’t excuse what’s been going on in Missouri.

    And read the last paragraph again. This is the tip of the iceberg. There’s every reason to suspect ACORN of using the same methods nationwide – that makes for a minimum of hundreds of thousands of fraudulent voter registrations.

    Here’s a question to consider. What makes Missouri different? Or is it different? Maybe the same stuff that goes on there is going on in every state, but the dems aren’t getting caught as much elsewhere.

    And it looks like I’m going to have to write a followup article, because some quick googling revealed that my ‘tip of the iceberg’ theorizing was dead on. ACORN is under investigation in multiple states for similar fradulent registration activities.


  • Clavos

    Um, Jet…

    She was the Secretary of State, not Attorney General; that was Charlie Crist, the current Republican candidate for Governor.

    And the election has been counted and recounted at least four times by independent (some of which were liberal) entities.

    None of those recounts came up with different results sufficient to change the official outcome.

  • Clavos

    nutty organization called Acorn.

    Nice pun…:>)

  • I thought so too Clavos.

  • By your logic Dave, I guess that means that just because Clinton made mistakes 8 years ago, that doesn’t excuse the whoppers that Bush has made in the last six.

    Nor does it give the Republicant’s any more right to blame him than it does to blame Bush?

    You know Bush is running around the country yelling smuggly that the Democrats don’t deserve to be voted into office because they don’t have a plan for vicotry in Iraq… I’ve seen what Bush has been doing for the the last three years there and let me clue you in… he doesn’t either

    Right now President George W. Bush is PRAYING that the Dems win congress… and do you know why?

    So he’ll have someone to blame when the shit hits the fan and we get around to facing the fact that we’re losing. If the congress stays republican it’ll be the downfall of his party and both he and you know it.

    The 2008 slogan signs are already being prindet up THE DEMS DID IT!!!

    gimme a break

  • Jet, have you ever seen ME blame Clinton for anything?

    The crowd that blame Clinton for our problems are engaging in simplistic reasoning to address complex issues. At most their one valid argument is that Clinton probably wasn’t as great a president as his supporters make him out to be. He made mistakes, but not ones anyone else wouldn’t have made in the same situation.

    As for Bush, it would be nice to see someone – anyone – from the left give him the same detatched assessment. People are so distracted by their emotions when they think about Bush that they’re totally incapable of looking at him objectively. While nutjobs on the right DO say a lot of stupid things, they’re dead on when they talk about Bush Derangement Syndrome – the irrational hatred of Bush which makes so many on the left incapable of even engaging in a rational discussion about him or his policies.


  • Oh Dave… you… you just wait till I come up with a snappy leftwing nut job retort..ewwwww.

    Until then
    Point taken


  • Clark Westfield

    I think there’s a valid reason for why people seem to be irrational when talking about Bush and his policies. Bush is so far off the map when it comes to his behavior (e.g., starting a war on intelligence he knew was false) and statements (e.g., a vote for Democrats is a vote for terrorists) that simply repeating what he actually said and responding to it makes anyone seem crazy.

  • Perfect example of my point, Clark. You just made two statements about Bush which are total mischaracterizations of Bush’s actions as if they were gospel truth. It;s like you’re living in a bizarre alternate reality.

    Now, back to the topic of democrat operatives signing up dead people to vote.


  • “Bush is so far off the map when it comes to his…statements (e.g., a vote for Democrats is a vote for terrorists)”

    “You just made two statements about Bush which are total mischaracterizations of Bush’s actions”

    But, you see Dave, that’s not a mischaracterization. Bush has pretty much expressed that sentiment the Clark writes about.

    Dave, who are you voting for?

  • But, you see Dave, that’s not a mischaracterization. Bush has pretty much expressed that sentiment the Clark writes about.

    In that particular case the mischaracterization is the assumption that Bush is not correct to make that association.

    Dave, who are you voting for?

    Mostly libertarians and independents, why?


  • Nancy

    This is true, Dave: Junior has actually SAID these things in recent days. Haven’t you been following the news sound bites? I’ve heard him in his latest Georgia & Montana stops actually stating that Democrats are planning to surrender to the terrorists as soon as they win the election, and these redneck yahoos are eating it up, so he goes on & says worse! I swear to god, he sounds like he’s drunk or on drugs. Since he’s among a hand-picked, vetted audience of adoring brown-nosers who think he’s the second coming, he’s been making more & more outrageous claims & statements. Methinks Kerry isn’t the only one whose mouth is running faster than his brain lately.

    Pity there isn’t some way to remote-control electrocute spammers like this Hill person. Ah, well: carry on, all.

  • When I was but a wee lad sittin’ on me da’s knee, he looked me straight in t’eye an’ said, “Junior, t’is here’s t’greatest land in t’world. An’ when yer old enough, I wanna make sure yer followin’ in t’great traditions of America: Yer can’t cast too many fuckin’ votes fer t’man yer want to see elected.”

    Vote Early, Vote Often, Keep The Tradition Alive.

    Now, boys and girls. Question: Was me da a Demofat or a Republicorn?

    In Jameson Veritas

  • Nancy

    Actually, y’know, I can’t wait until Tues & this is all over … for another year or so, if that long.

    Wish there were some way to pass a law forbidding any & all negative ads. A candidate and/or those advertising for him/her must not mention the opposition, but stick to the candidate’s own proposals, policies … & achievements. That would probably shut most of them up.

    I wish I could tell these fools, ‘Look – I don’t CARE what you think is wrong with your opponent. I already know what I think is wrong, so I don’t need your sorry input. Let’s stick to YOU: why do you want to be elected; once you are (assuming you win) what do you intend to do – besides collect a fat, undeservedly inflated paycheck & all kinds of outrageous perks? What do you plan to do to EARN it? Work – remember? I want a cogent, coherent answer out of you, not dithering & generic blather.’

    I also wish I could say, “I’m sick & tired of myself and everyone else in the rank & file working their fingers to the bone to support YOU in undeserved luxury & security.

    “You get to vote yourselves innumerable pay raises, without having to justify them or have anybody approve them but yourselves. I can’t do that; nobody else in the world – except CEOs in companies like Exxon or Enron (which says it all) can do that; so why should YOU be able to?!

    “You get all kinds of lifelong perks & privileges, including lavish, ultradeluxe medical insurance for both you AND your family, and you get to keep it AND your ridiculously lavish pension, even if you’re convicted of a crime & go to jail for it-! What the hell?! I don’t get to keep benefits if I go to jail, why should YOU? I’m not even secure about the future of MY retirement even if I never go to jail, and neither are most of my fellow Americans – why should YOU be? Most of us worker bees don’t have and can’t afford medical insurance – yet here we are, paying in our taxes so YOU can be supported in the style to which you’ve become accustomed? What the hell?! You should be supporting US, not vice versa, especially since you’re already wealthy!

    “To add insult to injury, you only ‘work’ as you euphamistically call it, two days a week: from Tuesday pm until Thursday pm, before you head out of town to go schmoozing & panhandling to get re-elected so’s you can continue to live the easy life at public expense.

    “To top it all off, you accept ‘gifts’, travel, and who knows what else from lobbyists (may God rot their souls in eternal hell), throw all your decisions their way at the expense of the public you’re sworn to serve, and then self-righteously & piously claim you’ve done nothing wrong & their bribery doesn’t influence your decisions? The hell it doesn’t! Try pulling the other one, asshole! You must think we’re all as stupid and gullible as you are greedy & amoral.

    “You’re FIRED!”

  • Nancy

    Your Da was a lobbyist, obviously!

  • JustOneMan

    Nancy….great rant!

    We Socialists…er I mean..um…er Democrats believe that workers create all the wealth under capitalism. A new society can only be constructed when they collectively seize control of that wealth and plan its production and distribution according to need.

    In addition anyone who doesnt agree with us should not be allowed, even usiing their own money, to speak, publish or transmit over public airways. Freedom of speach will only be tolerated for views that we support!

    In addition we should raise taxes to 50%, provide free healthcare, housing, bread, cheese and toilet paper! Everyone will be so much happier.

    That will be the perfect Socialist….er I mean..um…er Left Wing Democratic way of running this country!

    From the Left…JustOneMan

    PS Bush Lied!

  • JoM, there will be no need for taxation in the workers utopia, because all salaries will be paid by the government at wages they set. Hell, salaries may not even be necessary. Each worker can have a ration card for food and live in government housing for free. They can even have a ration card for 1 movie a week – which is all they’ll need once the government takes over hollywood and limits them to producing 1 film per week about the accomplishments of the glorious state. Books will be unnecessary because we’ll have a post-literate society and the government will need all the printing presses to print the wisdom on our leaders.


  • Clavos

    But, Dave, think of the security!

    Nanny will take care of everything!

  • You get to vote yourselves innumerable pay raises, without having to justify them or have anybody approve them but yourselves.

    Actually, there’s a Constitutional Amendment which prohibits that. It took 200 years to be ratified, but it’s in force now. No member of Congress can vote himself a raise which takes effect before the people have an opportunity to vote him out of office.

    I can’t do that; nobody else in the world – except CEOs in companies like Exxon or Enron (which says it all) can do that; so why should YOU be able to?!

    Again, wrong. CEOs cannot give themselves raises. Their compensation packages are approved by the boards of the companies which they run, and sometimes even by their stockholders. If you don’t like it, buy one share of Exxon, go to a shareholder meeting and speak out against it.


  • JustOneMan

    Nancy…ya see what I mean! Dave, the right-wing loon, has to complicate everything with his facts, figures and truth!

    The right is deplorable!

    From The Left…JustOneMan

  • If all this stuff happens that you two are talking about…will I have to get rid of the boat I just got?

  • JustOneMan


    More than likely yes! You see in Nancy’s and I “Left Wing Democratic World” your boat will be given to someone who “needs it” more than you. So more than likely the new boat that you worked, toiled and saved for will be given to some chronically unemployed crack addict who obviously could use it more than you!

    Andy its the only FAIR thing to do!

    From The Left..JustOneMan

  • Lumpy

    That’s one bright future you paint a picture of , guys. Will nancy be our ‘dear leader’?

  • then I’m leaving!

  • Me too, I have enough trouble with women.

  • Clavos


    I’ll stick with you if I can have control over the budget and DoD.


  • Jet – that was funny!

    What the hell…I got a boat…I’ll go to…I don’t think I’m gonna tell you guys!

  • On second thought, scratch that last, I want to be her treasury secretary. NANCY FOR PRESIDENT!!!

  • Baronius

    re comment #6:

    Jet, Dave does trump your hand. Indictments trump “happens to be”. Convictions trump indictments and “happens to be”.

    This is the thing that’s driving me nuts about the left over the last few years. They don’t make arguments. They put things next to each other. It’s what bothered me in the Diebold article a few weeks back. This guy just coincidentally knew that guy who happened to work with those guys. That’s not proof.

    Make an argument. Present a case. If you can’t make your case, step back. Stop pretending that coincidence is the same as documentation.

    Apparently, in 38 states, the Secretary of State has the final say in election certification. In at least some of those states, it’s legal to hold that position and a campaign staff position. (I say “apparently” because otherwise, by now someone would have thought to indict Harris or Blackwell.) If you want to make it illegal, great. I’d support the effort. But since bills of attainder are unconstitutional, lay off.

  • Oh Bushit

  • Lumpy

    I’d say you hit the target dead center with that one baronius. I’m way more worried about dead people voting as they have in the past than some conspiracy fantasy that might happen.

  • Arch Conservative

    Let’s not forget all the absentee military votes Al Gore tried to get thrown out in 2000. This from the party that “really supports the troops because they didn’t ead them into an illegal war.”


    I’ll say it again.


  • RogerMDillon

    and why did Gore want them thrown out? wasn’t it because they were improperly postmarked? Either follow all the rules or none. Mot just the ones that benefit your side.

  • Lumpy

    Or if the rules don’t break your way enforce them selectively or sue to get them thrown out.

    Personally I think we should err in favor of counting our military votrs rather than finding ways to exclude them.

    And did u know that dems in florida are already suing to make it harder for soldiers to vote absentee this year?

  • Baronius

    “Oh Bushit”

    Gosh, it’s funny that you’d say that, dontcha think? I mean, quite a coincidence, huh? That you happened to write that? What a shock, I mean who would have expected that you’d just happen to say “oh Bushit”? Funny how that happened, right? What are the odds? I mean, it isn’t like anyone would have expected it, that I’d write something, and you’d just happen to reply?

  • RogerMDillon

    “Personally I think we should err in favor of counting our military votrs rather than finding ways to exclude them.”

    I think we should err in favor of counting everyone’s vote once, rather than finding ways to exclude them.

  • Well Roger, then I guess you find the Democratic activists who are trying to corrupt the voter registration system to be as reprehensible as I do.

    As for counting military votes, I think they should be counted fairly, but I do find the lengths to which democrats are going to sue to exclude absentee ballots which the state election commissions have approved to be very troubling.


  • Nancy

    My rant addressed only the abuses of congress, not anybody else. Andy, as far as I’m concerned you & your boat are safe; but yes, actually, I’d probably make a great Treas. Sec., if only because I’m as tight fisted with money as the proverbial Scotsman, and even more so when it isn’t mine. Which is why I am a very first-rate administrator. I don’t believe in wasting Other People’s Money.

    As for these voter registration frauds, I don’t care what party they are, they should be prosecuted all the way to the gallows if necessary. Dem fraud is just as bad as GOP fraud, & I’m getting really tired of both (see rant, above).

    And anyway, I wouldn’t want to be pres, even if I could or someone were insane/idiot enough to offer it. That stupid I’m not; I know my limitations pretty well & stick to them.

  • Arch Conservative

    “and why did Gore want them thrown out? wasn’t it because they were improperly postmarked? Either follow all the rules or none. Mot just the ones that benefit your side.”

    Yeah smoke another one pal!

    He wanted them thrown out because most of them were for Bush. It had nothing to do with rules. If most of them had been for Gore he would have wanted them counted.

    It’s funny how the idiots that couldn’t “follow the rules” to figure out how to punch a ballot were made an issue of by Gore and his hanging chad conspiracists isn’t it dumbass?

    And if we’re going to discuss voter fraud we can’t ignore the left’s ardent opposition to voter id laws. You need an id to rent a fuckign DVD but Dems don’t think you should be required to produe an id to vote.


  • RogerMDillon

    I find corruption by either party to be reprehensible. Didn’t realize that the obvious needed to be stated, but then I forget who congregates here.

  • Arch Conservative

    “I find corruption by either party to be reprehensible.”

    Sure you do, and I find Rosie O’donnel to be extremely attractive.

  • Nancy

    My personal reaction to the hanging chads business was that the idiots in Florida needed to be removed from the registration rolls if they were too stupid or senile to figure out the ballot & punch a damned chad correctly. I saw that ballot, & while it was not as well laid out as it could have been, it was hardly indecipherable or incomprehensible. There were, however, considerable instances of voter intimidation & outright denial of voting rights where people were turned away with claims that “the polls are closed”, mostly in black, largely Democratic neighborhoods which did give the charges of election fraud veracity, so on the whole, IMO Gore should have kept fighting. He would probably have won, too, if BushCo hadn’t bought off the USSC – which is really the actual unforgivable thing that BushCo did, corrupting a formerly credible institution.

  • Lumpy

    You may be tired of both nancy, but dem fraud exists repub fraud is still just theories and smear campaigns.

  • John Q. Public

    No, Lumpy. Republican fraud exists as well. Last week a conviction was handed down for a Republican operative in New Hampshire, convicted of violating that state’s laws after jamming Democratic phone banks during the 2004 election.
    There are plenty of cases of fraud on both sides, readily documented.
    The concern of many, is in regards to the electronic voting machines making it possible for the entire system to be corrupted, by one side or the other.
    Diebold for the Republicans, and another of the companies that are owned in part by the Venezualen government.
    With both sides not playing fair, it is ever more vital for we, the voters, to make as certain as possible that the system itself has the required checks and balances, along with accountability, to prevent widespread tampering.

  • Ok, which is worse, registering dead people or making prank calls to a phone bank.

    Good try JQ, but you’ve got to do better than that.

    And just to be fair, the company with partial Venezuelan ownership is not run by Hugo Chavez. They only own 28% of the company, and have zero role in setting its policies.


  • Bliffle

    I suppose one should feel better that R’s cheat as much as D’s (or that D’s cheat as much as R’s, whichever), but wouldn’t it be better if they both just ran better candidates?

  • troll

    (with all of our myopic focus on our bizarre system of power transfer we are not paying attention to the most ironic election going…in Nicaragua tomorrow the Sandinistas might well regain power)

  • Hard to believe that Nicaraguans can’t remember the incompetence and corruption of the Ortega government.


  • troll

    another example of how Bush&Co has not been accomplishing the US’s time honoured job of suppressing populist movements in S America

  • Is populist your code-word for oppressive socialist totalitarianism, troll?


  • troll

    Dave – I’ll be happy to use your private language to describe the movement if you prefer

  • troll

    hmmm – but from my pov a N Americano calling another group ‘oppressive socialist totalitarianism’ is a lot like the pot calling the kettle black

  • Clavos

    another example of how Bush&Co has not been accomplishing the US’s time honoured job of suppressing populist movements in S America

    Which should make liberals happy…

  • Troll, if you think that our system – even as fucked up as it currently is – can be meaningfully compared to the tinhorn socialist dictatorships to our south then you’re beyond rational discussion.


  • troll

    well perhaps that’s true…but in any case it will be interesting to see if the Nics re-elect their tinhorn socialist dictator manana

  • Clavos

    From what I’ve read, it seems pretty likely.

    Where’s William Walker??

  • Now there’s the kind of filibustering we need more of – good old William Walker style.


  • troll

    *Where’s William Walker??*

    his pirate’s blood is on the wall…in Honduras I believe

  • troll

    (but I understand that his incarnation – the traitor North – has been hard at work in Nicaragua again appearing with
    US backed candidate Jose Rizo)

  • Wow, the fact that North could be considered a campaign asset in Nicaragua in what by all accounts is a fair election says something amazingly positive about our supposedly disreputable foreign policy of that era.


  • Hannity Limbaugh

    “amazingly positive”?

    Let’s remember that North is a convicted felon, a disgrace to the uniform he’s no longer allowed to wear, a criminal who not only violated congressional law, but imported cocaine in alliance with organized crime to finance the guns for hostages deal with Iran.

    You might want to read all that again, and check the transcripts of the Iran-Contra hearings from C-SPAN.

    North and the entire cabal involved in that fiasco were the first symptoms of the cancer that has infected the Republican party. That the Republican leadership embraces him, and hires ex-Admiral Poindexter, another convicted felon in the Iran-Contra affair, shows how morally bankrupt the party has become.

  • troll

    al contrario – perhaps his participation is an unspoken reminder of the horrors of the Contra era and a smug threat of the possibility of its return

  • HL, that was amazing in the sense that I’m amazed to see Nicaraguans viewing North as a positive figure.

    Yes, it was all illegal and many bad things were done, but apparently from the Nicaraguan perspective the fact that they were done for a good reason is enough for them.

    As for this having anything to do with the problems in the GOP you’re very confused. The problems in the GOP are real, but they come from entirely different sources, and I am more and more convinced they’re going to be purged after this election.


  • Oh, and as for the horrors of the Contra era, those horrors were on both sides, and despite leftist revisionism the Sandinistas are hardly the heroes of the story.


  • troll

    and why does it surprise you that groups of Contra members and sympathizers – Rizo’s primary backers – would view North as anything other than a hero – ?

    as for your straw man that pesky leftist revisionist I’ll leave it to you to duke it out with him whoever he might be

  • troll

    erp – should read ‘…view North as a hero – ?’

  • Lumpy

    Ollie North may be a criminal in the eyes of the law, but in the eyes of a lot of folks he was a hero who put duty above his own welfare and did good work for the cause of liberty.

  • Nancy

    Yeah, I suppose some folks felt that way about Quisling, Ben Arnold, and others of that ilk; invariably there are some so brainless that traitors & villains are heroes to their warped way of thinking.

  • Nancy, from the perspective of the British our founding fathers were traitors and villains.

    For that matter, when Navy Undersecretary Teddy Roosevelt ordered Dewey to Manilla without authority from the President or Congress, starting a war with Spain, that could well have been considered an act of treason, but instead he got elected president a few years later.


  • Martin Lav

    “have you ever seen ME blame Clinton for anything?”

    Dave Nalle

    Yes I have, you blamed Clinton for the rise of right-wing militias and fall of the stock market in 2001……

  • Martin Lav

    “Hard to believe that Nicaraguans can’t remember the incompetence and corruption of the Ortega government.”-Dave Nalle

    Hard to believe that Americans can’t remember the incompetence and corruption of the Bush Government. – Martin Lav

  • Nancy

    ROTFLOL-! Watch out, Dave!

  • JustOneMan

    Martin Lav

    Hard to believe the incompetence of the lefy wing loons who post here. – JustOneMan

  • Martin Lav

    It’s a sign of the times JoM.
    Aren’t you one of them now?

  • JustOneMan

    Thanks for the reminder -hey thats right I keep forgetting that I am now a “left-wing, early term abortion baby killing, blame America first blamer,cut and running, interspecies marraige supporting, Haliburtom hating, Rove ranting” moron!

    Back on the left….JustOneMan

  • troll

    (well…you chose the correct noun anyway)

  • Yes I have, you blamed Clinton for the rise of right-wing militias and fall of the stock market in 2001…..

    No, Martin. Go back and read what I actually wrote, not what you read into it. Clinton didn’t cause the rise of right-wing militias by anything he did. It’s just that his presence in the White House was part of what created an environment which was friendly to their emergence. As for the fall of the stock market in 2001 Clinton was no more responsible for that than he was for the tech boom, as I’ve pointed out before.


  • Zedd


    What characteristics of Bush would you have us evaluate.

    If it’s not his manor
    Not his statements
    Not his policies

    What would you rather we evaluate??

  • Zedd, are you talking to me? I haven’t said anything in this article or thread about evaluating Bush. Did you mean to post your questions somewhere else?

    Just to be helpful, I agree that Bush should be judged mainly on his policies. What else would one judge him on?


  • jayson

    “Missouri has a long history of voter fraud and election problems going back centuries…”
    Centuries? Is that a fact…?
    Missouri became a territory in 1812 and became a state in 1821. Let’s see, that’s 1812-2006, makes a century and–assuming that your fraud started right away. Or perhaps you’re referring to Native American voter fraud?

  • Martin Lav

    Davey me boy…..

    You wrote this:

    “Go back and read what I actually wrote, not what you read into it.”

    and then you wrote this:

    “Clinton didn’t cause the rise of right-wing militias by anything he did.”

    but then added this:

    “It’s just that his presence in the White House was part of what created an environment which was friendly to their emergence.”

    So the mere presence of Clinton or a democrat is enough to cause this country harm eh?

    Better start fortifying that pimped out duck blind, cause they’s coming to gitcha hunny!

  • Jayson, read some history sometime. St. Louis was first settled in 1699 by the French. That does indeed give Missouri ‘centuries’ of history, and yes election fraud there started pretty early on. And BTW, 1812 to 2006 is pretty much TWO centuries, not one. Good math skills. Did you go to government school?

    So the mere presence of Clinton or a democrat is enough to cause this country harm eh?

    Sadly, in the mind of many Americans, that’s all it takes, Martin. Put a statist socialist elitist in the White House and those who are inclined to form militias will be out in the woods drilling.


  • Martin Lav

    Came in from the woods eh Dave?

  • Clavos

    What characteristics of Bush would you have us evaluate.

    If it’s not his manor

    He has a manor? I thought it was just a ranch.

    Oh, maybe you mean the WH?

  • Thanks for the facts, Dave.

    Joe Slovo (mail):
    Just a couple of things:

    –First off we should note that ACORN itself first flagged the suspect cards 3 weeks ago and fired the workers for committing fraud.

    –Second, ACORN itself turned the cards into the BOE because MO law requires it to turn in every card collected, even if they suspect the cards are fraudulent.

    –In so doing ACORN also told the BOE the names of the fired workers and assisted in moving the legal process forward. They did the same thing when the FBI started investigating.

    In other words, ACORN itself uncovered the fraud in KC and started the legal proceedings, subsequently cooperating with all aspects of the investigation. It feels as aggreived as the BOE.

    Also, it should be noted that all investigations of previous fraud allegations have all cleared the organization of wrongdoing and in MN and CO resulted in prosecution of workers fired by ACORN for fraud. The worst charges, all in FL, were dismissed by a FL judge with prejudice.

    Finally, for some reason, Instapundit has taken the number 35,000, which refers to the number of cards collected by ACORN in the KC region this year, and applied it to allegations of the number of cards considered to be fraudulent. This is either sloppy reporting or a deliberate distortion.

    Here’s the text of the statement ACORN released in conjunction with the indictments.

    FOR IMMEDIATE RELEASE: November 1, 2006
    For more information contact: Kevin Whelan 985-960-1108


    Kansas City, MO – Leaders of the community group ACORN today applauded the FBI for the steps it is taking to investigate individuals suspected in several cases of possible voter registration fraud that the group reported to authorities during a recent ACORN voter registration drive in the Kansas City area.

    The individuals under investigation were temporary workers, hired–and later fired—by Kansas City ACORN (Association of Community Organizations for Reform Now) to help in its large-scale voter registration drive, which helps thousands of Kansas City residents register to vote.

    ACORN took the initiative on October 11 to contact the Kansas City Board of Elections and the Jackson County Prosecutor when the organization’s standard review process identified suspicious voter registration applications. ACORN provided to the Board and the prosecutor a letter with the name and contact information of the former employees who had collected the suspicious application. ACORN then facilitated the subsequent FBI inquiry by providing internal records documenting ACORN’s suspicion and other information as requested.. ACORN will continue to provide its full support and cooperation in the investigation.

    “When we caught this misconduct, we reporter it to the authorities. Now we want to see these folks prosecuted to the full extent of the law, because they have defrauded our organization, and, worse, detracted from our mission of ensuring that citizens in our community participate in the democratic process,” said Claudia Harris, Chairperson of Kansas City ACORN

    “Like the FBI, ACORN considers any interference in the voting process to be a very serious matter,” Harris continued. “Across the state our attorneys today reached a settlement with the St. Louis Board of Elections to issue a retraction of the intimidating letter they sent out to thousands of voters we registered. Vigilance is needed to make sure that Scott Leindecker’s St. Louis Board of Elections does not engage in any other dirty tricks to suppress the African American vote.”

    ACORN’s voter registration drives are committed to one objective: Registration of eligible low-income and minority citizens who wish to vote and have their votes counted. In the past year, ACORN has helped tens of thousands of Missouri residents register to vote. As part of ACORN’s voter registration program, ACORN has a comprehensive quality control that reviews all application for completeness and accuracy and calls applicants to verify their information. It was this process that identified the individuals who were referred to the Board and Prosecutors.
    11.2.2006 2:50pm

  • Put an end to all this liberal left-wing spin!

    UPDATED: Four ACORN workers indicted in Kansas City
    By Jo Mannies
    Wednesday, Nov. 01 2006

    According to the Kansas City Star, the U.S. attorney’s office over there has just announced it has indicted four workers with ACORN for “providing false information to the Kansas City Election Board, and…filing a false voter application with the board.”

    Each offense carries a penalty of up to five years in prison and a fine of $250,000; anyone found guilty also loses their right to vote.

    ACORN, which stands for the Association of Community Organizations for Reform Now, has come under fire in a number of states — and the city of St. Louis — over allegedly fraudulent voter registrations.

    ACORN national spokesman Kevin Whelan said the group actually had been responsible for three of the indictments. “We caught them; we turned them in,’’ he said. “We’re pleased that the FBI was able to bring these indictments and we provided them with information that helped with the investigation.”

    ACORN provided a copy of the letter it had sent to Kansas City authorities on Oct. 11.

    ACORN officials have maintained that they welcome any arrests of workers found to have committed fraud, but that they don’t want such problems to take away from the legitimate registrations honest workers have turned in.

    ACORN sent out a release earlier Wednesday, saying that its workers in St. Louis plan on “knocking on 150,000 doors — three times on Election Day — to get out the vote!”

    Meanwhile, the U.S. Attorney’s office here Catherine Hanaway, U.S. attorney for Missouri’s Eastern District, said Wednesday that her office has set up a hotline for people reporting possible election fraud or voter discrimination in connection with Tuesday’s election. The number is 314-539-7733.

    Assistant U.S. Attorney John Bodenhausen, an assistant U.S. attorney, will coordinate the office’s efforts, which are part of the Justice Department’s nationwide Election Day Program.

    Complaints about ballot access problems or discrimination can also be made directly to the Civil Rights Division’s Voting Section in Washington at 1-800-253-3931 or 202-307-2767.

  • Jayson, you might want to read the comment policy.

    As for ACORN, are you familiar with the phrase “Methinks thou dost protest too much?”

    Every organization accused of a crime is going to be quick to dissassociate itself from the criminals and practice some CYA. That’s all that’s going on here. They found out their workers were going to be indicted and fired them to create the appearance that they were cleaning house on their own.

    Now, perhaps you’d like to address the instances of registration fraud by ACORN in Ohio, Pennsylvania, New Mexico, Texas, Arkansas, Virginia, North Carolina, Georgia, Florida, Minnesota, Colorado, Tennessee and Wisconsin? My favorite is the case where ACORN was paying registration workers in crack cocaine in Ohio.

    You might want to spend some time at http://www.rottenACORN.com just for a start.


  • Dave,
    I’m hardly interested in addressing any other cases of alleged or proven voter fraud on the part of ACORN any more than you are for perceived radical right wing groups and parties. The point is that you framed this in a way that obfuscated the coverage of the story. But you know that.

    As for your hilarious history lesson in #89, nice retro-fitting. Dave, don’t read A book. Read lots and lots of them, even those that don’t give you the pleasure of wish-fulfillment. If you cared to define your terms and use language carefully you wouldn’t have the opportunity to exaggerate and obfuscate, so carry on. Statehood, territory, “what is today Missouri,” etc. Please. And such statements are of course meaningless without some comparison to voter fraud elsewhere. Have you been reading the histories of national voter fraud (I mean, of course, other than the “radical right-wing fascist” ones)?