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Should America Stop Immigration?

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In an op-ed piece entitled “Stop All Immigration Into America”, published in The American Daily, Frosty Wooldridge emphatically declares that multiculturalism is a failure. He goes on to say that America should close its borders to all immigrants.

He says:

These new immigrants arrive from totally incompatible cultures. They are the seeds of cancer sewn into our social fabric that will eventually destroy our nation. Again, when the rate of immigration exceeds the rate of assimilation, it is a recipe for the annihilation of our civilization.

So is he right? In my opinion, no. Immigration has been a positive force in American society, not a negative. Yes, some immigrants are loath to adopt our language and culture. Yes, educating immigrant students is getting increasingly expensive. Yes, they sometimes take American jobs at lower wages. All of these things might be true, but immigrants have brought more to us then they have taken away.

When we think of Immigrants, we think of the people who cross the border illegally and take jobs away from America. We forget about the legal immigrants who come here hoping for a better life. Just who are these immigrants? Well here are some examples:

  • Frank McCourt (Ireland), Author, winner of the Pulitzer Prize for Angela’s Ashes.
  • Andrew Grove (Hungary), Founder, Intel Corp.
  • Max Frankel (Germany), Editor, New York Times
  • Oscar de la Renta (Dominican Republic), Fashion Designer
  • Bjarne Stroustrup (Denmark), Inventor of the C++ Programming Language
  • Jenny Ming (Macau), CEO, Old Navy
  • Madeleine Albright (Czech Republic), Former U.S. Secretary of State
  • Andy Garcia (Cuba), Actor
  • Carlos Santana (Mexico), Musician
  • Albert Einstein (Germany), Physicist
[ADBLOCKHERE]I think that very short list should serve to demonstrate how much we’ve gained from immigration. We can’t allow fear of terrorism and a growing sense of isolationism prevent America from staying great. Immigration brings with it fresh blood, fresh ideas, and new ways of looking at the world. We need immigration to keep us vibrant.

(Originally published in Left to My Own Devices)

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About Joe

  • http://www.roblogpolitics.blogspot.com RJ Elliott

    “when the rate of immigration exceeds the rate of assimilation, it is a recipe for the annihilation of our civilization”

    Makes a good little rhyme…

  • http://selfaudit.blogspot.com Aaman

    Where did my comment go?

  • http://expatriatemenu.blogspot.com alpha

    Let us not forget my grandfather. He came from Palestine after Poland by way of England after deserting from the Turkish army into which he had been impressed. He had been a professor at the U. of Jerusalem and ended up a rabbi in Tampa, Florida. Not Einstein. Just another of the millions of people who made America.

    There were plenty of the same people then who said things like “when the rate of immigration…” They were afraid that the: Irish, German, Jewish, Russian, Chines, Japanese, Vietnamese, Cuban, Mexican, Haitian immigrants would destroy “our civilization”. So far it is only on the verge of destruction by the George Bushes and Pat Robertsons of the world (and the Al Sharptons, of course).

    There seems to be a continuum of politics that meets in a grand circle with the crazies of the right cancelling out the crazies of the left. Time for some traditional moderation in modern day America.

    Remember that when the rate of immigration equals the need for new workers, thinkers and consumers, America grows stronger.

  • http://murasaki.blog-city.com Purple Tigress

    First we should eliminate all the people from all the cultures that are incompatible with the original American cultures and send them back to where their ancestors came.

    That would take care of the original critic, I think.

    There were two anti-immigration acts targeting Asians, specifically the Japanese and the Chinese. These were eliminated because of World War II alliance with the Chinese during WWII and changing opinions toward Japanese (and an influx of Japanese war brides) after WWII. When these anti-immigration acts were in place, immigration flowed to Latin American countries, including Peru and Brazil. Apparently, these countries didn’t feel these people were cancer to their civilization.

    California was originally invaded by the Spanish. I suggest that this means that the immigrants who would have the most in common with the Southwest would be those from Spain, Portugal and Latin American countries.

    As another rice culture (going on the WWII debate between rice eaters and bread eaters), perhaps Asians would be a better fit for the Southwest.

    Assimilation is relative. Not all areas, not all cities are predominately WASP.

  • Bing

    That’s a nice little list in your post Joer but for every name on i there are hundreds of illegals who have committed violent crimes, gotten healthcare without paying a dime, worked here and not paid taxes and sent the money to another country, and so on.

    Lately you liberals have been whining about the rule of law as it pertains to the whole wiretapping incident with Bush. So I find it hypocritical that you keep playing your semantic games by referring to the illegal aliens in this country as “immigrants” or “undocumented workers.” The bottom line is that they have come here illegally and have no right to be here. End of story.

  • Maurice

    Stopping immigration seems unreasonable. Controlling immigration makes sense. I would never stop my kids from having friends over to our house. I do regulate how many at one time and forbid some because of behavior problems.

  • tommyd

    The Immigration Act of 1965 has been an absolute disaster for the United States of America. Multiculturalism is a failing disgrace. It doesn’t feel like America anymore, but more like a Third World country with a remnant of First World infrastructure….which is deteriorating quickly since all our tax money goes to welfare and warfare.

    We never needed the recent Third World immigrants but the corporations and business owners wanted them all, and we know who calls the shots in the U$A, don’t we?

  • http://www.richardbrodie.com/ Richard Brodie

    That’s a nice little list in your post Joe but for every name on i there are hundreds of illegals who have committed violent crimes, gotten healthcare without paying a dime, worked here and not paid taxes and sent the money to another country, and so on.

    And conversely, for every name on his list there are hundreds of thousands of NON-immigrants who have made equally significant contributions. Our own citizens may not have contributed in exactly the same way, but the “contributions” of immigrants would not be missed. In fact in most cases their achievements would simply have been made in other countries. We wouldn’t be able to engage in collective bragging about how they were American achievements, but so what? With the exception of the dubious benefits of those who become politicians, we would be able to enjoy the fruits of them nevertheless.

    I agree with Woolridge. The time is way overdue to shut the borders. The land is all taken now. We’re filled up. We don’t need millions of homesteaders anymore. Those who continue to pour in are clogging our country, with two, three, or more families moving into the same house, turning our roads into parking lots, swamping our health care, shcools, and welfare systems to the point of collapse, etc.

    I’d be willing to bet that most of those who are in favor of wide open borders and no limits are single people who aren’t struggling with raising families. Even these reality-insulated people would have to admit that there have to be some limits. There are six billion people in the world. Should we have a couple of hundred billion dollar budget to finance the importation of several tens of millions of new immigrants every year, in order to accelerate the process of becoming a completely balkanized third world country? If we don’t start thinking outside the confines of all the worn out bullshit PC platitudes, then that’s exactly the kind of a mess we’re going to be leaving for our children to inherit.

  • http://leftistjoe.blogspot.com Joseph Johaneman

    That’s a nice little list in your post Joer but for every name on i there are hundreds of illegals who have committed violent crimes, gotten healthcare without paying a dime, worked here and not paid taxes and sent the money to another country, and so on.

    Yeah, but my point is this: We gain more from immigration than we lose. Unless you’re 100% Native American, you come from immigrant stock. The infrastructure of America, like the railroad system, was built by immigrants. The cities were built by immigrants. (Which is why New York and other cities have a Chinatown, a Little Italy, etc.)

    Lately you liberals have been whining about the rule of law as it pertains to the whole wiretapping incident with Bush.

    I’m not really a liberal. I’m more leftist than most liberals. And questioning Bush’s illegal wiretaps is not whining. It’s enganging in our first amendment right to free speech, a distinction most Repubicans can’t see, and something this administration would like very much to go away. If Bush could burn the bill of rights on the steps of the Supreme court, he would. The Patriot Act is proof of that. It directly assails the 1st, the 4th, the 5th, the 6th, and the 8th amendments. It also goes after the 14th amendment, which provides equal protection under the law, citizen or not.

    The bottom line is, immigration is a positive force in the growth of our nation. It always has been, and it always will be.

  • gonzo marx

    how about we stop illegal Immigration and then take it from there?

    nuff said?

    Excelsior!

  • Bing

    Joe you keep making refernces to immigrants from the early 1900’s. The current crop of aliens for the most part isn’t exactly the same caliber as those who immigrated here and “bulit the railroads.” They are far less beneificial to American society.

    I don’t believe that we benefit more than suffer from the current crop of illegals. They are a drain on our economy and a plague on our culture. I know english isn’t the offical language of America but considering that what most of us have traditionally spoke and still speak, it should be. I’m so sick of the special treatment for spanish speaking people. If you want to come to here you sdhould speak english and if not too bad. And no this does not make me a racist or any other negative label you libs wanna put on me. Do you think any other nation would tolerate the crap we put up with here? If you went to france and expected everyone to cater to you in English I’d love to see how far you got.

    They’re not “undocumented workers, they’re not “immigrants,” they are ‘ILLEGAL ALIENS,” and they are a problem that needs to be dealt wiht with a firm hand.

  • http://www.richardbrodie.com/ Richard Brodie

    Do you think any other nation would tolerate the crap we put up with here?

    Certainly not Mexico. They deal very harshly with people trying to violate their sovereignty by sneaking in across THEIR southern border from Central America. If you can’t sing the Mexican national anthem, they’ll put you in jail and throw the key away. And there’s no MCLU to try and support the phony claim of invaders to be treated with the same rights as citizens!

    Then the fucking hypocrites have the gall to throw a fit when they find out that WE are going to get serious about building a wall all the way from the Gulf of Mexico to the Pacific, to keep THEM from overruning our country.

  • IgnatiusReilly

    “Certainly not Mexico.”

    Then how do you explain all the Central Americans that make their way into the country? Do they swim around?

  • http://www.richardbrodie.com/ Richard Brodie

    Then how do you explain all the Central Americans that make their way into the country?

    You mean like the Los Angeles MS-13 gang that is believed to have already smuggled in Al Qaida operatives with nuclear bomb making materials in preparation for operation American Hiroshima?

    Because they don’t catch all of them, obviously. Plus they are corrupt and easily suceptible to bribery.

  • Bing

    Exactly Richard there’s no MCLU and Mexico is a third world shithole where the law only works for the highest bidder.

    I have no idea why American liberals liek the ACLU have such a hard-on for illegal aliens but could care less about the rights of American citizens. Take the minutemen for example. The ACLu has pulled out every trick in the leftist playbook from labelling the minute as racists to claiming the rights of the “undocumented workers” have been violated by the minutmen reporting thier illegal activity. When these illegals cross they are not only breaking laws upon entering the country illegally but they are also often tresspassing on private property of many of the American citizens whose homes are on the border. Why isn’t the ACLU whining about thier rights?

    Face it these people are a problem and until the majority of the American population gets pissed enough nothing will be done about it.

  • http://selfaudit.blogspot.com Aaman

    #15 is Racist offensive

  • Bing

    How is it racist?

  • http://selfaudit.blogspot.com Aaman

    Mexico is a third world shithole is a compliment?

  • http://theugliestamerican.blogspot.com Andy Marsh

    I’ll ask the same question. How is #15 racist?

  • http://theugliestamerican.blogspot.com Andy Marsh

    it ain’t racist!

  • http://theugliestamerican.blogspot.com Andy Marsh

    it might be derogatory, even if it is true, but it’s not racist!

  • Bing

    It’s not racist but Aaman being a good liberal resorts to name calling when he cannot refute an argument with his own valid counterargument.

    Racist: def: a conservative winning an argument with a liberal

  • http://selfaudit.blogspot.com Aaman

    I’m glad I’m not a racist then, of any stripe.

  • http://theugliestamerican.blogspot.com Andy Marsh

    Hey – I used to live 5 miles from TJ…trust me…it’s a third world shithole, as are most border towns in mexico…thriving on underage college kids or sailors in the case of tijuana(sp), spending money on cheap tequilla and cheaper hookers!

  • http://www.futonreport.net/ Matthew T. Sussman

    Bing, you sure won all right.

  • http://alienboysworld.blogspot.com/ Christopher Rose

    The issue here on this post is “Should America Stop Immigration?”

    As an experiment in comment space civility, I am taking it upon myself to direct this conversation, suitably dressed for going out in public, back to that topic. There has been enough baiting and biting for one day guys and Bing, we’ve all understood your perspective towards tolerance, which is what people who fear it call liberal, so I’d like you to holster that particular blunderbuss, OK?

    I trust I am making myself clear, gentlemen? All complaints to the usual places!

    Thank you for your thoughtful co-operation.

  • http://selfaudit.blogspot.com Aaman

    On that note, what would a country built on immigration be without it? Rather toothless, even more so in an era of declining demographic forces.

  • http://theugliestamerican.blogspot.com Andy Marsh

    sorry…

  • http://theugliestamerican.blogspot.com Andy Marsh

    as gonzo said earlier…stop ILLEGAL immigration.

  • Bing

    My perspective toward tolerance?

    You’re damn right. I have no tolerance for people sneakign across the border illegally.

    I have no tolerance for the ACLU who doesn’t give a shit about people who were born and raised in America, pay taxes, pay for thier healthcare and obey the law but then bitches and whines and files numerous lawsuits on behalf of illegal aliens who actually have no rights under American law.

    “Tolerance is the virtue of a man without convictions.”- Gilbert J. Christensen

    So take your prespective on my lack of “tolerance” and shove it up your ass Christopher.

  • http://darkeroticism.blogspot.com swingingpuss

    For a change I’d like a Native American to take a stand here and ask the pilgrims to pack their illegal bags and return whence they came from ;)

  • http://selfaudit.blogspot.com Aaman

    Nah, they’re too tolerant

  • http://theugliestamerican.blogspot.com Andy Marsh

    they can have it back when they can take it back…if they want to inherit it…they must stay meek!

  • http://theugliestamerican.blogspot.com Andy Marsh

    so christopher…tolerance is a liberal word???

  • IgnatiusReilly

    “where the law only works for the highest bidder.”

    Does that make America a shithole as well?

  • http://theugliestamerican.blogspot.com Andy Marsh

    no offense, but you’re always welcome to leave…I mean, we are talking about open borders here!

  • http://darkeroticism.blogspot.com swingingpuss

    Meek? All they need to do is have more American homes built over their burial grounds then its just a matter of time.

  • http://theugliestamerican.blogspot.com Andy Marsh

    All they need to do is build a couple more places like foxwoods and they’ll have all my money anyway!

  • http://darkeroticism.blogspot.com swingingpuss

    Lol, Good one Andy

  • Bennett

    Calling Mexico a shithole may not be racist, but lumping all those imigrating (legally) from South America as inferior to Irish or Italiian or Chinese imigrants IS racist.

    You said “The current crop of aliens for the most part isn’t exactly the same caliber as those who immigrated here and “bulit the railroads.” They are far less beneificial to American society.”

    That generalization is a huge load of racist crap.

  • http://theugliestamerican.blogspot.com Andy Marsh

    well then, he should have said comment #11 was racist.

  • JR

    Comment #15 is not racist. It could more accurately be described as *chauvinistic.

    *It’s French, [Deleted]

  • gonzo marx

    ok…on illegal Immigration…

    here’s the thing, you can’t really blame those coming into the country for wanting a better life and trying to do right by their families…almost all of our Ancestors did the same thing

    the problem is the illegal part

    no matter how big a wall you build, they will find their way around it and keep coming until you remove the Incentive for them to do so illegally

    soooOOOooOOOoooo…howabout we start holding those the HIRE them legally accountable?

    it is already against the Law to do so, frmo both the perspective of the INS as well as a simple matter of Security for our Nation

    so how about we start enforcing the Law seriously….hold those that get caught hiring illegals to the same fines that our Government invoked for…oh…Janet Jackson’s booby?

    a bit over $500,000 PER INCIDENT!

    as well as the applicable jail time for those Responsible for violating the Federal Laws surrounding hiring folks without proper ID and evading tax Laws

    that would stop a lot fo this shit right in it’s tracks, and place the businesses operating Legally back on an even footing against those who are currently violating the Law

    fair enough?

    Excelsior!

  • http://murasaki.blog-city.com Purple Tigress

    I don’t think one can consider, given the recent rioting, that France is the lead to follow.

    As for railroads, many of those people were used and treated as less than human. Afterward, they were not wanted, becoming part of the unwanted immigrants and of the Chinese and Japanese, part of the yellow peril on the West Coast.

  • http://leftistjoe.blogspot.com Joseph Johaneman

    soooOOOooOOOoooo…howabout we start holding those the HIRE them legally accountable?

    Seems fair to me. I’m not supportive of illegal immigration, I’m just against no immigration at all.

  • http://leftistjoe.blogspot.com Joseph Johaneman

    Our own citizens may not have contributed in exactly the same way, but the “contributions” of immigrants would not be missed. In fact in most cases their achievements would simply have been made in other countries. We wouldn’t be able to engage in collective bragging about how they were American achievements, but so what?

    Okay, I’ll give you a primary historical example of “so what?” During WWII, the influx of German scientists helped us develop the atomic bomb before Germany. Just imagine if our borders were closed. Germany would have gotten the A-Bomb first, and we would have been in serious trouble.

    The current influx of immigrants is no different. What if there’s an Albert Einstein among them, or a Louis Pasteur? Do we dare take the chance of not letting such a person in? Any immigrant infant that comes in now may develop the cure for AIDS or a new way of fighting cancer, or a new weapon that’ll protect us. Personally, I think the potential benefits outweigh any possible negative consequences.

  • gonzo marx

    well Joseph, i think we have an agreement…as long as it is LEGAL immigration, i have no problems

    Full Disclosure: my mother’s grandparents all came here from Ireland aroudn the turn of the century and my father’s parents came here from Holland months before the Nazi’s took the country…

    ALL of them came via Ellis Island, quite legally

    i would that any new Americans did the same

    Excelsior!

  • JR

    Wow, you can’t even quote Stephen Colbert around here without getting censored. This place has gotten worse than network TV.

  • http://alienboysworld.blogspot.com/ Christopher Rose

    Andy: I don’t quite get your #34 but what I was saying is that, in retrospect it seems like the Republican Party has been trying to roll back many of the social advances that broke through as society liberalised in the 50s and 60s.

    Given that increased tolerance and a more educated, affluent and relaxed civil society is a hard thing to object to, some clever little wonk came up with the idea of smearing that school of thought with the use of the word liberal in an effective attempt to undermine it by associating it with the alternative cultural values to which nobody under the age of about 60 can possibly be unaware. I can’t see any value in such an attempt, nor what right it is of government to address such issues in that way.

    In case you’re wondering, I don’t see myself as either liberal or conservative, I just want to get the necessary work done and see little reason why the state should interfere in how people live their all too brief lives.

    I’ve allowed Bing’s ugly little outburst in #30 to stand, simply because it is so wonderfully maniacally excessive as to undermine all credibility and he clearly fails to understand the role of the ACLU . It is the last time I extend that courtesy to him, from now on double secret comment editing rules apply to Bing. And Crosby. And Stills. And Nash too. But not Young!

    There are many serious political issues which don’t get the attention they deserve because of the general climate of contentiousness that exists in US politics and given the importance of how your country conducts itself, I think it vital that the bar be set a little higher than childish namecalling.

    With that in mind, does anybody seriously expect the United States to do anything about it’s Immigration policies? Any thoughts on the longstanding green card lottery policy , which seems to do little except generate a whole load of near fraudulent websites and a flood of half-baked spam?

  • JR

    Self-righteous paternalism. I knew we had a better reason for slaughtering those redcoats than just a lousy tea tax.

  • Bennett

    I’m with gonzo and Joseph. Let anyone who wants to imigrate come in through Ellis Island. But they must have basic English language skills in order to become anything but temporary.

    Citizenship? You must speak English first.

    Other than that one requirement, I don’t care WHAT culture the immigrant comes from. My mother’s side came from Hungaria and Czechoslovakia, they learned English and prospered.

    I grew up with Latinos (and Phillipinos, Koreans, and Japanese – a middle class Navy town) who worked as hard and played as hard as anyone else. When you have friends and enemies of all shades and cultural backgrounds, the skin shade loses any meaning.

    I think it was a great way to grow up.

  • Clubhouse Cancer

    My grandmothers, grandfather and great grandfather all came to the United States from other countries. I’m glad no bloggers were screaming “Close the borders!” then.

  • Alec

    Frosty Wooldridge’s column is so weirdly beside the point that you wonder why he bothered to write it, and why anyone would waste their time reading it. The issue is not immigration, per se, but illegal immigration, but even here Woolridge should be thrown on the dustbin of history since the Bush Administration is addicted to the notion of de facto open borders in order to supply businesses with an endless supply of cheap labor, while Democrats foolishly believe that hordes of illegal immigrants will be forever subservient to Democratic Party paternalism. The bottom line is that both political parties are doing everything they can to increase the flow of immigrants to this country, either under the guise of guest worker programs or outright amnesty programs. By the way, the Bush Administration guest-worker policy will continue to destroy the middle class by pushing wages lower, but conservatives and brain-dead libertarians are so in love with the brand of authoritarian oligarchy that Bush and Cheney peddle so seductively that they willingly embrace self-destruction.

    On the other hand, the idea that current immigrants are somehow incompatible with “American values,” is little more than noxious fear mongering. The sad fact is that gangs and gang mentality has been exported from the US to Mexico and Central America. And study after study documents how immigrant children with traditional social values are seduced by the crassest American emphasis on materialism and cynicism. Even a conservative commentator like Dennis Prager has noted that every day, thousands of American women bring Latino men and women into their homes to do work without fear of being assaulted or molested, even though behaving the same way toward many native-born Americans would be equivalent to signing their own death warrant.

  • http://www.richardbrodie.com/ Richard Brodie

    JJ says: The current influx of immigrants is no different. What if there’s an Albert Einstein among them, or a Louis Pasteur? Do we dare take the chance of not letting such a person in?

    That’s just plain stupid. We have no way of knowing which of the world’s six billion people might be Einsteins or Pasteurs, So your question should be:

    Do we dare take the chance of not letting all six billion immigrate, just so we don’t miss out on getting certain potentially special intellects into America?

    You go on to say:

    Any immigrant infant that comes in now may develop the cure for AIDS or a new way of fighting cancer, or a new weapon that’ll protect us. Personally, I think the potential benefits outweigh any possible negative consequences.

    You have no idea what the potential benefits might be, if any, or what the negative consequences might be, and yet you have such a firm conviction that the former outweigh the latter! Well, you better start realizing that one of the negative consequences of allowing this country to be swamped by an unprecedented tidal wave of what you yourself have admitted to be “expensive to educate” immigrants, is that educational prospects will be reduced for the children OF OUR OWN CITIZENS, as limited educational resources are redirected away from THEM in order to be able to cater to immigrant education. What if there would have been a potential Einstein or Pasteur among THEM? Do we dare dilute the educational opportunities that would otherwise have been available for OUR OWN CHILDREN, so that we can fund education for the children of immigrants?

  • http://www.richardbrodie.com/ Richard Brodie

    CR says: it seems like the Republican Party has been trying to roll back many of the social advances that broke through as society liberalised in the 50s and 60s

    Some of us don’t share your view that what “broke through” represented “advances”, in any sense other than the trivial fact that the resulting “liberalised” state of society was chronologically later than the preceding more conservativised one!

  • http://bacalar.blogspot.com alpha

    Careful guys. I live in Mexico and my Spanish is sort of fluent but if the Migraciòn demands total fluency for my yearly visa I would have to find another country. And the US is out since it is far too expensive for retired people without gigantic incomes and too conservative and crazy under the present administration to be much less corrupt than the Third World.

    Besides, I hate racism and just read a whole bunch of it right here. It is why I left the south for New York 45 years ago. It seems to rear its ugly head more and more in the climate of fear engendered by the horrors of 9/11. But it was Arab crazies who did that; not Spanish speakers.

    Did some of these “minutemen” forget that little fact? If they want to wax unenthusiastic about immigrants, they should at least get the continent right. The bad guys live in the Middle East.

  • http:ruvysroost.blogspot.com Ruvy in Jerusalem

    As someone who has left you fair shores, and is not likely ever to return, I want to remind you of a few things that most of you can’t see from where you are.

    America has this huge calling card in New York Harbor called the Statue of Liberty. It has a reputation for being a place where one can make good money and live under a relatively honest government.

    “Give me your hungry, your poor, your tired masses yearning to breathe free…”

    It doesn’t say they have to be there legally.

    Its culture is exported all over the world. Its language is the imperial language of the planet.

    In his first novel, Sir Arthur Conan Doyle said of London, the imperial capital of its day, that all the garbage of the empire drifted in. If you wish, look at America as a present day version of London, circa 1880.

    Finally, your government presently takes the view that cheap labor is more important than secure borders.

    And now I’ll speak my views, knowing that they will be unwelcome at best.

    Open immigration has the disadvantage of pushing down wages and imposing large costs on the social welfare system. That squeezes the resources of everybody who has already “made it.”

    It requires an ethic and a vision that says that all comers are welome to take their best shot in a land of opportunity. In the short run, that policy stinks. In the long run, the US will stay on top of the planet by having the most energetic, enterprising people living there. That is what immigrants are. No matter where they are from.

    In the long run, you will remain a powerful empire because of that policy, as little as you may like it. And, I might add, as little as I may like it.

    But the choice is for you who live there and have to pay the taxes to make. Unfortunately, I and my fellows here (and even my enemies) live in the shadow of an empire that grows more evil daily.

  • Bing

    No Bennet it wasn’t racist. The simple facts are that those who emigrated in the early 1900’s paid taxes and obeyed the law more so than those coming here illegally now. That’s a fact and all the names you wanna label me can’t change that fact.

    Don’t you race baiters ever get tired of being wrong Bennet? it must be exhausting.

  • Clubhouse Cancer

    Bing, these “simple facts” must be proveable, or they;re hardly simple. Please explain your source for the fact that immigrants of the early 1900s “paid taxes and obeyed the law more so than those coming here now.”

  • http://leftistjoe.blogspot.com Joseph Johaneman

    Well, you better start realizing that one of the negative consequences of allowing this country to be swamped by an unprecedented tidal wave of what you yourself have admitted to be “expensive to educate” immigrants, is that educational prospects will be reduced for the children OF OUR OWN CITIZENS, as limited educational resources are redirected away from THEM in order to be able to cater to immigrant education.

    Okay, this one gets my goat just a little. See, I don’t think we should value citizens over legal immigrants. A person is a person, regardless of whether they were born here or not. In fact, the Supreme Court has said again and again that the 14th amendment allows anyone on our soil the same protection as a citizen.

    Send the illegals home, but we should not close our borders entirely. That would be stupid. Countries with strict immigration laws are finding that out as their population ages out, and they find it necessary to import workers.

    Everyone’s ancestors (unless your 100% Native American) came from somewhere else. So, anyone who says we should close our borders is saying their ancestors shouldn’t have come either, in my opinion.

    We should stop the illegals, but we should never, ever, close our borders entirely. That would be one of the worst things we could possibly do to our country. We would stagnate. We would eventually lose our dominance in the world. We would become a second rate power as our population aged out and we could not find enough workers to take the available jobs. Legal immigrants help us, not hinder us. I agree that illegals shouldn’t be here, but I will never agree to the suggestion that we close our borders entirely. That would just be ignorance based in fear.

  • http://www.diablog.us Dave Nalle

    Before we address the question of whether we should stop immigration we might want to figure out if we even can stop immigration.

    I’d suggest that in fact it’s impossible to stop illegal immigration with any level of expense and manpower which is vaguely reasonable. There comes a point where the cost of the effort exceeds any possible value which could be derived from it.

    And the basic fact is that with the growing labor shortage in the US we need immigrant labor and that’s a force too powerful to be diverted by mere ideology.

    Dave

  • Alec

    RE: 57: “Statue of Liberty. It has a reputation for being a place where one can make good money and live under a relatively honest government. ‘Give me your hungry, your poor, your tired masses yearning to breathe free…’ It doesn’t say they have to be there legally.” The words on a statue are not the same as immigration and naturalization law. If legal status doesn’t matter, then the section of the Constitution concerning naturalization doesn’t matter either.

    “Finally, your government presently takes the view that cheap labor is more important than secure borders.” This sadly, is very true.

    RE: 58: “The simple facts are that those who emigrated in the early 1900’s paid taxes and obeyed the law more so than those coming here illegally now. That’s a fact and all the names you wanna label me can’t change that fact.” Well, since the income tax did not even exist until 1913, and state and local systems ranged from a patchwork of export levies, consumption taxes, etc., your statement here is entirely false. And as can be seen in the recent PBS series about the history of Chicago, communities often permitted immigrants to be exploited without providing them many public services, or worse, demanded that they pay kickbacks and bribes in order to receive these services. The same was the case in New York and other big cities.

    RE: 61: “And the basic fact is that with the growing labor shortage in the US we need immigrant labor and that’s a force too powerful to be diverted by mere ideology.” Economics 101: If there were a labor shortage, wages would rise. Wages are stagnant, largely because the Bush Administration is committed to the idea of a conservative oligarchy in which a viable middle class no longer exists. Is it any wonder that Bush is cozy with regimes like Saudi Arabia or Mexico, in which a thin sliver of a privileged class controls the economy of the country? This explains in part his recess appointment of the unqualified Julie Myers to head immigration enforcement; since she will do everything she can to support Bush’s guest worker and open border programs.

  • Nancy

    I agree with Alec: nothing will be done to stop illegal immigration by BushCo, because his corporate buddies require the influx of illegals to drive down wages & keep the workers under control. If he dared, I wouldn’t be surprised to see Dubya try to reinstitute the grand old American tradition of slavery, but this time it wouldn’t be reserved for any particular race – just economic class.

  • gonzo marx

    i’ll stick with the “solution” i suggested in comment #43

    implement and enforce THAT (or even the Laws already on the books regarding employers and undocumentd workers….a federal rap) and you will begin to see the hiring practices change, and thus dry up the economic incentive for illegals to come into our country

    until you remove the Incentive, you will NOT stop the flow

    Excelsior!

  • zingzing

    from the Center for Immigration Studies (edited for space, not for content):

    “…researchers have concluded… that immigrants commit proportionately no more than and possibly even fewer crimes than native-born citizens. The General Accounting Office… found that foreign-born individuals accounted for about 19 percent of the total arrests in 1985 in six selected major cities. The foreign-born represented 19.6 percent of the aggregate population.

    …using 1980 and 1990 Census Public Use Microdata Samples, [it was] found that among men aged 18-40 immigrants were less likely to be in correctional institutions than the native-born. If native-born men had the institutionalization rates of immigrants with the same demographic traits, the former’s institutionalized population would be only two-thirds the current size… the authors found recent immigrants had no significant effect either on crime rates or the change in rates over time.

    INS data… show a lower recidivism rate for immigrants. “Of the 35,318 criminal aliens INS released from custody (but not did not deport) during October 1994 and May 1999 there were 11,605 who went on to commit new crimes. This recidivism (repeat offender) rate of 37 percent was well below the 66 percent figure for the U.S. criminal population for the comparable period.”
    see the site here:

    editor: sorry about quoting so much… but you know that it needs to be here so that the people who need to see it actually read it.

  • zingzing

    oh yeah, you shouldn’t edit bing. he’s just expressing his viewpoint. he’s got a nasty point of view, but that’s all it is. he’s not going to hurt anyone. besides, it’s comedy.

  • http:ruvysroost.blogspot.com Ruvy in Jerusalem

    Alec writes,

    “The words on a statue are not the same as immigration and naturalization law.”

    Obviously. The point is that the statue far overshadows the law. It is one hell of a calling card. Knock down the statue and you’ll get some attention. That will go round the world just as the poem on the Statue of Liberty has.

  • http://alienboysworld.blogspot.com/ Christopher Rose

    Richard: yeah, sure, I can just imagine you wanting to live in the bad old days? Are you sure though? I would have thought the massive changes in everything from social values through culture, our understanding of the world, everything about the way we live, and all that Blogcritics is, you’d not think any of that worth having? I can’t imagine anybody really wanting that. Not even someone who spent 20 years sealed in a fallout shelter…

  • Ebony Ghost

    I can’t understand why anyone would tender an argument in favor of illegal immigration. Aren’t these people, by definition, engaging in the commission of a crime? Does that crime also happen to be a felony? Aren’t those who provide shelter and employment to these people aiding and abetting the comission of said crime? Perhaps it’s just a simple matter of enforcing the law. Or, are certain people above the law?

    As far as any differences between legal immigrants and citizens, we have from the 14th Amendment, in part:

    1. All persons born or naturalized in the United States, and subject to the jurisdiction thereof, are citizens of the United States and of the State wherein they reside. No State shall make or enforce any law which shall abridge the privileges or immunities of citizens of the United States; nor shall any State deprive any person of life, liberty, or property, without due process of law; nor deny to any person within its jurisdiction the equal protection of the laws.

    Persons here illegally are subject to the jurisdiction of an entirely different country. Their equal protection under our laws should consist of a hearing before deportation. Of course, without the benifit of housing and employment, many would voluntarily return to their home of origin.

  • http://leftistjoe.blogspot.com Joseph Johaneman

    Persons here illegally are subject to the jurisdiction of an entirely different country. Their equal protection under our laws should consist of a hearing before deportation.

    While I agree with you to some extent, the amendment does read nor shall any State deprive any person of life, liberty, or property, without due process of law; nor deny to any person within its jurisdiction the equal protection of the laws. (Obviously the bold emphasis is mine) It doesn’t say citizens at this point, it says everyone, citizen, legal immigrant, illegal immigrant, terrorist, it doesn’t matter. The Supreme Court has upheld this interpretation of the 14th amendment again and again. This cannot be changed except by new Supreme Court Decisions or a Constitutional Amendment because it is a part of Constitutional law.

    Of course, with the world the way it is now, I suspect that the court will start moving away from this interpretation, and will start moving equal protection away from non-citizens, starting with illegal immigrants and then moving onto legal immigrants. Hell, the Patriot Act already does this. If someone really took a good look at it, they’d find out just how unconstitutional it really is. But the Supreme Court, as it stands, would not strike down much of the Patriot Act simply because they would feel a need to protect us from terrorism.

    As someone who’s even more leftist than most liberals (I’m an anarcho-syndicalist), it pains me to say this: We need to enforce immigration laws. My primary reason: So we can make sure the 14th amendment and the Bill of Rights are not undermined by the fear of terrorism. The Patriot Act is already doing that, and if even one illegal succesfully pulls off another terrorist attack, the country is going to go over the edge into isolationism like we’ve never seen before, and most people will suddenly become willing to give up their basic civil liberties in the name of National Security. That, to me, would be hell on earth.

    One thing I always remind myself: Rome was a Republic before it was an empire. Republics can become dictatorships. I don’t want history to repeat itself. I’d rather live in an imperfect Democratic Republic than a perfect dictatorial empire.

  • http://www.diablog.us Dave Nalle

    Economics 101: If there were a labor shortage, wages would rise.

    Economics 102: There is a point above which wages cannot rise for certain types of work without destroying the profitabilities of those businesses. Without labor suited to that work then the people who might open those businesses just decide it’s a bad investment and put their money into something else. No workers means no jobs.

    Dave

  • Alec

    Re: 43 and 64: implement and enforce THAT (or even the Laws already on the books regarding employers and undocumentd workers….a federal rap) and you will begin to see the hiring practices change, and thus dry up the economic incentive for illegals to come into our country.

    It’s interesting that folks ignore a hard reality. George Bush has NEVER offered any plan to stop or even slow illegal immigration, and certainly has never advocated or supported any law or policy to discourage employers from hiring illegal immigrants. To the contrary, he has consistently pushed for a guest worker program, but oddly enough, one which lacks any mechanism for deporting workers who violate or ignore limitations on guest worker assignments. He has given many speeches defending illegal immigrants’ right to come to America to work, but he has never once acknowledged how this damages workers who are citizens or legal residents. He was quick to enact laws to protect American drug companies from foreign competition, but clearly does not believe that American workers merit any similar consideration with respect to competition from foreign workers So despite the vigorous debate over this issue, the bottom line is that the present administration simply does not care about illegal immigration, and has not shifted its position at all since Bush’s first term inauguration.

    RE: 71: Economics 101: If there were a labor shortage, wages would rise.
    Economics 102: There is a point above which wages cannot rise for certain types of work without destroying the profitabilities of those businesses.

    Economics 102: Special Tutorial: After the hurricane and flood in New Orleans, employers raised wages and offered incentives to potential workers. Since wages had to rise, employers sought efficiencies elsewhere to compensate. But businesses were not destroyed simply because they had to offer higher wages even for relatively low-skill jobs. States where illegal immigration is massive tend to have the same prices for products and services as non-illegal immigrant states. This means that the profits are higher for these businesses. But since the state and local governments must absorb the social costs for illegal immigrants, citizens and legal residents end up paying twice, first in the form of lower wages, and again in tax costs and reduced social services.

  • Ebony Ghost

    Re: #70

    Joseph, to what extent do you disagree with the statement? Is it your contention that illegal immigrants are entitled to something other than a judicial determination that they don’t belong here and the remedy provided by immigration law?

  • http://www.diablog.us Dave Nalle

    So Alec, your solution is price inflation which negates the value of increases in wages? Sorry, that doesn’t work.

    The fact remains that jobs should pay what the market will bear for those jobs, and if the market price is lower than Americans will work for then we need to find immigrants to do them.

    And the reality right now is that any American who wants a job at a decent wage can get one. We’re right up against the wall on employment. Jobs for $8 an hour and $10 an hour are going begging and the fact is that the illegals who are coming here are not and have not been working for minimum wage or below for a long, long time. Illegals are making $10 or more an hour in cash and off the books, solely because they’re actually willing to show up and DO the work.

    Dave

  • Alec

    RE: Dave: 74: The fact remains that jobs should pay what the market will bear for those jobs, and if the market price is lower than Americans will work for then we need to find immigrants to do them. Also, note that I never said that illegal immigrants were mainly working for minimum wage. And your statement that we are “up against the wall on employment” is just factually incorrect.

    Dave, the fact remains that businesses do not run by free market theory. Employers manipulate wages and prices in order to maximize their profits, and willingly exploit workers wherever they can. In California, EVERY construction project employs illegals at $10 an hour and up so that builders do not have to pay citizens higher wages (the unions go along with this in order to protect some of their higher wage jobs). They also avoid unemployment insurance, social security taxes, and other statutory amounts that otherwise would be factors in the wage expense for legal workers. Some car washes will pay below minimum wage to illegals, work them long hours and then still short them on wages or simply fire them and refuse to pay, since there is a steady pool of low skill workers who will risk exploitation in order to earn even a small amount of money. There are many restaurants, where every employee, from the busboys to the cooks to the wait staff are all illegal, simply because employers can get away with it, not because citizens and legal residents will not do the work. The end result is to crowd citizens and legal residents out of the job market and to depress wages. And again, in every state without a large reservoir of illegal immigrant labor, Americans willingly and eagerly take offered jobs, so your argument that illegals magically show up and DO the work that others won’t just does not bear scrutiny.

    Another quick example: the actual preparation of millions of tax returns has been outsourced to India, reducing wage costs for CPAs and throwing thousands of American tax preparers out of work (many CPAs review the work, but don’t do the actual preparation themselves). But I don’t know of a single CPA who has reduced his or her prices even though their costs have dropped dramatically over the past few years. But it would be absurd to suggest that American preparers are unwilling to do the work that has been outsourced. Similarly, illegal immigration is a kind of “insourcing” that hurts legal workers and benefits employers.

  • gonzo marx

    what constantly amazes me is the “supply side” argument that illegal aliens are a “good thing” and that we have to live with it…

    FUCK THAT!

    which part of illegal is so difficult to comprehend?

    which part of the employers violating various federal statutes is so hard to understand?

    which part of the simple kitchen mathematics involving the artificial negative wage pressure stemming form the large supply of illegal workers is inconceivable?

    which part of the irrefutable mathematics involving the cost to Society versus the money lost by “under the table” practices is difficult to grasp?

    the fallacious Argument that we “need” these illegals is bullshit, the ONLY ones that “need” them are the fucking criminals who enable the practice by hiring them!!!

    not only do these criminals NOT have any “right” to behave in an illegal manner, NO business has any kind of guarantee to making a profit anywhere i can find in the Constitution/Bill of Rights

    aaAAAaarrRRRRrrGGGGGggGGGGGggHHHHH!!!!!

    supply AND demand….not just one side or the other

    the Equation MUST balance for there to be a truly “free market”

    nuff said?

    Excelsior!

  • Nancy

    Joseph, I know what an anarchist is, but what is a ‘syndicalist’?

  • http://parodieslost.typepad.com Mark Schannon

    I have to agree with Dave Nalle #61 that stopping illegal immigration is impossible although I do with we could find a solution that would make it easier for people for immigrate legally.

    If I have a concern, it seems to me (and I have no data to back this up) that today’s immigrants (and this includes Asians as well as Hispanics and perhaps others) are not assimilating the way earlier waves of immigrants did. The failure to learn English is a major impediment to anyone’s ability to succeed in this country, but there are so many enclaves (self-imposed, socially-imposed ghettos) where one never needs to speak English that people are being trapped in a downward spiral.

    The “melting pot” was always a myth–America’s always been more of a “stew” with each culture adding something to make it more interesting. I wonder now if even the stew analogy is failing.

    What the English and French have learned is that their failure to actively help immigrants assimilate is coming back to haunt them. I fear we’re making the same mistake.

  • Ruvy in Jerusalem

    Gonzo writes (in immense frustration)

    “which part of illegal is so difficult to comprehend?

    which part of the employers violating various federal statutes is so hard to understand?”

    You’re a pretty sharp guy Gonzo. Prostition is illegal in most states of your country. But in every little burg or hamlet is some chick working the streets with her body for sale.

    Now, what part of the law is so hard to understand? The part that is not affected when a guy gets a hard-on, or whatever it is that drives him to buy the services of the chick working the streets selling her tail. That instinct is older than all the laws that attempt to “regulate” prostitution.

    The girl has an irresistable calling card.

    So does your country.

    Lady Liberty stands in New York Harbor beckoning all to come to “the Golden Gate.”

    That calling card overshadows the newer immigration laws. You can’t possibly comprehend how much that statue with the little poem by the Jewish communist works as a marketing tool to draw people to America. If you honestly want to get the message across to the folks overseas that they are NOT wanted, you need to either knock down Lady Liberty or drag her off to a soybean field in the middle of Iowa where nobody wll see her.

    Then you can ask with reasonableness, “which part of illegal is so difficult to comprehend?”

  • Shark

    I’m just tryin’ to figure out — given the choice — who I’d choose to send back to where ‘they came from':

    Bing or Brodie…?

    mmm… Life’s full of tough choices.

  • http://leftistjoe.blogspot.com Joseph Johaneman

    Joseph, I know what an anarchist is, but what is a ‘syndicalist’?

    It refers to labor. Anarcho-syndicalists believe in democratizing labor. It’s our solution to the class struggle. For more about Anarcho-syndicalism, look at this wikipedia entry.

  • Ruvy in Jerusalem

    Joseph, it is rare to see a fellow syndicalist in the world. I’m a socialist syndicalist. This country was set up on those principles originally. The problem (amongst many others) was that the folks who set up the economy thought that they were really socialists and not syndicalists – so they screwed up a good system.

  • Dave Nalle

    My preference is the American approach to the class struggle – don’t have one.

    Dave

  • http://leftistjoe.blogspot.com Joseph Johaneman

    My preference is the American approach to the class struggle – don’t have one.

    Yeah, just let the rich get richer and the poor get poorer. Wonderful way to set up a society of so-called equals.

  • gonzo marx

    Ruvy sez…
    *Lady Liberty stands in New York Harbor beckoning all to come to “the Golden Gate.” *

    well now, as i have stated previously…

    we have had MANY waves of Immigrants in this Nation over the course of our existance, and it IS a good thing, for all the Reasons mentioned and more

    my difficulty revolves around the ILLEGAL immigrants, and the CRIMINAL businesses that knowingly hire them

    silly me, the Rule of Law and all that

    nuff said?

    Excelsior!

  • Bennett

    Actually Joseph, Dave is right. The struggle is pretty much over with.

    What we have is a privileged class and then the rest of us.

    Dave is of the former.

    I’ve come to believe that it’s the logical progression of capitalism. After all the growth and stock splits and mergers, it all comes down to “You sit on my Board Of Directors and vote me a billion dollar bonus, I’ll return the favor.”

    Times A Hundred.

    Link courtesy gonzo marx…

    The rest of us either watch TV, or watch with fascination as our society morphs into something we never dreamed could happen to the good ‘ol US of A.

    Not all is doom and gloom, but a lot is.

  • http://www.diablog.us Dave Nalle

    Yeah, just let the rich get richer and the poor get poorer. Wonderful way to set up a society of so-called equals.

    Actually, if you look at the statistics everyone gets richer, including the poor. But those who wish to make political capital out of class divisions can SAY the rich get richer and the poor get poorer because if everyone advances at the same basic rate, the rich appear to advance more rapidly than the poor because they have more to start with. This is true in every enterprise from starting a business to just living life. The more capital you have to start with, the more additional capital you can accumulate in a given period of time.

    A hypothetical economic situation which advances the poor by 10% and the rich by 1% will benefit both, but it will also result in a growth in the gap between rich and poor because 1% of a lot of money is more than 10% of a little. But everyone is still better off.

    Dave

  • Bennett

    Fortunate Son clarifies things.

  • Shark

    Dave Nalle: “My preference is the American approach to the class struggle – don’t have one.”

    [Shark — bearing a pitchfork and a torch — laughs as he stands amongst a hungry horde outside Dave’s gated-community ]

  • Shark

    I wonder if the Conservatives would object to a more liberal immigration policy —

    — if it allowed only Negro slaves from Africa?

    It could work…

  • http://www.richardbrodie.com/ Richard Brodie

    JJ says: Yeah, just let the rich get richer and the poor get poorer. Wonderful way to set up a society of so-called equals.

    Like about half of all Americans, you don’t understand the menaing of the term “equal”. It means equality of opportunity under a system of objective law. It is the opposite of a class or caste system. Someone from the humblest beginnings can rise to the greatest heights and conversely.

    What it does not mean is equality of results. A system such as you dream of, that reduces everyone down to the same economic level, eliminates the incentive to “get ahead”, and kills the profit motive drive that resulted in America’s historically unprecedented increasing standard of living. The extent to which your syndicalist principles have been implemented is precisely the extent to which the rate of increase in that standard of living has been slowed down and reversed.

    Before we switched over from laissez-faire capitalism to welfare state capitalism (welfare not only for the poor, but for corporations) there was a saying: rags to riches to rags in three generations. Worthless heirs didn’t have all the government supplied mechanisms of legal privilege that enable them nowadays to protect their fortunes from their own incompetence.

    What it all boils down to is that capitalism is based on the noble desire to better oneself through industriousness. Whereas syndicalism is based on a dispicable envy, whereby those who are too lazy to be ambitious, and too cowardly to try and steal for themselves what others have produced, instead want the government to do their stealing for them.

  • http://Nextoneonthetopoftheline Eder Cervantes

    when their’s a low wage and need workers, who do u turn to,and were you need someone to look down on who do u look on…

  • Chris

    In a healthy, free-enterprise society a fair portion of that wealth is put right back into the economy through the purchase of goods and/or services or the creation of businesses which offer even more varieties of goods/services and provide more jobs as well.

    These illegals send a collective $40 billion annually out of this country to their homelands, thereby doing tremendous to the long term economic health of the US. As far as Mexico is concerned, this comprises the single largest pool of national income besides oil and tourism. No wonder that corrupt and perverted government has every reason in the world to encourage futher colonization of the US.

    By definition, an organism that lives off another at the other’s expense and ultimate demise, is called a parasite.

  • Bill O. Writes

    Did these fine people you give as examples apply for citizenship, or crawl through this country’s window during the middle of the night? I believe the former.

  • http://gratefuldread.net NR Davis

    Re: #57: Unwelcome? Not at all, Ruvy. Even if many of us may or may not agree, we are grateful for every word. And what you write in this comment strikes me as being one of the most obvious facts in the whole immigration debate. Thank you for showing the harsh divide between the sentiments of too many US citizens and US claims as represented by its myths (equality of opportunity under law for all) and icons such as the New York statue.

    An anarcho-syndicalist at BC. Most cool. I have my anarchist tendencies, but I am closer to being a socialist-syndicalist.

    Re: #94: Sometimes – not always, but sometimes – people crawl through an open window because they need help. Shut up.

    Stopping all immigration is lunacy and worse. Dealing with illegal immigration (using a mixture of compassion and vigilance) is essential. And Ruvy is right: The law is what it is, but Lady Liberty looms larger.

    Oh, and the person who said the federal budget is split between welfare and warfare is dead wrong. Welfare programs are but a tiny piece of the public-fund pie – the vast majority of the rest, if we’re going to be honest, seems split between warfare and pork.

  • http://www.nrlc.org/ A.G.

    “Should America Stop Immigration?”

    This is not about immigration, this is about “illegal” immigration.

  • mikey

    If you are in our country, respect our flag, our values and our laws. Illegal immigrants are criminals and should be sent back. You can’t come over here wave your flag, not learn english, move 20 people into a house, let your kids run wild because you can’t control them. They join gangs, commit crime and kill each other and innocent people who want back the lives they had. They drive without a license, without insurance, do not pay taxes like they say they do, they might pay sales taxes but that is all. Make a better life in your own country, or go through the proper channels to get here. Do not steal someone elses social security number, do not buy drivers licenses, birth certificates. When they plow over a person in a crosswalk they run, due to the fact they have a license or insurance. It is funny how when they have killed someone they run back to the country they must hate to hide. If they would stop working for pennies maybe our own citizens would have a chance at decent wages

  • melissa reyes

    thats messed up fucken who’s gonna pick up ur straberries now i don’t think u will?

  • Heloise

    Comments 5 and 14 get it right. As I said in my other post illegal activities go hand in hand with immigration, legal or the dreaded illegal alien.

    The author of this column and other posters all state outright that there is an inherent annhilation of a civilization which suffers itself to absorb, assimilate, and looks the other way when crimes are being committed by these illegally entried groups.

    Talk about the Kennedys creating mayhem on the roads, what the hell look at the horrible crashes and DUI crimes the Mexican are foisting on the American insurance paying public.

    Just some of their road crimes cry out for life imprisonment let alone sneaking into this country with the nerve that they can work here undetected, protected, and paid….I can’t stand it….And the colors they paint their houses. BTW Dallas is cracking down on the bright colors that have been painted around some neighborhoods. They are making white people mad.

    Please don’t confuse immigration, which is a slow tedious, and rightfully so, process, with people sneaking into a place in the dead of night because they have not the backbone to make their own stinking hole a better place to live.

    Send those baby-making factories back to their OWN country. Hmmm, sounds like the Mexicans and Irish have a lot in common. Is it too late to return the Irish to Ireland?

    Heloise

  • Heloise

    Wa happened to the Monroe comments?
    Do tell

  • Sam

    We sholud just enslave the mexicans like we did the Africans and everything will be o.k.

  • Brian

    Immigration used to be from developed cultures. (Of the time). The third world did not have the means to move about as they do now. This is the first time in modern history a clash of first and third world cultures is occuring. This is not good for the developed world and it is not good for the developing world.

  • garagerat

    I say lets control immigration, get rid of those who fail to assimilate. Stop all the handouts and crackdown on those who employ illegals. You do not follow the law here , your gone. Not to jail,but to some other dumpy country where you actually fit in. I am seeing complete neighbor hoods here that are going down the toilet because their infested with other countries losers. These people do not even know what it means to live in anything other than squalor it seems. The housing on one block alone has been just destroyed.These kind of immigrants we can do without,and any do gooder people who import this as a feel good cause can go with them.

  • Nancy

    IMO, as usual, we should not be accomodating ILLEGAL immigrants for any reason, in any capacity, and invariably it’s those that are the ones who infest property & bring disease & crime with them where ever they settle. They do indeed need to be sent packing, and those who employ them severely punished – which will never happen under BushCo.

    On the plus side of legal immigration, (to be totally piggish about it) there’s all the yummy new eating places. Jeez, you should see the little town where I work: we’ve got Heinz’ 57 varieties, everything from Peruvian to Ethiopian to Thai to Carribean to Belgian/French to German plus every known kind of Chinese! If I could, I’d eat my way from one end to the other, and love every minute of it. And this is just a small suburb of DC, out in MD. Heaven is going out for lunch to a different country every day of the month, if you like (& can afford it; I can’t, but I can collect the menus & plan ;D ). Frequently these places are decorated with ‘native’ costumes or photos or art. It’s wonderful. I can travel all around the world in a way without leaving home. And I do enjoy going to the local small store(s), especially at dewali or Eid; the pastries & sweets are to die for. You could OD just from looking at them, they’re so gorgeous. Ditto the clothes they usually carry; invariably (if you sew, which I do) the local fabric stores really brighten up to cater to the new residents’ tastes. It’s fantastic.

  • 100% Mexicana

    For #76
    Well what i think people should do is stop complaining and start doing something. Like give mexico back the land your ancestors took away and if u really want illegal immigration to stop the only way is to solve Mexico’s economic problems. Which is obvious that none of u would do.SO STOP COMPLAINING!!!!!Immigration does help the U.S even if u dont agree. Maybe one of ur kids will end up with a Mexican. What are u going to do then?

  • Allisio Rex

    Don’t be fooled by those who claim that this Country was built by immigrants. The truth is that they omit to say,conveniently, that the only immigrants who built it were WHITE-EUROPEANS and they built it for themselves and not for others.
    Just right up to 45 years ago this was basically an all out White America and that’s the way it should have remained were not for the traison of President Kennedy and President Johnson whose actions,together with the laws passed by Congress and approved by the evil U.S. Supreme Court, forever changed the destiny of Whites.
    Name calling has no place here. This is a matter of racial survival and integration of other races within our White Race will destroy us and must be repelled with any legal means possible.
    So far the only integration I’ve seen in the past decades has been White Flight by the millions who have had to leave their homes, where they had lived some for generations, their work, their friends and their familiar surrounding. As minorities invade their safe neighborhoods and change them into jungles with high violent criminality,immorality and open carnivals, they run for they lives. These scenes are common places now all over the USA.
    Today Whites are on the run. They are the Jypsies in their own Country.
    This has to stop. All non-European immigration must be stopped. This experiment about racial integration within our Country is a failure and above all is anti-God.
    We are not meant to be together by operation of natural laws and man is not right to twist our Creator’s intent at separating the different races. For millions of years nobody messed with this established order until “Christian” Europeans misinterpreting and mixing up the Gospels and God’s will decided that after all we are all brothers and sisters when in fact our very nature makes us enemy of one another.
    The “hispanics” or better the “Ibero-Indians” in the South-West want the South-West all for themselves to form their Aztlan? Well, if I were in power I would let them know very rapidly who is the boss here.
    Eventually,Whites will have to make up their minds at resolving this pressing issue. Either they will accept this status quo and become a mestizo-mulato people and being in the minority with all the retaliation by the new emerging minority-majority or to fight back and remain masters of their own civilization.
    This will only be resolved by Whites themselves if they wake up to the horror of what’s happening because politically there will be NO solution.
    Some might say but wouldn’t you want to give to people from the third-world, (non_Europeans) the opportunity to the “American” dream?
    My answer is NO.

  • Kassondra

    I think we should stop immigration because there will be alot of terrist coming in to America to destroy America.

  • Nancy

    Immigrants have always been needed here in the US & always will be. We’d be a much poorer place if we were still the homogenous, white-bread society of the early 18th century. Almost everything currently comprising anything in the US is a product of the labor & efforts & talents of immigrants from all over, for the past 400 years, not to mention all that was created by our First Nations peoples before that. It might also be worth remembering that were it not for their graciousness & (some would consider misplaced) kindness, no European would have survived on this continent. That there was an English/European presence here at all was through their hospitality. Personally I love being able to choose dinner from everything from American to Ethiopean, Chinese, French, Malaysian, or Mexican & dozens of others. I love shopping in local stores for saris, cheongsams, kente cloth, or kimono. I adore seeing great art of Japan, China, India, Africa, & Native Americans as well as Europe in the museums, hearing music from all over – salsa as well as Sweet Honey, in addition to more classical or familiar European-derived styles. I enjoy celebrations of christmas, hannukah, kwanzaa, eid, dewali, or [chinese] new years: the more holidays, the merrier! When I visit small town friends, I feel odd even subliminally when all the faces are white; somehow it just doesn’t feel right that everybody looks ‘alike’. I like the diversity & the differences, of race and culture.

    I admit I don’t like it taken too far: persons who persist in betrothing pre-teen daughters, or female circumcision, or slaughtering their Eid goats in their back yards in defiance of US or local law, for example. I don’t think governmental information should be printed any other language than English, since like it or not that is our language of use & law here in the US, and those living here should have enough respect to learn it, just as I would learn French should I move to France. Moreover, learning English helps immigrants to assimilate, as well as find better jobs. How many talented & well educated professionals from other lands come here & end up working in fast food joints because they can’t speak or read English? Such a waste of time & training, but necessary when all vital info is conveyed thusly.

    I absolutely draw the line at illegals, and those who employ them. Personally, I would declare it open season on the former, & subject the latter to substantial time at hard labor for violating US labor laws, which not only subverts American born workers & legal immigrants for the sake of sheer greed, but also creates a class of quasi-slave labor, something we fought a war to eradicate long ago. Violation of the laws should & must not be tolerated for any reason by any person – including the president of the US or congress who fail to enforce them.

    Yet we also need to radically re-do our immigration policies & speed up our immmigration application procedures; as they stand now they’re a contemptible, laughable, archaic disgrace to any nation with the technology we have. What does INS mean, they can record people coming in – but not when they leave? How stupid & inept is that? That’s on a par with the FBI spending half a billion for a computer system that still doesn’t work, for gods sake, and is indefensible as well as incompetent & intolerable.

    A lot needs to happen, and unfortunately, those in charge of “deciding” have their heads so occupied with affairs outside the borders (& I would argue outside their jursidiction to begin with) they have neither the time nor inclination to give to solving internal problems of crisis proportions here & now. Be that as it may, we still need immigrants – as long as they’re legal, they’re mighty welcome to me.

  • yeah boi

    wow please get a life.
    what kind of nerdy idiots argue like this on internet sites.

  • mike

    I tolerate immigration, not so much illegal immigration.

    i think that the united states is fighting this battle of immigration. Foreign countries that are benefiting should be involved. They should find a way to help their people by creating a economy that supports them, thus preventing them from immigrating to other countries searching for a better life.
    Foreingn countries should stop relying on the United stated to help them reconstruct their failing economies.

    The solution to this problem is not to go to the borders construct a fence so many feet tall because as many say they will just construct bigger ladders. What the gov. should do is enforce its laws with more strictness starting with every single town in this nation.Turning a blide eye is no longer helping any one.

  • http://www.gwbush.blogspot.com RJ

    “Well what i think people should do is stop complaining and start doing something. Like give mexico back the land your ancestors took away”

    Actually, we bought that land from the Mexican government after we kicked their a**es in a war. And it was practically unpopulated back then, so at least we have managed to do something with it.

    But if you’re only interested in the “original owners” of the land, I suggest you give your entire country back to Spain…

    “and if u really want illegal immigration to stop the only way is to solve Mexico’s economic problems.”

    Or we could build a wall. Or mine the border.

    Or, here’s a thought, maybe the Mexican people could solve their own f***ing economic problems, instead of exporting their poverty and disease across the border into our country?

    “Immigration does help the U.S even if u dont agree.”

    Limited, legal immigration does. However, millions of impoverished illiterates crawling across the border illegally to take jobs away from Americans while sucking off our social welfare system doesn’t.

    “Maybe one of ur kids will end up with a Mexican. What are u going to do then?”

    End up with a Mexican, how? Like, as a gardener? I’m not sure what you mean…

  • Nancy

    Well, SOMETHING needs to be done, & the best place to start, IMO, would be in fixing the immigration process & beefing up the INS administration section so applications could be processed more efficiently so people wanting in don’t have to wait 20+ years. Our current system is antiquated & ridiculously understaffed to process the volume of applications coming in – & that’s just the legal ones.

    The biggest parts of the problem are tax-cheating employers, & craven congressmaggots who refuse to do anything because it might jeapordize their chances of re-election next time around, even if they just got re-elected – & most of whom are in the pockets of these same tax-cheats to begin with.

    Maybe it would be better to start by removing the infestation on Capitol Hill….?

  • http://www.roblogpolitics.blogspot.com RJ Elliott

    Mexicans love to point out how the US “stole” some of their territory 160 years ago. They never mention, however, that the US helped free them from French occupation just 20 years later…

  • Nancy

    A lot of things are conveniently glossed over or forgotten by many on all sides. I’ll admit my take on Tejas history is a bit vague, even after having skimmed thru Mitchner. I thought we annexed those territories, not paid for them?

  • http://www.roblogpolitics.blogspot.com RJ Elliott

    From here:

    The Treaty of Guadalupe Hidalgo, signed on February 2, 1848 by American diplomat Nicholas Trist, ended the war and gave the U.S undisputed control of Texas, established the U.S.-Mexican border of the Rio Grande River and ceded to the United States California, Nevada, Utah, and parts of Colorado, Arizona, New Mexico, and Wyoming. In return, Mexico received US$15,000,000. This exchange is known as the Mexican Cession. Mexicans living in the conquered lands could choose to return to Mexico or stay and become American citizens. Article X was stricken from the treaty before it was ratified by the U.S. Senate. These articles promised that the United States would recognize Mexican and Spanish land grants.

  • pimp

    i hate mexicans!!!

  • Ryan

    Yes, America along with most other first world countries need to stop unnecessary immigration based on economic profit and greed. And here’s the reason why.

  • http://PA Tay

    I believe that we are losing our jobs with immigration. Not only our jobs we are losing, but the space in our country. More than half of all illegal aliens go through the border from Mexico, and they go into California, Arizona, New Mexico and Texas, and further on.
    I understand that it’s temping for immigrants, because the United States has freedom. But that doesn’t mean that illegal immigrants can take our jobs, and space. And it’s not fair to us that they don’t have to pay taxes either. I also understand that they may need to come to the United States for surgery that they might not have over where they live, but what I don’t understand is, why don’t they just go back after there surgery is finished, or when they have enough money to feed there families.
    I don’t like the fact that all immigrants can’t speak English. If they are going to come to the United States, I think that they should at least speak English, so they can understand us better, and so that we can understand them. If they can at least speak some English that’s good enough. I see a lot of people in stores and all around Pennsylvania who don’t even know one word in English. I was waiting in line at a store for an hour because some people didn’t know how to communicate with one another.
    I think we should put a stop this, by only letting those through the border who absolutely need to come to the United States. I think more people are coming to the United States everyday! And it’s not fair to us that they don’t have to pay taxes either.

  • hi

    just put a stop to it, and there its over

  • KARLA

    that is so true !!

  • KARLA

    they shudd look at the men buiding homes there only latino’s

  • Laura

    Immigrants bring so much to our country. America is a big mixing bowl full of all cultures why take that away that is what makes up our very delicate life style. Where would we be without immigration?

  • Reverend

    Illegal immigration is just that. ILLEGAL. People can say that our country is based solely off of immigration, and that is mostly true, but with that being said, was done legally. The immigrants had to adapt also to a language that everyone could understand, which happened to be english. Now it seems everywhere I look I’m overwhelmed by spanish. Hard telling how much companies have spent reprinting their product to cater to someone that can’t or won’t adapt. Politician’s walk on egg shells on this topic. Who cares. Most of them can’t vote anyway. If you care about true legal Americans stand up for them. That will get votes. I get tired of hearing that a person is a racist because he speaks up about an issue. That’s what the Constitution is for. American’s to use. If I was to move to any other country that doesn’t speak english, should I insist that they learn english for me. Sounds stupid doesn’t it. Another thing that bugs me is the flags of the country they came from on their cars or clothes, or what not. I see 100% Puerto Rican, and such. What percent wanted to go to America if it was so good at home. Why as American do we allow our streets to be littered with signs for companies or etc. that I can’t read. I have no clue what’s going on in those walls. America has shown too much compassion for the illegal immigrants, and it needs to stop. Good men fought and died protecting this land from outsiders, let’s not let it be in vain.

    AMEN

  • The Man who lives for something

    What’s with all of this? There is nothing you people can do about this. Immigration will continue–most likely, forever.

    And if you all hate immigrants, you all should hate yourselves, YOU are the immigrants of this country. Give it back to the Natives.

  • leslie Espinoza

    yeah you say that they take up our space but you dont worry about taking their space when you go on vacation to the carribean or to mexico or any other place where immigrants are from tou dot care where their from when you need help in something and the only reason why hispanics are the only ones building houses is because the lazy americans want jobs where they dont have to move a muscle while hispanics are over there working their buts of to build us houses and give us a place where we can raice our kids so think about it and thn judge them because the same way that you judge them they judge you too im a legal immigrant but im dissapointed in this country that says its the land of the free and show other wise

  • ADP

    I have something to add. First of all, Joe, it’s really a touching spectacle, but you are completely off the mark in virtually every respect. The idea that immigrants have brought more than they have taken away, is arguably true, but clearly it does not logically follow that all immigrants are bringing more, per capita,
    (underlined) than they are taking away, at least relative to other the average “native” American’s resource consumption and input, particularly in present times. Cheap labor may be helpful in artificially inflating the economy in the short term, and useful in glazing things over with a false facade of a healthy economy, used in particular by those like CNN and NBC who have vested interests in doing so,(ties to big business that want cheap labor and import it) but that period of lies is rapidly coming to an end, evidenced by recent economic difficulties. In fact, it is fairly obvious given crime rates relative to the native population, and the drag on social services, that certain groups of permanent underclass immigrants are a net loss in the long run, especially in successive generations when they have social safety nets to fall back on and are not so desperate to work, and do not want to do menial labor which they perceive to be debasing. Immigrants are an addition to a country because they provide more brain power, more potential for capital production and pleasure production. Therefore, it is only sensible that they have given more than they have taken, as when one comes, one “native” American does not also leave. The argument is inherently flawed, that is. It does not mean that if you have adjusted the native population to a larger size it would not have accounted for the contribution of immigrants and more. Next, look at your list. Don’t you find it the least bit risible that all Northern Europeans on your list are writers, editors, scientists, inventors of complex algorithmic programming? The one Asian you have up there is from China, and is impressively, a CEO, but then look at the rest. Now the Hispanic names: Actor, musician, fashion designer. Notice anything here? We have a problem in America. Generally, wealth is created by engineers, mathematicians, scientists, and people with new, innovative ideas. Any idiot can be a fashion designer, or an actor, and while being a musician is clearly a rarer and more extraordinary talent, it is not an area in which America is in any way deficient. It also does not prove that certain people are more gifted in this area than others. Just because something is not race or ethnicity specific does not mean ethnicity does not assist in predicting the probability of it being so. So, while one Mexican may have become a musician in ten thousand, two great “native” American musicians may have been produced given equal resources, but instead we only have one in that ten thousand. Propaganda buying liberals like to begin their arguments with great assumptions and never connect the dots. That is, your argument does not add up. It is, by and large, illogical. I think that is why most liberals like immigrants so much. Typically these people do not hold them to, and do not generally understand the basic criteria of sound reasoning. The first fallacy involved is the obvious fallacy that all groups of people are equal in their mean abilities, in all areas, and everyone, I’m sorry everyone educated and rational, must know and understand this. I don’t, will you please educate me! This is perhaps the biggest lie of the 20th century and hopefully it does not shamefully continue onwards into the 21st. I know, people turn right off to racist arguments, but honestly, it has to be stated. I think it is best people become desensitized to it. What should be comprehended is that mathematically, mean abilities are exactly what we are talking about. We are talking about the collective contribution of the average contribution of each individual. So, each time you allow one individual from a weaker gene pool you have a net loss, mathematically. Nonetheless, you bring diversity which clearly has its perks, food and sexual choice being two of them(perspective is not. Reason is relative to truth and relative generally only to cognitive ability, and open mindedness, not perspective as perspective is a poor excuse and a misnomer. It is not about the many types of different perspectives but the quality of the perspective. I.E. how close it is to actual truth. Still, more diversity can bring about open mindedness to some degree, though willingness to consider, open mindedness, can still be supplemented in a great many other ways, and with differences being present though less “diversity”, these advantages do not need to be lost). So, diversity has its perks, but when certain population reproduce(as they are) at faster rates than more societally beneficial, morally beneficial groups, you have a net loss. That is, groups that kill people at one sixth the rate or less of other groups are probably more morally beneficial to society wouldn’t you say(any government statistic, or any other for that matter)? There is a point at which small advantages in diversity are trumped by the large disadvantages of a weaker populace overall. America, I think, is long past that threshold but is unwilling to, or for some reason, unable to realize it. It would take a fool, or someone whose mind has been engineered to hold people to different standards, and view arguments in ways which outrightly demand that in order to be taken seriously one must deny the realities of the world, to not realize this glaringly obvious reality. To not recognize that different populations have made completely unequal contributions to humanity’s progression is a scary denialist ideology today. Then, when backed into a corner in an argument, to deny progression altogether, is an even scarier frequently espoused ideology today, which actually directly undermines all the things which the enlightenment and the renaissance brought to the world, which have separated the west from the rest of the world for half a millennium. All your luxuries, your pleasure, your education, are the byproduct of these ideas in reason, science and advancement and were manufactured by men who were far more intelligent than the idiots who champion these wrongheaded positions. Your positions are nothing more than positions bludgeoned into the minds of Americans by the media elite, and a number of peace-seeking, self-interested, American traitors who are vacuous in nature, and do not have your interests at heart. To not see this is foolish— Chomsky says that there are people, powerful people who think you are too dumb to think for yourself or control your own fate, you know the specialized class, who create these necessary illusions for the betterment of the people, often without realizing their supreme arrogance in doing so and their severe miscalculations. You don’t actually believe these illusions which are intended to prevent us from killing each other, when we have no representative or governmental means to improve the genetic stock of the people(eugenics), since almost all people are somehow ignorantly opposed to such necessary societal controls, clearly without reading the arguments to both sides and ways to implement less intrusive and more societally advantageous techniques which do not displease people so much, but yield drastically grand results for life quality. Race egalitarianism is no doubt one of these necessary illusions and the byproduct of years of liberal and Jew-dominated media bias…Lewontin, Gould, Diamond…cough cough, Jews. Besides, Chomsky is not the only one to say this only the only one to get attention regarding it(Chomsky = Jew). It is really not so blatantly anti-semitic or prejudiced. I mean close to 90 percent of newspapers in the United States are run by Jews(and you can check that). This is not just classical racist vitriol, it is well documented, even if these same people tell you that this is all it is. Who do you think ensures they say this? clue: Abe Foxman(jew)- Anti(Jewish)-defamation League. The point is man, America is really on the decline, and if you do not see that you are just blind. It is not for want of money. It is for want of moral responsibility and for massive dysgenic trends. Now, I don’t cast liberals as being the villains behind decreasing moral responsibility and contribution to country and community entirely, as much of the right moral agenda is way off in my view, but massive dysgenic trends…that’s the left man. Our national IQ( accounting for Flynn effect, relative to other nations) has dropped roughly 4 points in the last 50 years. We have a problem in graduating engineers who create wealth virtually from scratch? Well, here is an idea, take a look at the black and Hispanic population, now 30 percent of the country, who are drastically underrepresented in the fields most needed. It is the liberals always saying to do what you want to do, not what you should do or need to do, isn’t it? I mean sure, I agree with this, in many situations where the benefits of sacrificing are negligible, but here they are not. Our future is at stake; our ability to compete on the global market, and unfortunately thanks to what I would call deficiencies and drawbacks, cultural and ethnic alike, we are not on par with most other Western countries, including up and coming nations, we no longer can compete in so many facets and in so many parts of the market. Now, you can turn a blind eye, but we are talking about very obvious realities here. I find it difficult to find another explanation. Perhaps cultural changes, or living with big privileges and not being driven to seek out more demanding degrees? Perhaps, but I do not think these theories explain as much as Richard Lynn’s do. Wake up, America is fast becoming a third world nation. The dollar is crashing, our global standing, and our infrastructure is crumbling. I mean we have fallen far behind northern Europe in every measurable living standard and technology. And who is going to build us back up? A bunch of psychologists, and pseudo-economists? You can deny the realities of these theories now, but in 20 years I think it is going to be far more difficult for you. Likely, however, you will just pigeon hole your thought processes, become a cognitive caricature of your old self, and will somehow justify all these problems as being caused by white injustice(another one of the great lies continually being expounded upon in every neo-liberal university in America), until the white population withers down to an insignificant percentage, at which point you will no longer be able to deny what was right in front of your eyes all along. You might be dead long before that, however, with the projected life span in America now gradually decreasing. I mean, these liberals do not even want to assimilate people anymore to Western culture, norms and reason, otherwise they will realize how large a percentage of these certain people just can not conform to certain standards of reason, which could be very detrimental to their cause and belief system if they are forced to face this. We just can not absorb the numbers that are coming in and hope to remain a global leader, even if all immigrants were of equal mean abilities. Do not listen to me though. I won’t be an American for too long anyway, hopefully that is. Maybe I’ll be lucky and get to Bavaria within the next few years, where I hope to settle down for the rest of my life, and watch America fall apart from the sidelines, which sadly, most Americans are already doing, in so many respects and for lack of reason. Sorry about your country and your bullshit man, best of luck. Hope you wake up from your slumber.

  • http://drdreadful.blogspot.com Dr Dreadful

    ADP, I doubt you’ll get many responses to your jaw-droppingly long comment, mainly because your utter unfamiliarity with the concept of the paragraph makes it next to impossible to read.

    Your argument, as far as I’m able to make it out through the fog of verbosity, falls down on its central precept. You talk about ‘the obvious fallacy that all groups of people are equal in their mean abilities’. Now excuse me, but it seems to me that calling something an ‘obvious’ fallacy is itself fallacious unless you can (a) point to some evidence in favor of your argument which is general public knowledge, and more crucially (b) show how this is claimed to be true of all groups. (Is Joe arguing that a group of construction workers from Jalisco is just as capable of running a multinational corporation as a group of Harvard MBAs, for instance?).

    And call me cynical (and this a cheap shot), but your choice of Bavaria as your preferred retirement destination does not in the least bit surprise me.

  • Elizabeth

    we are all da same we dont deserve to be choosed because one is better dan da other one im mexican and hispanic and to say the truth i give a shet if american people think they are different dan others because i noe we mexican people noe we are friendlyer dan wat ur lames are

  • Ana

    I agree with comment #43.

    I have personal experience with this and I think its wrong how illegal immigrants work and get free health care while others are paying but at the same time we need to think about what the good things they’ve done. I’m sure a lot of you wouldn’t be here right now if it wasnt for immigration. Immigrants were to be welcomed b/c of their skills/professions and not for their coutries of origin, but we should consider it for those who want a better life and that can prove it. by i dont know maybe learn english and pay taxes just like everyone else..

  • telling the truth

    we should stop all immigration and send everyone back where they came from. we also should not allow anyone who does not have 100% american blood in them run for any kind of office. in order to hold an american office the blood line should have to be traced so far back. in no other country can an american go and be given any benefits or be given grants and special perks for going to that country to live we need to worry about our own. stop allow outsiders to take away jobs from us. we can help our money problems by cutting off non americans and stop allowing them to work and give their jobs to americans. send them all back.

  • http://drdreadful.blogspot.com Dr Dreadful

    we should stop all immigration and send everyone back where they came from.

    You’d be left with an empty country.

    we also should not allow anyone who does not have 100% american blood in them run for any kind of office.

    What is ‘100% American blood’, pray tell?

  • shine

    Immigration (especially crossing the sea) is unjust not only to local population but ultimately to the immigrants too as they are losing their most important wealth -family connections- for financial prosperity.End result is :Financial prosperity with Spiritual Austerity which is destructice for the Planet too !

  • Tommy

    I used to support immigration but there is a limit to everything. When people come here legally they need to understand that they are abandoning their own troubled nation and need to embrace our culture not try to change it. And yes I am totally against illegal immigration or amnesty and I am TOTALLY convinced that immigrants are taking jobs that natural born Americans need and deserve. I work for a company that outsources Indian IT workers here in the US and I can honestly say they are NOT any smarter or harder working than any American born IT worker – and they are jealous, rude, and disrespectful to others. I finally had to ask to have my desk moved because their constant banter in Hindi was so disruptive I couldn’t hear myself think to do my own work.

  • Jennifer Boyd

    Immigrants now come to this country with their hands out, doing nothing to earn the housing, the education, the rights that our ancestors and our current family members are fighting and dying for. Every community in the U.S. is overrun by rude, no speaka the English, I have a right to be here thugs. They bring their whole families here, up to 70 members in each fmaily, they take social security, low rent housing, bring Grandma who’s 90 and she collects SS, she babysits their 10 kids and we pay her to do that. What did Grandma do to earn the social security? Nothing! Send them all home, retroactive at least 20 years, no more anchor babies! I don’t care if they’re born and bred here, they hate the very hands that feed them! I resent paying for non-workers while my kid has had no free anything – not that she needs it but why do I have to pay for them?
    Lawyers should not make a living taking food out of our mouths by helping immigrants get here and stay. We have enough home-grown lazy people here, let’s don’t import more. Fix your own country like we fixed ours. Go away. Our politicians don’t care, it doesn’t affect them.

  • Peruvian

    Anyone who thinks immigrants should go back, should go back to Europe, because the native Americans lives here before us; and even then, they probably invaded it from cultures before them; so no one should live here.

  • Tracey S

    I am of the opinion that Americans come first in America. No if’s and’s or but’s. We get first dibs on jobs. We were born and raised here. This is our home. I am a nurse who can’t find a job, not because of my qualifications. But because there are too many Filipino and Indian nurses taking my job. I am sorry if I have offended anyone, but that is not fair. It isn’t our fault that they were born in an impoverished country. America needs to take care of its people, and that is the truth.

  • Tracey S

    Peruvian, that is just ignorant. American means you were born here. That is what makes you American. Damn near every country has mixed blood. But being born there makes you that nationality. Think hard!!!

  • Tracey S

    Jennifer- AMEN TO YOUR COMMENT!!

  • wiremouse

    Heloise (99), RJ (111), Jennifer Boyd (134), Bing (many) – i love you guys!! For your humorous very insightful additions. I’ve read every single comment (for my debate) so out of 138 they’re the most relevant and insightful just if anyone wants to read them.

    Now THE HEART of the ISSUE – why do ‘American born’ citizens deserve a better chance than immigrants? And what even defines a ‘real’ citizen in a country made up of immigrants? Like how far back do your immigrant ancestors have to be for you to be a citizen?

    If we have an answer for this the debate’s over!

    Ps ADP use paragraphs + don’t use overcomplicated phrasing to hide a lack of fact-based substance.
    Pps Congrats to the Hispanic girl who persuaded us of the friendliness of her people by insulting us(?!)
    Ppps Ireland is the most beautiful place on earth for a holiday!!

  • mike mullett

    I personally think we should do better to LOCK our borders to all illegal immigrants into this country.
    We should just take care of our own and things would be a hell of alot better.Less welfare, less illegal immigration acts, less corruption in the streets.We taxpayers are spending billions on these immigrants that are slowly taking over this country.Health care issues, job issues (most went overseas.) we are hardly unable to take care of ourselves let alone the rest of the world!
    I am AGAINST tax increases so we can keep taking such greater care of everyone in the world better than our own.Let us serve the USA for a change.Concerned American.Keep America American.

  • AJJONES

    its got5 to STOP!..we are full!..why cant you see that?…today no citizen can find a job ,yet there is a lottery every year that gives 50,000 OTHERS, lifetime greencards, free plane tickets for that person and their entire family….to me this is something that must stop now,..and possiblely forever!

  • AJJONES

    peruvian,…then if thats the case, i should be defending my land like the indians did, with blood thirsty ways, and hang your scalp from my bedpost to deter you.

  • kate

    they have a right to live here, as much as we do.

  • MICHAEL SCHWINN

    KATE YOU ARE IN A DREAM YOUR SELF , NO THEY DONT & NO THEY CANT , PERIOD NO AMESTY , NO HIGHER EDUCATION ,AMERICANS ONLY , AND AMERICA IS FULL RIGHT NOW, AND WILL ALWAYS BE CLOSED FOR ILLEGALS WHO DISRESPECT OUR AND YOUR LAWS , YOU ARE PROBALLY UNDER 30 AND CANT SEE WHAT WIIL BECOME OF MY BELOVED AMERICA .SO STOP SUPPORTING THESE THIRD WORLD CRIMINALS . PLKAIN AS THAT.

  • MICHAEL SCHWINN

    IM DIDNT SERVE IN VEITNAM TO GIVE MY BELOVED AMERICA TO A THIRD WORLD CRIMNALS ,STOP IMMIGRATION TO AMERICA NOW , SEE IMMIGRATION GUMBALLS,ON YOUTUBE NOW

  • get real

    let them ride a boat so once they get here they will be strong

  • mysdefied

    I wish there was a way to ban such uninformed pieces from any medium that might be accessible and ultimately accepted as gospel truth by the herd of human shaped sheep. Dear clueless writer: please step away from your keyboard until you pull your head out of the “rabbit” or whatever hole you have it in. Go read up some more, interview actual people who are affected by such policy. Talk to children who’ve been shortchanged in schools that cater to esl while cutting and culling all meaningful academia. Talk to those who’ve been raped, robbed, assaulted by these serial psychopaths. Then come back and tell me they are wonderful. Please go back to your drawing board and spend some time and energy to consider why you are even posting your piece. Do you gain by their entrance? Are you a prison or union lobbiest? Are you employed to write misinformation and propaganda? Hopefully you are just ignorantly repeating what the corporate run major media has programmed into your head. If so…shake it out and go seek the truth for yourself. Cheers. Then come back and share your findings.

  • Secret

    I believe that the goverment has No right to decide wehter immigration should stop or not. its up to kids and teenagers. Soon everyone in the government will die.If they keep with this shit we wont have an/a opinion/decide. Right know the goverment is doing b.s missing up the world. It seems like they dont know what their doing

  • Joe

    I don’t have a problem with immigration per se. Indeed, my forbearers were from Ireland and Sicily. They came here to escape oppression and find a better life. And in return, they enriched their communities and most(myself included), if not all of their male descendents served honorably in our military.

    Indeed, one only need read the story of Kareem Rashad Sultan Khan a first generation Arab American who gave his life in Iraq. For him, joining the Army and defending this country weren’t obligations, they were privileges.

    HOWEVER, there is a definite distinction between immigrants who are willing to come here and work and sacrifice in return for the privilege of American citizenship, and those who come here and simply expect a better way of life. Moreover, I find very little more infuriating than those who refuse to make any effort to assimilate, and feel that they should be granted understanding as well as recognition of their native languages and customs. Exacerbating this is the fact that many people new to this country who feel this way are from places that, for all intents and purposes, ban immigration.

    I spoke with a young man who was supposed to be going to school and working for a foreign firm for one year as part of his studies. The nation to which he was supposed to visit as a student forced the University he was going to attend to retract their invitation and the firm to give the job to a “native born” worker. What stunned me about this was that the country he was supposed to go to was a Western European democracy, as well as a long time and staunch ally of the U.S.

    Thus, I now feel that we should start adopting a more protectionist stance. It’s not the role of the United States to take immigrants from countries that won’t in turn provide opportunities to our own people.

  • Joe (a different Joe)

    Actually, I’m a different Joe that the one to whom ADP is replying. I wrote the above comment.

  • Raymond D.

    It is wrong to believe that because some immigrants are scientists, artists, and intelligent people, all immigration is good. It is NOT good for any country to receive 10 Einsteins if they come in a package with 2000 Bin Ladens. The immigration must be selective.

  • drrichardpaul

    I think the fallacy with your thought process is that you rely on thinking US Born Citizens cannot do these same things, or that all the immigrants have forever changed the US for the better. Maybe in some areas you might be correct, but not in all areas. For example, Madeleine Albright was indeed the Secretary of State, however what force for Democracy and the American Dream was she? We should examine everything before making outrageous statements.

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