For the WBV proponents out there, tell the rest of us what this all means and why this study is so relevant and important. Instead of providing links to oodles and oodles of meaningless, flawed research, tell us why we should care about how WBV effects apparent mass and cross axis transfer. Tell us why WBV can do what traditional modes of exercise can’t.
From the title of the study we know that the researchers are trying to determine the effects of vibration training on apparent mass and cross axis transfer functions. I mean isn’t cross axis transfer the crux of any effective training program?
Seriously though, this study means nothing to anyone but the five researchers who conducted it and to the WBV hucksters who figured out that this study can somehow be used as proof that WBV accomplishes something unique and useful. The fact that Hypergravity provides this study to support the use of WBV training without explaining what the data means and how it’s practically applied is a great example of how marketing folk use science to intimidate and impress.
If these results are so important and impressive this study wouldn’t be listed seventh on the list and there would be some accompanying info as to why this study matters.
The link to the eighth item on the list of research is broken and takes you to the seventh item that deals with the all-important cross axis transfer study.
The ninth item on the list is titled, Effects of whole-body vibration in patients with multiple sclerosis: a pilot study. In this study 12 MS patients were split into two groups; the placebo group that had a TENS electrical nerve stimulation device attached to their forearm in order to simulate the vibrations received from a WBV platform, while the intervention group received actual whole body vibrations.
The link on the Hypergravity page takes you to Pubmed, where you can get to the full details of this study as well. Once the details of the study are revealed the conclusions reached by the authors that WBV training may improve the posture of MS patients becomes less certain.
Article comments
— go to most recent comments1 - Snarkattack
I assume this is in reference to purely physiological health of the human body?
I ask only because my yoga teacher (don't mock, at least not yet) told us in class that performing what is called the 'vibrating breath' or chanting stimulates endorphins or something similar (which apparently accounts for why some mentally unstable people chronically wail).
I've also heard the same thing about singing (like in a choir, or as a social activity on regular basis), the vibrations felt through the body again increases endorphins and even strengthens the immune system.
I don't have any academic references to back this up so I'm not claiming that it's 100% foolproof but I do think it has merit, particularly the latter point (from personal experience as a chronic depressive).
Hmm, so what do you think? Total baloney or time to join the people of Hy Brasil (from film Erik the Viking) singing their peaceful, happy lungs out?
2 - Aaman Lamba
Great analysis, Sal, very information-rich and timely, I'm sure, to exercise-types
3 - sal m
snarky:
i have more faith in an intuitive/traditional theory/philosophy such as the one forwarded by your yoga instructor than i do in a theory that calls upon shoddy science for support.
add in the fact that the WBV platforms cost upwards of $5000 versus the costless nature of the yoga instructor's advice and it's a no brainer.
sing your ass off....perhaps literally....
4 - Scott
sal m
I just came across your blogs last night and am amazed at the amount of hype surrounding this whole WBV thing. I am tending to lean in the direction that it is just that; hype!
In your first blog attracted the attention of some supposed GURU'S on WBV training such as Artur, D Leigha and a guy who supposedly was the formerproduct manager of Power Plate; Lloyd Shaw, who magically appeared after D Leigha seemed to be growing tired of the debate and made mention of him. But hey this is hyperspace, who knows who you are really talking to.
Anyway my debate is this: sal m has never used WBV and is relying on his epierience as a personal trainer and reasearch that does not completely add up to debunk the whole WBV theory. I think his argument would be more compelling if he were to actually test WBV for himself and report on the results. In a court of law you cannot prove something based soley on theory, you need credible witnesses.
Of all the posts made in previos blogs there has only been one negative expierience reported by OldGirl 518. Is there anyone else out there who has had a bad expierience with WBV therapy or has not seen any results??
Please! Let your stories be heard!
5 - HYPERGRAVITY
REITERATING:
I've watched Sal's Healthy Skeptic blog with much amusement as he attacks the concept of Whole Body Vibration and any researcher who has conducted a study that is not up to Sal's standards. (When did he become the great arbiter of such things anyway?) As Hypergravity's sales manager, I feel I have to speak up, since he has come out of nowhere and started attacking our company.
Sal, may I ask, what did we ever do to you?
First of all, repeatedly ridiculing spelling mistakes on our old website is in such poor taste. The gentleman who wrote the text on the old site is over 70 years old and speaks 7 languages, of which, English is his fifth. Call me when you've mastered even 2 languages, and then we'll discuss spelling errors.
It is true that we had put together a page that contained links to many studies that were performed with Whole Body Vibration platforms, but nowhere did we state an opinion on them. We merely have tried to show the public what studies are out there, warts and all. Yes there are good studies. Yes there are bad studies. Some of the studies, such as those performed by Galileo/Vibraflex are conducted on pivotal vibration devices which affect the body differently than the linear vibration units we make. They are not better or worse, they're only different. In fact, we only made reference to a couple studies on our Benefits page. I remember seeing one of them mentioned by a doctor on your previous page but I don't think you ever answered him/her and I don't have time to sift through the 100+ responses to check, so here it is again:
Effect of vibratory stimulation training on maximal force and flexibility.
Journal of Sports Science 1994 Dec;12(6):561-6.
Issurin VB, Liebermann DG, Tenenbaum G.
Ribstein Centre for Research and Sport Medicine Sciences, Wingate Institute, Wingate Post, Israel.
In this study, we investigated a new method of training for maximal strength and flexibility, which included exertion with superimposed vibration (vibratory stimulation, VS) on target muscles. Twenty-eight male athletes were divided into three groups, and trained three times a week for 3 weeks in one of the following conditions: (A) conventional exercises for strength of the arms and VS stretching exercises for the legs; (B) VS strength exercises for the arms and conventional stretching exercises for the legs; (C) irrelevant training (control group). The vibration was applied at 44 Hz while its amplitude was 3 mm. The effect of training was evaluated by means of isotonic maximal force, heel-to-heel length in the two-leg split across, and flex-and-reach test for body flexion. The VS strength training yielded an average increase in isotonic maximal strength of 49.8%, compared with an average gain of 16% with conventional training, while no gain was observed for the control group. The VS flexibility training resulted in an average gain in the legs split of 14.5 cm compared with 4.1 cm for the conventional training and 2 cm for the control groups, respectively. The ANOVA revealed significant pre-post training effects and an interaction between pre-post training and 'treatment' effects (P < 0.001) for the isotonic maximal force and both flexibility tests. It was concluded that superimposed vibrations applied for short periods allow for increased gains in maximal strength and flexibility.
This is a well designed study conducted not on the elderly but on 28 young, healthy, males. They even used a control group. (I'm sure it was because they didn't want to incur the wrath of Sal the great research design guru) Anyway, let's compare:
GROUP. . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .ISOTONIC MAXIMAL STRENGTH
Vibration Training . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . + 49.8%
Conventional Training. . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . + 16%
Control Group . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . + 0%
GROUP . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . LEG SPLIT FLEXIBILITY
Vibration Training . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . + 14.5 cm
Conventional Training . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . + 4.1 cm
Control Group. . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . + 2 cm
6 - HYPERGRAVITY
Now, let me make a big disclaimer. Although this research may strongly support the great potential that WBV has as a form of exercise, we are not trying to say (and never will say) that this should replace conventional exercise. Far from it! The more active people are, the better. The absolute fact that nobody can argue with is that WBV training makes your muscles do work. Period. And, if WBV is something that can motivate someone to get off the couch and get active again, GREAT!
Like I said, I have been following this blog for a while and I have come to admire Lloyd's candor from afar. He seems to be an honorable guy with a genuine interest in advancing public knowledge about WBV, while exposing the paranoid speculation (and often outright lies) of some in this industry who are less than scrupulous. He understands, as I do, that there is a need for much more research into the various applications of WBV, but let's make no mistake: there ARE documented health benefits to using WBV.
I know because I hear about them first-hand. Yes, my job is to sell a product, but I love what I do because it's a product I can believe in and I can honestly say I go to sleep at night knowing I helped people. Regardless of what any skeptics can say against a handful of Whole Body Vibration studies, I continue to get calls from people who love to tell me how their Hypergravity is helping them lose weight, or tone up, or relieve their fibromyalgia, or lower their blood pressure, or eliminate their plantar fasciitis, or just simply regain enough energy to play a full 18 holes of golf, and I could go on for hours! These people were SICK AND TIRED of being SICK AND TIRED because all their doctors knew to do was prescribe another pill to mask their symptoms instead of solve their problems! You have no idea how incredibly grateful they are. We become like part of their family. They send cards at Christmas or Hanukkah, and invite us to their kid's birthday parties. And we go!
And, Sal, no matter how much you try to dismantle other people's research, you can never--and I mean NEVER--take away what we have given to these people. Just because it is anecdotal, doesn't make it less real, and I DARE you to tell these mothers, fathers and grandparents that their stories--their struggles and their triumphs--are worthless and have no meaning! I dare you.
Christopher
7 - HYPERGRAVITY
P.S. Let's remember you STILL have never even tried one of these machines yourself.
8 - Phillip Winn
In a court of law you cannot prove something based soley on theory, you need credible witnesses.
Scott, that's not even close to true. Those who are making extraordinary claims (the manufacturers of WBV devices) are the ones who need to prove their case. The research doesn't add up all right -- it doesn't add up in any way that that supports the manufacturers, that is!
On the one hand we have the science that everybody accepts, all of which says that WBV is useless. On the other hand we have claims made by people who either stand to profit from their claims (and are therefore heavily biased), or lack the knowledge or ability to perform controlled studies (to demonstrate, for example, that lunges while on a WBV are more effective than lunges alone). In the courtroom, which do you think is more compelling -- the big stack of science textbooks, or the sales manager?
9 - Victor Plenty
Most varieties of snake oil are ones I've never tried, but I'm confident they're worthless.
Whole body vibration has thus far been proven valuable to only one small group of people: people who work for the manufacturers of whole body vibration equipment. Its value to this group of people has been established beyond all reasonable doubt.
The specious arguments such people use to support their claims strongly indicate they are the only ones who will ever profit from whole body vibration machines.
(Here's a hint: don't just brag about the number of languages your researcher knows. Hire somebody who is fluent in English to proofread your English-language research papers and other publications. Otherwise a neutral observer has no reason to believe you give a damn about the quality of your research.)
10 - sal m
it is quite amusing that someone from the hypergravity site is so "bold" to come to this site to respond to my valid criticisms of their gadget without clearly identifying themself.
the other efforts of this "HYPERGRAVITY" person are just plain laughable.
for starters i have not set myself up as the arbiter of anything. what i have done is review the materials that these WBV manufacturers have provided as proof and have expressed the opinion that there is no proof offered in any of these studies.
as a professional in the field of fitness i am part of the target market to which these people are trying to sell, and as such i am of the opinion that there is no proof that WBV can do anything for anyone. therefore i am qualified to reach such an opinion.
the HYPERGRAVITY person attempts to refute my opinion by offering up yet another abstract of a shoddy study that provides no details. particularly interesting in this abstract is the description of the "irrelevant training" engaged in by the control group. there are no other details provided with regard to the type of exercises performed by these "28 male athletes" or details of any kind that allow anyone to make any kind of conclusion about the efficacy of WBV training.
and how is it poor taste to point out that your web site is riddled with spelling errors, and overt misattention to details and overall general sloppiness? the hypergravity folks are asking people to shell out thousands of dollars for their equipment and yet cannot produce an error-free web site. a company cannot be taken seriously if they cannot even produce a decent web site.
and while we're on the subject, on the "Applications" page of the web site the hypergravity people make more outlandish claims about WBV, saying among other things that the hypergravity platform can reverse the aging process, reduce cellulite and fat, reduce wrinkles, improve restoration of hair color (!) and more, all without a shred of proof to back up these claims.
anecdotal evidence is great for marketing departments and salesmen, but the story about you guys feeling good about all the struggles and triumphs that you have helped people overcome is pure myth, just like WBV training.
11 - Lloyd Shaw
If anyone doubts my motives or identity. You are more than welcome to call me [Personal contact info removed] at my development centre in N.Z. ( Vibra-Train ) And i will confirm to you personally i wrote this.
And for the those of you in " fitness industry " . The ones who dare to judge what the developers ( not the marketers ) are trying to do. You are more than welcome to visit me at my mortuary business to see the results of YOUR best efforts.
The FACT remains that obesity is a massive problem you have no real answer for , or we wouldnt be talking about it.
12 - sal m
lloyd:
the answer to obesity is lies in the concept of individual choice, and not in a vibrating platform. given the absolute dearth of any kind of legit data dealing with the efficacy of WBV as it pertains to any member of the population, making the statement that WBV is somehow the answer to the obesity problem is pure folly.
the people who suffer from a metabolic disorder that results in obesity is a small fraction of the total population of the obese. it may be politically incorrect to say it, but the vast majority of obese people have chosen to be obese.
and you can't put your phone number in a comment, as it violates the comment policy.
13 - sal m
and one more thing, blaming the fitness industry for people dying from obesity is laughable and reduces your credibility to the level of the crediblity of the data that WBV is an effective solution to anything.
in case you didn't get the message, fat people are fat because they choose to be fat. they buy and eat - overeat - the foods, they ignore the advice of society and the medical community and they are the ones who are responsible for their sedentary and unhealthy lifestyles.
again, the percentage of people with legit metabolic/medical obesity are not considered in this light, but the vast majority of the obese have chosen their path.
14 - Lloyd Shaw
Your comments SAL M as usual are correct. It is their choice to be obese. But you and i confiring on that in no way helps the situation. We are not obese.
What i am saying is these people need a stepping stone to simple movement. Not a size 8 bikini. They are beyond our advice. Which is what the " fitness industry " has refused to acknowledge. It instead CHOOSES to apply a simplistic approch of " just eat less and exercise more " . To justify there own lack of the understanding of how far gone the problem is.
Let me ask you a question , how often have you seen a clinically obese individual actually reverse their condition ?
I bet you could count them on one hand.
But despite this dismal failure the industry is so arrogant as to not even want to try another approch. I have seen it with my own two eyes. Personal Trainers telling people Vibration Training CANT work. No reason givin. Just a ploint blank denial of even the possability it may help someone .
And they DARE pretend to care, i know what a caring attitude looks like , and its not that. Its as fake as the plastic machines coming out of China.
That is why i count them as part of the problem , not the solution.
15 - sal m
lloyd:
i think the people in the "fitness business" that can be blamed for the "tower of babel" situation that exisits with regard to diet and exercise are not true professionals, but are marketers and celebrities that have an agenda and want to trade off on their name recognition to make a buck off of the gullible, star-struck masses.
over my 20 years in the biz, i have seen how the majority of trainers who train "everyday people" have to struggle to get clients to overcome the nonsense that they have heard in the mainstream media.
i guess there are people in the WBV business who are making it tough for legit WBV'ers to get their message out. the hucksters who are pushing WBV as applicable for everyone are making it hard for legit guys like yourself to get your message out.
16 - mark
Who will do rigorous objective science? Not me. We -believe- or not , according to our limited knowledge and understanding of research findings, of experts and their opinions. We get in trouble when we pretend to understand what we don't understand. We choose what 'sounds senseable'. In the end, the best we can do is try and master our personal paradox: Objectively judge our subjective results. I submit my subjective results from a short session, (three minutes), on a 40MHz vibration platform: 1/Holding a semi-squat position (thighs about half-way down toward parallel), felt as if had a 150lb weight vest on , (I own an 84lb vest to compare). 2/ Flexibility of my hamstrings and tension in my achilles tendon was greatly improved immediately after a forward bend on the machine. The effect lasted for at least few hours, (an hour longer than any previous therapy or exercise's effect has lasted). 3/ Although no specific work was done for this, stress in my neck was relieved for a few hours, (an effect equal to chiropractic treatments that have never lasted more than an hour). 4/ The next day my thighs had a delayed onset muscular soreness. I am active, regularly walk up and down multiple flights of stairs, and do sets of leg presses with 400 lbs without soreness. so I must regard this effect with interest. Sal, why not just try it? You've given us a good analysis of the lax research and misleading promotion, now give us your opinion, of the machine itself.
17 - Phillip Winn
There's a sucker born every minute -- or more often.
18 - mark
Trying and buying are two different things, unless you don't trust your own sales resistance. One can be also be a sucker by losing a real advantage due to stubborness masquerading as skeptism. I'm more than happy to hear from anyone who's tried one of Hypergravity's machines and was not impressed. I'm not disputing that the research is unconvincing, so let's lay off the paperwork and compare experiences. Hey, Sal loves kettlebells, and most if not all of Pavel's Russian anecdotes are made up. Why doesn't Sal scrupulously research Pavel's story-telling?: Because Sal TRIED the kettlebells, and he LIKED them. Fair enough...Try the machine.
19 - sal m
mark:
you are just another anonymous internet random masquerading as a fitness expert.
i tried and use kettlebells and have read pavel's books because they are rooted not only in the rich history of training but because pavel takes a no-nonsense, common sense approach to his philosophy. also, the kettlebells are accessible.
WBV training on the other hand is based in fake science that tries to dress up flawed studies so that these studies can be used as proof that WBV works. when i've called these studies out as flawed and inaccurate, those in the wbv industry tell me to forget the science and just try it for myself.
what a joke.
and if you had any knowledge of training you would be aware of basic flexibility techniques that can improve a person's level of flexibility without the need for equipment that costs anything. when you consider the ridiculous expense of the ridiculous WBV gadgets, your position becomes even more ludicrous.
20 - mark
I -am- Mark, I'd be anonymous no matter how much more I told you about myself, it would simply mean nothing anyone on the forum. What do you want to know? I am -not- a fitness expert, and never said I was. I'm only speaking my mind and explaining my experience. I was born in 1948. I have no financial interest in vibration, and no friends or family in the industry. I've tried many stretching techniques. I have Pavel's books, on stretching and strength, and many others. I've dabbled in many martial arts, but have studied tai chi since 1978, and strength training since 1965. I have kettlebells, (made for me, much cheaper). I find the effect of the vibration machine on the tension in my left achilles tendon and neck to be something other than any stetching, massage, chiropractic, or acupunture has caused,(much more complete, quicker, easier, and longer lasting).. I don't own a vibration machine, and I do a rigorous stretching routine every day, by necessity, just to get a fraction of the effect. Yes, the machines are too expensive,(i'm not buying one), and no, they're not readily available, (but I found one to try, and so can you.)....... Most, if not all, of Pavels 'rich history' is made up by Pavel. (I don't have the sites for you to check, but if you're interested, the 'other side' of the kettlebell myth is easy to track down.) His training may be no-nonsense,(some experts dispute this), but his promotion is full of it. I don't care, and you don't care. We like results.That's fine. But why don't you write about how much paper he wastes with empty space and huge print, so he can turn a pamphlet into a thirty-dollar book, only to rewrite it the next year and sell it to us all over again? I'd appreciate your criticisms much more if you dealt them out a little more fairly.
21 - mark
Regarding my not purchasing a machine: To be fair, I'd probably get the 'home' Hypergravity,($3,499+$280=$4279), but I weigh 235lbs, and would want to use fairly heavy dumbells while on the platform, which puts me at the limits of the commercial unit, ($7,449+$450=$7889). Power Plate is even more, ($9,259+600+$9,850!). Too high, no doubt on that count. (At least Hypergravity will extend the warranty year by year.) When a reasonably priced club near me gets one, I'll be there.
22 - mark
I thought if it was from a negative perspective, that the product info would be acceptable, but as I look at it , I can see that it may not be. My apologies, and I understand if you wish to delete this. By the way, Are personal attacks allowed if it's your blog?
23 - sal m
there is nothing to delete here...you've expressed your opinion with which i have disagreed.
24 - Bob H
Great comments here. As for me I've been researching WBV for a little over a year now and recently had the opportunity to utilize a demo vibraflex unit in my office (I'm a chiropractor) for a week. My patients love it, especially the ones with restless-leg-syndrome (able to sleep finally) as nothing else has helped them at all.
25 - alan
glad i found your blog. was thinking of buying a soloflex unit. couldn't find studies that satisfied me. after finding your blog i will continue to wait.