The results from last night’s Presidential Debate between Sarah Palin and Joe Biden are in.
Fox News: Winner – Sarah Palin
MSNBC: Winner – Joe Biden
Shocking isn’t it?
It’s hard to argue that Sarah Palin didn’t acquit herself well. Rudy Giuliani went so far as to say that Palin wiped the floor with Biden, but of course, Giuliani is still spending his time trying to win the Florida Primary, the one that will propel him to the Republican nomination.
I’ll say up front that the things that Sarah Palin believes are not the things that I believe. Nevertheless, for someone who is supposed to be just a hockey mom and an outsider, she sure did come off like a traditional politician.
The following exchange took place after the debate between MSNBC’s Keith Olbermann and Hawaii Governor Linda Lingle.
Keith Olbermann: Is it all unfair to the debate process to say to the moderator - I may not answer the question in the way you want me to or in several occasions as the Governor did tonight not answer the question that was posed by the moderator and change the topic after the question was posed?
Linda Lingle: Well, I thought it was great debate strategy and showed an experienced debater.
And that in a nutshell is why I hate American politics. It shouldn’t be a game or a marketing campaign. It should be about passionate people expressing their views honestly.
Have we really devolved to the point where a candidate’s crafty ability to dodge a question is seen as a positive attribute? I admit that I probably would have thought little of whatever Palin came up with in reponse to those questions, but I would have at least given her credit for answering them.
Article comments
— go to most recent comments1 - Baritone
I sincerely doubt that Palin uttered even one extemporaneous sentence last night. Virtually every word she spoke, including her folksy phrases and even her winks and her "shout out" to that 3rd grade class, were carefully scripted and thoroughly rehearsed. Not a spontaneous word.
Basically, she proved to all of us that she is a good study. Nothing more.
I do feel that either Glen Ifel or even Biden should have challenged Palen's unwillingness to answer questions, and her repeated steering the discussion back to her comfort zone.
I wouldn't say that Biden did great, but it was obvious that he was in his element, and that he displayed both a depth and breadth of knowledge in all areas covered during the debate.
Ifel didn't pitch any curve balls. All her questions covered legitimate areas that should have been answerable by both candidates. That Palin openly and purposely dodged several questions may have been a good debating tactic, but I must agree with Brad. Good debating technique does not serve the interests of the voting public. We deserve to know what she knows. If she doesn't know the answer, it would have been far more honest for her to say so. Of course, in effect, that's just what she did everytime she steered away from question after question.
B
2 - JB
Well, when you are a liberal Bush hater, not hard to see why you feel this way.
Don't hate! Congratulate!
3 - Baritone
Yes, I am a "liberal Bush hater," and with good reason.
That Palin lovers fail to recognize that all of her responses were from rote memorization is only testament to their own bias and selective blindness, not to mention a lack of discernment. For all of you Palin succeeded in faking sincerity. Yet another plus for Tundra Barbie.
B
4 - DaveNalle
I find it inconceivable that anyone could become governor of a state or even a mayor without having some basic ability to answer the kinds of questions Couric and Gibson threw at her. I think that what we were looking at in those two interviews was someone who was so nervous that she just totally lost it.
I saw a moment of that in the debate with Biden, but by providing her with a script and drilling it into her they managed to avoid what I would guess is near crippling stage fright.
I don't think Palin is stupid or doesn't read newspapers or doesn't know some basics on foreign affairs. I think that the evidence and the verbal nattering she falls into is a sign that she's just absolutely terrified and loses it when put on the spot.
It's something she can and probably will outgrow, but it takes time and experience and maybe some intense therapy and acting classes.
Dave
5 - Brad Laidman
Damn they were just going to reveal what newspapers she reads on CNN and then the OJ verdict comes in!
Those Republicans are brilliant!
6 - Silas Kain
Dear God, would Americans be this interested if it was say, 535 members of Congress put on trial for the biggest bait and switch in American history? Would we be this interested if George W. Bush were charged with war crimes upon exit from office? Who cares if OJ got convicted? It didn't hurt Hertz Rent-A-Car stocks this time around!
7 - georgio
ok jump on me but I have to say this ..when Palin refers to "Joe six pack" as middle America I laugh everytime because if you have a six pack of beer everyday ..YOU ARE AN ALCOHOLIC...with serious problems .
8 - Joanne Huspek
This is nothing new. All politicians are masters of the dodge. None of them can answer a question with a direct answer, and I'm talking both side of the aisle. That's the reason why I really have to limit my intake of "news" items featuring politicians. I might end up throwing something big and heavy at my husband's favorite flat screen, and then I'd be in big trouble.
I wish I could have learned those skills. Oh, wait... I couldn't have. I have a basic level of decency and integrity. That's why I'm not an attorney, or a politician.
9 - jamminsue
Georgio:
ok jump on me but I have to say this ..when Palin refers to "Joe six pack" as middle America I laugh everytime because if you have a six pack of beer everyday ..YOU ARE AN ALCOHOLIC...with serious problems.
Not everyone who drinks six beers every night is an alcoholic, but it does tend to kill enough brain cells to make 'ol Joe amenable to any kind of silliness. There are those that think and then those that are told, and believe they are thiking.
10 - bliffle
Art Hoppe, who invented Joe Sixpak about 40 years ago as a figure of fun, would get a hoot out of knowing that old Joe has become a heroic figure in the world of 2008.
11 - Cindy D
I guess "risk vs. reward" doesn't get much discussion on the streets of Wasilla.
I was amazed at Palin's opposition to the McCain campaign's concession of MI.
Palin says she "fired off and e-mail" (having read about the pull out in the news), asking, “Oh c’mon, do we have to?”
She would rather, "keep trying." Nevermind that your opponents have a 10-13 point lead.
You've got to admire that "never give up" no matter how hard reality knocks on your skull die-hard spirit.
I can only wonder how this would translate into her handling of the economy if the latest headlines were to read "Beauty and the Deceased".
12 - madinkawarrior
Thinkprogress.org has a video showing Gov Palin reading off of her talking points notes.Now I know why at times she would drift into talking about something that had nothing to do with question asked.To think this women could be a heart beat from the presidency SCARY!!!
13 - Arch Conservative
Although I agree that Palin is not ready to be president it would be refreshing if all of this criticism of her was coming from those who didn't have Barack Obama's nutsack in their mouths.
14 - troll
"May I call you Joe?"......."Say it ain't so Joe!"
what contrived horse shit
15 - Cindy D
RE # 12
good point madinka.
What Palin says,
"Well, I may not answer your questions the way you'd like."
What Palin means,
"How do you expect me to recite the script I memorized if you keep asking all those different questions."
16 - Dan(Miller)
Arch,
You say, I agree that Palin is not ready to be president . . .. Compared to whom?
Either the Obama/Biden ticket or the McCain/Palin ticket will be elected. Those are the only alternates, and we are stuck with them. I find it all very depressing.
Leaving aside the minor fact that Governor Palin is not running for President, the two candidates who are, and Senator Biden as well, are members of that interesting club called the U.S. Senate which, along with the honorable members of the House, just brought us one of the silliest pieces of legislation in recent memory. Is any one of the three ready to be president? For that matter, is anybody?
As you also comment, it would be refreshing if all of this criticism of . . . [Governor Palin] was coming from those who didn't have Barack Obama's nutsack in their mouths. I agree, but were that the case the criticisms would probably be different and less vapid. There are certainly legitimate criticisms to be made, but most of those I have read have been juvenile and off base. Plucked from relatively obscurity only a few weeks ago, and considering how well she has done despite that, and despite a hostile press, I think she would grow into a better President more quickly than any of the other three.
Dan(Miller)
17 - Clavos
Plucked from relatively obscurity only a few weeks ago, and considering how well she has done despite that, and despite a hostile press, I think she would grow into a better President more quickly than any of the other three.
Hear! Hear!
18 - Lisa Solod Warren
You're kidding, boys (Clav and Dan), right? Plucked from obscurity? Why the hell WAS she plucked from obscurity in the first place? This woman is poised to become the veep, and perhaps, the President of the United States, should McCain fall ill or die. She should never have been plucked from obscurity in the first place. What bizarre logic from two supposedly intelligent men. If Arch can accuse us of having Obama's nutsack in our mouths (an ugly and stupid image) I can only say that you must be two of those men who have fallen for her "cute as a button looks" and have a serious hard on for that faded cheerleader thing.
Palin not only did not answer the questions, had notes in front of her, stuck to ridiculous talking points, mentioned energy when it wasn't to the point, and winked and appeared folksy to try and disarm, she got many may facts wrong... I could go into all of them here if I weren't recovering from surgery and just barely able to sit (Yeah, some excuse) but they are easy to find..including getting the information about the stategy in Afghanistan wrong, Obama's positions wrong, McCain's positions wrong (so that he had to correct her the next day), and the minor fact of the general's name wrong. In fact, they left her out of the loop and didn't even TELL her about Michigan, which stunned me because I was sitting there saying to myself: Why doesn't she know?
And you think she did well? Talk about setting the bar low.
I must assume that both your wives are far more intelligent that Little Miss Sunshine and that you wouldn't even begin to put up with such silliness from them.
But from a VP candidate it's okay?
19 - Cindy D
Apparently, anything short of her falling on the floor and running in circles like Curly of the three stooges, is evidence for Palin's success in the debate.
Palin: "I'm sorry, I'll have to let Jesus answer that question..whoop, whoop, whoop, whoop, whoop, whoop, whooop."
Nyak, Nyak, Nyak...
Our responses were vapid. Perhaps we went wrong. We didn't once make any mention of anyone's "nutsack."
20 - Brad Laidman
I'd actually argue that the Press was fairly in love with her after the convention. She was the one that dodged all the interviews and then when she sat down with the less than intimidating Katie Couric had a meltdown of epic proportions, they turned on her and well, rightly so.
21 - Cindy D
Now we're going to be treated to Palin's every sentence beginning, "Well, I was reading my copy of today’s New York Times ..."
When I was dusting off the ol' moose antlers with the latest copy of the Economist...
How stupid can people actually be? Is someone buying this shit?
22 - Franco
"There are certainly legitimate criticisms to be made, but most of those I have read have been juvenile and off base. Plucked from relatively obscurity only a few weeks ago, and considering how well she has done despite that, and despite a hostile press, I think she would grow into a better President more quickly than any of the other three".
Excellent comment Dan.
Palin is anything but inexperienced in government and has already made her mark as an agent of change. A mark that stands right now as high as any mark on the walls in DC. "Busting up big oils hold on politices in Alaska".
She is smart as a whip, and makes no apologias while she looks you right in the eye which is exactly what she did as governor taking on and braking up big oil, and to boot she throw members of her own party in jail over it.
Ya right, she's only good when being scripted.
Biden has 36 years experience in both the front and back rooms in DC and in conducting debates on the national stage. Palin has 6 years working up through State government to governor with just 5 weeks in debates on the national stage. Biden should have been able to show her the door, and couldn't do it.
In fact, Biden was even a bit taken with her during the debate. But Biden did his job for his guy the best he could, even thought Biden once stated Obama did not have the experiance to be President. But Biden hammered away in the debate and he is no push over. Guess what...neither is Palin
23 - Franco
#18 " Lisa Solod Warren
"cute as a button looks"
She's got that too.
24 - Franco
#20 " Brad Laidman
"she sat down with the less than intimidating Katie Couric had a meltdown of epic proportions"
In their early life achievements, Couric and Palin both gained public attention. Couric was a petite peppy cheerleader on the side lines yelling for her team, while Palin got in the game kicking ass and taking names.
In their later carries, peppy Couric is still on the sidelines yelling for her team albit devoting her efforts to keeping her head above water from the never-ending nightmare of constantly displaying the definition of the Peter Principle. While Palin becomes govenor of the largest energy state in the union and kicks ass and takes names of big oil. Names she mentioned in the debate. A woman taking on big oil and braking them and to boot she throw members of her own party in jail over it. A job clearly not over her head.
Action speak louder then words.
Couric is the joke, not Palin. And as far as what news sources Palin reads, after finding out she can kick big oils ass, I'd like to subscribe to what ever it is she reads. But I am sure it is not anything Couric ever had to say that assisted in the actions Palin took.
25 - Baritone
Kicked big oils ass? Really? Doggone it, ya just otta show us just how she managed that, by golly.
Big oil is still big oil. Specifically, what Babe Sarah did was increase the windfall profit taxes that the oil companies pay to the state. This tax, or payment was originally established more than 20 years ago. She simply upped the ante.
Oh, and which candidate proposes that big oil pay a federal windfall tax, and which one opposes it?
Her big 40 million dollar natural gas pipeline project exists only on paper and stands no more than a 50/50 chance of actually being built, and is at least 10 years away, if it does.
All of you who were taken in by Palin's debate performance obviously are unable to discern extemporaneous speaking as Biden did throughout, and rote memorization as Tundra Barbie did. She did not voice an original thought the entire evening.
If all of us liberals have Obama's nutsack in our mouths - what a nice image, btw, all you Palin lovers would obviously eat a mile of her shit just to kiss her ass. You all sit watching her with a lump in your drawers imagining your face nuzzling those once perky breasts.
B