New Orleans Mayor Ray Nagin explains in a radio interview why he didn't use the hundreds of his city's school buses to evacuate residents:
"I need 500 buses, man," he told WWL. "One of the briefings we had they were talking about getting, you know, public school bus drivers to come down here and bus people out of here."
Nagin described his response:
"I'm like - you've got to be kidding me. This is a natural disaster. Get every doggone Greyhound bus line in the country and get their asses moving to New Orleans."
While Nagin was waiting for his Greyhound fleet, Katrina's floodwaters swamped his school buses, rendering them unusable.
Let's try to follow the Mayor's "logic" here:
- There were hundreds of buses available to him
- He would have preferred 500 Greyhound buses
- There were not 500 Greyhound buses available to him
- Therefore, he didn't use the buses he had
And therefore, thousands of people were trapped in the city, with no means to escape. And many of them died.
I think this guy's MENSA card needs to be revoked...
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Article comments
— go to most recent comments1 - billy
and why didnt bush step in if this is the case?
obviously then it is bush's fault.
2 - Rich
Your missing the point of your logic.
Who was going to drive these buses?
The school bus drivers? They got away, much like many of the police officers who's families lived in the path of the hurricane.
I'm not defending him mistakes were made, but I hope you realize FEMA also caused people to die.
3 - marc
Your missing the point of your logic.
Not at all, in reading the Cities and States evac plan you will learn it expressly states the buses were to be used and used early enough before storm (and before the police and potential drivers left the area.) landfall to make a difference.
Probably not all but certainly more would have gotten out than actually did.
And guess what, no matter the danger a police officers first responsibility is the to city who he's paid to protect. If they fled the deaths are also on their hands.
billy go read your constitution maybe a little enlightenment will prevent you from making an utter fool of yourself. But then again, you look so good in that duncecap.
4 - RogerMDillion
Right on point, Rich. Every right winger keeps showing the photo of busses, but I have yet to see a photo of the hundreds of drivers.
5 - Silas Kain
I'm sick of that picture of drowning school busses being the picture that launched a million words of bullshit from Conservatives. EVERYBODY at all levels screwed up. And until every last victim is accounted for from St Bernard's County, LA to Mobile, AL; we should just shut up about who's to blame. The one thing, however, that I believe we must be vocal about is demanding an investigation with someone trustworthy in charge. Candidates like Colin Powell, Bob Dole, Steve Forbes, Jack Kemp or Lee Iacocca.
6 - Scott
All these comments and articles about local officials failing are really just misplaced anger. Local governments have neither the personnel nor the monetary ability to carry out such a large-scale operation like evacuating a city of over 1 million people whereas the federal agencies in place, for the most part, do. The mayor and governor gave the evacuation order and 80% of the city did evacuate. Even if the local government did run school buses out of the city for the remainder of people, there'd still be tens of thousands left. That's where the shelters come into play - they opened shelters for those who couldn't leave but never expected the aftermath Katrina would bring.
I'm not saying Nagin is totally innocent but the blame for what has happened falls on more than his shoulders alone.
7 - Bennett
Exactly right, Scott. FEMA is charged with providing the means to evacuate in the event of a forseeable disaster.
The minute it was forcast that a category 5 hurricane would hit the gulf coast around New Orleans, they should have moved. They didn't.
The top ten people in FEMA are appointees, NONE have disaster planning or relief experience. All of the folks that delt with Hurricane Andrew are gone.
There was a great segment on Jim Leaher's Nightly News (sorry about the spelling of his name, it's a tough one!) outlining the failure of FEMA to do what it's designed to do.
A shame, a waste, a travesty, a loss of too many good people.
8 - RJ
I find it almost sad that no one wants to address the actual issue this post brings up.
Nagin had HUNDREDS of buses at his disposal. He used NONE of them.
THOUSANDS of people wanted to get out of NO, but couldn't. They didn't have cars. They would have gladly hopped on buses to escape.
But there were no buses coming for them.
Because Mayor Nagin was apparently holding out for a fleet of Greyhounds that never came...
DEAL WITH THAT!
9 - Bennett
I understand your outrage, RJ, but FEMA is charged with dealing with potential disasters. If they had been on the ball, if they had their folks in the Mayor's office once a category 5 hurricane was forcast to impact the New Orleans area, helping coordinate, demanding that the busses be made ready for drivers, drivers provided by FEMA if local drivers were not available, moving to get as many people out of NO as possible, then our government process and responsibility would have been served.
This didn't happen. It should have, according to my latest IRS return.
10 - Dave Nalle
>>and why didnt bush step in if this is the case?
obviously then it is bush's fault.<<
How was Bush supposed to know about this problem - oh yeah, he's psychic, I forgot.
>>Who was going to drive these buses?<<
According to governor Blanco she had deployed 'thousands' of national guardsmen inside New Orleans prior to the storm. Perhaps some of them could have driven the buses.
Dave
11 - Silas Kain
We elect politicians who are a reflection of our society: self-indulgent, superficial, dishonest, and downright stupid. Forgive me, make that lacking common sense. If we accept these low standards for the people we elect, the ultimate blame rests upon our shoulders.
12 - Jewels
Negligent Nagin rides again! (But not on his buses, only Greyhounds.) Sorry folks!
13 - Rich
RJ,
Don't be blinded by partisanship by saying "I find it almost sad that no one wants to address the actual issue this post brings up".
It is reckless to imagine the fault is only on the Mayor, which I believe your post suggests.
The FEMA leadership is composed of Bush cronies. Even if they were well intentioned to help they were bound to fail and they did.
Cronieism should stop, at least when American lives are at stake. After the partisan sniping is over (from BOTH sides) I hope we learn this deathly mistake.
14 - wrbones
FEMA's responsibility is to co-ordinate disaster relief AFTER a disaster. They have no other responsibility, nor do they have resources for bailing you out beforehand. That's not in their job description.
Federal, state and local disaster preparedness guidelines tell us that the local mayor, governor, and statre are primarily responsible for their own disaster preparedness. Is your city and state prepared?
Additionally, there is the Possee Comitatus Act, and the Insurrection Act, which means that the feds can only go in AFTER the locals have invited them and only after the state has declared a state of emergency. The only other option is for the President to declare a nation-wide state of martial law...
Unless you want a dictator or a tyrant, the President's options are limited by law. Additionally there is some silly group called Congress that must be dealt with as well.
The feds can do nothing until the state declares an emergency and then orders it's state National Guard to be deployed...and then asks the feds to step in...
New Orleans and the state of Louisiana did not follow their own disaaster guidelines, and then further held up relief efforts (after the flooding began) by arguing with the feds over who had authority over what and when and how...
Additionally, 90,000 square miles were flattened, which is an area larger than all but ten states in this nation...logistics is a factor...but some of you don't care about the facts or the Constitution...or personal responsibility.
The worst of the disaster was directly caused by a local leadership failure.
15 - Dave Nalle
>>Cronieism should stop, at least when American lives are at stake. After the partisan sniping is over (from BOTH sides) I hope we learn this deathly mistake.<<
That's right. Presidents should only appoint people who they have no personal knowledge of and have no way to assess their character or capabilities. I say we appoint RANDOM people to all government jobs. It's the only fair way.
Dave
16 - Michael
Reverend Jessie Jackson's apology of Mayor Nagin's missed opportunity to utilize local school busses to evacuate the city was based on the notion that there was no prearranged destination for those evacuees. I know hindsight is 20-20, but to pass on this opportunity for this reason seems to be putting the cart before the horse. The problem of what to do with the rescued citizens pales in comparison with the potential for wide-spread death due to inaction.
17 - Dave Nalle
The evacuation plan that Mayor Nagin signed off on specifically designated those school buses for evacuation. It's a pretty cut and dried case of failure to follow the plan. Along with not stocking the Superdome with water and supplies as was supposed to have been done. The title of this thread is right on target.
Dave
18 - pcone
wrbones, it took me about five seconds to find the truth about FEMA, and sorry, you're WRONG. From FEMA's website link
"The Federal Emergency Management Agency - a former independent agency that became part of the new Department of Homeland Security in March 2003 - is tasked with responding to, planning for, recovering from and mitigating against disasters."
Also at the bottom of the page...
"As it has for more than 20 years, FEMA's mission remains: to lead America to prepare for, prevent, respond to and recover from disasters with a vision of 'A Nation Prepared.' At no time in its history has this vision been more important to the country than in the aftermath of Sept. 11th."
I'm not a lawyer but it seems pretty obvious that "to prepare for", "responding to", "planning for" and "mitigating against" all imply that FEMA is responsible for all phases of distaster response, not just after. And the phrase "A Nation Prepared" says it all, doesn't it? (Then again, so does "in the aftermath of Sept. 11th.")
19 - Daniel King
School buses are not difficult to drive. A 17 year old who had never driven a bus before, hopped on a school bus and drove out safe & sound. They are not 18 wheelers. The people should have been evacuated before the storm. Remember people were wating in line 6-8 hrs. at the Superdome, the day the storm was going to hit.MAYOR NAGIN WAITED UNTIL THE LAST DAY TO ORDER A MADATORY EVACUATION. All those people could have been evacuated USING THE SCHOOL BUSES!!!! Regarding the people who didn't evacuate in New Orleans-WHAT NEWS WERE THEY WATCHING?!! Watching the weather channel, CNN & FOX, one would thought that New Orleans was going to be the next Atlantis. And they predicted the EYE OF A CAT.5 HURRICANE WAS HEADING STRAIGHT FOR NEW ORLEANS. Also some of the blame must lie with the individual. When they tell you to supply yourself with 10 days food & water-BELIEVE THEM!!! The troublemakers at Hot Air America are really going off the deep end. Randi Rhodes is really going to be disappointed if Bush didn't murder 40,000 Americans.(AS IF 10,00 WASN'T A OUTRAGEOUS EXAGERATION)Her phony moral outrage is really barf producing. She had to keep telling people how many times she cried. Even her producer Tim Alan quit, because he had enough of her act. She demanded Air America fly her to Crawford on a private jet.(now that's funny).She's screaming and spewing that the rising real estate prices in New York City are Bush's fault. Blaming Bush over & over- it is his fault that she can't afford a apartment in the city. She could ,if she sold her $800,00 house down in Florida. She left out that important fact, as usual.
20 - Joe Democrat
Here ya go....
Louisiana disaster plan, pg 13, para 5 , dated 01/00
'The primary means of hurricane evacuation will be personal vehicles. School and municipal buses, government-owned vehicles and vehicles provided by volunteer agencies may be used to provide transportation for individuals who lack transportation and require assistance in evacuating'...
Thanks for nothing Ray!!!!
21 - Jewels
Joe, it seems only if you steal the buses...
I did hear of one courageous young man that 'stole' (per report) a school bus to escape. This guy proceeded to pick up folks along his way out of town to Houston until the bus was standing room only. Greta van Susteran had him on and I can't locate his name now.
And what about that big blonde Cajin guy and his wife, they saved a lot of folks with their airboat, by themselves...they seem to have remained anonymous. "Somebody" should give them a nice fat compensation check I'd think.
The Louisiana disaster plan was pretty much B.Y.O.B. (bring your own bus)
22 - Dave Nalle
pcone, how are you and other people missing the obvious passages in the FEMA manual which say that local authorities are the first responders and carry the brunt of the work duties aside from organization and oversight? It's mentioned numerous times in FEMA documentation. I direct you to: FEMA Disaster Procedure Manual
Dave
23 - wrbones
So...where does it say on FEMA's website that they have first responder responsibility for S.A.R. and evacuation?
It's not in their job description.
In any case, they can't do a thing until the state asks for their help.
Sorry. Try again. This time, read the whole thing, will ya?
Reading comprehension. Get some.
24 - Jewels
comprehensive reading is a skill...
25 - Hawkeye
Seems to me there is plenty of blame to go around and hopefully everyone will get and take their beating with dignity and learn something from it.
Ray Nagin really did screw the pooch, and as much as FEMA was clearly on it's ass in this, it was Nagin's job to follow HIS plan and evacuate HIS people. If bus drivers were an issue, it should have been addressed in the plan so that it wasn't an issue during the event. It wasn't FEMA's job to do Nagin's job or Blanco's job.
Both New Orleans AND Louisiana received millions of dollars from FEMA/DHS for disaster/terrorism preparedness, and I hope the big investigation that follows will bring those facts to light.
Not sure why it is so hard for anyone in America to have a civil discussion about this without becoming shrill and devolving into name-calling. We used to be better than that.
Hawkeye