After all, even if Lucas did not intend to compare Vader and President Bush, many liberals have, and that is just silly to the extreme. Are you really so angry and desperate that you have to compare the President to a movie character? If so, maybe you should wait until the new movie The Fantastic Four comes out, then you can compare the President to the character "Dr. Doom."
As for my take on the movie's possible slant? As I said earlier, I'm not sure.
I will say this; if there is ONE line in the whole movie that MIGHT be a slap at the President, it would be the line uttered by Obi Wan towards the very end of the movie. He and Anakin are preparing to do battle with one another and Anakin utters this oft-quoted line: "If you're not with me, you're my enemy."
For me, this wasn't a key line. I've heard that same line (or something like it) uttered a thousand times in movies and on television over the years. What made me laugh was the response by Obi Wan: "Only a Sith thinks in absolutes"; at which point, Obi Wan draws his light sabre and prepares to do battle with Anakin the evil absolutist.
I laughed for two reasons. First of all, because, it seemed to me to be a very thinly veiled slap at conservatism in general, if not the President in particular. Liberals love to accuse conservatives of couching our beliefs in terms of moral absolutes, ignoring the grayish nuances of life.
Secondly, I laughed because Obi Wan's reply was one to make any absolutist proud. As a matter of fact, Obi Wan's reply was more absolutist in nature than Anakin's original statment!
Think about it... Anakin makes a very simple statement, not about life in general, but to Obi Wan in particular. "If you are not with me," he says to his master, "then you are my enemy." Very clear declaration of intent, don't you think? "Join me or we duke it out right here," is Anakin's message.
Article comments
1 - Convex
I have to admit that the first time I've heard it was from some ridiculous right-wing websites blasting Lucas as a liberal. I think you got your wings mixed up.
Funny take on Obi Wan being absolutist though.
2 - David Flanagan
Convex,
I actually first heard of the controversy from the MSM which had been covering the banter emerging from the movie's screening in which liberals were saying that the movie was offering some comparisons between Darth Vader and the President. From there, however, right wing sites did take up the argument, some of which were in tones of outrage.
I could never bring myself to be outraged; either because I'm used to hearing such things or because I'm not offended by a message that cautions us on the issue of government power.
Or maybe it's just because I think that drawing a link between the two is incredibly silly bordering on childishness. I still have trouble imagining Lucas rewriting scripts to critique the President. I just don't think he did it, though, it could be the case.
Thanks,
David
3 - Convex
Yes, agreed, either side doing it is silly.
However, if the opposing side does it it means they think of the pres as this person (sith lord), funny enough if the other side does it they think the same!
In other words, in my mind, if the right is blasting Lucas for taking shots at Bush that's equivalent to equating Bush with the Sith in *their* minds.
Do you see what I mean?
By buying into this theory, on either side, you have to believe that Bush is subverting democracy and all the other evil things - since Lucas did not come out and say it was about Bush.
Instead of bashing Lucas, the right should be saying how ridiculous the theory is (like you just did) but because Bush *isn't* like that not that they can't believe Lucas would do it. Instead many of them *are* bashing Lucas and basically giving the theory merit.
4 - Convex
Oh, and I read about it on right-wing blog sites before the movie came out. That doesn't necessarily mean the chicken came before the egg but I'm just being clear.
5 - David Flanagan
Convex,
I understand your point though I disagree. For me, it seemed quite ridiculous that the left would even come up with such a ridiculous comparison.
And I first heard of these comparisons from reports coming out of the MSM related to the movie's airing at the Cannes Film Festival on May 15. Here is an excerpt and a link for context:
Thanks,
David
6 - gonzo marx
whoever made the comparison is just too silly for words..
after all, for whatever you want to say about him..for or against
Darth Vader was competent
nuff said?
Excelsior!
7 - David Flanagan
Gonzo,
Darth Vader your definition of "competent?"
Interesting...
8 - Nancy
Next thing we know, W will be running around flailing a plastic lightsaber and ranting about "...from a certain point of view...". Comparing Bush to Darth Vader? Oh, PLEEZE: I loathe Bush, but I wouldn't compare the two; Bush & Jar Jar Binks, maybe, but Vader? Nah.
9 - JR
Comparing Bush to Darth Vader?
No child left behind takes on a whole new meaning.
10 - Convex
Like I said, its a chicken or egg thing but the comparisons I saw started with the release of the book. I have no link for you but I accept it that it began as a left thing from Cannes.
Howveer, I am speaking more abuot the respnose from the right. Instead of saying how ridiculous the comparison is, they are bashing Lucas, implying that the comparison is correct. This is a little troubling coming from the man's own supporters.
You use the "Lucas wouldn't do that" defense, which I think is just as troubling, if it came from a Bush supporter which I don't know if you are or not.
The point is trashing Lucas is buying into the comparison, whatever side you're on.
11 - gonzo marx
David...
i did NOT use Vader to DEFINE "competent"...instead i used the adjective to describe a difference between the two that made the comparison ludacris...
example: Vader's military Intelligence was accurate, when errors occured, the offending party was held accountable and punished ("I find your lack of Faith, disturbing")
Vader's planning of military Operations was complete and well thought out, using overwhenlming force to achieve presicely the well defined Goals he had before him
Vader was an "A" student in each of his Incarnations
Vader could actually work hard and fix things as a youth, young Jedi
Vader's military service (as Anakin) was active duty in a shooting military conflict
on and on...
that's why comparing the two is just silly..
nuff said?
Excelsior!
12 - George P. Wood
If President Bush is Darth Vader, then does that make the Taliban and Al Qaeda into Jedi?
13 - Lysander
I think it all comes down to POV, as it were. During the opera scene, Anakin says something like, "The Sith are evil." To which the Chancellor responds with something like, "Good and evil are a point of view."
Then, during the battle on Mustafar, Obi-Wan decrees, "Anakin, Palpatine is evil!" To which Anakin shouts back, "From my point of view the Jedi are evil!"
However, in 'A New Hope,' an older Obi-Wan tells Luke that Darth Vader betrayed and murdered his father, only to clarify that statement in 'Return of the Jedi,' where, as force ghost, he says, "So what I told was true, from a certain point of view." To which Luke responds, "From a certain point of view!?!" To which the force ghost of Obi-Wan states, "Luke, you'll find that many of the truths we cling to depend greatly on our own point of view."
Obi-Wan, both young and old, is one of my favorite characters. I guess it was interesting for me to see him evolve from "only a Sith deals in absolutes" and "Palpatine is evil" to "What I told you was true, from a certain point of view" and "You'll find that many of the truths we cling to depend greatly on our own point of view."