Cindy Sheehan's mourning has turned to questions. It was good of the President to have consoled her in mourning. It is wrong of the President to ignore her very public concerns and her very simple request.
Raw Story is talking about the article from 2004 which Matt Drudge is employing, with a Right attack-dog-wind beneath his wings [he got the report archive from Freepers]. The mission to attack is on - the objective is to discredit the mother of a fallen Iraqi soldier.…
Article comments
— go to most recent comments76 - Jude
Dave, you said:
The woman in question DID talk to Bush, extensively.
I do not think it was an extensive or a particularly intense discussion, from Cindy Sheehan's version of the story. Sheehan claims that Bush had a "party" attitude and walked into the room asking "Who are we honoring here?" (He hadn't even taken a moment to commit Casey's name to memory - even for that moment.) This does not qualify as an extensive conversation to me.
77 - Getagrip
Just like everything else that is happening, this is just ANOTHER weapon of mass distraction. Keep everyone busy arguing and pointing fingers while the criminals rape and pillage the planet. They laugh their asses off when they talk about you people. Democrats, Republicans, Green Party.......all part of the same agenda. All three parties were controlled completely by Skull & Bones in the last election. That says it all!
The goal is to make the US government look so corrupt that the people will scream out that something must be done.
Problem, Reaction, Solution. It is the way they do everything.
Problem: How do we get the american people to accept war in the middle east and totalitarian laws at home. I know, another Pearl Harbour style attack will do it....boom, the WTC comes down
Reaction: The american people scream something must be done.
Solution: War in the middle east and the patriot act.
Problem: How do we get the american people to accept the american union, one big superstate for north america? I know, we make the entire government so corrupt the people will be begging for change.
Reaction: The american people are fed up with the corruption in the government, all sides. Something must be done!
Solution: Create the american union composing of Canada, US, Mexico and now all the countries under CAFTA.
It is all an illusion folks. An illusion created by the international banking cartel, military industrial complex and a few "secret" societies who have as their ultimate goal....turning our planet into a prison.......with them worshipped as gods just like in the good old days.
If we continue down the path we are going, their ultimate dreams will come true. Their "Great Work of the Ages" will become reality.
Everyone in the government needs to be fired. EVERYONE, no exceptions. All members of CFR, Trilateral Commission, Bilderbergers, Bohemian Grovers, Skull & Bones, Masons, Committee of 300, Royal Bloodlines..........all of them need to be removed and barred from office permanently. It needs to be written into law. If they are not removed nothing will EVER change. EVER!
The entire government system needs to be overhauled. The power needs to be put BACK into the hands of the people and never relinquished again. EVER! The federal government needs to be VERY small and essentially powerless, only having the powers WE the people give to it. And we CANNOT bow down to pressure from the outside to create the american union for the globalist agenda. Sure it would be fantastic not to have any borders, but only if WE decide that is the way it is to be. NOT the UN.
Wakeup people, smell the conspiracy and the napalm......time is running out.
78 - Dave Nalle
>>I do not think it was an extensive or a particularly intense discussion, from Cindy Sheehan's version of the story. Sheehan claims that Bush had a "party" attitude and walked into the room asking "Who are we honoring here?" (He hadn't even taken a moment to commit Casey's name to memory - even for that moment.) This does not qualify as an extensive conversation to me.
<<
Her account doesn't fit with the accounts of others who met with Bush under similar circumstances where he spent time in detailed conversations with parents and is reported to not only have known the names but also the service details of the slain soldiers in question, and to have been very serious and involved.
You might want to read the Sheehan's own account of their previous meeting with Bush, which was brief, but which they apparently found supportive and meaningful. Their description at the time doesn't match her current description of the event at all. You can read it here.
Dave
79 - Dave Nalle
>>All three parties were controlled completely by Skull & Bones in the last election. That says it all!<<
Skull & Bones is essentially a college fraternity. My fraternity sends me a monthly newsletter which I usually just throw in the trash. It doesn't control my mind.
Dave
80 - Dave Nalle
BTW, Getagrip - you're a crypto-fascist who's been spending way too much time on infowars.com with your grip on reality turned off. Alex Jones is NOT the new fuhrer.
Dave
81 - Jude
I think she has every right to protest, but there are laws in Texas against vagrancy and creating a public nuisance and trespassing, and if she's violating those or if she made some sort of credible threat then she does have a legal problem. But if it's a peaceful protest on public property then more power to her.
The use of the law, with a political bent as impetus, happens.
We know it.
Even if a protest may seem "peaceful" to some people, all that the law "enforcers" need to say is that they felt it was not peaceful and the protestors are carted away. I saw it happen in NYC during the Republican National Convention.
If someone decides to use law enforcement to cart Cindy Sheehan away, mark my words, it will be a one of the steepest tipping points of public opinion on the President's handling of this war. He has surely turned a mountain into a molehill - for NO reason.
82 - wil
Nancy writes:
"Millions of darker-than-us people have been slaughtered by their own governments in Africa, Dave, but I don't notice Smirk rushing over there to save THEM & ensure their freedom & democracy"
That's because (and as loathe as I am to actually say this), they're Africans. Hell, they're not even niggers - they don't rate that high.
Dave writes:
">>FIRST IT WAS WMD. THEN IT WAS AL QUEDA TIES. NOW IT'S TO BRING FREEDOM TO IRAQ.<<
And you don't think that any or all of those reasons are good things?"
Not if they were based on lies to begin with, Dave.
You're missing the whole point: our President LIED to justify his waging war on Iraq.
Sure, bringing freedom and democracy to the oppressed is, in principle, a good thing but how come Mr. Bush isn't sending in the Marines to Darfur? Why aren't we kicking ass all over the globe in those places where such oppressive conditions exist?
More to the point: how come we're not kicking the crap out of China and North Korea? They, at least, do possess WMD's and are by all definitions threats to global stability.
I'll tell you why: there's nothing in it for us. And we certainly wouldn't dare impose our values militarily on countries who could meet us with equity.
Had Bush actually said, "We're going to Iraq to secure the oil fields", I'd have gone along with that. I like cheap oil as much as the next guy.
- wil
83 - Nancy
He does a good deal for 'no reason', it seems. I'd love to see him expose himself for what he is so even the most idiotic of his defenders has nothing to say. IMO, he showed his true colors when he said "Bring it on!", secure in the knowledge that neither he nor any of his family or friends would ever, ever be in harm's way - the mark of a true coward. Of all the chickenshit, yellow, cocky, smug, arrogant, irresponsible things to have said. Yeah, Smirk: you go to Iraq, put on a uniform, pick up a gun, and THEN say 'bring it on'. I doubt he would.
84 - Dawn
Every mother of every fallen hero would like a word with the person who sent the orders for war. The military isn't culinary school. It is for those men and women who feel something deeper in their hearts about freedom and protecting this nation than the average citizens. We must mourn every soldier who dies defending us, but can we expect the President to meet with every mother?
Even FDR wouldn't have wanted that job.
My answer to this delimma is to counsel your children vigorously and with vigilance to NOT join the military, and if they are so compelled to not heed your words, then you must stand by their decision to do so. Surely Casey wasn't forced to join the military.
This isn't the draft - when it becomes the draft, then by golly, I will be right with those who oppose Bush's decision, because that's a horse of a different color.
85 - getagrip
Dave you are asleep. Wakeup. I know you like to believe everything the government spits your way, but they are lying through their teeth. Anyone with half a brain can see through the lies..........wakeup and join the living! Or stay asleep and die with the sheeple. It is only a choice.
What does Alex Jones have to do with anything? I don't need anyone to tell me what is going on, I have been researching it for over 10 years straight. I may not know everything, but I have a fairly good idea what the agenda is and who the players are. You on the other hand have not researched anything and believe whatever you are told by the government and their puppets. I meet people like yourself everyday, basically good people who are trying their best to believe in the systems and people they think they are electing. There is nothing wrong with that and in fact it is the way things should be. Unfortunately you have been duped by a global gang of criminals who have taken control of the planet for their own evil gain.
Don't support them anymore. Leave the dark side and move into the light. I promise you will feel much better for having done so.
86 - Guzo
All people commenting here need to drop this 'left-right paradigm' reality they live in. Isn't it clear, especially with a quick review of the last several decades, that both sides serve only one master,,,,corporate lobbyists? Too bad that sounds cliche but it is the absolute truth. Our entire government structure is corrupt to the very essence of the meaning. I seen an interview with George Bush Sr. by Cokie Roberts, she asked him about 'third parties' and his reply was disdain for them. He vehemently advocated a two-party system, ya wanna know why? Because if you control both sides, your guaranteed to know the outcome - thesis, anti-thesis, sythesis or problem, reaction, solution - the old Hegalian Dialectic. A third party that is NOT controlled could throw several wrenches into the programming of ,as I see it, World Domination or 'New World Order'. Which George Bush Sr. has promoted several times in public.
(want the truth about the Bush family:
http://www.tarpley.net/bushb.htm if the revelations in this book do not change your entire reality of the Bush family, you are truly souless, and yes that is MY opinion)
Also I see from these posts that many, if not all believe that 9/11 was still orchestrated by 19 muslim hijackers from caves. This is absolutely astonishing considering the plethora of analysis and data produced since that very morning. Fire HAS NOT, CANNOT, and WILL NOT ever reduce concrete and steel to a fine powder and dust PERIOD! Those buildings came down in a perfect demolition fashion. 9/11, I'm sorry to say, was a perfect psy-op aimed at the American people's inability to think for themselves, and unfortunatley it has worked to this point. Watching planes fly into buildings then imploding into their own footprint works when one chooses not to use critical thinking to make an informed opinion. Painful Questions and Loose Change are two documentaries that produce complete scientific evidence to thwart the true conspiracy theory, the official government story! But don't take my word for it, if you haven't done any research on this subject I truly hope that you would, only when people get past denying the truth can we defeat the true terroists among us and they are inside the gates.
http://www.physics911.net/spine.htm
Peace to All,
Guzo
87 - MCH
"You should respect my choice just as I respect yours...Do something useful instead."
- Dave Nalle
Nalle, I realize you're used to bullying students around in the classroom, but don't ever tell me what to do, OK?
Respect is earned, not demanded; and I have absolutely NO respect for a blowhard phoney who compared dying in accidental traffic fatalities to those courageous soldiers who've been killed in combat.
Is that understood, Nalle?
88 - Me
You Americans... are so naive.
Start worring about your own deam country which is going straight to hell.
Social Security ...GONE
American Bussinesses...GONE
Freedom....GONE
ARMY....Soon GONE
2010, Welcome to a third world country.
this used to be the US. but it was sold out to the companyes that harvest the OIL. All they had left is a bunch of corpses.
and BUSH....BUSH who????
Sorry, but its the truth.
You can ignore it, or DO SOMETHING.
and SOMETHING is certainly not WAR.
www.fotolog.net/truesoldier
PEACE
89 - Effendi
RebelYell, Rock On!!
It took along time for me to "wake Up" also. A REAL American Patriot serves the best Interest of AMERICANS always, not just who has the big $$.
OK Dave, Here is the breakdown how I see it.
My father is an Immigrant (from Iran) he escaped during the Revolution in 1979. I did not know him until I was 30 years old. I was adopted as a Baby and grew up 100% baseball and apple pie. I do NOT share the same beliefs as my father. I am an AMERICAN Born and Raised. he is an Immigrant who like you grew up in a country where he did not have the freedom to state his true feelings. In Public my father praises his new country the United States openly and loudly (just like you) but in private he shares the same fears the rest of us with half a brain question. I think that the treason for this is because people like Myself who have never lived under repression until now, are not afraid of our government. WE state out opinion openly, loudly and proudly because we have never faced arrest for speaking our mind. I am an American soldier that is proud of having carried a gun and defending America in my time, and in my mind that gives me the RIGHT to demand proof that what is being done in the Name of Americans is indeed the best move for them. I am tired of Lobbyists and outside influences that are dual citizens of other countries that are suggested to be making the right move for Americans. Have we lost our mind?. Either you are an American and your actions best benefit America or you are NOT An American and your first protection is for some other country or religion but clearly not America. My opinion of you is that you rearing in foreign oppressed countries has created a core belief within you that is afraid of the truth. You feel that if you support the President no matter what he does you have no chance of being deported or accused of being "Anti-American". Well I've been called everything and I don't care. My life is not overshadowed by fears that foreigners must feel. If you were Not raised in America, if your loyalties are not 100% in the interest of your family and friends and neighbors than I cannot respect your opinion because it is skewed by the experience of your life elsewhere.
I am a Proud American and I have NO FEAR of clearly outlining what I feel for my fellow countrymen from my heart.
I am proud of you RebelYell, I know where you are coming from. It is a fine line to be true to your fellow Americans that count on us and knowing when and where to support our government that appears to have been hijacked by big money and foreign interests. Thank You for your time.
A TRUE American Patriot
DJEffendi@Hotmail.com
Scott!!
90 - Jude
Dave,
You may have missed the fact that I linked the article you're recommending in the first sentence of my piece - see above under "Matt Drudge". I read it days ago.
Why should Cindy Sheehan's version have to mirror the other families' versions?
By the way, you sent no names or links to these "other families"..I would appreciate those links if you expect me to discuss this frankly and fairly.
91 - Dave Nalle
Oh yes, I understand your brand of hate and cowardice pretty well, MCH. I'll say whatever I want to you, because you haven't earned the right to be respected because you are fundamentally dishonest.
You don't have the guts to honestly discuss issues and resort to the most infantile and personal of attacks to try to shut down open discourse. You're basically a fascist and bring nothing positive to the table.
Dave
92 - ss
Personally I don't think there's any one simple reason we're in Iraq, but, for the sake of arguement (and ignoring the entirety of our past relatioship with Iraq) lets assume our motives were the best possible. That we wanted to defend the defenseless and provide them with the tools of a democratic society so they could one day defend their own freedoms.
The article I've taken qoutes from is in reference to the slaying of Steven Vincent, a journalist who wanted us to invade Iraq for the reasons given above. The article was posted today by the AP.
'One line of inquiry being pursued by Iraqi police is that Vincent was shot because of his association with the female interpreter.
Basra has fallen under the control of hardline Islamists who frown on any contact between men and women except within families
In an opinion column published July 31 in the Times, Vincent wrote that Basra's police force had been heavily infiltrated by members of Shiite political groups, including those loyal to radical cleric Muqtada al-Sadr'
'Vincent also was critical of the British military for turning a blind eye to abuses of power by Shiite extremists in Basra.'
That's the Shiites, folks. The ones who are on our side. To be fair, the bulk of the article is an unnamed source in British Intelligence giving what he describes as 'his strong opinion' that Vincent was not killed by a death squad working INSIDE the Basra police department (though Vincent himself believed that this death squad did exist).
The adult literacy rate (not illiteracy, literacy) is 40% (source: CIA World Fact Book) Given that and the bleak economic situation in Iraq for the past ten years, it's really not suprising that they'll vote if Sistani tells them too, but the whole freedom and individual liberty thing, what a democracy is actually supposed to exist for, remain a concept out of the grasp of the majority group that will be ruling Iraq.
No WMD's were found
Terrorists have struck Europe twice
And death squads, some on 'our side' roam freely enough on the streets of Iraq to kill Western journalists when they feel like it.
If he won't talk to Mrs. Sheehan, doesn't the President owe a better explanation of whats gone wrong and what he plans to do about it to all of us?
93 - donald huttle
The bottom line to the war is this in the form of one question: Is their one justifiable reason why even one american son or daughter should spill their blood in the middle east? If so...what is this reason? Please don't even try saying Democracy. Let's try spilling our blood protecting our wide open borders which are abused and exploited every single day. Everything is coming across our borders including portable nuclear weapons. Secondly...As a Viet-nam veteran...I have seen the face of all of this before. I am much older now and am not looking at this through young eyes. But now my eyes see much better. Stop this now if you can. Stop it on an individual basis first by facing the truth based solely on the truth itself. Don't buy the hype that is used to keep you quiet. This is about the merchandizing of the American people by those in charge. Love of government and love of country is two entirely different things. And to any heartbroken mother who has suffered the worst of trajedys that a woman can experience, I can only say: You'll see your boy again. Stop your useless march on deaf ears. Your son and any son is no more important to Bush than a used tooth-pick. It's all about them. They are out of control and you are only wasting your time and money. The general American public is too fat and cowardly to do anything more than cluck their tongues at what they see them do to you for annoying them. Return with dignity to your home. Pray for vindication. Pray for God's justice. THIS YOU WILL SEE. Don Huttle
94 - Jude Nagurney Camwell
The strangest thing to me is that if her child were such a good guy, as she states, that he always thought of others first, believed in Christ, participated fully in church, she should be comforted by the fact the he is in Heaven with his Savior now.
PLEASE - Don't give us that line when we're talking about asking truth from the President of the United States.
By the way, Jesus Christ Himself was CRUCIFIED by politicos - for being outspoken about the hierarchy/government of the day. Yes - your savior was oppressed and executed - and many people believe he did it to save mankind - but Bush is not Jesus Christ and he needs to answer to the people of the United States!
Cindy Sheehan did not know that WMD was a LIE the first time Bush met with her. She knows it now. And a whole lot more. We all do.
95 - Dave Nalle
Scott, I agree that we have a lot to worry about here in the US. Having lived in other societies this is even more apparent to me than it is to those who've never travelled beyond their own home town - which is far too many Americans. What concerns me is that too much of our attention is being diverted to worrying about things which are not an immediate threat to the nation.
Worrying about soldiers in Iraq is important - especially on an individual basis - but it's not a threat to the nation in the way that issues like social security, healthcare, terrorism and preservation of our civil liberties are. It's become a distraction thrown out by those who are afraid to discuss these other issues. If they attack Bush on Iraq then they don't have to come up with ideas to solve the country's real problems, and I find that sleazy and cowardly.
>>Why should Cindy Sheehan's version have to mirror the other families' versions? <<
Every experience is unique. I think my point here is that initially it DID mirror their versions, but it changed after the fact, and some have suggested that this change is primarily politically motivated. I don't presume to judge her.
>>By the way, you sent no names or links to these "other families"..I would appreciate those links if you expect me to discuss this frankly and fairly.<<
I'll try to dig them up. I originally found them througgh milblogs, but it was quite a while ago. I've also talked to a member of one of the families who met with Bush and reacted favorably, though the family member I know is quite skeptical about the war and the administration.
Dave
96 - Jude Nagurney Camwell
SS -
You said
If he won't talk to Mrs. Sheehan, doesn't the President owe a better explanation of whats gone wrong and what he plans to do about it to all of us?
He owes all of us. He is our moral leader (dear God help us), and he is our public servant. He is not a King. He is not a God.
I wrote a piece about this titled "Congress Needs to Lean on Bush to Change Course/Policy on Iraq" at my freelance site. It will show I'm not a Bush-basher - I am an idea person. And I love America.
Excerpt:
Is there any man or woman out there today who can look us in the eye and tell us they have a plan to rectify the many mistakes that the Bush administration has made in Iraq?
The only way to preserve America's reputation is for all of Congress to lean upon President Bush to admit his huge mistakes and to bring our warrior-troops home and to make a humble appeal to our international allies for material support in a peace-keeping mission in Iraq. Republicans in Congress need to leave their clinging partisanship at the door and do what is right for America. It only makes sense that we cannot leave Iraqi troops to fend for themselves, because it will not preserve the fragile democracy blooming in Iraq. It's also clear we can no longer occupy the nation - even those who THANK us for freeing them from Saddam Hussein are asking us to leave. Where are the sensible ideas? Are they being squelched because of the President's pointless determination to follow a failing course?
97 - usedtoberight
Dave says
"but it's not a threat to the nation in the way that issues like social security, healthcare, ****terrorism**** and preservation of our civil liberties are"
In all of my years of living as an American, in cities large and small, I have NEVER seen irrefutable proof that an act of "Terrorism", by a middle eastern extremist, has been executed on American soil. The biggest terrorists are those in charge of our country. If you still believe that load of crap 911 "official story", then you need help, more than anyone in a blog is prepared to or capable of giving, and I pray for your soul. And as for "preservation of our civil liberties" - the very people you seem to follow around like a puppy dog are the ones stripping us of our civil liberties. No WMD. No Links to Al Qaida. No Democracy to any part of the Middle East. Just Oil. Money and Oil. Please Dave, wake up.
98 - wil
rebelyell writes:
"As a "Proud Fuckin' Civilian", i think the mind set of those who have volunteered to protect the freedoms of my loved ones and myself are of paramount importance. You are protecting our freedoms, right?"
The last time I checked...
"I understand you’re a little disgruntled over having been lied to and being asked to accomplish a definitive action against an ideology but nobody said it would be easy."
Nor did I expect it would be, but thank you for acknowleding that yes, indeed, I as well as every soldier, sailor and Marine has been lied to.
Look...if Mr. Bush had been honest from the start and said, "We're going into Iraq to remove Saddam from power and secure the oil fields" I wouldn't have a problem with it.
In fact, I'm all for it. We need oil, oil is important to our national interests (as well as our economic survival) and if it means we gotta swipe it from someone like Saddam so I don't go into the poor house topping off the tank on my SUV, so be it.
But do not, under any circumstances, bullshit me.
Don't tell me that there is a threat of nuclear, biological and chemical weapons where none exists.
Don't tell me that the country I'm about to invade is directly responsible for the tragedy of 9/11 when it wasn't.
And when those reasons are shown for the bullshit they really are, don't tell me that we're going to liberate and bring democracy to their people, especially when nobody ever gave a shit about democratizing them at all.
"I only hope that if (Goodness Forbid) you are ever tasked to actually DEFEND your homeland, you won't let this little episode sour your enthusiasm. Again, i thank you."
I am actually defending the homeland, rebel.
I'm currently over here in South Korea, facing north toward the real threat, the one we should have been focusing on from the start. I'm patiently waiting for the missiles to start flying and for two million North Korean soldiers to spill over the border at any moment
who would like nothing better than to have "One Korea, under communism."
As I look out the window, I see North Korean soldiers glaring back at me.
Yes, I'm *that* close.
Please don't presume to lecture me about "actually" defending my country, or being asked to accomplish a definitive action against an ideology. As you can plainly see, I'm all too intimate with the concept.
- wil
99 - Jude
A few Articles:
CINDY SHEEHAN -- SPEAKING TRUTH IS POWER [American Chronicle]
SHEEHAN SPEAKS FOR A MAJORITY [TomPaine.com]
Bereaved mother camps outside Bush ranch
100 - MCH
...More doublespeak from DAVE NALLE'S HANDBOOK OF HYPOCRISY:
"It's not that we were afraid to serve or unwilling to serve, the fact is that there wasn't a NEED for people of that generation to serve."
- Dave Nalle
You just continue to perpetuate the lies, don't you Nalle? The TRUTH is, you were in your early 30s at the time of Desert Storm, and yet still evaded service, in spite of not knowing how long that war would last at the time.
To be continued...
101 - Jude
Wil,
That was one powerful statement. I'm glad you've spoken out.
102 - Natalie Davis
Found and interesting op-ed by William Rivers Pitt on this subject; it's called Bush Is No Nixon:
Nixon did some vile, slimy things, but I'll take off the baseball cap to the Trickster for this.
103 - wil
Yes, I agree we should get back to thread at hand:
Good for Cindy Sheehan! As it has become increasingly obvious the war in Iraq was based entirely on a lie, she deserves a face-to-face with Mr. Bush...and a damn good explanation.
104 - Andy
I think she has as much chance to see Bush as Michael Moore does.
105 - Natalie Davis
Oh, so those who don't agree with Shrubbie -- about half of the population -- don't count? Just as I suspected... He was lying when he claimed to be a president for all.
106 - Centrist
"I wouldn't be at all surprised if Bush has offered to meet her privately and she refused."
If that had really happened, do you really think it wouldn't have been all over the government-run mainstream media in a heartbeat? Wild Bill O'Reilly would be jacking off furiously, Annsama bin Coulter's Adam's apple would practically be busting out of her throat, and that little weenie Tucker Carlson's bowtie would be spinning like a propeller.
107 - Nancy
I consider those who voted Smirk in & supported his stealing the election in 2000, & then re-elected him to 4 more years in '04, to be just as reprehensible as he is. Blindness, stupidity, & partisanship are no excuse.
Furthermore, I think Guzo in #86 has hit the nail on the head as far as either party goes.
108 - Paul Revere
The Bush Administration does not care about the American people. You are food to them. If you notice the only people prospering in these times of unemployment , poverty and pain, are the large corporations that donated to the Bush Campaign.
It is time to water the tree of freedom with the blood of tyrants.
109 - Natalie Davis
Revolution! Tea, anyone?
110 - Rebelyell
Wil, I’m afraid you mistook my cynicism of our current situation in Iraq as a personal affront. I don’t stoop to that on blogs. I truly meant to say thank you for your post and I agree with most of what you say. I apologize for my ambiguousness.
My first duty station was Osan, 8 minutes from the DMZ. I know how you feel.
And I concur also that the biggest issue facing the safety of the United States is the fact that the people have been continuously lied to by their “elected” representatives.
Mrs. Sheehan has my most sincere condolences, support and appreciation for taking the fight to the theater of greatest threat.
Rebelyell
111 - MCH
Just a brief "thankyou" to all the veterans who've responded on this thread; rebelyell, wil, joshua martin, Donald Huttle, Effendi (Scott), et al. And thanx for your sacrifices.
It's refreshing to see the veterans outnumber the Chickenhawks (Dave Nalle, R.J. Elliott, etc) for a change.
112 - Dave Nalle
>>If that had really happened, do you really think it wouldn't have been all over the government-run mainstream media in a heartbeat? <<
It's been pretty thorouhgly demonstrated that Bush doesn't do things that way - much to his own detriment politically. He keeps certain things private and has a strange sense of moral proprietty about what he should and shouldn't say to the press. I can't say anything for sure, but based on all I've read about this situation I firmly believe that if Bush invited Cindy Sheehan to a private meeting she would not go and would insist on a public meeting which would never happen. And I know that if he made the offer and she refused he would not play it up for publicity.
Whatever else Bush may have done wrong, I still believe he has some basic principles, at least in his personal relationships. I think he has a lot of personal problems and almost pathological behavior patterns as well, but he's not evil and he's not a monster and he does have some sort of conscience.
As for the rest of the recent responses, wouldn't it be nice if all the energy you folks put into hate and endless complaining were directed instead towards something positive?
Dave
113 - Alan
Our "president" is nothing more than an AWOL coward but pro war,otherwise known as a chicken hawk, convicted drunk driver, admitted drug abuser, a dim wit, and a fake texan. The bush's are from Conn. Nothing that these "people" suprize me any more.
114 - bob
reading these comments makes my decision to pick up my business and millions and get the fuck out of this country. most of you are so goddam ignorant to what's going on in the world, it scares the shit out of me. enjoy your fucking fascist police state - and don't whine to me when you're stuck here begging for nickels once bush, greenspan & co. completely bankrupt this nation.
p.s. get out there and vote! (dumbasses.)
115 - gridbug
Dave Nalle sez:
"Worrying about soldiers in Iraq is important - especially on an individual basis - but it's not a threat to the nation in the way that issues like social security, healthcare, terrorism and preservation of our civil liberties are. It's become a distraction thrown out by those who are afraid to discuss these other issues. If they attack Bush on Iraq then they don't have to come up with ideas to solve the country's real problems, and I find that sleazy and cowardly."
Kinda hard to expose all the "real" problems that are plaguing this country when the ones that are perpetrating the crimes against us are the ones running the show. The only way to collapse the wall is to loosen one of the load-bearing bricks, then getting the hell out of the way as everything comes apart. I see Cindy Sheehan's vigil as one of the most significant acts against what is obviously a corrupt and criminal administration to date, and the more support and spotlight she gets the harder it will be for them to avoid detection. I believe in America, and I loathe those who have decided that the have more's matter more than the other 99% of the citizenry. I find myself asking why the Democrats have missed opportunity after opportunity in slamming the BushCo adminstration on things like the false rationale for the Iraq invasion as documented by the Downing Street minutes. I wish desperately to see America restored to her former glory. At the hands of the NeoCon driven administration, there will only be darker times ahead.
It's reassuring to see more and more Americans finally waking up to the fact that they've been deliberately manipulated and misled. How exactly is the Iraq war making America safer? How is the mass insertion of Christian theology into the social system going to be better for the country?
When will the Dave Nalles of America realize that they've been (and are continuing to be) swindled?
116 - Rick
Praise all the soldiers that are fighting for a lost cause i feel for them and their families for they are dying for the oil and the oligarchy the global money hungry corporations that are implementing the New World Order.Wake up people and look at the big picture!
117 - troll
- still think you can control 'em?
3 more years - geeeezus
get your gullible self off my bridge
troll
118 - gridbug
August 10th, 2005 3:13 pm
Why No Tea and Sympathy?
By Maureen Dowd / New York Times
W. can't get no satisfaction on Iraq.
There's an angry mother of a dead soldier camping outside his Crawford ranch, demanding to see a president who prefers his sympathy to be carefully choreographed.
A new CNN-USA Today-Gallup poll shows that a majority of Americans now think that going to war was a mistake and that the war has made the U.S. more vulnerable to terrorism. So fighting them there means it's more likely we'll have to fight them here?
Donald Rumsfeld acknowledged yesterday that sophisticated bombs were streaming over the border from Iran to Iraq.
And the Rolling Stones have taken a rare break from sex odes to record an antiwar song called "Sweet Neo Con," chiding Condi Rice and Mr. Bush. "You call yourself a Christian; I call you a hypocrite," Mick Jagger sings.
[edited -- please post a short snippet and a link to the full article]
119 - Nancy
Why should she meet with him privately and give him yet more fodder for his lies? Meeting him privately would simply mean her word against his - and Rove's, and whatever other flunkies he's holed up with; then after she left, he'd be free to proclaim what a wonderful, compassionate person he is, and what a screwed up poor woman she is & how he was able to soothe her tortured soul, blah blah blah, thus continuing his policy of exploiting to the max those who have no don't have the access to the media that he has. He won't meet her in public because he can't afford to. He can't afford to have his lies exposed, and he won't admit the truth. Even when he's been caught on camera or recorded on tape, he lies & denies & spins & evades discussing what he doesn't want to with his classic babble which addresses nothing. Yes, he has pathological problems - foremost of which is being a "successful sociopath", one who has no empathy or capability of feeling for others, but who can learn to deceive & play the role. He's capable of sending American kids off to die for his wealthy buddies who are his political donors & bootlickers, and then lying about it; he's capable of rewarding the snakes & weasels who execute his dirty work & figure out ways to get him his way with big titles, promotions, and national medals of honor, thereby tarnishing every other one that's ever been awarded, because they're now nothing but political payoff trash. He's capable of subverting & politicizing even the S.C. so that their credibility will never be the same to at least half the country, a situation that was avoided until Bush called in Pappy's political debts to finish off buying an election he couldn't win honestly; he's capable of smearing true war heroes - men who went to vietnam, actually did duty, and got wounded for it - in at least 2 cases, grievously via limb amputation or being held POW - of lying and misrepresenting & having that human maggot, Rove (who even his father disdained to employ) spread his poisonous whispering campaigns among the stupid & gullible, aided by the partisan & malicious - and these honorable persons slandered were in his own political party! So much for his much-vaunted loyalty & decency. I do believe all that amply demonstrates he has NO conscience whatsoever, no ethics, no humanity. He is indeed a monster.
120 - wil
RebelYell writes:
"Wil, I’m afraid you mistook my cynicism of our current situation in Iraq as a personal affront. I don’t stoop to that on blogs. I truly meant to say thank you for your post and I agree with most of what you say. I apologize for my ambiguousness."
Apology accepted. As is apparent, I'm too used to dealing with right-wing (knee)jerk reactionaries who have neither the time nor the inclination to take a hard look at the situation our CnC has gotten us into.
"My first duty station was Osan, 8 minutes from the DMZ. I know how you feel."
You, too, have graced the Scariest Place On Earth? Kudos!
"And I concur also that the biggest issue facing the safety of the United States is the fact that the people have been continuously lied to by their “elected” representatives."
From your lips to God's ears, my friend.
"Mrs. Sheehan has my most sincere condolences, support and appreciation for taking the fight to the theater of greatest threat."
Amen.
Take care of yourself.
- wil
121 - ray
It sounds like everyone is caught up in the phony liberal vs conservative debate! It's not about right vs left ,
it's right vs wrong !!
122 - Robert
Cindy Sheehan sees here loving child killed in an illegal and unjust war. She cannot rely on the mainstream media which fails miserably to voice anything other than platitudes and propaganda of the Bush chickenhawks. She finds out by various means that her son was sent to war with a lack of basic protection and wearing Vietnam era armor. Humvees which are only glorified station wagons are regularly blown up and now they are to have armor added which significantly adds weight that it was not designed for. This increases the cost of gas and yes you guessed it the Pentagon says it will send cheaper SUVs to Iraq for not operational duties. The horror is the huge defense spending that has naknrupt the country to the tune of $17000 for every man woman and child mostly owed to Halliburton. Wake up America and take to the streets, time is running out fast.
Story here.
And here.
123 - billy
its sad bush wont meet with her, but she doesnt understand bush's game. if he met with her it would be a sign of weakness. bush values power over right or wrong. he never buckles even when wrong, i.e. rove, iraq, meeting with this lady.
quite sad for her.
124 - cosmic bruce
Cindy Sheehan is doing what comes naturally for most conscious living organisms, which is to take care of your offspring. An inbuilt desire to see your own flesh and blood do well and become capable of holding their own and making a go of it in the world. After all Bush Senior has done this also has he not? He has given an illiterate, criminal, socially challenged child of his a job and purpose in life. Ok, so it is the most important job in the modern world and he is making him do what he wants him to but he is still looking after his own. There is no point asking W to do anything, I have seen exactly the same TV footage as you have...... the lights are on but there is nobody home. When you interbreed for so long it is bound to happen. There is an overwhelming need for the elite to keep their bloodline pure at all costs, whilst spilling as much of others peoples blood as possible. Satanic, ritualistic offerings? Who, or what, requires the amount of blood they have spilt since ancient times? Do the research folks, if you have not already, it is all in black and white somewhere. My favourite saying... "you can prove anything with facts". They cant go five minutes without 'spilling some claret' as we brits say. There were over 50 wars in the 20th century and the old UK-USA-Israel alliance was involved in every one. They either started, finished, funded, trained or supplied every single one either openly or secretly.
Several things remain true whatever your political bias. Fighting fire with fire makes a huge out of control FIRE! Trying to put out a fire by starting loads more never worked before and never will. And, replacing a dictator with another dictator gives you one result.... another dictator. I cant read and know everything of course, but I think you will find that the regime in Iraq was put into power by the British way back last century anyway. Removing a true democracy under false pretenses of abuse or military capabilities to install another leader that is carefully hand picked by yourself is another tried and tested plan of the agenda.
War is raw. Blessings to all those who have faced the true horror on humanities behalf whether justified or not. Please don't do it again though. If we take out about 2,000 satanists we can have Eden back for keeps, how about it?
Please check out www.circus2iraq.org and see the smiles on the childrens faces. Ms Sheehan can no longer see her own child smile, but she can certainly do something to help keep the joy on millions of others.
125 - headed for Bahamas
I find it amazing that a president who continually espouses the "ownership society" and personal responsibility not only comes from a family with butt-loads of money and has no clue what the average American lives, but also refuses to practice what he preaches. Not too Godly if you ask me.
He seems to forget - HE WORKS FOR US.