The right, while trying to hide Governor Palin's affiliation with Dominionist Christianity launches religious "terror" tactics against Obama and America.
The wolves who present themselves as "concerned" Christians prey on the absolute ignorance of their church members - indeed on all Christians. The viral emails going out from the Christian “right” painting Obama as the Antichrist are first and foremost shameful, and second are complete “biblical” fabrications.…
Article comments
— go to most recent comments26 - Al Barger
Marlowe- I was just talking to Jebus, and he said that you're definitely going to hell for opposing the unmasking of Barack "666" Obama. Do not pass go, do not collect $200.
XOX
27 - troll
fascism is already here - don't be deceived by the velvet glove
not saying it's good...not saying it's bad
28 - Dr Dreadful
Clav:
And how did we all end up with relatives in Sierra Leone??? All my life I've been told my family was from Sweden!!
The longship must have got lost on the way to Guadalajara.
29 - Fabelhaft Schneckensaft
Personal attacks are not allowed
That's a laugh!
How many personal attacks have there already been on here?
30 - Andy Marsh
I don't know...how many?
31 - MARLOWE
Al! I missed your post! And obviously I missed the meeting where my burning in hell for all eternity was discussed. I actually ditched the meeting on purpose, figuring since I was going to hell already why start 30 minutes early?
As for the number of 666... Interesting isn't it... How that number, along with the Antichrist gets dragged out every few years to be slapped on someone those holding the reins of religious power despise.
Of course if more Christians (and the same is true of Muslims and Jews and plenty of others) would spend more time in an independent investigation of TRUTH as opposed to getting all their "knowledge" from someone standing at a pulpit we might not have as much religious hatred these days...
Everyone should go out and READ and STUDY their own religious history - ON THEIR OWN. They should ASK QUESTIONS - first of THEMSELVES then of the powers-that-be...
WWJD? What would Jesus do? He certainly wouldn't be sitting in church on Sunday nodding his head to everything said... Like an idiot... He'd be out doing the work of His Father.
Marlowe
32 - Baritone
Would Jesus be a capitalist?
In this day and age, I wonder if Jesus would stick to carpentry or, perhaps, branch out into, say, framing or drywall. Or would he become an entrepreneur and build tract homes, or maybe "McMansions?" - Christ and Associates, 'My Father's House' Custom Builders. "We build heaven right here on earth."
B
33 - Andy Marsh
I imagine I'll get a little grief for this but...maybe custom built crosses???
34 - Jordan Richardson
Make them chocolate and I'm sold, Andy.
35 - Arch Conservative
I'm going to go out on a limb here and say that when Marlowe was a young boy, father O'malley stuck something in his rectory that he shouldn't have.
36 - Andy Marsh
Guess you plan on joining me in that warm place there Jordan! Freaking bunch of heretics aorund here!
37 - Jordan Richardson
Perhaps there's even a breakfast cereal: Christ's Crucifixion Clusters (Now With Soy!).
38 - Andy Marsh
Oh, I see, you want to cut in line!!!
39 - Jordan Richardson
I just wanna make sure the fires are nice and warm before you jump in, Brother Andy.
40 - Andy Marsh
Gee...I just don't know what to say. That's so thoughtful of you!
41 - Baritone
I like the cross idea. Different woods - burnished mahogany and say, teak, or burled walnut on the high end, maybe poplar, ash or oak for the middle market, and pine for the Wally World masses. Perhaps cedar for those who want to stay fresh & moth free while being crucified. Of course there would be different sizes for the whole family - small, medium, large, junior, petite, "husky," XL, XXL, XXXL, XXXXL, "big & tall," "fat & sloppy" - the whole gamut.
Then, we could also talk about veneers or vinyl plastic over pressed fiber board (the latter sold in the Dollar stores.) How about mix and match crucifixes and coffins? Dare we say, plaid?
How about an appearance of "The Son of God" on a special segment of Norm Abram's "New Yankee Workshop" - titled 'Make and Bear Your Own Cross?'
All right. I'll stop.
B
42 - Victor Plenty
The chocolate cross is a more tasty idea.
43 - Baritone
Vic,
Ooh! Both white and brown chocolate. Very ecumenical. And only $3.50!
B
44 - Jon Sobel
The more reasonable elements of the right are pretty hostile towards the religious right and are doing much more to reign them in and keep them from doing harm than anyone on the left is.
Yes, Dave, I'd like to see some backup for this statement too. My impression is the opposite - that the more "reasonable elements" coddle the extreme right and speak to them in code words, nudge nudge wink wink.
45 - Cannonshop
#32:
Would Jesus be a Capitalist?
No. He wouldn't be a socialist either, or a Theocrat, or fascist.
Methinks he might (if born today) choose to be an EMT. Why? because that would be doing his father's work, and living as a common man. When Jesus said "Render unto Caesar what is Caesers, and unto the Lord what is HIS." He was telling his people to pay their taxes, but don't worship the Government.
Practical advice, really. I think he understood that any government strong enough to give you what you want/need, is strong enough to take everything you have.
I think Jesus would be a (moderate)Libertarian.
46 - Baritone
Do people really think that Jesus would involve himself in human politics, that he would take positions for or against political factions? Wouldn't that be below his pay grade?
B
47 - MARLOWE
Baritone... In his book AMERICAN FASCIST: THE CHRISTIAN RIGHT... Chris Hedges lays it out pretty well how this IS happening - how people, millions believe it... Read ECHO CHAMBER by Kathleen Jamieson and Joseph Cappella about the conservative media establishment... These millions become, within out own media saturated society ISOLATED to and even inoculated against "outside" "liberal media" "propaganda". So yes, it is happening..
Its like the CREATION of the Antichirst... Despite the fact that there is NO identification of any ONE Antichrist in the NT, those in the fundamentalist/dominionist movements spend a lot of time fabricating this straw man to keep the COLLECTIVE FEAR focused...
It is despicable. You have millions of people who turn to the message of Christ for comfort, having seen many of the LIBERAL philosophies of the past 30 years discredited in their personal lives and instead of focusing on the LIFE of Jesus and following the SPIRIT of CHRIST these people are slowly turned into mindless soliders for Jesus. Go watch JESUS CAMP by Becky Fischer...
We can't let these people - who are NO DIFFERENT THEN THE BLOOD THIRSTY MULLAS who advocate suicide bombings - continue to WARP the message of love and peace of Jesus and turn these people in a thoughtless mass... Ripe for the directing of God knows who...
Marlowe
48 - Jordan Richardson
Good reading/viewing list, Marlowe. I'd add God's Politics by Jim Wallis as well.
49 - MARLOWE
Jordan! I'll check it out. Thanks!
50 - Baritone
In fact, I have read Hedges' book and seen "Jesus Camp" among others dealing with dominionists and theocrats. Of course, you are correct. It is just those people who are effectively brainwashing others into being warriors for Jesus. They dream of Jesus descending from the heavens, a grim smile on his face, wearing ammo belts crossed over his shoulders with a machine gun blazing from each hand while mounted on a glorious white stallion with flaming nostrils trampling the godless hoard. No warm and fuzzies for these people.
Obviously, I was being facetious with my question above. I have written a couple of articles here regarding this situation over which I remain concerned and disturbed.
B
51 - Al Barger
Yeah Brother Marlowe, I too have seen Jesus camp, and I'ma have to call BULLSHIT on this:
Go watch JESUS CAMP by Becky Fischer...
We can't let these people - who are NO DIFFERENT THEN THE BLOOD THIRSTY MULLAS who advocate suicide bombings...
The Jesus Camp people are NOTHING LIKE blood thirsty mullahs. They're not advocating murdering infidels. Indeed, one of their main top concerns is to try to STOP killing unborn babies.
52 - Jordan Richardson
The Jesus Camp people are NOTHING LIKE blood thirsty mullahs. They're not advocating murdering infidels. Indeed, one of their main top concerns is to try to STOP killing unborn babies.
Having been exposed to the emotional and psychological methodologies of Jesus Camp types and having spent time on "the inside" throughout the past 25 or so years of my Waking Life, I can tell you without reservation that there is little difference between the Evangelical War Movement that advocates dying for Christ and those "mullahs" you refer to.
53 - bliffle
It's not only the religions that prey on peoples ignorance, advertisers do it, so do politicians, and a whole hatful of other people.
The cure is to study, research, think, discuss and generally improve one's knowledge and facility.
It is NOT a cure to adopt some shorthand simpleminded mottos and old-wives tales.
54 - MARLOWE
Baritone... Thanks and I figured...
Al, I know FIRST HAND the thoughts, gross prejudices, racist fuel behind some of these movements. Is it the "majority" of Christians? Of COURSE NOT! Neither do the majority of Muslims side with suicide bombers. Neither do the majority of Jews side with radicals that continue to insist on sweeping Israel clear of all non-Jews (and some of those OTHER Jews who aren't JEW enough)...
It's like kind, White suburban Whites, who listen to NPR and drive Volvos, refusing to believe there is STILL a tremendous amount of risidule prejudice among Whites toward Blacks and Latinos... But I HEAR it every day... Even though I am Mexican by blood I am fair haired and blue eyed, so people "assume". They open up around me... This from all walks of life. That's what's been so depressing over the years... It isn't a problem among the poorly educated Whites... Nope, I've sat in board rooms and heard things just as bad...
Infection, whether physical, mental or spiritual doesn't come crashing in like a tidal wave... It comes in bit by bit...
Marlowe
55 - Al Barger
Jordan- That's nonsense. You say you had a rough time growing up with Christian fundamentalist types. Fair enough. Lots of people have issues with childhood exposure to religion. I'm glad that the Christian summer camps that I went to were mild mannered Bible study and volleyball and nice stuff. But there's not much in even the harshest end of American Christian groups even vaguely in a league with some of these madrassas and such. Not everything a little bad is just like evil jihadists.
None of those kids in the Jesus Camp movie are going to end up being terrorists or assassins or overly psychotic. They might end up picketing in front of Congress or working election campaigns to defeat pro-abortion politicians. Than ain't mullah activity.
56 - Al Barger
While I'm at it, I'm just past even listening to a lot of this anti-religious nonsense. You don't want to believe, then don't. I don't, as much as I like going to church.
But it's just absolutely goddam ridiculous to be demonizing American Christian types. Even the more hardcore are mostly just looking to have some reasonable consideration of their views. Being against abortion and gay marriage does not make you JUST LIKE a frickin' mullah. Pat Robertson is a bit on the wacky side, but on his worst day he's not one of these shithead radical Muslim. NOT THE SAME THING.
57 - MARLOWE
I don't believe anyone's mentioned issues of "gay rights" or "abortion" (which I am personally opposed to but on the same turn I don't have the right to dictate to others their moral choices)
And again, we're not talking about the MAJORITY of Christians Al. So please stop trying to twist this around...
And yes Al, there are enough of the "others" who do feel the best thing we could do would be to nuke the Mid-East...
But again, we're talking about the fact that, for one INSTANT we are ACCEPTING people trying to actually PAINT a presidential candidate as the Antichrist - that THIS kind of massive distortion - playing on the fears of millions of Christians - ever be tolerated...
And YES Al, the forces behind this obviously think it can work - OTHERWISE they'd never do it...
And let's not forget the loving Christian attitude that allowed the Inquisition Al... And the purges... And the expulsion of the Jews... And the massacre of the Native Americans or their forced conversion on pain of death...
Or how you have folks in N. Idaho who have managed to tie Nazi philosophy to being soldiers of Christ...
Religious hatred knows NO racial, national, ethnic boundaries Al....
Marlowe
58 - Jordan Richardson
Barger, that's not what I said.
I said that I was "exposed to the emotional and psychological methodologies of Jesus Camp types and having spent time on 'the inside' throughout the past 25 or so years of my Waking Life." I didn't "grow up with Christian fundamentalists."
Not everything a little bad is just like evil jihadists.
Again, not what I said. The methodology, the emotional manipulation, and the techniques to garner followers is eerily similar. I have actually also been exposed to radical Islamic teachings, not firsthand, and the use of emotion, passion, fear, and paranoia are almost identical. I am not suggesting the outcomes are identical, however.
None of those kids in the Jesus Camp movie are going to end up being terrorists or assassins or overly psychotic.
I would suggest that much of the Christian argument against homosexuals is overly psychotic and often violent. The protestors at Matthew Shepard's funeral comes to mind. You may cite that those Evangelicals are on the extreme fringes, to which I'd respond in kind: the mullahs you speak of are on the extreme fringes.
One could cite Eric Rudolph as a clear example of a Christian terrorist.
Again, I am suggesting that the rhetoric is similar, if not identical. If the sociological climate in America was similar to that in the Middle East or in other Islamic areas, one could easily argue that Christians would, too, become more violent. But the fact of the matter is that Christians simply don't have their faith and lifestyles threatened in the same way that many Muslims do. They can get away with a myriad of hate speech and prejudice in ways that members of other religious groups and organizations cannot in America. Alter the climate, add some persecution, and you'd be surprised where those ensconced in the Jesus Camp style of rhetoric would end up.
59 - Andy Marsh
B-tone - comment #41! I was rolling reading that!!! Talk about taking an idea and running with it!
60 - jbevans
Historically, some who hold to the doctrine of dispensational premillenialism have connected John's Antichrist to some individual alive at the time of their writing. Notable candidates have included Adolph Hitler, the Ayatollah Khomani, Osama bin Laden and even Henry Kissinger. Much of this is linked to the mark of the beats in Revelation 13.
You are exactly correct in your discussion of the Antichrist which actually has nothing to do with the end of time.
Like some of your readers above, I am unaware of any emails that name Barack Obama as the Antichrist. However I wouldn't be suprised.
A good post - thanks.
61 - Jordan Richardson
Here's an excerpt from one such Obama/Antichrist email my wife actually received (from her right-wing Fundy family):
According to the Book of Revelations the anti-christ is: The anti-christ will be a man, in his 40s, of MUSLIM descent, who will deceive the nations with persuassive language, and have a MASSIVE Christ-like appeal.... the prophecy says that people will flock to him and he will promise false hope and world peace, and when he is in power, will destory everything. Is it OBAMA??
Here's somebody's batshit crazy blog about the topic.
And here's a Huff Post article about the email. It would appear that there are a few of these, but I can tell you that they do indeed exist and people are sending them around.
62 - MARLOWE
Jordan... Thanks for posting this... The sites are all over... This is how the ugliness begins, as I've said.
We tend to think of the horrors of the past arriving FULL BLOWN... That is rarely the case. It took Nazis a decade... The Inquisition started with a few questions...
Tha absurdity of the "proof" above concerning the Antichrist is designed to play on the IGNORANCE and RACISM of Whites... Anyone who can't see that are truly blind...
Mark 8:18 Having eyes, see ye not? and having ears, hear ye not? and do ye not remember?
63 - Clavos
Tha absurdity of the "proof" above concerning the Antichrist is designed to play on the IGNORANCE and RACISM of Whites... Anyone who can't see that are truly blind...
Yet another argument for atheism. If you don't believe, there's no such thing as an "antichrist."
Once again, religion shows its ugly side.
64 - Jordan Richardson
For many Christians, there's no such thing as an anti-Christ either.
65 - MARLOWE
In most monotheistic religions there is always AN "Antichrist"-like person(s). They are the one(s) who deny the message of the Manifestation of God. The truth of it is IN the actual quotes in 1John and 2John... It is anyone who actively struggles against the SPIRIT of God.
You can see this in Judaism. The struggles Moses had against those who wished to turn the people away from monotheism. The same is true in Islam where the most powerful commercial familes of the Arabian peninsula fought tooth and nail against the monotheism of Mohammad... And then finally "became" Muslim when they saw the handwriting on the wall...
Anyone who PROMOTES hatred, prejudice, bigotry, religious intolerance, etc., is IN ESSENCE the Antichrist - i.e., they are AGAINST the Spirit of Christ...
Marlowe
66 - Jordan Richardson
Eh, that's a bit of a reach in interpretation from where I sit. But I have no interest in getting into an exegetical discussion here. One might say that there are certain things that people do that are contrary to the nature of Christ, sure.
But in terms of the eschatalogical sense of things, I'm not so sure that the anti-Christ concept is one universally accepted throughout monotheism. When we look at the Greek terms, "anti" (αντί) doesn't purely mean the "opposite of" but also means "in place of." So the anti-Christ concept, especially applied by the bullshitters on the hard right religious wingnut segment of society, really references somebody wanting to or aiming to replace Christ.
67 - Christianna
An antichrist is ANYBODY who goes against the teachings of Christ. Obama caters to homosexuals and selfish wicked mothers who think it's ok to rip their own child out of their womb. Remember, we are all made in the image of God, even an unborn baby. Babies in the wombs have SOULs too. Obama would be ok if his own daughter had an abortion if she made a "mistake" and didn't want to "be punished with a baby". What would Christ say? People like Barack keep Christ nailed to his cross. He is not a Christian.
68 - Christopher Rose
Christianna, how nice of you to visit Blogcritics during your day out of the ward, thanks for stopping by.
69 - Jordan Richardson
Christianna, you're right. Jesus is not a Christian.
70 - MARLOWE
Christianna! Thanks for being a perfect example of what this article is speaking about!
Of course in the Bible NONE of what you've laid out as the definition of the Antichrist is used by the author of 1John or 2John.
Indeed abortion was quite common at that time and while it was proscribed in Jewish law I (as were a whole HOST of things) I believe Jesus said it best when He said, LET HE WHO IS WITHOUT SIN... You certainly know the rest of that don't you Christianna?
You see, the MISSION of Jesus was to REDEEM our SOULS. Not to create some bizarre, sick version of a "perfect world". Indeed there is no where in the NT where He says anything even remotely like that... He speaks of heaven sure. But when He addressed those who were ready to stone the prostitute He was pointing out that HERE AND NOW no one, least of all God's creatures, ARE IN THE POSITION TO BE JUDGE, JURY AND executioner...
Society is the place where such laws and things are dealt with. Society is where these laws are carried out DISPASSIONATELY - so that when YOUR DAY before a judge comes Ms. C., you will NOT FACE an angry mob hell bent on drowning their blood lust in your execution but rather a jury of your peers that weighs out matters with JUSTICE....
And it isn't our place as individuals to go about condemning others.
If you truly wish to advance the message of Christ then you LIVE the life of Christ... You LEAD BY EXAMPLE. Each of us will answer to God - ON OUR OWN. Neither you or anyone else will be there the day your neighbor stands before God...
Of course I realize this is likely falling on deaf ears... Alas, the quote from earlier works in so many ways...
Mark 8:18 Having eyes, see ye not? and having ears, hear ye not? and do ye not remember?
Marlowe
71 - MARLOWE
Mark 8:18 Having eyes, see ye not? and having ears, hear ye not? and do ye not remember?
I've quoted this several times today... For those who may NOT get it, Jesus is asking if one has SPIRITUAL EYES and SPIRITUAL HEARING... Of course we all have eyes. But can we discern the TRUTH of things with our SOUL...
One of the many ways He so desperately tried to show the people back then to NOT taking EVERYTHING so LITERALLY...
Luke 9:59-62 But he said to him, 'Lord, let me first go and bury my father.' 60 But he said to him, 'Leave the dead to bury their own dead; but as for you, go and proclaim the kingdom of God.'
Now did Jesus expect the young fellow to believe that some CORPSE was going to rise up and bury his father for him? Of course not...
Let the SPIRITUALLY DEAD bury the PHYSCIALLY dead...
God save us from literalists... Because the illness of religious fanaticism has completely metastasized throughout their soul...
Marlowe
72 - Kwaayesnama
Religious radicals wear different hats. The future of the world might be at stake in this election. I ask you would you want a person like Sarah Palin to have her finger on the Nuclear Button? If you listen to her views about
why we are in this misguided war she sounds like a religious Radical. Why was the Reverend Wright a three-month story and her religious rantings are not reported?
73 - Clavos
The future of the world might be at stake in this election.
But probably isn't...
74 - Cannonshop
Kwaayesnama, I suggest you go back and read some of FDR's speeches, and count the number of times he invokes God, then examine your own statement as to why Wright's ranting was a three month story, while Palin's was about half a day.
75 - RON
Come on America; we don;t need fear!! We need to get back to the Bible! Most of American is like the kettle on the fire, call the pot black!! The Antichrist is more than homosexual, or abortionist, or a funny sounding name!! i agree we need to get back to good Christian values; these first need to be preched nd taught within the curches: Once we get the church converted back to the Bible, we can start evangelizing the world!
I am in doubt about both canadates ability to lead; worried that both will lead our nation away from the Christaian values we were founded on.
America does not need liberalism!! we need Jesus as our leader.
Ron