John McCain suggests that no foreign entity would dare test the mettle of a President McCain. To me that sounds like a dangerous dare.
Something’s been niggling at the periphery of my mind as I listen to John McCain constantly repeating the refrain “I’ve been tested; my opponent has not.” Of course the implication is that McCain is Commander-in-Chief ready, while Obama has too steep a learning curve. McCain’s tests include his confinement in the Hanoi Hilton, where he was a Vietnamese prisoner of war. That certainly is a test of a person’s mettle. I’m not denying that his survival was an act of pure courage and strength.…
Article comments
76 - Dr Dreadful
For an example from the Bush presidency, think Harriet Miers.
(No wonder he wanted her on the Supreme Court - he could do no wrong in her eyes!)
77 - John Rider
Glen,
Yes I did miss the information that Senator "Obama's mom had to go on food stamps for the two of them to eat". A quick look at the internet found that Senator Obama made reference to his mother and food stamps in a 2006 interview with noted journalist Joe Klein in Time Magazine. Mr. Klein quotes Senator Obama as saying "For example, I was going to a fancy prep school, and my mother was on food stamps while she was getting her Ph.D." (Time Magazine).
On a personal note, when I was at University at about this same time, I knew students who applied for and received food stamps. Most lived in nice housing, drove nice cars, and seemed to have plenty of cash.
If you can direct me to any references talking about how Senator Obama, his mother, and his sister (you forgot his younger sister) were having difficulty finding food to eat, please let me know how to access them. I could not find them in a quick search of the internet. I find it shocking that Senator Obama's grandmother (the bank vice president) and the directors of his fancy prep school would let young Obama go hungry.
Glen, I was not trying to deceive you. Today is the first day I have heard that Senator Obama was ever near the receiving end of food stamps. The main point I was trying to make was that Obama is a child of privilege.
Glen, I was not trying to make it seem as if Senator Obama has never known real poverty. I have no motivation to do so. There is nothing particularly noble in being the poorest of the poor. Knowing real poverty is not a qualification for the presidency. Why are you trying to make it seem that Senator Obama has personally experienced real poverty? I have seen no evidence that he has. Why is that important to you? You are confusing seeing poverty and having intellectual knowledge of poverty with experiencing real poverty. There is no comparison. I believe the Senator has seen real poverty, especially in Africa and Indonesia, but he has never "known" it.
No Glen, I have not spent much time in Southeast Asia. I have spent a few weeks now and then in Singapore, Malaysia, and Thailand. Where I have seen poverty is in Africa. I lived in one of the less desirable sections of Lagos for over three years and saw people as poor and as miserable as any in the world. They exist in the millions.
Senator Obama's stepfather was by all reports a geologist who worked with and for the Indonesian government and Mobil Oil. Most the many geologist I know who lived and worked in Indonesia liked it very much. They lived in good housing, had maids, cooks, houseboys, and drivers. At the very least, as a professional, Senator Obama's stepfather should have been providing a middle class to upper middle class life style to his family. (I will admit I have not read the senators book, so I don't know for sure). Many of these same professionals who worked in Indonesia have also lived in Lagos Nigeria and tell me living in Indonesia is much better.
Glen, you say you know what real poverty is. What is your definition? My definition of real poverty are the people I saw sleeping in the dirt under motorway bridges in Lagos Nigeria. You can tell who is really poor because their clothing becomes dark with grimy dirt. People who have only one set of ragged cloths have little opportunity to take off their cloths and wash. Even these people are better off then some of the rural people I have seen far to the north. Again, what is your definition?
Finally: Glen., What to say about your diatribe on Senator McCain. It is illogical,emotional, and contradictory. You write " McCain has NEVER, repeat NEVER - as child OR adult - had to worry about ... good medical care" (your emphasis, not mine). You then go on to accuse him of treason by writing that McCain "offered to give 'military information' to his captors if they would just get him to a hospital". It sure sounds like he was worried about good medical care to me. Do you think you might want to re-think that a little.
I would agree with you that being a prisoner of war does not make McCain qualified to be president. You have to realize that McCain being a prisoner of war does not make Obama qualified either. Neither one is fit to be President of the United States.
P.S. It is my understanding that Colonel David Hackworth is not the most decorated military man in American history. I always thought that that honor went to the disabled war veteran and Hollywood actor Audi Murphy. Isn't Hackworth no. 2?
78 - Clavos
John Rider,
You are correct when you say Hackworth is not the most decorated soldier in history. He was (I have heard, but never investigated) the most decorated soldier in Vietnam. He was also one of the Vietnam soldiers most subjected to disciplinary measures.
From what I've read, he was a brave soldier, but not a good soldier, in the sense that he had much difficulty following lawful orders.
Audie Murphy IS the most decorated US soldier in history. The VA Medical Center in San Antonio, TX is named for him.
79 - bliffle
Clavos' repeated attribution of the cognomen 'messiah' to Obama brings to mind that while Obama has never claimed divine purpose to his campaign, the current temporary occupant of the Whitehouse has. Didn't W say something like God revealed to him that he was destined to be Pres.? Now that's chutzpah!
80 - bliffle
One could fairly say that McCain HAS been tested and is ready: to surrender to the North Vietnamese, as he did in 1969 when he offered to give military info in exchange for hospital care 4 days after his capture. Is that the McCain plan, surrender? Or is it some kind of exaggerated belligerence to expiate his guilt?
81 - Les Slater
Jet,
"...have you really changed any minds? are there any converts you can point to?"
First of all I am not trying to present anything original here. What I present is generally a classic Marxist perspective, and yes, I do find it taken more seriously than it used to be.
This is just a reflection of what can be seen in the population as a whole, especially, but not limited to, the working class.
Generally agreeing with Dave's 67, I would like to point out similarly with the deepening of the economic crisis there are more people that agree that capitalism is the problem.
Again, agreeing with Dave's 67, that's generally the point I was trying to make with Glenn. That it is not the particular personalities, but the objective circumstances that are primary.
I suspect you Jet do not agree with my, and other's, perspectives. Try taking on the content instead of whining about the participants.
Les
82 - Clavos
One could fairly say that McCain HAS been tested and is ready: to surrender to the North Vietnamese, as he did in 1969 when he offered to give military info in exchange for hospital care 4 days after his capture.
You are, as always, absolutely right, bliffle.
McCain is a cowardly weasel, and anyone who votes for him is equally craven.
83 - Cindy D
RE Glenn and zing:
Obama will be better for Foreign relations.
84 - Cindy D
...with the surge, the march towards a conclusion of the Iraq war has been pretty much inevitable.
What Iraq war Dave? Remember? There is no Iraq war.
Well, for everyone else there is. But surely not for you.
85 - bliffle
Dave sez:
"At this point everyone's military policy in Iraq is the same, ..."
Yes, because everyone is taking their advice from Petraeus. I suppose they have to because he's the commander in Iraq. Somehow I suspect that CinCs like Roosevelt and Churchill would be less generous toward Petraeus, since they often challenged the judgements of their famous generals.
I suspect that The Surge is less a military move than a promotion device for Petraeus (in which purpose it has succeeded grandly), and it will collapse once the US payroll that bribes the insurgents is removed. That, or Al Sadr decides to go back on the warpath.
86 - To the Victa go the spoils
John Rider: "Singapore, Malaysia".
No John, you're right ... you won't see too much poverty in those two places, Singapore especially, nor in Hong Kong. Nor that much crime.
They have the highest standards of living overall in Asia. Thailand's getting better, especially in Bangkok, and while it's not great and on a par with the Philippines and Indo in terms of its poverty, it's still not the abject poverty you might find in Africa.
Interesting that the places with the best standards of living and more than a nod to rule of law are the former British colonies, Malaysia being a double success story as a Muslim state (Burma, of course, being the tarantula in the woodpile and going in the opposite direction and remaining one of the two true basket cases of asia).
You also won't feel unsafe walking around Kuala Lumpur, which kind of lays to rest some of those old religious and racial stereotypes.
[Stan. Knock it off. Pretty please. You know what I mean.
Dread
Comments Ed]
87 - Les Slater
"...everyone is taking their advice from Petraeus. I suppose they have to because he's the commander in Iraq."
Before he was commander in Iraq he had to be confirmed by the Senate. In the confirmation hearings, he made it perfectly clear what his intentions were, including the surge. He also made it clear that a vote for confirmation was a vote for what he was advocating.
He was confirmed 95 to 2. Obama can not truthfully claim that he did not support the surge from the beginning. Obama DID vote yea on the confirmation.
88 - Glenn Contrarian
John Rider -
my bad - it's Audie Murphy. But hey, Hackworth DID receive something like 10 Silver Stars in his 100+ medals.
And Kudos to your reply! It's not often that I get corrected by a conservative (that's an assumption on my part that you are one), with facts and references, and with a large measure of professional courtesy. For the several things that I said that were wrong, I apologize. Please accept my sincere gratitude for the correction (I make it a practice to sincerely thank someone - even if I really don't like him - for proving me wrong in anything).
Are you sure you're not a liberal? Or at least an independent? Just kidding. (mostly)
When it comes to my 'diatribe on McCain', his offer of military information is from his own admission...and ANY senior military worth his salt can tell you that an offer of military information - regardless of medical need or even torture - is dishonorable and is considered "giving aid and comfort to the enemy"...which is precisely what Colonel Hackworth accused McCain of doing.
McCain led a privileged life. Do you know what happens to pilots who crash their jets more than once? McCain crashed his jets three times before he was shot down.
He was also near the bottom of the class at Annapolis. Hey - don't get me wrong - I was offered Annapolis myself by a senator. I didn't accept the offer (thank God!), but I respect any who made it through any military academy. But the reason this is of interest is that one must wonder if his four-star dad had anything to do with his successful completion of Annapolis, just as his dad's four stars are VERY likely to have kept McCain flying after THREE crashes.
One last thing to consider about McCain and his near-the-bottom academic performance at Annapolis - he STILL doesn't use the internet, and not even e-mail.
This is a guy who apparently has even LESS intellectual curiosity than Bush! Remember that both of them have shown that even with two wars going on in the Middle East they don't know the difference between Sunni and Shi'a and the importance thereof...
...and I'd LOVE to quiz Ms. Palin on how the Sunni/Shi'a schism affects Middle East politics....
89 - Glenn Contrarian
John -
P.S. Been to Hong Kong and Singapore - love them both - and I own a house and a business in Southeast Asia - and I've been to Mombasa a few times and Nairobi once. I agree with you wholeheartedly that the poverty in Africa is far worse than in Southeast Asia...
...but in Southeast Asia - remember how you mentioned the maids, houseboys, cooks, etc.? Even the lower middle class have maids there. In Asia, just because someone has maids and houseboys doesn't mean they're well-to-do. It just means that the maid and the houseboy are really poor and are willing to work for next-to-nothing-plus-a-little-food.
And what really kills me is that - at least in Thailand and the Philippines - the people there are as a whole happier than here in America. They smile more, they laugh more, their elderly grow old in the same house watching their grandchildren and great-grands every single day. I see them scraping by for meals, for clothing, for money, and they certainly have all the human problems we do with relationships and rivalries...yet as a people they are happier than we are here in the greatest nation on earth, busting our butts until we're seventy-something looking forward to which nursing home our kids are going to put us in.
Now how did I get from John McCain to nursing homes. Is that a, um, "Freudian Progression"?
90 - Clavos
All of what you post above is correct, Glenn.
And yet, millions of (admittedly stupid) amurricans are voting for him.
Go figure.
91 - Dan(Miller)
Re Comment #88, one must wonder if . . . [Senator McCain's] four-star dad had anything to do with his successful completion of Annapolis.
Senator McCain was graduated from the Naval Academy in 1958. His father was promoted from captain to rear admiral in 1958 or 1959.
I didn't want you to wonder about this too much. Whatever influence Captain McCain may have had on his son's time at Annapolis, it was not as a "four-star" dad.
Dan(Miller)
92 - Glenn Contrarian
Dan -
Good point. Thank you. Sorta kills that particular inference of nepotism, doesn't it? But I still think the influence kept McCain flying after three crashes.
93 - Dan(Miller)
Clav, re Comment #71
Senator Obama is also as Moses and Martin Luther King, Jr. Cornal Garnett Henning, an AME bishop for parts of Ohio, West Virginia and Pennsylvania, thanked God for having "given us a Moses and a Martin called Barack Obama."
Any idea where I can get one of those nifty "In Obama we Trust" T-shirts?
Dan(Miller)
94 - Dan(Miller)
PS to Comment #93,
Perhaps, like Moses, Senator Obama would lead us out of Egypt and to a new and glorious reality where true peace reigns. I guess we should hope for the best.
Dan(Miller)
95 - bliffle
Some Obama supporters can be accused of excess hyperbole, comparing Obama to Messiah and Moses, etc., but, AFIK Obama himself has not claimed those glamorous attributes.
On the other hand, we have a sitting president who seems to claim that god wanted him to be president.
And yet, Dave and Clavos didn't protest such inferences. IIRC.
96 - Dave Nalle
Audie Murphy IS the most decorated US soldier in history. The VA Medical Center in San Antonio, TX is named for him.
Audie Murphy is definitely the most decorated US soldier of WW2, but I thought Mad Anthony Wayne was the most decorated US soldier of all time.
Dave
97 - Clavos
AFIK Obama himself has not claimed those glamorous attributes.
True. Never said he did.
On the other hand, we have a sitting president who seems to claim that god wanted him to be president.
And yet, Dave and Clavos didn't protest such inferences. IIRC.
1. As always, I don't speak for Dave.
2. If he's claiming it, he's not inferring, he's implying.
3. I didn't protest it, because IMO, "god" is a figment, so I don't care that he claims a mandate from god - I know it's not true, and you might as well try to bail the ocean out with a teacup as stop any pol from lying; that endeavor comes under the rubric of wrestling with a pig (or putting lipstick on one).
98 - Dave Nalle
Bush's delusions of being a messenger of god predate my activity on BC, which started in 2004. After that date Bush deliberately played down any messianic aspirations.
As for the characterization of Obama as a Messiah, from what I understand it originated with discussion of this Newsweek cover in which his image was photoshopped to look vaguely like a halo was radiating from behind his head.
Dave
99 - Glenn Contrarian
Hey bliffle -
Didja notice that when you pointed out Bush's Ima-Messenger complex, Clavos and Dave had to spin their way out of that one? The tragic thing is that they believe their excuses were logical and sensible.
(hm - Bush...complex...in the same sentence - something just doesn't work there)
100 - Jet
Uh Dave, perhaps you missed my article of September 12, 2006? On page two you'll see that I did indeed cover Bush's claim that God ordained that he should be president. Bush Announces Vision Of "Third Awakening", An Apocalyptic Fight Between Good And Evil... God Help Us All
101 - Dave Nalle
And Jet, did I write anything in that comment thread to defend or support his claim?
Dave
102 - zingzing
dave--i worked at newsweek when that cover came out, and i saw that cover every morning when i got in, after every cigarette, after lunch and on my way out the door in the evening, at my desk, at my bosses desk, at co-workers' desks, in the conference room and in the stacks for a solid week, and never once--never once!--did i think it looked like a halo. it never crossed my mind. not to say it doesn't look slightly like a halo when you point out that it looks slightly like a halo... but sheesh. it also looks like he's got a large chunk of the back of his head missing, but no one is saying it looks like an assassination attempt.
103 - Victa
Doc: "Knock it off. Pretty please. You know what I mean."
Doc, I've just bought a new cortacesped ... a Victa :) Seems like it works in nicely with the US election.
Stop being the serious Pom, Doc. We're here to have fun too ... I'm not replying to my own posts.
104 - Clavos
@#99,
Glenn, pay attention -- I am an atheist. ANYONE --the pope, billy graham, george bush, mother teresa, martin luther king, jesse jackson, you, bliffle, ANYONE who claims to have a communication with "god" is full of shit in my book.
Capsice?
105 - Franco
#74 " Dr Dreadfu
But seriously - with Obama, is it really as pervasively hyperbolic as you claim?
Doc, you missed it. I shared Clavo's use for the word sardonic, not hyperbolic
Here is what he said.
"It's why I use the Messiah thing (my use of which, btw, is intended to be sardonic, not hyperbolic) aside from the fact that Farrakhan literally said it,"
106 - bliffle
Clavos spins,
"I didn't protest it, because IMO, "god" is a figment, so I don't care that he claims a mandate from god - I know it's not true,..."
You don't care that the man is ruled by 'figments'? Isn't that considered a dangerous delusion?
107 - Clavos
You don't care that the man is ruled by 'figments'?
Nope.
Isn't that considered a dangerous delusion?
Yep.
108 - Condor
yawn....
109 - Clavos
ZZZZZZZZZZ...
110 - bliffle
Clavos, Condor:
Are you two guys sleeping together?