The Free Gaza Movement's Spirit of Humanity was surrounded by Israeli warships and humanitarian aid workers were abducted.
June 30, 2009 15:30 local time: Israeli Occupation forces have boarded the Free Gaza Movement's aid boat Spirit of Humanity and abducted 21 humanitarian aid workers including six-term U.S. Congresswoman and former presidential candidate Cynthia McKinney and Nobel Peace Prize Laureate Mairead Corrigan Maguire. Major news outlets MSNBC, ABC, CNN, BBC, FOX, and The Nation have been silent on events, thus far.…
Article comments
— go to most recent comments26 - Cindy
Your government is illegitimate Ruvy. I am sure you would have known my opinion about that.
27 - Ruvy
Cindy, I have a lower opinion of the government of Israel than you do. But until we kick the traitors out, and put someone better in, that is what there is. And they are at least doing a showboat version of defending the country's sovereignty against interference from shit like Cynthia McKinney and the ever so righteous NGO's who have all the sympathy in the world for Arab murdserers and none for victims of failed ountries:
** like Eritrea (Israel accepted 60 refugees from Eritrea last Wednesday, granting them visas and passports);
** like refugees from the Sudan (Israel has a whole community of Sudanese refugees, both Christian and Moslem, who have fled war, rape and massacre).
What you do not know or understand about this conflict makes your article look positively stupid. But don't feel bad. You have plenty of company on the web, and under the terms "Israel abducts" you presently have a page-rank of 2 - oops! 3 - Foreign Policy Journal or Mathaba just edged you out.
There are lots of idiots out there mouthing similar garbage to you, and lots of useful idiots for the Arabs. You've just joined their club. Fortunately for you, they do not charge dues! If there were fewer of them, you might be able to make money from some "Palestine" magazine, like Liam Bailey (who formerly wrote here) does. But I suspect you have gotten to the party a little late for that.
28 - zingzing
well, dave, if you're not picking sides, good for you.
i'm of the opinion that they're both--and i've said this before--like children fighting over a sandbox. (except with bombs, or rocks or something.)
29 - Cindy
23 first sentence should have been italics: quoting Dave.
30 - Cindy
Ruvy,
You will have to have expected that I am not going to be anti-human being, but that I would be anti-govt. I have yet to find a govt that isn't terroristic. Did you expect that I would hold Israel higher than any other govt? Govts kill people. That is what domination is about.
I have no interest in supporting Israel in its insane actions. I have no interest in supporting Hamas in its insane actions.
I told you, I think you should be marching on your govt and demanding the rights of your Arab neighbors and also your Jewish ones. That is sane. Massacres and wars aren't.
Neo-nazis are unlikely to be very interested in the plight of Arabs or Jews. I don't expect this article will hold any appeal.
31 - Cindy
Ollie is gone and I am left me talking to myself in comment 16? lol And I invited company.
32 - Dave Nalle
Cindy, in this article you have chosen sides, whether you choose to acknowledge it or not. By tacitly backing the position of McKinney and her agents provocateur group who Israel could reasonably see as a threat, you are choosing to side with Hamas. Not the innocents, the terrorists.
The purpose of McKinney's group was to provoke a reaction exactly like this and draw attention to the situation. Israel reacted as they wanted and made them a cause celebre, and you're playing along.
That's all fine, but you should at least admit that none of this is moving anyone towards a peaceful settlement, it's all just escalating the situation.
Dave
33 - Cindy
Dave,
I guess you didn't not read the 300 words. The ship was searched and given security clearance in Cyprus.
I am incredulous at your ability to warp the situation. A crew which includes a former Congresswoman/presidential candidate and a Nobel Laureate, who are taking a cargo of toys and medicine to people who have been severely blockaded for 2 years, and have been security cleared are such a threat to a fleet of warships that they have to all be removed and taken away?
I can't wait to see what the big O guy does about it.
34 - zingzing
dave, do you think they had something other than toys and medicine, or are you picking sides?
do you agree that toys and medicine are innocuous objects?
maybe these people were looking for this sort of reaction, i dunno. but the fact is that's what they were carrying and those things should go through.
if this woman wasn't on board, would you be behind such a venture? or does politics trump humanitarianism?
you seem to be backing israel's actions with no regard for what actually happened. i don't give a shit what this woman wants, but those toys and medicine should go through.
35 - zingzing
(to continue,) and if you don't, you've chosen sides whether you're ready to acknowledge it or not.
36 - Cannonshop
#34 Zing, they don't NEED more than "Toys and Medicine" to provide aid and assistance to Hamas-all they need, is to provoke a reaction by appearing (to their target) to have more.
Study some Psyops literature, the methods and suggestions for methods fall right in line with this incident. Not all attacks involve guns or bombs, because not all targets require guns or bombs. It's ridiculously easy to manufacture an event that hurts your chosen target, especially in an unstable political situation like Israel. In fact, it would have worked AGAINST Hamas if McKinney had carried anything OTHER than toys and medicines. (notably, Medical supplies are critical to waging warfare. How do you assure that the medical supplies in this case would NOT be going to Hamas "Fighters" instead of civilian kids? you can't...)
37 - Cindy
Oh an Dave, you may have missed this part but both the Israeli govt and Hamas are terrorists.
Do you hear yourself? Israel bombed civilians in a fishbowl, defenseless people--not terrorists. Why is Israel more legitimate than Hamas in your eyes Dave?
38 - Ruvy
The toys and medicine will go through - after a security check - the woman will not. Frankly, she is lucky not to be arrested and tossed into some pokey in Tel Aviv somewhere. That is what she deserves.
The fact that she is a Nobel Laureate is irrelevant. Yassir Arafat was a Nobel Laureate, and Shimon Peres is a Nobel Laureate - both of them have committed murder.
As I have pointed out, the author's complete ignorance of the motives of the players here makes this article look stupid. Frankly any highlighting of it makes the site look like an Arab agit-prop outfit.
39 - Cindy
Hamas, Israel, Hamas, Israel, Hamas, Israel
What does it have to do with Hamas Cannon? What about the people? What about their goal, which was to bring attention to the situation the people find themselves in?
40 - ralph
If people commit illegal acts it is normal that they are punished.
I would like to know if those people protested also against Hamas rockets firing and suicide attacks against Israeli civilians or if they protest against the killing of Muslim by other Muslim ?
Or lifes become important only if Israel
kill people acting as self defence or retaliation ?
ralph
41 - Ruvy
Israel bombed civilians in a fishbowl, defenseless people-
Poor, poor Palestinians - who dance for joy when Jewish children die.
You haven't made a choice, Cindy? You're for "the people"? What a fool you sound like! What a useful idiot you make yourself into. At least you should charge Hamas for the favors you are doing them!
42 - Cannonshop
#39 what ABOUT the people, Cindy? the Congresswoman's doing this for Plolitical reasons. Whether naive ones, or sinister, makes no difference. There are children without medicine in war-zones throughout the world, (including, but not limited to, Afghanistan, Pakistan, Iraq, Sudan, Africa-in-general, and the Shan people in Asia.) She chose to defy Israeli law in particular, and show solidarity with Hamas and the "Palestinian Cause".
The kids have little or nothing to do with a Congresswoman pulling a PR stunt-other than being an easy path to headlines and a chance to 'stand out' by emulating Mr. Carter.
Hell, if she were serious about just alleviating suffering, there's folks right here in the Western Hemisphere who get less aid and need it more. This was a publicity stunt at Best and a cynical move to undermine Israeli sovereignty (most likely), with the intent of assisting in the destruction of Israel as a sop to the radical muslims in the region, so she could win brownie points with the AMERICAN left.
she wanted headlines, she's got 'em.
43 - Ruvy
Terrorist Fire Two Mortar Shells at Israel
Arab Rock Throwing Causes Hevron Car to Crash
Where's the outrage, Cindy? Where's the breaking news article? When Jewish life is threatened you don't give a god-dazmn, do you? But when some precious bullshit operation to make Jews looks bad is thwarted, out comes the concern, the over-wrought headlines, the agit-prop bullshit.
That is hypocrisy, and a double-standard, the kind of shit the infantile left is famous for, the trash that makes me regard them (and you) lower than garbage. That is why you have lost all my respect.
44 - Cindy
Oh, just a small correction Cannon. They didn't break Israeli law. In fact Israel broke international law by taking them from international waters where Israel has no jurisdiction.
So, I suppose this changes your mind. Since you are concerned with the legality, yes?
Of course they are attempting to bring attention to Gaza, Cannon. Both the article and I said as much. What's wrong with that? When you have a cause you want publicity.
the "Palestinian Cause"
So, you're saying what? You support apartheid? Palestinians don't have the right to exist?
Hell, if she were serious about just alleviating suffering...
Palestinians don't deserve to be cared about? It seems as if it is unacceptable to you.
45 - Christopher Rose
Oh look, more opinion direct from the Stone Age via Ruvy: "Some women should be shoved into a kitchen and told to bake cookies". And he won't take you seriously, Cindy. You must be devastated!
On a slightly more serious note, it comes as no surprise that Ruvy sees no difference between reporting an unusual news event involving a US political figure and everyday reports from a warzone.
Doesn't it get tiring carrying that massive boulder of resentment around all the time? It sure is reading this repetitive prejudice.
46 - Ruvy
Cindy, obviously, you support apartheid! In Gaza, in 2005, not only were Jews kicked out to placate your shitty government, the dead Jews got kicked out, too! The graves were disinterred, the bodies disturbed, a violation of OUR religous law. All this so that Gaza coudl be judenfrei und judenrein Jew free and Jew clean - so that Arab standards of APARTHEID would be enforced. More hyposcrisy from the infantile left! When Olmert was dragged to Washington to have some bullshit meeting with the Arabs and Bush last year, the Arabs would not shake Olmert's hand, nor allow him or Livni to enter the same entrance as they did. They were required to enter the servant's entrance, like the hired help. Jews were treated as second class dogs at a public conference. Not a peep from the infantile left. Not a word in the western media.
When Jews get treated like shit, or get torn bone from bone, you don't give a damn! But shoot a fuckin' Arab's toe off and you all scream genocide!
[Personal attack deleted by Comments Editor]
AND YOU BELIEVE IN APARTHEID FOR JEWS!
To which address would you like your hakenkreuz [Translation: swastika. Comments Editor] sent, and would you like a death's head on it or not?
47 - Christopher Rose
Cindy, you're spot on about Dave; he has been selling this line about him being objective and informed by facts for years now and simply can't or won't accept that he is utterly dogmatic. It would be funny if it wasn't so tragic to see such prejudice masquerading as objectivity. At least with Ruvy we know what we're dealing with; Dave appears to have done a deal with Orwell.
48 - Cindy
Ruvy,
Here is the whole story--all two sentences.
Terrorist Fire Two Mortar Shells at Israel
Reported: 09:08 AM - Jul/01/09
(IsraelNN.com) Terrorists fired two mortar shells at Israel Wednesday morning. No one was injured. The shells fell just short of the security fence near the Karni border crossing.
January 2009:
Israel bombs Gaza into the night
Israel has made 60 air strikes on the Gaza Strip in a single night after the first daily truce to allow in humanitarian aid expired.
A nation with a full military have bombed people armed with rocks. Like your other article suggests--they throw rocks. What should they do? What would you do under their conditions? How many planes and ships and tanks do Palestinians have. Or are they going to keep you under apartheid with their rocks? Bigotry isn't apartheid.
About the article's use of the word 'terrorist'. Is the Israeli govt terrorists too? Bombing civilians would qualify, I would think. They think they can get away with it because people give legitimacy to governments. Hell, if China says some group are terrorists it's automatically given credence. Look at the Uighurs, China says they terrorists, Joanne wrote it in her article. Now there is what I call indoctrination. Your average 'freedom-loving' American willing to take the word of an oppressive totalitarian regime about who are and are not terrorists. The Uighurs are a minority group of Chinese citizens. The govt is trying to stamp them out of existence. Maybe they fought back? Wonder if that's how they got to be terrorists?
49 - Ruvy
The attack on Gaza during Hanukka was long overdue, Cindy. A steady barrage of rockets fell on Jewish towns and villages from 2001 unti 2008. The appropriate response would have been either starving the population into submission or driving them out of Gaza and letting the damned Egyptians and Bedouin in the Sinai take care of them. Than is how one secures borders against those who make war against you. Yeah, it's not nice, but the fire bombing of Dresden was also not nice, and just as necessary.
Terrorism kills and the Arabs have been playing terrorist against our people and a traitorous Jerusalem regime has been letting them, even aiding and abetting their efforts when it suited them - as it did numerous times.
As I told you, your ignorance of trhe facts on the ground here makes your article and your defense of these assholes trying to undermine the State look stupid, and makes the site look stupid.
So, read and learn.
The government of Israel cut all sorts of deals with el-FataH because the el-FataH strategy is loot the enemy first, and then kill them. So Arafat and his henchmen built a casino in Jericho, with the help of the late unlamented Yossi Ginossar, so that Israelis would drive east from Tel Aviv and spend their hard earned shekels on fixed games. LOOT The Israeli government turned a blind eye while el-FataH stole the Arab residents of Gaza and Judea and Samaria blind. LOOT In return, the government in Jerusalem wanted to demoralize the Jews who lived beyond the Green Line, in Judea, Samaria and Gaza. So the Shabak fed Arabs the locations of Jews to be killed. The murder of ShalHevet Pass, an infant in her father's hands, the murder of Rav Binyanmin Kahane and his wife, killed while not one bullet touched the four children in the vehicle, the murder of Mrs. Hatuel and her children as they drove from Gaza in 2004, all were done by Arab marksmen trained by the Americans, the CIA.
But the Arabs got disgusted with the corruption of el-FataH if not with their bloodthirst, and chose Hamas - whose strategy is to loot first and then kill. That means no deals with Israelis - just war.
The Israeli government has been unable to cut deals with Hamas. So they wish to eliminate them and restore el-Fatah to full power, resume making money with corrupt deals, and resume demoralizing the residents of Judea and Samaria with Arab marksmen accomplishing murder hits with the help of the Shabak.
Those are the facts on the ground, Cindy.
But you don't give a damn about savages who tear apart children bone by bone if they are Jews, like what happened to Kobi Mandell in 2000. You don't give a damn if Jews die, only if NGO's or goyim die. I have yet to see you complain or protest over the murder of Jews at all - only Arabs - "the people". We'll see if you give a damn for the facts - the ugly painful facts - or if you just dismiss them like so many other arrogant members of the infantile left do.
50 - Christopher Rose
Your determined efforts to misrepresent the views of other people is staggering, Ruvy.
You say "But you don't give a damn about savages who tear apart children bone by bone if they are Jews, like what happened to Kobi Mandell in 2000. You don't give a damn if Jews die, only if NGO's or goyim die. I have yet to see you complain or protest over the murder of Jews at all - only Arabs - "the people". We'll see if you give a damn for the facts - the ugly painful facts - or if you just dismiss them like so many other arrogant members of the infantile left do."
However Cindy has already said "I have no interest in supporting Israel in its insane actions. I have no interest in supporting Hamas in its insane actions."
And also "I don't choose one group over another. I choose all innocent people--they all go in one group. All innocent people should stand up for each other. They will be the ones who are the victims of the terrorists on both sides."
This mental myopia is a huge contributing factor to the ongoing problems in the Middle East. It's not a phenomenon that is unique to you or your side of the argument, but it is absolutely making any rational discussion and any sense of hope or progress that much more difficult than needs be.
51 - Jeff
Cindy/Roger, do you rant this much against the millions we've killed in Iraq? I guess that's OK according to you cause we're promoting democracy. Israel is ONLY democracy in middle east, why are you against a UN formed democratic country but FOR arab regimes with kings that abuse human rights and kill more arabs then anyone else on the planet? After all the tough talk, none of the arab countries help Gaza, they don't want them either. Gaza is run by terrorists, the same reason we're in Afghanistan. Where's the outcry against North Korea, Iran, Syria, Saudi Arabia, Cuba, Somalia etc and their abuse against their entire populations....easy to just be anti-semitic and be pro-terrorist like it's romantic Castro days. Israel wants and flourishes with peace, period, the others do not.
52 - roger nowosielski
I haven't read this whole thread yet - soon will. I'm amazed, however, at the hostility this article has generated thus, even from such usually cool heads as Mr. Nalle. Which leads to only one possible conclusion: Either the author of the article has willfully or inadvertently misrepresented the fact of the case, or the objectors are far more insane than I ever gave them credit for.
So first, was this a case for humanitarian aid or was it not?
Was the aid authorized by the US or was it a "pirate operation"?
Are the people in Gaza in need of humanitarian help?
Then what the hell does it matter who the aid workers are unless there are reasons to believe the purpose of the mission was terrorism?
And what's wrong with the damn title "Israel abducts." Fuck Israel if it acts like it does and all who defend her. To say that this article ought to feature on some neo-Nazi site (as in #20) - sorry, Ruvy, can't let that one go - is just plain ignorant and stupid.
So unless I've been mislead as to the facts of the case, I'm quickly coming to the conclusion that whatever reasonableness one could attribute to conservative thought on BC is all but gone - and we're barely six months into the new administration.
Care to think how ossified your brains will be by the time the Dems pull another victory in 2010 and 2012?
Oh, I understand it now. Perhaps it's just an adverse reaction to Al Franken's victory yesterday, making the Senate filibuster-proof. Makes perfect sense, boys.
53 - Jeff
Cindy:"What do you call a govt that bombs a civilian population that is defenseless? That has no aircraft? No nothing?" I call it Iraq & Afghanistan.
With your logic, if Israel is terrorist and then so is USA.
If we stop a ship from North Korea or Iran it's the same thing, a security issue. Palestinians (made up word) have had many many many chances over the years for peace but since it's a business for Hamas & Hezbollah they torpedo it every time. Isreal has shown great restraint over the years but enough is enough sometimes.
54 - Jeff
Israel did not "abduct" them. I guess everyone in Gitmo & Iran is "abducted" too. The Israeli soldiers they hold hostage were abducted after killing many of them to do it. This was a clear basic pirate operation knowing and wanting to be in the media and to aid terrorists was their only purpose.
55 - roger nowosielski
#51
"Cindy/Roger, do you rant this much against the millions we've killed in Iraq?"
I'm not going to call you the name I ought to call you, because it'd be deleted. Number one, there was no rant here. The rant came from you, and if you can't tell a difference, take a refresher course.
Second, I've never supported the Iraqi experiment (and I'm sure Cindy didn't either).
And what has this got to do with humanitarian aid?
Next time, address me personally if you have something to say. I don't respond to multiple addresses.
56 - mark
Good one, Cindy.
Too bad the "medical supplies, children's toys, and reconstruction kits" didn't get through.
(Ruvy, if you're concerned about how the site looks, then you should consider how your obscene racist ranting comes across.)
57 - Jeannie Danna
Good article!
I'll bake cookies for you..:)
I wanted to bring this excerpt to the attention of Jeff, #53 What about the 11,000 Palestinians who languish in jail, many of them tortured. We will update you on the status of our kidnapped passengers and our impounded boat, but who will do the same for the Palestinians and their boats?
We will insist that Israel stop interfering with our voyages to Gaza, since they do not have the right; legal or moral, to enforce a siege that collectively punishes 1.5 million Palestinians.
#53 I hardly think you can say that these people are all made up...
Who were we to take their homes and land to begin with!
58 - Jeff
Ms. McKinney, I'm sorry, just expressing my opinon as did you all. Sorry you took it personally and that you want to call me a name, I can guess what it is obviously. You can be called something as well. But I won't, I promote civilized countries.
I'm not sure what this has to do with humanitarian aid, it was about the so called "abduction". She should worry about bringing aid to the poor starving kids in the US first.
59 - Jeannie Danna
We should not have poor starving children in this country!
60 - roger nowosielski
Nobody cares, Jeff, about your opinion about Ms. McKinney. You're free to your opinion, and so is everybody else. But notice your first response to the article:
"Cynthia McKinney is a total nutjob! How come there's no outcry from those wackos to release the hostages the Hamas TERRORISTS and MURDERERS still hold captive?" (#3)
You made the connection and therefore thought that by making this connection you've somehow managed to discredit the validity of the article and the points it made.
It was to this and nothing else that I responded.
61 - Jeff
Fair enough I guess. Thanks for repeating my comments as I stand by that response strongly and not sure what validity the article actually has. They were supposedly bringing aid to terrorists when they were warned not to, they were taken into custody not abducted after failing to respond. Seems clear to me. And wouldn't even be in the news if not for that USA discredited nut. McKinney's mental state IS part of their validity when considering the source. Yes, Jeannie we should not have starving people in our own country nor should Darfur, Somalia, North Korea etc. Gaza is last on my list to aid.
62 - roger nowosielski
Finally some coverage of the event:
1
2
3
The whole issue seems to turn around the legality or the illegality of the Gaza blockade.
63 - roger nowosielski
But Jeff, the story is that they were supposedly authorized to do so by the administration. I don't know what the precise facts are.
64 - Jeff
Says who? I don't see that anywhere. Just a mention for their creative argument that President Obama just told Israel to let in humanitarian and reconstruction supplies. That doesn't mean any self absorbed wacko can take a ship any time anywhere. There are rules and regulations like crossing border with Mexico and dealing with Cuba. has to be done through proper channels not when they feel like it to stir up & become the news. Why didn't she clear it with Israel first if she truly cared about her humanitarian goal? Self serving to make news.
65 - Jeff
and when, why, how does US admin have authority to authorize her boat in Gaza? c,mon
66 - roger nowosielski
What's your real beef, Jeff? What do you really object to? As far as I'm concerned, you failed to articulate it. Perhaps if you were to do so, I might get to understand your position because as of now, all I hear is objections.
What is it that really bugs you about it, Jeff?
67 - Jeff
Thought I articluated it very clearly. You said they were supposedly authorized and I expressed that they were not.
68 - roger nowosielski
Apart from the facts of the matter, Jeff - and I don't know what they are - that's still a rather narrow view and it doesn't say much about the nature of your objection, deep down, that is. I stated what I regard as points of contention in #52.
Would you care to address them?
69 - Clavos
Ruvy,
As I have pointed out, the author's complete ignorance of the motives of the players here makes this article look stupid. Frankly any highlighting of it makes the site look like an Arab agit-prop outfit.
WHOA, Ruvy.
I "highlighted" the article. If I were interested in presenting Arab "agit-prop" believe me, I would be a lot more proactive and efficient about it than simply featuring this article.
As you know from my comments over the years, I am strongly pro-Israel.
Not that my reasons are your or anyone else's (except for senior editorial management's) business, but I featured the article for two reasons: it is timely (exceptionally so, as BC articles go; Cindy beat most of the major outlets on this one), and I knew it would draw a lot of traffic and discussion.
End of story.
70 - Dan(Miller)
According to the quote in the article from Congresswoman McKinney, President Obama just told Israel to let in humanitarian and reconstruction supplies. . . (emphasis added).
What right does the United States Government have to "tell" Israel to do that? The same "right" it has to "tell" Israel to abandon Jewish settlements? The same right it has to "tell" Honduras to reinstall a properly deposed president?
Those wicked Israelis and Hondurans seem not to be obeying orders from the United States Government. Damn! And, of course, the pleasant chaps running the theocracy in Iran seem to be ignoring the request that they stop killing protesters. Oh well. That's different. I guess.
Dan(Miller)
71 - Dave Nalle
Scary though it is, Ralph and Ruvy's last two comments actually make a great deal of sense.
And Zing, I certainly find Israel's attacks on civilians in Gaza unacceptable. Of course, they hit civilians mainly because Hamas hides in or near civilian targets to create the maximum possible negative impact for whatever Israel does against them. So some blame attaches to Hamas.
As for McKinney and company, sure their cargo was innocent. That doesn't mean that they were innocent. As Cannon pointed out the purpose of their visit was to be provocative, to generate a response from Israel and get press as a result. They aren't going to be summarily executed or even mistreated. They'll get sent home and they'll get to complain a lot in the press and that will do more for the innocent in Gaza than the toys and food, and that was their intent.
The real point is that this is a non-story, I suppose.
Dave
72 - Dave Nalle
And BTW, stop calling McKinney a "presidential candidate." Her role as candidate of the Socialist Party was far less significant than her years as a Congresswoman. Anyone can run for president. Doesn't mean we should take them seriously. She came in 6th behind Chuck Baldwin of the Put Women in the Kitchen in a Gingham Frock Party. If we had a parliamentary system her party would have needed 20 times as many votes as she got to win a single seat in Congress.
Dave
73 - roger nowosielski
"They aren't going to be summarily executed or even mistreated."
Are you suggesting, Dave, that perhaps they ought to be?
As to Dan's comment, namely, "what right does the United States Government have to "tell" Israel to do that?" The right of a patron. Besides, there's a bigger issue at state - peace in the region, which transcends the rather narrow conception on the part of Israel as to how it's to be achieved.
It all depends, of course, on how one regards Israel's part in the conflict. If one happens to think Israel can do no wrong, the conclusions follow.
74 - Dave Nalle
Are you suggesting, Dave, that perhaps they ought to be?
Well, that would certainly add more substance to the story than their currently is, but no. Cynthia McKinney deserves to live a long and failure-filled life. My point is that the Israelis aren't behaving barbarically in this instance despite the alarmism in this article.
Dave
75 - roger nowosielski
Well, the whole question then turns, as I've already stated up the thread, on the legality of the Gaza blockade.