Judeo-Christian religion in the United States is far from dead, but other religions are increasingly viable. In addition to Radical Islam ("eighty percent of the prisoners who 'find faith' in prison convert to Islam," generally of the radical kind), Leftism, Multiculturalism, Progressivism and the like seem pervasive. Even the Church of Global Warming, while modestly weakened, remains sufficiently vibrant that absolution may yet be had by buying dispensations. Mere ideologies perhaps, aside from Radical Islam, but their adherents bring religious passion to their dogmas and consider it churlish, if not criminal, to question them. While the Judeo-Christian religions remain vibrant, the others seem not only indignant but overtly hostile; there is at least a chance that they will prevail, if not soon then eventually. As suggested below, that would be unfortunate.
Douglas Adams, author of Hitchhiker's Guide to the Galaxy and other neat stuff, died in 2001. Although his memorial service was held at the Anglican St. Martin in the Fields Church, he had described himself as a "radical atheist" in order not to be confused with mere Agnostics. Adams did not "believe" in God, nor did he "believe" that there is no God. He was "convinced" that there is no God, and that is rather different. Like Adams, I don't "believe" one way or the other; unlike Adams, I am not "convinced" that there is no God and consider myself an Agnostic rather than an Atheist. I am also partially color blind and can't distinguish various color shades. I understand that most others can do so and I act on the assumption that the various shades exist. I accept that my sensory perceptions as to such matters may be inferior to theirs and also that there is no cure; stuck is stuck. Somewhat analogously, other people may have superior ability to sense the divine than I do; so be it There is nothing I can do about that either; again, stuck is stuck. Although in some ways I behave as though they may be right, just "going along to get along" wouldn't work because belief cannot be faked; there is also the problem that there are very many divergent perceptions of the divine. It seems unlikely that all of them are right but it is quite possible that all of them are wrong. In a 1998 speech, Adams propounded a fascinating question, "Is There an Artificial God?" He suggested that there is and cited an example from Bali.
Article comments
— go to most recent comments1 - roger nowosielski
Interesting piece, Dan. Calls for a second reading.
2 - Ruvy
Dan,
You weren't looking at the AA Blue Book when you were writing this, were you? Your whole concept could be boiled down to "act as if" - which is straight out of AA.
3 - roger nowosielski
It comes from the philosophy of als ob, before AA's inception.
4 - Dan(Miller)
Ruvy and Roger,
Nope. I hadn't seen the AA Blue Book (or read about als ob either). I need all of my spare money to buy booze, and in any event don't want to associate with a bunch of drunks.
Dan(Miller)
5 - Dr Dreadful
Steyn doesn't quite understand the UK.
The government is routinely blamed for almost everything, as a convenience. However, most people don't actually expect them to do anything about whatever it is.
6 - Dan(Miller)
Doc,
most people don't actually expect them to do anything about whatever it is.
And that, Sir, may be one of the principal differences between British Subjects and US Citizens.
Dan(Miller)
7 - roger nowosielski
I don't blame you, Dan. If you have to drink, go to a decent pub and rub elbows with the rich drunks.
8 - roger nowosielski
Interesting sideline discussion.
Is the Tea Party Movement an expression, as per Steyn, of the "American Spirit"?
9 - roger nowosielski
I hope Dreadful and STM will get involved in the discussion. A heck of an article by Steyn - provocative as hell.
10 - Brian aka Guppusmaximus
Sorry, Dan, I don't buy the idea that turning away from religion or a belief in "god" has run this country into the ground. I think that the action taken under the guise of an "Act of God" or that has been influenced by the bible has led us into far more trouble. I feel that one's moral compass should be led by an honest caring for each other as opposed to one that is thrust upon us by law or rule.
My prime example would be the genocide that the Christianity has been inflicting upon South Africa. These people follow the Pope's interpretation of the bible that condemns the use of contraceptives. These contraceptives could reduce the spread of AIDS in that country.
A few of my favorite quotes:
"A man's ethical behavior should be based effectually on sympathy, education, and social ties; no religious basis is necessary. Man would indeed be in a poor way if he had to be restrained by fear of punishment and hope of reward after death." -Albert Einstein
"What can be asserted without proof can be dismissed without proof." -Christopher Hitchens
11 - roger nowosielski
I think Dan is looking for a way of reinstating "moral fiber" in his countrymen, Brian, and he happens to think that religious values might be of help.
For full context, you should read the article he linked to on page three, by Mark Steyn.
12 - Baronius
Dan - It's been said that the mindset you're describing existed in the 1950's. There was a common understanding that "acting as if" would allow a society to function, but there was no (or at best diminished) underlying belief. When the rebellions of the 1960's took place, they were able to topple the established structures rather easily because the support for them had been pragmatic rather than principled.
I don't know if I agree with that analysis. But if it's correct, it would seem that a society won't defend a belief that it pretends to have, only a belief that it has.
13 - roger nowosielski
I think Dan is more keen on convincing himself, Baronius, rather than others.
Good observation, by the way.
14 - Dr Dreadful
And that, Sir, may be one of the principal differences between British Subjects and US Citizens.
I was reading something yesterday - damned if I can find it now - in which a commentator was assessing the mood of the British voting public, and discussing the factors that might cause people to shy away from voting the Conservatives back into power. In particular, he was pointing out the general wariness of giving too much power to... local government.
City and county (and lower) governments in the UK are often regarded as being bureaucratic, over-idealistic, incompetent, incestuous and petty, and in my experience that's quite often a fair assessment.
There's a perception, the commentator said, that Westminster can get most things done far more effectively; and it is true that a lot of people don't trust their local council with anything much more sophisticated than making sure the streetlights work.
It's the polar opposite of the prevailing mood in the US.
15 - Dr Dreadful
Baronius: interesting comment 12. I'm a bit surprised you didn't argue that this article belongs in the Culture section! ;-)
Douglas Adams's comparison with our money economy is interesting. Money only has the value we agree that it has, and it often doesn't even physically exist.
Do you see money as being a sort of belief, or merely a convention?
16 - roger nowosielski
Well, then you should be able to account for such a significant difference, Dreadful. What are the critical factors?
17 - roger nowosielski
Good question, but the analogy doesn't work, I think. Or does it?
18 - Brian aka Guppusmaximus
I'm with him on that most of the way, Roger. I just believe that the truth will better guide us to that then some faux belief system that is based on superstition. With regards to the article, I see a lot of complaints (and they may be valid) but I didn't read any solutions!
"The United States now spends more on its military than the next 40 or so nations combined. Yet in two rinky-dink no-account semi-colonial policing campaigns, it doesn’t feel like that, does it? A lot of bucks, but not much of a bang."
what were we supposed to do...Nuke the f*ck out of our "enemies"?!
19 - Dr Dreadful
Size and history, I should say, Rog. Britain is confined to one island and has, in general, been a homogenous unit for centuries. America started as a disparate set of colonies, situated several weeks' journey from one another on a vast continent, all with their own ideas as to how things should be run.
20 - roger nowosielski
Size I'd definitely agree with, and homogeneity too. There's got to be a greater bond between the peoples of Britain, including the Scotch, the Irish, and the Welsch, than there exists amoung Americans whose the only basis for "national unity" rests on the conception of government which guarantees each and every subject certain right, liberty and freedoms.
21 - John Wilson
Dan has a delusional view of US history and religion.
Just 40 years ago good god-fearing christian soldiers gunned down 4 unarmed students at Kent State, and some parents even said they deserved it, as did a few god-loving politicians.
22 - Dr Dreadful
Don't let a person from Scotland hear you call them 'Scotch', Rog...
Scotch is a drink. A Scot is a person of Scottish nationality. Scots is both the plural of 'Scot' and the name of the (almost extinct) Scottish language, which is similar to but significantly distinct from English.
I'll forgive your mangling of the spelling of 'Welsh' this once and once only. :-)
23 - roger nowosielski
Sorr, Dreadful, was in a hurry.
24 - roger nowosielski
I still think, Brian, that the key to Dan's article is the piece by Mark Steyn (linked). I see Dan as groping here, because he himself is an agnostic.
25 - roger nowosielski
John Wilson,
The problem at hand is one of grounding morality. And it's awfully difficult without an appeal to the highest authority.