When Thomas Jefferson said that “people get the government they deserve,” it was more than just a clever turn of phrase. It also was not an isolated insight but a timeless truth, one expressed by many. William Cowper said,
“When was public virtue to be found when private was not?”
Benjamin Franklin stated,
“Only a virtuous people are capable of freedom. As nations become more corrupt and vicious, they have more need of masters.”
Truth be known, I could probably fill a book with the words of wise ones who have spoken in kind. But, you know, I understand this principle well. I know that people get the government they deserve; what bothers me is that I’m going to get the government they deserve.
You should be bothered, too. With the “people” changing radically through Third World immigration (Ted Kennedy’s 1965 immigration act ensures that 85 percent of immigrants come from the Third World and Asia), it’s legitimate to wonder how demographics influence democracy. And it’s not hard to understand how these folks will shape government, for they have done so before – in their own lands.
Since our largest immigrant group hails from Mexico, let’s look south of the border. Mexico is a thoroughly corrupt country, not at all unique in the Third World but certainly emblematic of it. For instance, they have the dubious distinction of possibly having the most corrupt police force in the world, as Mexican authorities enforce whatever law pays them the most. According to a documentary on the subject, you can buy your way out of a fatal hit-and-run for 450 dollars. But the corruption is so systemic that many of us have heard the stories ourselves. I remember being told of a man who traveled to Mexico and was mugged by the police (a documented example of theft by Mexican police can be found here). Then I heard about a hapless soul who had to sell his home to pay tribute to a family with more clout and a grudge against him; the police payed him a visit and told him he’d be shot if he didn’t. Most recently, an acquaintance told me how he was pulled over for running a stop sign that didn’t exist and had to pay the crooked cop a bribe so he could continue on his way. And this corruption is mirrored in every aspect of Mexican society, in the bureaucrats, the courts and, of course, the politicians.
Article comments
— go to most recent comments1 - Clavos
More racist filth from David Duke's evil twin.
I suppose it never occurred to you that one of the reasons "Third Worlders" come here is precisely because they are trying to escape the corruption? Or that Mexican police are corrupt because they aren't paid a living wage?
Why didn't you present Florida in your analysis of states with large "Third World" populations? Florida has a larger immigrant percentage of its population than Arizona, by far.
Could it be you left Florida out because the story of Third World immigration here is an unqualified success?
2 - Dave Nalle
Very cogently put, Selwyn. It troubles me occasionally that there are a few nativists like yourself who can put two sentences together and make a historical reference. Fortunately it's such a tiny minority in the mass of crackpots living in trailers that no one rational is going to get fooled by the few of you who can put pretty words around an ugly attitude.
To the article. Has it ever occured to you that people in Mexico don't like living under a corrupt regime? Have you considered how much more abusive their police are towards them than towards a gringo who might have some clout to get them in trouble? For that matter have you ever spoken to a first-generation Mexican immigrant? If you had you'd realize that one of the reasons they come here is to get away from the oppression of their home country, and once here they treasure the rights we honor that they had to live so long without.
As for California, if it's gone so far down the tubes and abandonned the legacy of Reagan, how is it that their governor is the closest thing we've got in contemporary politics to another Reagan?
And you seem a bit off on Arizona as well. Kyl is one of the most genuinely conservative Republicans we have in office right now, and McCain isn't far behind him. Despite all the rhetoric directed against them they are consiervative leaning to libertarian on most issue. Check their ratings sometime. They're stronger on almost all conservative core issues than 80% of the other elected GOP members. If two such staunch conservatives have thought immigration through and come from states where they've had direct contact with immigrants, might it not be significant that they favor a relatively welcoming immigration policy? Maybe they know something you don't.
BTW, what state do you live in?
Dave
3 - STM
Has anyone noticed that Selwyn looks distinctly latino?
4 - Dr Dreadful
Dave, you're wearing out your keyboard over nothing. Selwyn won't respond to your questions as he never returns to survey comments on his screeds.
So, Stan, wanna hijack this thread as well? Or are we still having too much fun on the other one?
5 - Clavos
Go fer it, mates; I've already had my say...
6 - STM
I think, in truth, some people are too frightened to come and debate us one at a time (as themselves), because what they really prefer is mass debating.
7 - Dr Dreadful
STM wondered:
Has anyone noticed that Selwyn looks distinctly latino?
Which one is Selwyn? There are a lot of portraits at the top of his homepage, none of whom look particularly Hispanic.
My money is on the really ugly bastard, fourth from the right. Plato, is it?
8 - STM
Plato, as a Greek and a champion of democracy, enjoyed mass debating as well. Washington, Westminster and Canberra are also full of mass debaters.
Google images will get you Selwyn, Doc, swarthy fellow that he is.
9 - Dave Nalle
Has anyone noticed that Selwyn looks distinctly latino?
Only in the older photos. In newer ones it looks like he's upgraded his hair to look a bit more aryan.
Dave
10 - RJ
Clavos calls the author a racist. Dave says this writer is one of the few non-trailer-dwelling, semi-literate individuals who supports this political position.
Meanwhile, poll after poll indicates that the vast majority of actual American citizens don't want to reward the people who broke into this country illegally with easy citizenship. They also would like to see our borders actually defended. They also would like to have our current immigration laws enforced. They also would like to make English the official language.
But, I guess they are all just racist, illiterate, trailer-park-dwelling scum. You know, like that bigoted moron Lou Dobbs.
(And this, from some of our most conservative contributors!)
11 - RJ
"More racist filth from David Duke's evil twin."
Name-calling like this is prohibited by BC's comments rules. Also, it's a logical fallacy to attack the messenger.
"I suppose it never occurred to you that one of the reasons "Third Worlders" come here is precisely because they are trying to escape the corruption? Or that Mexican police are corrupt because they aren't paid a living wage?"
Sounds like Mexico's problem. Why is it in the best interests of the United States and the American people to make it our problem?
12 - RJ
"Has it ever occured to you that people in Mexico don't like living under a corrupt regime?"
Has it ever occurred to you that there are literally billions of people around the world who live under corrupt regimes (Zimbabwe, Red China, Venezuela, etc.), and don't like it, and would rather live in the US, but that we can't let them all in???
13 - Dave Nalle
RJ, that was not the point here. I wasn't suggesting letting everyone on earth into the US. Duke argued that Mexicans are inherently corrupt and spreaders of corruption because they have a corrupt system in Mexico. I was merely pointing out the flipside of that argument.
Dave
14 - RJ
"For that matter have you ever spoken to a first-generation Mexican immigrant? If you had you'd realize that one of the reasons they come here is to get away from the oppression of their home country, and once here they treasure the rights we honor that they had to live so long without."
Then why did we see all those Mexican flags waving during their MAY DAY protest marches the last couple years, Dave?
15 - RJ
"As for California, if it's gone so far down the tubes and abandonned the legacy of Reagan, how is it that their governor is the closest thing we've got in contemporary politics to another Reagan?"
I hope you're kidding. Arnold is about as much a Reagan conservative as Dubya is a Goldwater Republican...
16 - STM
Seriously Dave? What, blond tips and what-not? A few touch-ups here and there? A bit of white pancake make-up?
In Selwyn's case, half his luck if he really is of latino background. I actually do have blond hair and blue eyes, and have to cover up all the time to protect from the strong sun. I always need sunglasses and have to wear a long-sleeved wetsuit vest all through summer and whack a litre of sunscreen on my face every time I go for a surf after 10am or before 4pm. In this climate, it's a drawback to be fair and I'm envious of my olive-skinned son who goes in the surf for 15 minutes and is suntanned for the next year.
I even used to dye my hair dark once upon a time so people wouldn't think of me as "blond". Didn't work.
Clav, meanwhile, considering his background, looks suprisingly like a Viking who took a wrong turn in the longboat at the Mexican coast. Erik O'Clavos :)
17 - RJ
"I wasn't suggesting letting everyone on earth into the US."
So...not everyone. Just the 10-20 million who have easy access to our country because of our undefended southern border.
[borat]That makes sense, NOT![/borat]
18 - Dave Nalle
RJ, go read my articles on immigration and dispute what I actually believe, rather than making shit up.
My most recent articles object to the current immigration bill, but for sensible reasons, not the racist crap you have decided to support here.
What we need is a strong guest worker program to provide the labor we need while maintaining control over that population. Put the illegals into the guest worker program and let a small number of the best ones move on to citizenship. With a legal way to work here they'll cooperate with the law, we make it as hard as hell to work without a guest worker visa, and send those who don't get with the program back to Mexico. No more jumping the border because there will be a system to let them in legally.
Dave
19 - RJ
Let's look at the larger picture, people!
-About 3 in 4 Americans believe our country is on the "wrong track"
-President Bush has a favorable rating of just over 30%
-The Congress (run by Democrats in both houses) has a favorable rating just over...30%
-A majority of Americans think we are losing in Iraq, and in the larger "war on terrorism" as well
-A majority of Americans oppose amnesty, and want stronger enforcement at the southern border
Basically, the PEOPLE are in rebellion, just not open rebellion (yet).
They hate the President. They hate the Congress. They hate Republicans. They hate Democrats.
They think we are headed in the wrong direction, as a nation.
They want more border security. They want fewer illegals crossing the border. They don't want their jobs taken by illegals, and they don't want their jobs outsourced to another country.
The economy is bordering on recession, energy prices are up, inflation is up, the housing market is in free-fall, our trade deficit is at a record high, our budget deficit is still in the hundreds of billions, our entitlement programs remain unreformed and underfunded, and our Presidential candidates are not exactly titillating the base (right or left).
We are a hop, a skip, and a jump away from either a revolution of some kind, or, lacking that, a devolution. Take your pick.
Our immigration/borders debate is merely a symptom of the main problem. We aren't even a real country anymore.
20 - RJ
"My most recent articles object to the current immigration bill, but for sensible reasons, not the racist crap you have decided to support here."
I don't appreciate being called a racist for supporting the enforcement of federal law, and with the majority of the American people in agreement with me. Especially by a fellow conservative.
But I guess Pat Buchanan and Mickey Kaus and Peggy Noonan and Ann Coulter were all right: This is the issue that will divide and destroy the Republican Party.
Hillary in 2008...in a fucking LANDSLIDE!!!
21 - RJ
"With a legal way to work here they'll cooperate with the law"
Dave: When have ILLEGAL IMMIGRANTS ever cooperated with the law in the past?
If they had cooperated with the law in the past, this wouldn't even be an issue, would it?
22 - Dave Nalle
The immigration issue is peripheral to the main problems in the country, and while people oppose amnesty, they do NOT oppose a guest worker program.
In a Time Magazine poll 79% supported the idea of a guest worker program. That's an overwhelming level of support. In the same poll only 47% wanted to deport illegals.
What the people want, in this instance, is to keep the illegals as workers while not letting them become citizens with an amnesty.
Dave
23 - STM
"We are a hop, a skip, and a jump away from either a revolution of some kind, or, lacking that, a devolution. Take your pick."
If only those founding fathers had realised the price to be paid 200 years down the track from breaking with the Crown.
It's never too late to come back, though RJ.
24 - RJ
Yeah, the UK is a lot better off, right? LOL... :-/
25 - SCFMH
Didn't the USA become great partly because of unrestricted immigration?
"Give me your tired, your poor,
Your huddled masses yearning to breathe free,
The wretched refuse of your teeming shore.
Send these, the homeless, tempest-tost to me,
I lift my lamp beside the golden door!"
Conservatives usually love to look back and say how great it was in 't' old days. Why not in this case?