Let's see here ... Russia storms into Georgia, an independent country to which it never had any claim — Russia annexed it in 1801 — and lays waste to entire communities of innocent civilians.
If this were all about South Ossetia, then what the hell was the bombing of Gori and Tbilisi all about? Why bomb apartment buildings? And why, pray tell, did Russia decide to stir the pot in the autonomous province of Abkhazia? (Though, having said that, in line with my beliefs, I would support Abkhazia's independence from either Georgia or Russia.)
Did Georgia really deserve this kind of stomping to the curb just because she decided to flex her muscles a bit in South Ossetia? Russia has long bullied Georgia; why should the Russians stop doing so now?
Russia claims that Georgians were trying to "ethnically cleanse" Russians from South Ossetia. A load of bull. I don't believe one word of it. Look at any good map of that region. Does South Ossetia fit more cleanly into Russia, or Georgia? Besides Russia playing the part of imperialist bully only too well, it's clear why they took the opportunity handed to them to beat Georgia to a bleeding pulp.
The oil pipeline. What Russia wanted is clear: to control the pipeline, tell British Petroleum (BP), who owns it, to screw off, and dictate their own terms with Europe regarding the oil.
Now, lastly, remember all the protests against the Iraq war? Millions taking to the streets in major cities, demanding that America (and Britain) back off? That it was an imperialist war, that it was all about oil?
How many anti-war marches were held in honor of the raped country of Georgia? How many people took to Western streets on her behalf? How many speeches did Stop The War deliver demanding that Russia back off, to stop being greedy for oil?
NONE.
I think this demonstrates only too aptly the fickleness and hypocrisy of the anti-war movement. They're only interested in bashing America, Britain and Israel. Russia, of course, gets a free pass.
Article comments
— go to most recent comments1 - vox populi
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2 - Anastasia
You call leveling the whole city and killing 1600 civilians in one night "flexing muscles"? Most of those people were citizens of Russia. What do you think US would do if someone killed 1600 of US citizens? Oh wait... something like that already happened, no?
3 - K.C. Corcoran
Hypocrisy? No, it's the fact that we as Americans have more influence over the actions of our own country than we do over the actions of the Russians. It's as simple as that. I'm completely against the Russian invasion of Georgia, as are all of the anti-war protesters I know. Wrong is wrong, no matter who is doing it, so please actually talk to some anti-war protesters before you go making wild assertions.
4 - Cannonshop
Weak excuse, K.C. I think mister Manning nailed it-war protestors only show up if it's the U.S. or a U.S. ally.
5 - Dr Dreadful
While I take your point, Cannonshop, it's not quite as clear-cut as that.
Remember the series of protests recently during the Olympic torch relay? Not a war protest exactly, but you can bet your bottom dollar that most of those protesting weren't sympathetic to the US either.
6 - Dr Dreadful
And it's a long time ago, but I do recall anti-war protests outside the Soviet Embassy in London during the Afghan occupation.
7 - DM
I am reading this blog and I can tell you, we are no friend of Georgia. Geogia will always border Russia, and Russia will always have a lot more in common with them than we. Both nations have a long history in common, share same culture, eastern orthodox christianity and etc. So many families have Georgian and Russian roots.
Everybody in Russia knows about Georgia and its culture. The only Georgia we in the US know about is the one from the "Dukes of Hazard".
I am tired of a new strong "ally" every couple of months and the B.S. we are fed how we stand for democracy. Wasn't Pakistan our ally too. Or Saudi Arabia, the beacon of democracy. And what about Egypt, Jordan, Kuwait, etc.
We egged this country and its ambitious president to attack Russia by bombing the breakaway province of South Ossetia. The result, is death and destruction. Ossetians will hate Georgians who destroyed their capital and the Georgians will hate the Russians who bombed their country and invaded its towns. Why was this necessary?
In these countries, wars are not forgotten. The Caspian oil will be gone in 10 years and as the BP oil line becomes irrelevant so would this tiny little republic become irrelevant to us. But the hate and destruction which we helped create will linger on.
8 - H2SF
You forget (or don't know about) the very old ethnic strife between georgians and ossetians. Nobody in that region believes that the ossetians would survive for long if Georgia were to control South Ossetia territory.
Read about the 1992 war there and all the killings that happened. It's a difficult situation with no clear cut solution, but uniletaral grab of control by military means by Georgia is definitely NOT a solution.
9 - Dave Nalle
H2SF, the history of killings in that region is largely one of Ossetians killing Georgians with Russian backing and not the other way around.
And DM, I've been to Georgia. Have you? We did not encourage Georgia to attack Ossetia. We halped them build up their military to deal with incursions from Chechnia and because they were willing to help us out in Iraq. All of that has nothing to do with Russia.
And for the record the Ossetian capital was not bombed. Some areas around it were shelled to slow the advance of Russian troops. The city is still in pretty good shape.
And for the record, Georgia had already ordered its troops out of Ossetia AND had offered a cease fire days before Russians shelled their capital and other parts of their territory.
Dave
An
an
10 - Baronius
What can the average American do? One country invades another on the other side of the world. Neither one is in a military alliance with the US. Even if they were, our government and military would be involved, not the average citizen.
I don't mean to sound cold. This situation is horrible. The US is extended to its fullest fixing horrible situations. I can vote to support a strong foreign policy in three months, and I can donate to relief organizations, but that's about it.
Ruvy wrote a recent article about Georgia, which began with a rant against apathetic Americans. We read the same comments everywhere, that Americans only care about American Idol. That's nonsense. But we Americans tend to be practical. My knowledge or passion about fighting in the Caucasus will have zero effect, as near as I can figure.
11 - Pablo
Gotta love how Davey always prefaces his remarks by sayin "I've been there have you?" As if that gives you one ounce of real political knowledge about the areas you pontificate about. After all Davey you have been to the good ole US of A haven't ya buddy? Well kinda, hehe being in Texass and all, and you still don't know squat about whats going on in this country, geez.
Your attempt at self-bolstering just doesn't cut it bubba.
I am still waiting with baited breath to hear you on the Alex Jones show!
I will pit my tin-foil hat against your Mr. Know It All, arrogant, egotistical condescension any day o the week bucko.
Just my two sense Davey boy.
12 - Clavos
I am still waiting with baited breath...
Catching anything with it?
If not, maybe you should try chumming your breath before baiting it.
13 - Dan Miller
Clav,
To quote another comment from a different thread,
Aggggggghhhhhhh!
Dan
14 - troll
aphesis gets the better of many of us
15 - Clavos
I thought aphesis just covers missed vowels, troll?
16 - troll
my understanding is that the dropped 'a' in 'abated' would be an instance...not so - ?
17 - Baritone
After Clav beat me silly for the same mistake, I have aptly learned my lesson as regards the above malaprop. Pablo's error was not an example of aphesis, but rather simply using the wrong homonym.
Clav is a brute, but I have learned much while being beaten to a proverbial bloody pulp by the Mexican Mad Dog Spelling Guy.
B
18 - Clavos
Sorry, guys, fell asleep there for a while.
B-tone is correct, troll. Pablo actually added a vowel. It's bated breath.
That said, I was being coy. You see, Dan was (almost) quoting me in #13, but actually left out a consonant. What I had written on the other thread was Aaarrrggghhh.
Good times, good times! :>)
19 - Dave Nalle
Gotta love how Davey always prefaces his remarks by sayin "I've been there have you?" As if that gives you one ounce of real political knowledge about the areas you pontificate about.
It gives me a more personal basis for understanding who the good guys and bad guys are in a complex situation, certainly.
After all Davey you have been to the good ole US of A haven't ya buddy? Well kinda, hehe being in Texass and all, and you still don't know squat about whats going on in this country, geez.
Sure I do. A bunch of fringe whack-jobs thought they had a shot at political power and are now retreating back into their holes, rereading the Turner Diaries and stockpiling spam in their garages.
Dave
20 - Mark Edward Manning
K.C.: "Wrong is wrong, no matter who is doing it, so please actually talk to some anti-war protesters before you go making wild assertions."
OK, fine, I grant you that most anti-war types just might be disgusted by Russia's heavy-handedness, but, again, I ask:
Where are the millions of people taking to the streets in outrage? Where can Stop The War's posters berating Russia for her actions be found?
If my assertion that they couldn't give a flying fig about conflict if it doesn't concern America, Britain or Israel is wild, as you say, then prove me wrong. Any piece from any major left-wing publication or commentator will do.
21 - Ruvy
Mark,
Your article, ass well as Dave's is weak in that it only looks at the locus of the fighting and the issues apparently involved locally. The entire region is at stake here, and by extension, the future of Europe, America and Russia.
Go read both my articles on the issue, Mark, as well as the comments and the updates. Setting aside references to prophecy, there is a lot more at stake than meets the eye.
As for the peaceniks, what do you expect? They were always soft on the brutality of the Russians and they have not changed. You're a fool to expect them to.
22 - Ruvy
Baronius,
The least you can do with all of this is to understand that events occurring in the Caucasus are all of a piece, tightly connected to those occurring in the Lebanon, Iran and Iraq. Knowledge and understanding are far more valuable than they seem at first blush. In fact, knowledge and understanding is more powerful than the most lethal of weapons - it enables the survivor to make other lethal weapons and take vengeance, for example....
23 - troll
(Clavos and Baritone - I didn't realize that aphesis is considered an error...I thought that it is an historical process => it was the aphesis process that generated the word 'bated' making the common error of switching to 'baited' likely...#14 was a comment about our language generally
I blame the bard for this one)
Mark - what 'anti-war movement' are you referring to...the one that so successfully prevented the death and destruction in Iraq - ?
...perhaps you are just a bit quick on the trigger...the 'peaceniks' may yet turn the slaughter into the occasion for a party
24 - Clavos
I blame the bard for this one
And, as with much of Modern English, rightfully so.
25 - Polemicscat
Lincoln has been regarded by (Union) authors of textbooks as our greatest president, but he and his army committed more atrocities than any other president in our history. He suspended habeas corpus for the duration of his administration and imprisoned and intimidated all who disagreed with him, north and south. In doing so he nullified the Ninth and Tenth Amendments of the US Constitution.
One of his chief war criminals was Sherman:
"Upon taking command in Memphis, Sherman described his ultimate purpose in the war to his wife:'extermination, not of soldiers alone, that is the least part of the trouble, but the people.' His loving wife responded by expressing her sincerest wish that the war would be a war 'of extermination and that all [Southerners] would be driven like the Swine into the sea. May we carry fire and sword into their states till not one habitation is left standing."
---Thomas J. DiLorenzo, The Real Lincoln, pp. 182-3.