I just love how they urinated on their own Koran. How they flushed their own Koran. How they ripped up their own Koran. How the 5 incidents that Americans were responsible for were negligable.
Look. If the Koran says all the stuff that Zarqawi, Bin Laden, and Zawahari says it does, I don't think we should be giving the f**ers Korans in prison...and why should we respect it if they don't?
Is everybody here saying only the left is afraid of becoming the savages we abhor as enemies? I think we as Americans realzie we are better than people who behead. Are we so insecure that we have to mention that every time we mention what Americans may have done wrong?
There were direct policies in place for some of this. and the same guy who oversaw Gitmo was then transferred to lead Abu Ghraib. We are also sending some people - hopefully only those we KNOW are terrorists - to be tortured in Syria and Egypt.
The first is an undesputable fact. The second is somethng I have never heard anyone in the government deny, even when asked directly. I may have missed it.
Let me go back to the question of "gulag" not being used in the report however - The NYTimes phrases it as if it is. Is there a cite that says otherwise? I was to quick to accept that without a cite. You have to pay 25 pounds for the Amnesty report so I can't read it directly.
Well I heard the Gulag comment in the context of a quote "Gitmo ... is the gulag of our time". Whether that quote was in the report or not is not something that really matters when the head of Amnesty says such things. It's also woefully naive. The insist that these guys are protected by the Geneva Conventions. They are not. No serious reading of the Geneva Conventions can conclude that people who are not part of an organized state army and who do not carry arms openly are entitled to protections. Mercenaries, likewise, are not entitled to protection.
But the side that says we are wrong openly uses deceptions. How can we take them seriously? There is intelligent discussion to be had on how to treat these prisoners. But a barking dog and being told to stand for a few hours is not torture in any meaning of the Geneva Conventions. Cruel and painful, sure. But we aren't taking knives to these people.
The sensationalism (on both sides) makes it all but impossible to have a discussion on these issues anymore. People throw words around because of their emotional impact, not because the facts warrant it.
Sorry John. My honest mistake. Someone else said that on a different thread - in their post. Got my threads confused and was, I thought, responding to them earlier in the thread, though you obviously reminded me of it.
As for a lack of rational responses and the 'teething' high-chair banging liberals,
LEMMEE PARSE THIS FOR THOSE WHO LAMENT THE LACK OF 'Rational responses':
BAMBI-NECK: "...when the Left harps about "divisiveness" that they are the ones that brought it by supporting the enemies of our country and those who would kill our civilians."
Mr. Bambi-neck explicitly says:
The "left" supports the enemies of America -- ie. the left are traitors to the USA, a violation, btw, punishable by death in this country.
[NOTE: the Constitution defines treason as levying war against the United States or "in adhering to their Enemies, giving them Aid and Comfort"; the penalty ranges from "shall suffer death" to "shall be imprisoned not less than five years and fined under this title but not less than $10,000; and shall be incapable of holding any office under the United States."]
So when should we liberal show up at the ovens for our 'de-lousing'?
YOU'RE A RIGHT WING BLOWHARD NUT CASE, BAMBI-NECK; a truly rational response would be to ask that you suck a tailpipe.
Yes, that's exactly what I'm saying, I'm saying that every liberal should be exterminated. You've caught us. That's been the sooper-sekret KKKarl Rove plan all along, either you are with us or you get killed.
Article comments
26 - Cao
I just love how they urinated on their own Koran. How they flushed their own Koran. How they ripped up their own Koran. How the 5 incidents that Americans were responsible for were negligable.
Look. If the Koran says all the stuff that Zarqawi, Bin Laden, and Zawahari says it does, I don't think we should be giving the f**ers Korans in prison...and why should we respect it if they don't?
27 - Temple Stark
Is everybody here saying only the left is afraid of becoming the savages we abhor as enemies? I think we as Americans realzie we are better than people who behead. Are we so insecure that we have to mention that every time we mention what Americans may have done wrong?
There were direct policies in place for some of this. and the same guy who oversaw Gitmo was then transferred to lead Abu Ghraib. We are also sending some people - hopefully only those we KNOW are terrorists - to be tortured in Syria and Egypt.
The first is an undesputable fact. The second is somethng I have never heard anyone in the government deny, even when asked directly. I may have missed it.
Let me go back to the question of "gulag" not being used in the report however - The NYTimes phrases it as if it is. Is there a cite that says otherwise? I was to quick to accept that without a cite. You have to pay 25 pounds for the Amnesty report so I can't read it directly.
28 - John Bambenek
Well I heard the Gulag comment in the context of a quote "Gitmo ... is the gulag of our time". Whether that quote was in the report or not is not something that really matters when the head of Amnesty says such things. It's also woefully naive. The insist that these guys are protected by the Geneva Conventions. They are not. No serious reading of the Geneva Conventions can conclude that people who are not part of an organized state army and who do not carry arms openly are entitled to protections. Mercenaries, likewise, are not entitled to protection.
But the side that says we are wrong openly uses deceptions. How can we take them seriously? There is intelligent discussion to be had on how to treat these prisoners. But a barking dog and being told to stand for a few hours is not torture in any meaning of the Geneva Conventions. Cruel and painful, sure. But we aren't taking knives to these people.
The sensationalism (on both sides) makes it all but impossible to have a discussion on these issues anymore. People throw words around because of their emotional impact, not because the facts warrant it.
29 - Temple Stark
Sorry John. My honest mistake. Someone else said that on a different thread - in their post. Got my threads confused and was, I thought, responding to them earlier in the thread, though you obviously reminded me of it.
30 - John Bambenek
No worries.
31 - dee
Does not seem like my type of author at all.
32 - Shark
As for a lack of rational responses and the 'teething' high-chair banging liberals,
LEMMEE PARSE THIS FOR THOSE WHO LAMENT THE LACK OF 'Rational responses':
BAMBI-NECK: "...when the Left harps about "divisiveness" that they are the ones that brought it by supporting the enemies of our country and those who would kill our civilians."
Mr. Bambi-neck explicitly says:
The "left" supports the enemies of America -- ie. the left are traitors to the USA, a violation, btw, punishable by death in this country.
[NOTE: the Constitution defines treason as levying war against the United States or "in adhering to their Enemies, giving them Aid and Comfort"; the penalty ranges from "shall suffer death" to "shall be imprisoned not less than five years and fined under this title but not less than $10,000; and shall be incapable of holding any office under the United States."]
So when should we liberal show up at the ovens for our 'de-lousing'?
YOU'RE A RIGHT WING BLOWHARD NUT CASE, BAMBI-NECK; a truly rational response would be to ask that you suck a tailpipe.
33 - Temple Stark
This is the post where the gulag reference was made.
34 - John Bambenek
Shark:
Yes, that's exactly what I'm saying, I'm saying that every liberal should be exterminated. You've caught us. That's been the sooper-sekret KKKarl Rove plan all along, either you are with us or you get killed.
35 - Dave Nalle
Well, at leas that seems to have shut Shark up for once.
Dave
36 - John Bambenek
I have done my part for king and country then. :)
37 - RJ
Cao! Welcome! I haven't seen you here before this!
But I see you all the time on BlogExplosion... ;-)
38 - Shark
Bambi-Neck sez:
"...that's exactly what I'm saying: ...every liberal should be exterminated. ...either you are with us or you get killed."
MARKETING SLOGAN OF THE NEW GOP.
39 - John Bambenek
Marketing slogan on the new DNC:
"Waaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaahhhhhhhhhhhhhh!"
40 - Mark Saleski
right. this last comment is an absolute perfect condensation of the current state of political 'discourse' these days:
"I'm right....and you're a moron".
no wonder google thinks we're a satire site.
41 - John Bambenek
Political discourse doesn't take place in comments. Never has.
42 - Mark Saleski
well, it's not like it can't, it just doesn't.
43 - John Bambenek
No, there is no reason that it can't. But by far, the majority of commenters are simply flaming and flailing. No point trying to discuss.
44 - Shark
Bambi: "...the majority of commenters are simply flaming and flailing. No point trying to discuss."
DISCUSS THIS:
* "The Left... support[s] the enemies of our country and those who would kill our civilians."
* excerpt from Mein Kampf
45 - John Bambenek
There's nothing to discuss. That statement is fact.
46 - Mark Saleski
i hope you've included your "marketing slogan of the new dnc" in with the flaming and flailing.
(tho i'm not sure if it's a flame or a flail)
47 - John Bambenek
To be fair, it was more mocking than flaming.