Dr. George Tiller, 67, of Wichita, Kansas, was shot to death at about ten o'clock (CDT) this morning as he entered his church, the Reformation Lutheran Church, for services. Details are still sketchy, but Wichita police have confirmed that the victim of the shooting is Dr. Tiller.
As one of the few practitioners of late term abortions in the country, Tiller was a polarizing lightning rod of a figure in the ongoing national debate about abortion, and had earned the nickname of "Tiller the Killer" among conservative opponents of abortion.
During more than two decades of notoriety, Tiller was no stranger to threats and protests at his clinic in Wichita. He had been the target of a gunman once before, in 1993, when he was shot and wounded.
Wichita police have announced they are looking for a blue Ford Taurus with a K-State vanity plate, license number 225 BAB. Police described him as a white male in his 50s or 60s, 6 feet 1 inch tall, 220 pounds, wearing a white shirt and dark pants.
Late-term abortions are defined as those which take place after the twentieth week of gestation. They, along with partial birth abortions, are the most controversial procedures in the overall debate over abortion, which has raged ever since the Roe v. Wade Supreme Court decision in the early seventies. Opponents maintain that late-term fetuses are "viable," (capable of living) and should not be performed for that reason. The exact point at which viability occurs is variable and is at the heart of the controversy.
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Article comments
— go to most recent comments1 - Ruvy
A friend of mine who participates on an American Jewish list suggested that this murder may be used by the Obama boys ("never waste a crisis" Manny Rahm) as a kind of "Reichstag Fire" incident to clamp down on opposing opinions in the country. Until he produced this article from the Huffington Post on "Christian Terrorism" I was inclined to doubt him. But I'm less inclined now. So reproduced below is my comment to his original suggestion.
Suspension of civil liberties may not come immediately, but Obama does realize that that he has only until January, 2011 to push through an agenda without serious opposition. So, I would expect some suspension of civil liberties before the 2010 elections, but not serious enough to make the elections seem entirely moot.
Whatever he is, Obama is not an idiot and he knows not to go too far, too fast. The difference between the Weimar Republic and the States is all those guys who own guns, bless their hearts.
2 - zingzing
ruvy, will you eat your words if what you prophesize fails to occur?
an abortionist gets murdered and you say that obama is a fascist. where the fuck is your logic coming from?
the fact is that some crazy (most likely christian) loon shot a man. it's not unexpected.
i'd hate to think of what would happen if you were actually in charge of anything other than your bowel movements.
3 - Clavos
Interesting point, Ruvy. I hope you and your friend are wrong regarding the "clamping down" on dissent.
I think Obama is too smart to make an overt move like that; he'll find another way to neutralize his opposition; perhaps by some means of co-opting it.
4 - leighann
I heard a speech while I was in college where the speaker handed out brochures and said that in a late term abortion, the baby is turned around so it will come out of the mother feet first and just before its head comes out something is stuck in the back of its neck and the brain sucked out. If this is true then where is the outrage? Does anyone know if it is true?
5 - zingzing
"where is the outrage?"
um. really?
6 - leighann
yes. It was wrong for someone to kill this doctor and it is an outrage. That is clear. I was not commenting on that because it goes without saying.
If it is true what I have heard about these type of abortions then it is outragous that it is a matter of inches or minutes that decides if this is a legal abortion or a murder. That is crazy! Was this baby less of a human two minutes before when its head was still inside of its mother? I guess so.
I have searched partial birth abortions on the internet today and find a bunch of stuff from pro-life groups so I am still not sure about the accuracy of the information but I would think that common sense would tell you that it cant be true. I mean if it is dangerous to the mother to have this baby then would it not hurt her even more to have a baby be born breeched and would not the damage of a birth already be done since the baby is already all the way out except its head? I do not understand how this can be safer for the mother. Well maybe if she is in the 5th or 6th month but not in the 7th, 8th or 9th. It seems that if the mother and doctor feel that an abortion is the only way that they could find a more humane way to go about it.
7 - Ruvy
"where is the outrage?" um. really?
Well, Leighann, at least we know who doesn't answer to the name "daddy" on this comment thread.
Having lost one son to an abortion because the mother never told me until after it was done, and feeling as I do that late term abortions of the type described in the article are murder of viable fetuses, I feel a certain outrage at what the late Dr. Tiller did for a living. But I feel a certain outrage that he was murdered as well - and fear for your nation how power-hungry politicians (especially those already in the White House) may use that murder to further their own nefarious ambitions..
8 - zingzing
ruvy, my point was that there is outrage. maybe leighann just doesn't pay attention. i don't know what you were trying to say with the "daddy" comment.
"[i] fear for your nation how power-hungry politicians (especially those already in the White House) may use that murder to further their own nefarious ambitions.."
how the fuck would they do that? why would they do that? what the hell are you talking about? you really think that the obama administration IS ABLE to take the murder of an abortionist and use it to destroy civil rights? explain how that would occur. then think about how crazy you are.
9 - Clavos
Ever read 1984 zing?
Any government is capable of any atrocious act the human mind can dream up, and at one time or another, likely will.
Your federal government, for example, has used Americans as guinea pigs, inflicting horrible diseases on them without their knowledge, for purposes of experimentation and "research."
10 - Ruvy
you really think that the obama administration IS ABLE to take the murder of an abortionist and use it to destroy civil rights? explain how that would occur.
Why should I speculate on the imagined follies of Mr. Obama when I can watch the real ones as he performs them? I do not want history to take a leaf from my book and use it against me, zing....
We can all watch the fun together. I can watch it (thank G-d) from a safe distance.
11 - Dave Nalle
Ruvy, Tiller has been attacked before, including one prior assassination attempt where he was shot twice, and that was under Bush -- so I hardly credit your "reichstag fire" conspiracy. You sound like Alex Jones.
Dave
12 - Ruvy
Why should I speculate on the imagined follies of Mr. Obama when I can watch the real ones as he performs them? I do not want history to take a leaf from my book and use it against me,
BTW, Clavos, I stole that line straight from H.G. Wells, just modifying a name here and there. At least you recognize what zing refuses to see. Maybe zing should borrow your glasses....
13 - leighann
Yes, there is outrage. There is outrage from your pro-life groups and crazy people who go into churches and kill doctors or blow up clinics. I am asking where the outrage is among all of the other people.
I do not think that Ruvy is crazy. He is a product of his environment just as we are. My father is mentally ill. He digs holes in his yard and keeps his windows foiled and goes through his air conditioning ducts because he is suspicious that the army and law enforcement are out to get him. He has no logical reason to think these things so he gets a check every month and has to take medication. He is crazy. Suspicion or the actions of my father would not be a reason for us to think that Ruvy is crazy given the environment in which he lives. From his perspective (which I do not and can not fully understand), it makes sense for him to be suspicious of the current administration for the reasons he has listed many times here.
Btw crazier things have happened.
14 - zingzing
you're a paranoid man, ruvy. what, exactly, are you seeing? you always fail to mention that part, but that's okay, as no one really gives a shit anymore. it's comical.
clavos, yes, i've read 1984, but if obama is capable of turning this murder into a fascist takeover, i'll be the first to say congrats. it's fucking impossible (setting aside the fact that there's absolutely no reason to believe he would want to do any such thing), and it would prove him to be a political genius the likes of which the world has never seen.
15 - Ruvy
You sound like Alex Jones. I've heard Alex Jones talk on air, Dave. That's a rank insult! I don't huff and puff when speaking in public like an out of breath St. Bernard....
Tiller has been attacked before - true, but he hasn't been killed before. It's murders that make these things possible and palatable to a public. A mere attack might get people outraged, but you got to get them as boiled up as owls before they will agree to limit their own freedom. That takes murder.
16 - zingzing
ruvy: "Maybe zing should borrow your glasses...."
i don't need glasses. i'm young enough to have perfect vision, vision that isn't distorted by bitterness and hatred.
leighann: "I do not think that Ruvy is crazy."
you take me too literally. i don't mean insane. i mean violently misanthropic and zealous in his cracked-out beliefs. that better?
"Yes, there is outrage. There is outrage from your pro-life groups and crazy people who go into churches and kill doctors or blow up clinics. I am asking where the outrage is among all of the other people."
well, they don't go shooting people and blowing up innocent people (and babies). but you really can't say that you've never come across an article decrying late term birth abortion, right? that would take some serious doing. i'm impressed by your avoidance technique, if that's true.
17 - zingzing
hrm. late term abortion... or partial birth abortion... either one, but not "late term birth abortion..."
18 - zingzing
ruvy: "You sound like Alex Jones. I've heard Alex Jones talk on air, Dave. That's a rank insult! I don't huff and puff when speaking in public like an out of breath St. Bernard...."
ha! go dave! it's true. i never connected the two. and ruvy, your self-description was spot on. "rank," indeed.
19 - Ruvy
Reading your comments is truly funny, zing. Looks to me like you overshot your wad, and now you;'re walking sideways, like a crab, to avoid your own foolish and overblown bullshit.
And by the way, the idea of the "Reichstag fire" was not mine to begin with at all, and at first I doubted it. Only after reading the Huff and Puff baloney on "Christian terrorism" did it dawn on me that my friend in the States might have a point - and even then, I moderated what he imagined. It seemed to extreme to be plausible.
Were this done, it would be done in a very sophisticated way, with "opinion leaders" like the "Grey Lady", the LA Times and the Washington Post pushing repeats of the Huffington bullshit, with news anchors playing up the terrorism angle, etc., etc.
20 - Matt Sussman
So his life ended prematurely?
21 - zingzing
"Reading your comments is truly funny, zing. Looks to me like you overshot your wad, and now you;'re walking sideways, like a crab, to avoid your own foolish and overblown bullshit."
walking sideways? my foolish and overblown bullshit? how do you come away with that conclusion? you're the one back-peddling, claiming it wasn't your completely ridiculous idea, but your "american friend's." how you can claim i've overshot my load (which is simply that you're a nut) is beyond me. you ARE a nut. no walking sideways here.
why do you think obama would want to stage some sort of fascist coup? what next? we all call him caesar? where does your fantasy world end?
22 - Dave Nalle
Tiller has been attacked before - true, but he hasn't been killed before.
That's solely a function of chance, Ruvy. This assassin just happened to be a better shot than the last one.
Dave
23 - roger nowosielski
Served him right, no?
24 - roger nowosielski
How many times does a man have to die for one and the same crime. Isn't it double jeopardy?
25 - zingzing
"Were this done, it would be done in a very sophisticated way, with "opinion leaders" like the "Grey Lady", the LA Times and the Washington Post pushing repeats of the Huffington bullshit, with news anchors playing up the terrorism angle, etc., etc."
ok, well, let's see who is right. i'll say that there won't be a obama-led fascist coup, you'll say that there will be. what would you care to bet? tell you what, i'll give you my first born child (he'll be safer there anyway, if what you say comes to pass) and you can give me... oh, i dunno, a ball of lint. a recipe for chicken soup. a big bag of nothing. i don't care.