Terrorists will attack the American homeland again - but only out of the sheer necessity of self-preservation.
Cheney's still up to his old demagoguery: "Former Vice President Dick Cheney warned that there is a "high probability" that terrorists will attempt a catastrophic nuclear or biological attack in coming years, and said he fears the Obama administration's policies will make it more likely the attempt will succeed."…
Article comments
126 - Cindy D
I agree with you. And I am finding myself recently able to begin getting over my anger a bit at a time. It's a very good thing. But, can't rush progress.
127 - Roger Nowosielski
Just think of what is that that you're really angry about! Understanding the cause(s) is one sure way of diffusing it and stripping the defense mechanism of its (in this case)improper function.
But you're a psychologist, not I. So I don't know why I'm telling you what you already know.
Perhaps just a Socratic reminder.
128 - Cindy D
Finding out that not everyone in the world is an asshole has helped a lot. lol
129 - Roger Nowosielski
Of course. But it still doesn't deal with or resolve the problem of the self.
I admit, though, you MUST have positive examples. Otherwise, it's like trying to pull yourself by your own bootstraps - a next to impossible proposition.
130 - Lumpy
lately I find myself filled with a white hot rage that the grossest of the inexcusable malefactors who helped to create the mortgage crisis like Dodd and Frank and Pelosi and Feinstein not only are not being held accountable for their past crimes and corruptiion but are now playing a large role in the passage of a trillion dollars of insane spending which will drive us from recession to full on depression.
131 - Al Barger
Roger sez: "You are extending the notion of self-defense (from home and family) to that of country. It's precisely that leap that many of us here question."
You're questioning that? How can you possibly question that? It's the same thing on the macro. Jihadists want to kill as many Americans as possible - and that would include me and mine. We can't literally all defend ourselves against the armies and forces of the world 100% individually with our coon dogs and shotguns. That's good for stopping random burglars, but not effective against military groups.
The point of having a US military is to protect me and you and our families from people who wish us harm. One of the jihadist plots they busted up about four years ago involved some plan to blow up a shopping mall in Columbus, Ohio. Hey, wait, I've got people there. That's the niece whose birthday party I was talking about a little earlier.
The US military defends me and my family - and you and your family if you live in the US. How could you miss that?
Cindy- I'm frankly kinda disappointed in you. We were getting along so good there for awhile, and now tonight you're back to calling me names and being mean. I mean, you're calling ME hateful and intolerant - but you're the one carrying on like I'm just an evil no good sumbitch because I'm not agreeing with you. Well, you and Handyguy. You're both in favor of all kinds of diversity of outlook and opinion - as long as they agree with YOU.
132 - Al Barger
Handy guys sez in 115: "It's your words, Al, that are bullying: needlessly harsh, full of laughable macho bluster, and deliberately hurtful.
PS The word 'fag' should not be in any straight man's vocabulary if he wants to be believed when he makes pseudo-tolerant noises about gays. You would never, I assume, use the N-word. Just about the same level of nasty hate is involved."
Handyguy- don't be such a faggot. Jebus Crikey. You can play all sensitive and caring, but that still does not give you the license to make up the rules for how I talk and my use of the language. Like Thomas Jefferson, I have sworn upon the altar of God eternal hostility against every from of tyranny over the mind of man. That certainly includes petty attempts at intimidation under threat of being labeled with some mark of Cain (racist, homophobic) by some anonymous shmuck on the internet.
"Faggot" of course does not necessarily mean homosexual. The acronym of the Film Actors Guild in Team America was not an accusation of homosexuality. Indeed, there was one specific act of homosexual behavior in the film - and that was between two members of Team America.
When Ann Coulter (who is evil and needlessly cruel - and usually correct and very funny) called John Edwards a "fag," she was not saying that he has sex with other men. She was saying that he's a wimp, a nancy boy not even vaguely fit to be able to be a commander in chief.
You wish to enforce a PC code without regard to it being disconnected from reality. Thus the broad meaning of fag as a wimp draws from the fact that a lot of gay guys are wimpy or feminine. That doesn't mean that there aren't many fine tough gay dudes in the army - about which I don't think the government even has a right to object.
But your hairdresser and antique dealers down the block may likely be behaviorally different in ways other than the preferred genders of their sex partners. Different people have different traits and abilities, and some of them statistically run parallel. You just mostly have to keep in mind that people aren't statistics - which may not apply in a particular case.
But I'll lay out a couple of statements which I can assure you are all true. I make occassional gay jokes and use the words fag and faggot under some circumstances - such as a need to piss of some PC pinkos.
Yet nonetheless, I'm all in favor of gay folk. I harbor no ill will toward anyone for their sexual orientation, and I don't feel any particular negative energy or anxiety when meeting or hanging out with gay dudes. It's all good.
I've occassionally been propositioned or asked out by gay guys, and generally find it complimentary. No, but thanks for asking. It's nice to know that SOMEONE is wanting to have sex with me.
Related free association: Working as a paid ballot petitioner for the Libertarian Party in Texas when I was 19 years old in 1982, we worked a huge gay pride parade and picnic in Houston - from which I still have commemorative mugs. I had, among other things, several different middle aged black dudes wanting dates. That was trippy to me. It struck me quite comical trying to think through exactly what these fellows had in mind. So this 50 year old gray headed black dude wants to put his penis in my butt? Really?
There was one fairly handsome and well spoken young black guy though who recognized me from the rally a couple of days later just doing my regular petition route downtown, and asked me out real nice. I remember thinking at the time something like that if I swung that way this would be a right eligible gentleman.
That same little stint in Houston was also my first time seeing Rocky Horror. The gay dude among the dozen or so guys sharing this small but luxuriously air conditioned apartment was the only one of us with his own transport - a motorcycle. I was perfectly happy to ride on the back of his motorcycle to go see Rocky Horror with the gay Catholic cowboy from Iowa. Good times.
Also, I will use the word "nigger" if I goddam well want to, and the first reason for doing so is to defy the edicts of PC. But I'm fairly careful and conscious of the word. Watch where you point that thing. I know it's not necessarily nice - and I'm not trying to be mean or unnecessarily cruel.
Though of course sometimes you got to be cruel to be kind. If I could get video of khalid sheikh mohammed being waterboarded, I'd add the Nick Lowe song as a soundtrack and post it to MoreThings.
I wouldn't use the dreaded N word casually at all at BC or in any form of publication. But the most casual use amid friendly environs is typically self-referential. If I'm at my brother's and he's tardy with the refreshments, I might ask what a nigger's got to do to get a cup of joe. But then, I'm not trying to be a wigger either.
But just all in all, Handyguy, you and Miss Cindy here have carried on about me, and I've said nothing with hateful or spiteful intent at all. Seems like you two are the ones with the venom and ill will, anxious to put your own little marks of Cain on me as supposedly homophobic or racist or whatever.
But if that's what get's y'all through the night, it's alright. I'll be your designated villain for the evening. That'll be easier for you to cope with than reality. Pay no attention to the swarthy man behind the curtain with the ticking briefcase.
133 - El Bicho
Al, I'd ask you not to be such an fuckin' asshole, but a leopard can't change his spots. Of course, I don't mean that term the way most people do. I saw a cable-access show where "fuckin' asshole" meant "long winded," so there's no reason to be insulted.
Trying to claim there's no homosexual connotation to calling someone a faggot is either disingenuous or ignorant, although in your case I grant it could be both.
The fact that you react to people wanting you to show a little respect to others as some sort of tyranny against you shows what a sad, selfish, pathetic man you are. There's no reason you need to lash out at others because of your impotence and lack of self worth. Try to lift yourself up instead of dragging others down.
134 - Al Barger
[Personal attack deleted]
It's hard for me to say what's right when all I want to do is wrong.
[No more of this from either one of you. Al, you are full of bull and you know it. El B, making it personal is just going to fan this little flame war. That is all.
Assistant Comments Editor]
135 - bliffle
Al says:
"it's enough that they fear our wrath too much to attack US."
Well now, you see, there's the problem, namely, that never seems to work.
Everywhere you look in history somebody-or-another is trying to intimidate their foe sufficiently to subdue them. And it never works. Eventually the foe finds some sneaky way to strike back.
If it COULD work, wouldn't our posession of 10,000 deadly Hbombs be enough to discourage our foes?
Every once in awhile some guy says "it's enough that they fear our wrath too much to attack US" and then runs away as if he had said something TRUE, which it is not. There is simply no way to sufficiently frighten everyone to discourage them all from counter-attacking.
It's against human nature.
You can successfully oppress foes, for awhile, though not very long, but you can't seem to ever intimidate them forever.
It's just a dream, a fantasy.
136 - bliffle
Al says some things that are indecipherable: "No, there's not a contradiction between not wanting screwed with versus not particularly being obsessed with whether someone likes US."
Huh? This seems like just a set of conflicting desires, not an argument.
"I would intend not to give people legitimate reason to dislike US - though we probably have a little bit sometimes stepped in it."
Well, there you go again.
137 - Al Barger
I'm calling bullshit on the assistant comment editor. Dear Mr Hall Monitor, what's your particular problem? I wasn't attacking anybody. I just wanted to know if El Bicho was having as good a time as me.
And when did quoting "Gett Off" become a personal attack? I only called you out here to say I can.
I'm just saying that SOMEONE here isn't getting nearly enough fiber in their diet. Maybe some of these Muslims and FedEx drivers and BC hall monitors just need a REALLY BIG bowl of All Bran.
138 - Al Barger
OK Bliffle you sorta halfway actually tried to ask a question, but I don't see how they are necessarily conflicting desires. The important thing is that for whatever reasons, people either don't want to or don't dare to violently attack US.
I would generally say that it's best to try to use as much sweet talk and carrots as possible to get to that end, cause you catch more flies with honey than with vinegar. And it's just nice to be nice.
However, there are still some flies, and some big nasty wasps with stingers that won't be stopped with honey or Obama's honey tongue. You just got to get something and go hunt them down and kill them before they f you up.
Nor do I see the second one as any kind of conundrum or contradiction. We aim to have good intentions and try to help others as we also watch out for our own interests. But sometimes we're reckless arrogant dicks, per Team America.
If I were living in Nazi Germany, then I'd be living under a government that was doing great wickedness in the world. I'd like to hope that I'd have sense enough to oppose it, if only in my mind.
But the US are the good guys in the world, or 99% so. For all have sinned and fell short of the glory of God. So I'm inclined to give US the benefit of the doubt, but I'm not seeing that much really big for which the US needs to apologize to the world for anytime lately in the first place.
So in short I think the US is largely mostly trying to do good in the world, but that we screw it up a little sometimes. We miscalculate. But also because we swing such a big cigar in the world, our little missteps can be devastating to a far off individual or small community.
So that's one understandable reason why a certain amount of legitimate friction is going to come, even when we're trying to do right. So it's OK for folks to be mad at us if they feel they must - and we maybe sometimes deserve a little bit of it. It's all good, just so long as people know that no matter how mad they get at US, they'd best not come after US with violent intent.
139 - Dr Dreadful
I wasn't attacking anybody. I just wanted to know if El Bicho was having as good a time as me.
Sure you were, Al.
What is 'Gett Off' when it's at home?
140 - Glenn Contrarian
Al -
Are we really the good guys in the world when we attack a country on false pretenses, and now - six years later - a million or so Iraqi men, women, and children have been killed in violence that we enabled, ethnic cleansing of Sunnis occurred - again enabled by us - and up to two million Iraqi refugees are still living in Syria and Jordan...most of whom are Sunni, 'ethnically cleansed' from Iraq and unable to go home?
What we did in Iraq was not a good thing. If we had never invaded Iraq, we'd still have the moral high ground in the world. But we did invade...and our national honor now has a stain that will take decades to remove.
141 - Dave Nalle
If we had never invaded Iraq, we'd still have the moral high ground in the world.
I find this idea to be simplistic and implausible. Most of those who hate us for invading Iraq would hate us anyway for supporting Israel. Is it necessarily a mistake to further offend people who already hate us?
Dave
142 - Cannonshop
#140
I call bullshit on this. Most of the "Outpouring of Sympathy" after 9/11 was more in the vein of "Hey, it wasn't us, don't hurt me!" than real concern-hell, the Arab Street was DANCING with joy at the news.
There was/is no "moral High Ground" to lose-other than putting to bed the continuing "Sanctions" that enabled the "Oil-for-food" scam used by Bhoutros-Bhoutros to enrich himself and his family while starving the Iraqi people out, and ending the continuous Naval Blockade of Iraqi waters.
Oh, and ending the regime of a genocidal thug-one that WE put in power decades earlier, and in our "Sensitivity" to the "arab street" we didn't kill the first time we invaded.
"Moral High Ground" is for people who've already LOST, it's the loser saying "But I did my best".
143 - Christopher Rose
Al Barger makes many ludicrous and laugh out loud dumb remarks but this has to be the funniest ever:- "I've occassionally been propositioned or asked out by gay guys, and generally find it complimentary. No, but thanks for asking. It's nice to know that SOMEONE is wanting to have sex with me." I want details because I find that hard to believe.
144 - pablo
RE 143
Great comment by Barger, laughing my ass off at the moment cuz of it. If only lovely (ugly) Ann Coulter would make a pass at ya eh Al? hehehehehe
145 - Cindy D
Al,
Okay, I have been thinking. Maybe there is no point to being mean. Maybe though it might serve as a launching point for better understanding.
You and I are at odds. Partly because we base our views on different information, as evidenced by this comment:
But the US are the good guys in the world, or 99% so.
Al, I would like to say that that is not how the rest of the world sees the US. The rest of the world has better information and experience.
Here is a video. It's an old one so the millions of people the US killed are far greater now. Not evil commies--but peasants. US has been killing people for years. Maybe 20 million now? Maybe more. I hope you will watch that. That is former CIA agent John Stockwell.
Now here is a peace offering. It's my favorite new artist (well, new to me). I think you might like her.
146 - Roger Nowosielski
Al Barger:
I really think #132 (and anything in that category)should never have appeared or at least be highly edited. Perhaps it doesn't offend in the manner that would meet BC standards, but that kind of tirade doesn't serve any purpose at all.
I wonder how many friends you have made, Al, with your obnoxious rantings? If I were Nally or some of the more sensible members of the conservative/republican movement, I'd truly be ashamed knowing that there are still people out there like you; and I certainly wouldn't associate with them. You have easily outdone Rush, and that ain't easy to do. Perhaps you can still find a few kindred soul on this website with whom you might have a "meaningful" exchange - perhaps I could even name one or two, but I shan't - but rest assured: that number is dwindling.
To tell the truth, Al, I have a far greater respect for H&C. At least he comes out with his bigoted statements, we all know it, and offers no apologies. That's more honest and sincere than what you have done. The mentioned comment is the most sorry and pathetic mixture of phony apologies, assertion of self-righteousness and feeble efforts at self-justification. You would do yourself a great favor to read it to yourself once in a while - when you're not agitated by other people's views - and take a closer look at the kind of person you're representing yourself to be. I sincerely hope that there will be some change in you, however minimal, for your sake.
As for myself, I have tried to keep the conversation open to the extent possible - agreeing with you on some points in so far they were agreeable - trying all along to advance the dialogue in an attempt to reach you and perhaps make you reflect. I realize my time has been all wasted. So don't bother to reply; and if you do, I will not be responding.
Not for a long while, Al - until I see some positive change in your thinking and mode of expression.
Good luck, buddy, and stay well,
Roger
147 - Al Barger
Nobody likes me. Everybody hates me. I think I'm gonna eat a worm.
Roger, really. I SO sincerely apologize for offending your tender sensibilities. NOT. I am not being hateful. I have no ill will in my heart - but neither do I have respect for such as your totally unfounded moral tut-tutting here. I'm just not going to concede to your PC nonsense.
Again, I note that I'm being called out for being supposedly a hater, but pretty much all the hatin' here is being directed AT me.
And the editor monkey is cool with everybody calling me really mean names, racist, homophobe, "fuckin' asshole." Hey, that's cool with me, if you all feel the need. But I get censored as a dreaded and forbidden "personal attack" for, I suppose, sideways suggesting that the person cussing me out needed to get laid.
Why, I'm so awful that you suggest that no decent conservative even would want to be associated with my awful wickedness. I'm SUCH an outlaw! I should be shunned by decent society.
I mean, maybe YOU need to read yourself and see how you sound. "I hope there's some change in you, however minimal, for your sake." Bullshit right there with that fake concern and that whole passive intimidation thing. Gee, I hope you change so that you can become acceptable to us liberals at the BC. Called not gonna happen.
That would go beyond suffering fools gladly to actively appeasing them. Y'all's foolishness here is only gonna tend to run me the other way, ain't it?
But you're putting me in the time out corner so I can think about what I've done. "Not for a long while" will you give me the favor of your association. Well, now, isn't that special? I'm sorry Daddy. Can you forgive me my wickedness? Oh please, don't leave me here!
Miss Cindy- You was getting a little rough with me there yesterday, but I forgive you. I've seen you a couple of times where you get a little carried away, but then you catch yourself like above and come back making nice. It's alright. Just a couple of comments on a blog - nobody hurt. XOX
The Lisa Hannigan song was nice - but I was most impressed with the video props. Lordy, how much effort did someone put into creating those pop-up books? Those are AWESOME.
And here's a particularly tasty little sumpin for you.
148 - Cindy D
Al,
Your link is bad. But, I am sure I figured out what you were posting.
That is cool Al, and here is something Sly Stone might say in reply.
:-)
149 - Dave Nalle
And the editor monkey is cool with everybody calling me really mean names,
Al, this "editor monkey" sympathizes, but since I get the same done to me day in and day out, including having my response to an insuilting comment edited while the original insulter gets a pass, my only advice to you is to "suck it up" as they say.
Getting abuse piled on you for telling the truth is part of our lot in life. If they weren't abusing us it would be a sign we were doing something wrong.
Dave
150 - Al Barger
Miss Cindy- Apologies for the dead link. They have apparently removed the file from their site, doggone them Floozies. That old YouTube performance is nice, but it ain't nothing like half the full effect. For one thing, they've added a singer, Miss Nancy of the lungs who turns that thing OUT. Drop me a note and I'll send you the proper version to fully blow your mind. Meantime, try a little more of them HERE.
And "Everyday People" is always in season, ain't it?
151 - Roger Nowosielski
Dave,
I may have disagreed with you plenty of times on this or that issue, but I don't believe I ever called you names or was disparaging in any way. If I ever was, please point it out. So I would hope you'd keep things in perspective and not paint everyone with the same brush.
But then again, Dave, I don't believe you have ever resorted to the kind of tirade in question. And if you ever do, I'd loose all respect for you.
There's just no sense calling people names and worst, and it's true for everyone, regardless of where they stand. Moral outrage is one thing, the rules of polite conversation another. We both know it.
Roger
152 - Cindy D
Yep Al. Sly Stone wrote your Floozie song though. It was sorta serendipitous. :-)
153 - Al Barger
Thanks Dave. But I'm afraid I'm not going to respond to you any more until you go away and re-think your evil hateful rightwing ways. Maybe I'll let you out of the time-out corner when you re-think your opposition to everything that is good and right, as of course embodied by President Obama, The One.
Now can we stop this needless bickering and get back to healing the planet?
154 - bliffle
There you go again, Al, with the non sequitur.
"The important thing is that for whatever reasons, people either don't want to or don't dare to violently attack US. "
Hey, maybe we should EXAMINE those reasons and apply what we learn. There are plenty of people who don't want to attack us: the French, Canadians, Hungarians,...etc., all kinds of people. Don't you think maybe we should look at why and apply that knowledge?
Did we intimidate the French, Canadians, Hungarians, etc., into not attacking us because of our 10,000 nukes?
Or is "whatever" sufficient for you to throw away that lesson?
155 - Dave Nalle
Roger, roger. You've got some sort of guilt complex going there. I was certainly not referring to you in #149.
Al, I'm sitting in the lotus position singing kumbaya quietly.
Dave
156 - Roger Nowosielski
Of course I know that, Dave. Just want you to be fair, as I'm sure you will be.
157 - Cindy D
Which One Al? The One who is responsible for this? or this?
(uh oh...wonders if there is room in the time out corner prolly gonna hafta get my own separate time out corner.)
158 - handyguy
My dad, who has lived in the South all his life and is no liberal, occasionally comes up with some spontaneous homespun wisdom.
"The thing about hard-line conservatives," he said to me once, "is that they're so obnoxious and smart-alecky, and they think they're real funny."
Plenty of obnoxious lefties too, of course. But there are several posters on here, and a number of nationally recognized conservative voices, who wear their obnoxiousness as a badge of honor.
I admit that I often respond in kind on here when someone's remarks irk me. But turning down the obnox-o-meter, on both sides, would just possibly allow us to actually discuss an issue, rather than beating it to death.
159 - Roger Nowosielski
But Handy,
Why respond to obnoxiousness at all? Just think! Perhaps they're doing it to shock you.
160 - Dave Nalle
I find Al's obnoxiousness entertaining. I don't always agree with him on everything, but having him out there allows me to be or at least to seem more reasonable. That's an important function.
Those who are objecting to him here are really objecting mostly to his style rather than his substance, and that's as much a flaw in the reader as the writer. It's kind of the flipside of those who give kudos to Pablo because he expresses himself in a seemingly collegial way, not realizing that underneath that he's as unpalatable in reality as Al appears to be on the surface.
Dave
161 - Roger Nowosielski
Allow me to part company with you on this one, Dave. And no, I don't need the foil of ridiculousness so as to offset my soundness. And neither should you. I have greater faith in you, Dave, and know you can do better.
I have no idea, of course, what he's like in person. But if he's anywhere near to the way he sounds or presents himself to be, I'd never him home for dinner. Of course, you may be more liberal than I in your choice of friends and house guest. It's a personal decision and I cannot blame you.
And I'm far from being prissy or endowed with delicate sensibilities as he tried to imply - don't believe in political correctness or any of that bullshit. If you think I'm being argumentative judging by what you see on these threads, I've got news for you: I'm a holy terror in person, and I don't take prisoners. But there are limits to acceptable behavior - whether in person or online. And that tirade of his - that's where I draw the line. It's beyond being funny or entertaining.
So there's at least one respect in which I happen to be more conservative than you. It's a start anyway.
Roger
162 - Cindy D
I wonder how much coverage this will get on tv. This will happen today:
Pelosi, Feinstein Homes Targeted Sunday for 'Occupations'
SAN FRANCISCO - Peace activists with CodePINK unveiled plans to occupy the homes of Speaker of the House Nancy Pelosi and Sen. Dianne Feinstein Sunday because the Obama Administration is moving forward with expanding the war in Afghanistan.
And in other news: 600,000 people lost their jobs in January.
163 - Al Barger
Miss Cindy, I will give President Obama credit for the missle attacks in Pakistan. That's at least one serious thing he's doing to defend the country. And he certainly famously promised this in a primary debate against Hillary.
To Dave and Roger, I don't think that I'm particularly obnoxious. I'm a hell of a nice guy. If I had any friends, you could ask them.
To me, Roger among others is quite offensive in his sanctimonious pronunciations, though I try to patiently restrain my natural urge to mock them - but I'm no saint. I completely refuse to even sort of kinda halfway sanction or mollify their PC nonsense. My crime for which I must be banished from polite society is not hate - that's all coming from the other side here. Rather, my real crime is rejection of the moral authority of their petty little speech codes and other such pinko claptrap.
Roger needs to learn to be more tolerant of diverse opinions and to accept people like me who are different from him. Now, I don't want to take anyone's inventory, but he obviously has some resentment over issues that aren't really about mean ol' Al. Perhaps he needs diversity training at Mimi's Holiday Camp.
Being a man of peace though, I'll ask WWOD? So then, following His example from the inaugaral, I'll extend to you the hand of friendship, if you'll just unclench your fist. You can't ask a nigga to do more than that for you.
164 - Cindy D
Killing innocent people. That is pretty serious.
165 - Dave Nalle
Of course, you may be more liberal than I
Quoted for truth.
Dave
166 - Al Barger
Cindy- We're not trying to kill innocent people. Indeed we generally go to great lengths to avoid killing innocent people. But Taliban and Al Qaeda types HAVE to be taken out, and there's no possible way to do such without the possibility of some innocents getting hurt. That's a damned shame - but it's on their heads. Also though, I question how many of the dead are really that innocent - but there likely are going to be some truly innocent people hurt.
To use another example, there's been a great deal of wailing and gnashing of teeth over the Israelis bombing schools and mosques in Gaza recently. But Hamas had stashes of weapons and were firing from schools and mosques with children and congregants around them.
Would you want to argue that the Israelis have a moral obligation to let Hamas keep attacking? Any children who get killed like that, their blood is on the hands of Hamas - and their parents for putting them in that situation. What are they doing loaning out their own children to be used as human shields or sacrificed for mere anti-Israeli propaganda pictures?
167 - Mongo
Well we won't miss our old VP that much will we?
168 - Mongo
But we have to see how well our new VP does also.