From The Daily Telegraph:
YouGov sought to gauge the character of the Muslim community's response to the events of July 7. As the figures in the chart show, 88 per cent of British Muslims clearly have no intention of trying to justify the bus and Tube murders.
However, six per cent insist that the bombings were, on the contrary, fully justified.
Six per cent may seem a small proportion but in absolute numbers it amounts to about 100,000 individuals who, if not prepared to carry out terrorist acts, are ready to support those who do.
Moreover, the proportion of YouGov's respondents who, while not condoning the London attacks, have some sympathy with the feelings and motives of those who carried them out is considerably larger - 24 per cent.
A substantial majority, 56 per cent, say that, whether or not they sympathise with the bombers, they can at least understand why some people might want to behave in this way.
YouGov also asked whether or not its Muslim respondents agreed or disagreed with Tony Blair's description of the ideas and ideology of the London bombers as "perverted and poisonous."
Again, while a large majority, 58 per cent, agree with him, a substantial minority, 26 per cent, are reluctant to be so dismissive.
The responses indicate that Muslim men are more likely than Muslim women to be alienated from the mainstream and that the young are more likely to be similarly alienated than the old.
However, there are few signs in YouGov's findings that Muslims of Pakistani and Bangladeshi origin are any more disaffected than their co-religionists from elsewhere.
The sheer scale of Muslim alienation from British society that the survey reveals is remarkable. Although a large majority of British Muslims are more than content to make their home in this country, a significant minority are not.
For example, YouGov asked respondents how loyal they feel towards Britain. As the figures in the chart show, the great majority say they feel "very loyal" (46 per cent) or "fairly loyal" (33 per cent) but nearly one British Muslim in five, 18 per cent, feels little loyalty towards this country or none at all.
If these findings are accurate, and they probably are, well over 100,000 British Muslims feel no loyalty whatsoever towards this country.
The proportion of men who say they feel no loyalty to Britain is more than three times the proportion of women saying the same.
.jpg?t=20120527181101)
Article comments
1 - Jones Violet
The Trouble with Islam is an amazing, brilliant book.
2 - WTF
It appears from your statements, that Britain, may be made up of something which we see in Canada...
Whereas the U.S. calls itself a "melting pot" and criticizes the "balkanization" of certain areas within her borders. Canada, and now Britain seem to have fostered a mosaic, or in fact a "Balkanization" I see this as problematic in maintaining order across the lines of separation within the borders.
I also predict a country is fraught with difficulties when demographics protect the criminal based on kinship or ethnic bond. That transcends civility, and sets precedence towards lawlessness in society.
Could we be witnessing the beginning of the end of civilization? I suggest a study of Webster’s and other sources. Perhaps a review of Edward Gibbons work regarding the decline and fall of Rome. Perhaps Rome, as a system, deserved to fall. But when one puts the human factor into the equation, it's not as pretty. Suffering will come before and after a fall of such magnitude, and those responsible, will wander in from fringe to loot and carry off the vestiges of civilization.
Are these types of event cyclic? War cycles, peace cycles? Perhaps
3 - dietdoc
WTF writes: "cliclic? War cycles, peace cycles? Perhaps."
Reply: If that is, indeed, the case, I certainly percieve a quickening of the cycle. World War I and II, Korea, Viet Nam, and the conflicts of the 21st century....the intervals between peace - if not the carnage involved - is clearly becoming shorter.
I saw some historian quoted recently that, if one graphs the number of dead from war per year, the figures were exponetially increasing every year for the past few centuries until the atomic bombs on Japan. Since then, the number dying in war has remained relatively stable. [Before your ask, I don't have a reference] If that is true, it seems that the number dead may be stable, but the number of wars (conflicts) is, in my mind, certainly increasing.
What does it all mean? I will leave that to deeper minds than mine.
ROn
4 - Nancy
If they dislike western culture so much, then why did they move there? Did the survey address that question as well? Does it not occur to them that if the culture changes, so will the economics, and they'll end up right back in the same old middle eastern pisshole they came from, just colder & damper?
I suspect (& I sincerely hope I don't live to see it myself) that what this is going to entail is all-out culture wars, w/muslims vs everybody else eventually declaring total genocide on the other. Most non-muslims are not willing to convert, and being unable to tell 'good' muslims from 'bad' will end up just saying the hell w/it & wiping out all muslims; the muslims will do the same, in the name of religion & self defence, unless the imams who preach this stuff can be ruthlessly suppressed. I think in this case, 'human rights' is going to have to give where tolerance of radical islam is concerned, unless everyone wants to face armageddon.
Which brings me to MY basic premise: organized religion of any kind sucks & ought to be banned & destroyed.
5 - WTF
China, is also looming on the horizen with a definate agenda towards world domination.
For a quick read (not too detailed but perhaps a good primer) check out Flyboy's. Japan went through a period of it's own manifest destiny and couldn't understand why the West protested their expansion.
The Japanese described it as being invited to sit at a table with the adults, who were busily stuffing themselves with all the food.
China, may be limbering up for some world scale leveraging on many fronts. Wasn't there a book out concerning China and the stealth war they are beginning to wage?
I'll have to research that. It may provide a good read.
U.S. -- as traditionally known, will probably cease to exist, as we know it. Unless there is a decisive turn around in western thought.
There are other entities in the world who just don't want to get along... they want to run the place.
Human nature? Probably. I have to agree with Nancy. I don't want to be around to see it.
6 - andy marsh
that's the "religion of peace" for you!
Nice post RJ!
7 - reality check
To Nancy:
I don't think the situation will decend into an all out religious war. The situation is serious and a lot must be going on behind the scenes, I am sure many governments are finding ways of curbing the growth of their muslim minority. If the muslim population grows to 10% then we will see the growth of no go areas, more attacks on
jews and more rapes. In the long run next 100-200 years I expect Islam to reform it self from within, perhaps the process has allready started. However, this "self cleansing" within the islamic world will inevitably have a violent phase, we should avoid contact with it for our own safety. They can only reform themselves, they are no different to any other civillisation that has had to restructure from time to time. The west has done this many times, India and China are also in the process of reform, muslims are no different.
I favour a quiet policy of peacefully restricting the growth of the muslim population. If the politican fail to
see reality then the muslim population
will most likely be restricted by fascists and "social boycotts" of muslim businesses. The situation could
become very ugly if it not handle carefully.
8 - reality check
Dear Nancy you wrote:
"Which brings me to MY basic premise: organized religion of any kind sucks & ought to be banned & destroyed."
This is what Pol Pot and Mao thought and look what they did. To be so anti-religion is in some ways a religion too. Personally speaking: what I find ridiculous about religion is that it tries to give the answer to life the universe and everything within a book.
This is ridiculous, eastern religions often state this as they advise things are not learn by memoring "scriptures" but only by personal experience.
When people believe religious text literally then this can "open the door to the devil", but such people have to
learn for themselves, and unfortunately the Koran can have a very violent literal interpretation.
9 - a
why does everyone see muslims and islam as the enemy?muslims are not anti-social they are not backward thinkers they are not terrorits and all the rest of the things people nowadays accuse them with. timothy mcvai was a terrorist but that doesnt mean that white people and christians should be fought, eliminated and blamed for every act that a christian committs. There will always be murderers from the begining of time till judgement day and i think that God put us on this earth to bring life and find harmony and similarities with one another. we werent created all the same and from the same background and ideaologies. some irresponsibility and disrespect by some people does not mean we should wipe them out from their identities and their religion. I think we should try even more than ever to open dialogues with them (since we are very good at those!) and teach them to do the same in addressing their issues (especially while they living here) and not make them always feel like they are targeted and vulnerable whether here in western countries or in their original homes. and we should always remember that teh west is somewhat responsible for the dictatorships and tyrants ruling some muslim regions and so we shouldnt blame them (muslims) when they act out of vulnarebility or hatred in retaliation. we should respect their backgrounds, respect their cultural thoughts (which are actually very enriching and interesting) and try as much as possible to address issues or problem areas with them in our homeland and what we see as appropriate or unacceptable, what is tolerable or intolerable. that way, we will be functioning and fulifilling our human duties towards one another. the world and our time is not perfect, but if we dont know how to go about resolving our issues, then and only then will we see a clash of civilizations. theres no use in wasting our feelings in hatred or anger or resentemnet. issues must be addressed, problems must be solved and I think this is tehway to do it.I believe in taking a different approach to solving todays problems that way, we will actually make positive change for long years to come.