Those who favor unrealistic border security schemes are either ignorant of the facts or pursuing an agenda other than solving the immigration problem.
The fun thing about the immigration debate is that it never goes away. I started writing on the topic a year ago, firmly convinced that it was a vital issue to address because we might have a new immigration policy at any moment. Now I realize that I can keep writing on it forever, because the anti-immigration ideologues will never come to their senses. So we'll never get any kind of immigration policy passed, and bloggers and pundits can feel free to enjoy the topic forever.…
Article comments
— go to most recent comments126 - Dave Nalle
No, Richard. The question is whether the USA was EVER a 'white american homeland', and the answer is obviously that it never was. From the very beginning of the nation our population has been diverse with an ongoing trend against laws based on racial prejudice. By supporting separatism and racism you deny the trend towards inclusion and freedom which makes America great and embrace all of the worst and most self-serving beliefs which have been repeatedly discredited over the last 230 years.
Dave
127 - Victor Plenty
Is anybody surprised to learn this about dear old Dick Brodie? This is the same dude who thinks women would be much better off if they didn't have to bother their pretty little heads with the ickyness of voting.
128 - Richard Brodie
So if your daughter married a Mexican and had his children, how would you respond?
One of my daughters did marry an extremely handsome Mexican man, and did have a very beautiful daughter by him. He is predominately European (Spanish) from the Mexico City area. And although she divorced him when he tried to cheat on her with her best friend, I am still on good terms with him, and he still refers to me as "dad."
I am not a hate-filled hating hater of people belonging to races other than my own. I believe that God created all the races, and that all the different varieties of the human species are at least equally as worthy of being protected as are different varieties of birds, fishes, etc.
When the time comes for an inevitable geographical separation along natural racial lines, I suspect that my granddaughter will probably feel most comfortable in the racially blended territory that will emerge between Aztlan to the south and New America to the north, that is in the area stretching from what is now known as Northern California to Northern Colorado.
129 - Andy Marsh
I was told by the CG that a cuban that gets a foot on American soil is given $9300. I can't find it anywhere to confirm if it's true, but I now know why they keep trying and trying. The CG folks I work with tell me when they catch these folks on their rafts or inner tubes they like to say..."see you in two weeks!" These guys tell me that they've caught the same people 2 and 3 times trying to float the 90 miles to Key West.
130 - Margaret Romao Toigo
Great article, Dave.
I have especially enjoyed reading your passionate, yet pragmatic, responses to your critics, some of whom do not appear to understand the economics of this issue, and others who seem to be deliberately ignoring any and all facts that refute the anachronistic disinformation they apparently believe rationalizes their bigotry.
"Tree hugger" or "troglodyte," if you're standing in opposition to ignorance and hate, you’re fighting the good fight.
131 - Andy Marsh
Dave - I know I'm late getting in on this, but do you rally believe those 30 guys waiting at the Circle-K in the morning for the contractors to come pick them up for work are paying taxes on the $10 an hour they're making?
You can't be that gullible...
I lived in AZ for 4 years...I moved into a relatively new community in the west valley of Phoenix...before that development and one or two others went up, the area was nothing but farmland and in the school system my kids were the minority...it was one of the poorest school districts in all of AZ and that's bad, because at the time, AZ was way down on the list of the amount of money spent per child...that's why I don't live there anymore.
132 - Margaret Romao Toigo
Mr. Brodie has apparently not yet heard that the notion of "race" is nothing more than a political construct in the modern world.
"Miscengenistic genocide" against the "white race" is not possible because there is no "white race," except to racists -- oops! Sorry about that, "racialists." That is the "politically correct" term you people prefer, right?
Then, again, I have to wonder if Mr. Brodie might just be pulling our chains with contrived affectations, such as:
133 - Lawrence
Margaret, there is plenty of bigotry to go around pertaining to this subject, but also plenty of arrogant, willful ignorance as is evident in your post. You insinuate that anyone who criticizes Dave's article and refutes his facts is a bigot. This proves to me that you are dishonest and have made up your mind about this issue. There are other facts such as those posted in #49 that are worthy of consideration as well. I tend to believe those, since my experience living in a city overrun with illegal aliens substantiates them. In fact, most everywhere I go seems to bear witness to the reality that America has been invaded by illegal aliens. I can only guess that you are living in some sort of liberal La La land, and choose to believe a lie when every poll has shown that a large majority of Americans rank border security and illegal immigration as major problems. Or I suppose the majority of Americans are bigots, or members of a vast right-wing conspiracy.
134 - Richard Brodie
From the very beginning of the nation our population has been diverse with an ongoing trend against laws based on racial prejudice. By supporting separatism and racism you deny the trend towards inclusion and freedom which makes America great
First, Dave, America is no longer a "nation", i.e. a group of people related by birth (race) - you know, "nativity", "nation", same root - as it was for a long time when the white race built it into a fabulous country.
And secondly, it is no longer great. Now it has become a corrupt consumerist welfare state on the verge of catastrophic financial and political collapse - the inescapable dead end of "inclusional" multiculturalism. And the sooner this old, rotten order is swept away to make room for a fresh beginning, the better.
135 - JustOneMan
Dave #81
First you are definetly not self employed..$900 is cheap for insurance..so dont tell me to shop around...
Second..NJ is a cease pool of illegals..why are you only counting Mexicans as illegal aliens?
You sound a little racist to me...in NJ we have illegals from all over the world...
136 - Clavos
Lawrence,
The "facts" posted in #49 were refuted by Dave Nalle in # 56. Try again.
I live in a city where 51% of the population was born in another country, and more than 65% of the population is of Latin American descent. The countries of birth range from Mexico to Russia (we have the largest group of Russians outside of New York). Some are undoubtedly illegals, but the majority are legal and hard-working, productive citizens.
Our crime rates, according to the FBI, are significantly lower than the national average and our unemployment rate, according to the BLS, is well below the rest of the nation. We have an unprecedented economic boom going on, and many of the local businesses, large and small, are owned and operated by Latinos. Our local government is almost 100% Latino, and our services, such as fire and police are heavily Latino.
Our city works, and works well.
137 - Victor Plenty
Richard, you poor dupe. White people didn't build America. Moon People built America, inspired by the silvery radiance of the Moon Throne.
The Moon Queen sent her Moon Missionaries from the Moon Monasteries, where they had mastered the magnificant arts of Moon Magic, inspired by the silvery radiance of the Moon Throne.
In America the Moon Monks built their Moon Missions, and taught everyone the mysteries of their Moon Magic, and made this a great country, inspired by the silvery radiance of the Moon Throne.
As should we all. As should we all.
(Sorry, folks, but honestly, how else can one be expected to talk to somebody as batty as Herr Brodie?)
138 - Clavos
Andy #129,
Whomever in the CG told you that Cubans get $9300 on arrival in the US was pulling your leg. You haven't been able to confirm it because it's not true.
The Cubans keep coming because Fidel Castro, aside from being a despot, is an inept leader. Over the past 47 years he has managed to destroy what was once a vibrant, beautiful island, that, by Caribbean standards was wealthy, to the Cuba of today, which is impoverished, backward, and tyrannical.
The Cubans come for those reasons and for one bad one, IMO: US immigration policy vis-a-vis the Cubans provides that, if they manage to actually set foot on US soil, regardless of how they got here, they're allowed to stay legally.
They are the only foreign nationals to whom we extend that opportunity, and I believe it's a mistake, not because it encourages Cubans to come here, but because it encourages them to endanger themselves, and because it is an inequitable policy, which is resented (rightfully) by other immigrant groups. It was originally instituted in the days when most Cubans were fleeing the island for political reasons, and were seeking asylum. In recent years the demographics have changed and most today are coming for economic reasons, much like the Mexicans.
139 - Michael J. West
Richard, America was never a "nation" in the sense to which you are referring. First of all, there were no homo sapiens indigenous to the Americas, meaning that the ancestors of every human being who ever lived here came from somewhere else.
Second of all, the closest we come to having native Americans are--well, the Native Americans. Who were actually of many nations, i.e. tribes. And who were not, in any case, white.
Third, are you sure it was the white race that built it into a fabulous country? I mean, the white race alone? Seems to me that their black slaves did an awful lot of the actual building. Seems to me that blacks have every bit as much claim as whites do for building America, past or present.
140 - Margaret Romao Toigo
Lawrence, I made no such assertion -- or even the insinuation -- that "anyone who criticizes Dave's article and refutes his facts is a bigot."
And nobody will be able to use my words, in context, to demonstrate that I did, either. (Not to mention that Dave's facts have yet to be credibly refuted.)
I considered the assertions that were made in #49, but felt that they were effectively refuted, by Dave, in #56, as well as by various others in several other subsequent comments.
I seek the truth, not propaganda that conforms to my personal experiences or some popular worldview, which is why I have been lurking on this particular thread for several days, reading and verifying information, and analyzing the nuances of the diversity of opinions posted therein.
I do not care about polls or popular opinion as I am not a politician. I am non-partisan and I do not subscribe to conspiracy theories.
I do not believe that a majority of Americans are bigots, but rather that they do not fully understand the economics of this issue due to the large amount of disinformation that is spread by politicians who hope to appeal to the people's fears of higher taxes, unemployment, crime, and terrorism.
Meanwhile, the bigots -- who are most decidedly a minority in this enlightened day and age, no matter how loud they may be -- use the same disinformation to rationalize their hatred.
And the beat goes on...
141 - Richard Brodie
Mr. Brodie has apparently not yet heard that the notion of "race" is nothing more than a political construct in the modern world.
Do us a big favor. Tell all the endangered species freakazoids that the different varieties (i.e. races) of animal species they are so zealous about preserving, are nothing more than "political constructs in the modern world." Think of all those lagoons and other habitats that could be transformed and put to productive commercial use if the same standard you variety-deniers apply to the human species would be consistently applied to other members of the Animal Kingdom!
142 - Michael J. West
God, how I long for the relative sanity of Arch Conservative.
143 - JustOneMan
Earth to Brodie...Earth to Brodie...Come in Brodie...
"hate-filled hating hater" lol lol that is a great line... i think you stole the idea...
"The smelly smell that smells... smelly. "
- Mr. Krabs Sponge Bob Square Pants
144 - Clavos
Brodie,
Your error is in thinking that a "race" of humans is the same as a "species" of animal. ALL humans, regardless of race, are the same species, Homo Sapiens.
As to the notion of race, following is a quote from Wikipedia on the subject:
"Since the 1940s, evolutionary scientists have rejected the view of race according to which a number of finite lists of essential characteristics could be used to determine a like number of races. Many evolutionary and social scientists think common race definitions, or any race definitions pertaining to humans, lack taxonomic rigour and validity. They argue that race definitions are imprecise, arbitrary, derived from custom, and that the races observed vary according to the culture examined. They further maintain that "race" as such is best understood as a social construct, and conceptualize and analyze human genotypic and phenotypic variation in terms of populations and clines instead. .Other scientists, however, have argued that this position is motivated more by political than scientific reasons." (emphasis mine)
145 - Martin Lav
Getting back on topic and away from racists views of some posters. The point is this, does the US need to adopt a sensible immigration policy, that includes: Guest Worker Permits (WE ALREADY HAVE THIS FOR MIGRANT WORKERS AND HAVE HAD THEM FOR A LONG TIME), Should we enforce our borders? Do we penalize employers? The question of what we do with the undocumented workers that are already here, is moot, can't do nothing with them. No one has the will to send them back. The facts cited in Dave's article are bogus. I live and work in SoCal and have for 25 years. The migration issue is huge here and the tide must be controlled. We are downgrading our value as workers, by bringing in lower waged unskilled workers. Mexicans are some of the hardest working people I know, but the will work for less and YES DAVE they will live in a apt. with multiple families (just drive through these neighborhoods here....LOOKS real nice!--ghetto's) and yes they drive an old beat-up pick up truck that spews oil and gas and smoke all over the road ( aren't you an environmental wacko too?). This problem is huge and we don't need to import cheap labor. Put our kids to work. I used to pick berries in Washington State for Christ-sake.....never saw a migrant worker and this was only in 1975. Get a clue and if you are living in suburban Austin, Tx. in your lily white neighborhood, looking at the Mexican gardener who trims and mows your lawn cheaper than the Japanese Gardener you fired that cultivated, contoured and loved your garden, then you see what you pay for.
146 - Andy Marsh
Clavos - I've heard it from a few different sources...and I did say I had no proof it was true...I also agree that it's dead wrong to give one group that preferential treatment if they get one foot on American soil and turning others away if they get one foot on American soil, money or not.
I also know that "back in the day" it was pretty much American policy for any person from a communist country to be given "amnesty" for making it here.
I wasn't commenting on whether it's right or wrong...just that it's happening.
I'm going to keep researching this money thing...I've heard anything from $9300 to $10000...it came from somewhere...the rumor I mean...
147 - Lawrence
Martin, I agree with you. What you are saying, what I'm saying and many others as well is essentially that illegal immigration is way out of control, only going to continue to get worse unless drastic action is taken. Dave, Margaret, and Clavos will not be convinced. They don't care about what's best for this country. They say they have the facts. I read facts all the time in the newspaper that tell me they are wrong. I see the evidence everyday where I live and here the stories everyday where anyone else lives. But they are right and we are wrong. there's no use trying to reason with that.
148 - RedTard
"Meanwhile, the bigots -- who are most decidedly a minority in this enlightened day and age"
If we were truly enlightened and educated there would be far more racists and 'bigots'.
Equality is a fantasy created to prevent hurt feelings, emotion trumping logic. Unfortunately, saying something is so, no matter how vigorously, does not make it true.
149 - Clavos
Equality is a fantasy created to prevent hurt feelings, emotion trumping logic.
RedTard
July 19, 2006
"We hold these truths to be self-evident, that all men are created equal,"
-The Declaration of Independence
United States of America
July 4, 1776
150 - RedTard
Those same men later counted slaves as 3/5 human. I fully agree that every human should be treated equally under the law, actual equality is a completely different issue.
151 - Clavos
So if equality is, as you say, a fantasy, what in your fantasy makes one person superior to another?
152 - Michael J. West
If one person is not me, they are therefore inferior to me. Duh. :-D
153 - Clavos
Touché, MJW
154 - Richard Brodie
Clavos: So if equality is, as you say, a fantasy, what in your fantasy makes one person superior to another?
Your error is in thinking that inequality is a one-dimensional vertical continuum going from inferiority at the bottom to superiority at the top. So if I maintain that two races are not equal, your buttoned-down mentality constrains you to think I must be some kind of a supremacist who is implying that one race is "higher" than the other.
In actuality, there is a multi-dimensional field of many different human attributes, mental, physical, emotional, creative, intuitional, etc. One race may have the genetic endowment to excel in some ways, while another one excels in different areas.
But it is totally unscientific to delcare in advance, as a matter of political correctness, that there cannot possibly be any significant racial differences, and in the extreme case condemning any attempt at open-minded investigation of such questions.
Only a fool would claim that since chimpanzee DNA is only 2% different from human DNA, therefore there could not possibly be any significant differences in behavior patterns and intelligence between them. Caucasian and Negroid DNA differ by only 1% which means those who claim there could not possibly be any significant differences in behavior patterns and intelligence between those two races are approximately half as foolish as those who would make the same claim with regard to humans vs. chimpanzees.
155 - MCH
"Clavos - I've heard it from a few different sources...and I did say I had no proof it was true..."
And of course, Andy Marsh would never post an unsubstantiated commment...uh...except for the time he spread the rumor about the gossip that John Kerry wouldn't sign the SF-180 because "someone" suspected he was dishonorably discharged...
156 - Richard Brodie
Clavos Your error is in thinking that a "race" of humans is the same as a "species" of animal. ALL humans, regardless of race, are the same species, Homo Sapiens.
I didn't make that error at all. Homo Sapiens is one species in the Animal kingdom. We, like all other animal species exist in the form of various SUB-species. For non-human animals we use the taxonomic term "variety" for a sub-species, whereas for humans we instead use the term "race". I never said or even implied that "race" is equivalent to "species."
I was pointing out the inconsistency of the liberal positions which, on the one hand, value the preservation of different varieties of non-human animal life, while at the same time maintaining that preservation of varieties (races) of HUMAN animal life is not only NOT something to be valued, but that it is actually a desirable goal for such variety to be totally eliminated!
157 - Clavos
One race may have the genetic endowment to excel in some ways, while another one excels in different areas.
Specific examples?
Had you said "individual" instead of race, I would agree with you, but to say an entire race is somehow less (or more) able to excel at something than another, is racism, pure and simple.
158 - Richard Brodie
Clavos, you are so fuckin' brainwashed.
Specific examples?
IQ variations show whites 100, mongoloids 106, blacks 70 - in their natural, unmixed habitats. However blacks excel at endurance, as one would expect for an equatorial African population naturally selected for being able to outrun lions and other beasts of prey.
Had you said "individual" instead of race, I would agree with you, but to say an entire race is somehow less (or more) able to excel at something than another, is racism, pure and simple.
Of course there will be individual variation in every group. But there is no reason to expect that there would NOT be significant variation, GENERALLY, between races with differently evolved DNA - especially with respect to such a complicated organism as the brain. You can call it whatever you want, but "race" is equally as morally neutral a term as is "astronomy", and your pathetic attempt to stigmatize real, albeit non-politically correct racial realities by calling people who choose to recognize them "racists", is as childish as if the Catholic church had tried to stigmatize Copernicus by calling him an "astronomist pure and simple" for daring to contradict the politically correct Ptolomaic System.
159 - JR
Richard Brodie: IQ variations show whites 100, mongoloids 106...
So how come in the history of science and mathematics there are so many notable whites and so few notable mongoloids?
160 - Dave Getitstraight
I don't know where you got your fact?? But there pure crap.If you can read, read this:
161 - Nancy
..."Mongoloids"? Mongoloids? Are we sure we know what we're talking about, here?
162 - Richard Brodie
Mongoloid: a major human racial classification traditionally distinguished by physical characteristics such as yellowish-brown skin pigmentation, straight black hair, dark eyes with pronounced epicanthic folds, and prominent cheekbones.
So how come in the history of science and mathematics there are so many notable whites and so few notable mongoloids?
I believe it is because the element of creativity is not fully revealed on IQ tests which are limited to measuring mere knowledge and reasoning power. Higher, more elusive racial traits, such as artistic and scientific genius, the ability to originate and maintain a morally and economically advanced level of civilization, etc., can only be inferred from the kind of historical facts to which you allude.
163 - Clavos
Brodie, You are full of shit and phony, psuedo-scientific "facts." I notice that all the rest of the reasonable, intelligent commentors in this thread stopped replying to you long ago.
I'm tired of reading your racist garbage. Find somone else to spew your crap to.
164 - Margaret Romao Toigo
Mr. Brodie, you are indeed a curiosity. I think you have been engaged here because the views you express are so utterly quaint in this day and age.
Segregation was abolished, once and for all, in the 1960s. While integration has presented numerous challenges over the years, for various reasons, it has, overall, been a great success that has enriched our society and culture.
There's no going back, you know. Americans under the age of 40 grew up in an integrated society, it's all they know -- and it's all their children know, too.
Okay, back to immigration.
Lawrence, I believe that it is in this country's economic best interests to have a straightforward guest worker program and to adjust our immigration policies to reflect the economic realities of the natural laws of supply and demand.
I have taken note of the fact that, regardless of laws and policies, millions of workers come here because there are millions of jobs that need to be filled.
If those millions of jobs were filled by American citizens, workers from elsewhere would not be finding an abundance of work here and would therefore stay away.
But that is not the case here, and it has not been the case here for quite some time now because supply naturally meets demand. Attempts to reduce demand have proven futile time and time again, while attempts to control supply have proven disastrous -- like our current immigration policies.
Humanity has about as much control over supply and demand as it has over the weather, yet we still labor under the delusion that we can legislate nature into compliance with our wills.
This is all part of the principle of bringing the underground economy out of the shadows and into the light by regulating it to reflect above ground reality, instead of the wishes of those who want that reality to be different and have the audacity to believe that it is possible to change it with walls, minefields, and troops on the border.
165 - Richard Brodie
Segregation was abolished, once and for all, in the 1960s.
An attempt was made to abolish it by government fiat. But like all other government ZOGwash that goes against human nature, it remains a fiction that is only a reality in the minds of anti-racialist dupes, and is only implemented on a personal level by those with serious identity and self-esteem deficiencies. People with a healthy racial pride, whatever their race, will always self-segregate in accordance with the natural human desire to be with one's own kind.
166 - Clavos
ZOG = "Zionist Occupation Government". Careful, Margaret, this guy is a Jew-hater and a real nutcase.
167 - Richard Brodie
this guy is a Jew-hater
I do not hate all Jews. What I do hate is seeing thousands of American youth being killed for the pariah state known as Israel - and if we are pushed by the Israel Lobby (one arm of ZOG) into war with Syria and Iran, tens or even hundreds of thousands of American families will end up losing their children because of these bastards.
168 - Michael J. West
Imperial Wizard Brodie,
How can you simultaneously claim to be a champion of diversity, while claiming that people who surround themselves with a diverse group of friends have serious identity and self-esteem issues?
169 - Martin Lav
Ignore the racist bastard, please....once and for all. Brother.....
Guest worker program is and has been in place. Cesar Chavez helped to regulate it back in the 60's. Do we not have green cards in this country that allow companies to fill positions with people not citizens of this country? Ask any Canadian living and working here. By the way, most of them are legally here because they can't fly under the radar because they don't do menial labor work. If they lose their job through termination, they must find another here or they and their entire family must go back to Canada. Even if they own a home, go to school here, pay taxes etc....... Now since most of them don't live in apartment with 3 other families as our esteemed author claims, they can't just hide out, change their name, get a fake ID and go work at the car wash.
What are the millions of jobs that we need filled by guest workers I wonder? Bus-boys, Maids, Gardeners, Construction Workers ??? We don't need those jobs filled with outside workers we can fill them here if we pay them correctly. All we are doing is encouraging people to come here to depress wages. Making a go of it by perpetuating SLUM-LIKE conditions and driving around in polluted cars, is not a good policy for this country I don't think. And for those of you that continually state that this country was founded on the backs of immigrants, that's true and they were legal by the most part. Immigration is the cornerstone of this great country, but it's been controlled and the mass waves of Irish and Italians and Chinese that came here were all persecuted, but they wanted to become Americans, assimilate and contribute. And they were never more than 10% of our overall population. With the stats we have now and granting "amnesty" through some sort of BUSH led program of guest workers--basically crafted after Reagans same rhetoric back in 1987 will push the percentage of immmigrants well past any historical level.
170 - Victor Plenty
It's gratifying to see Brodie babble openly about ZOG. Yesterday I thought his worldview was only beneath contempt. Now I know that was giving him far too much credit.
Now the sources of his views on immigration are clear, and they can be dismissed out of hand without any need for further debate.
These people are a greater threat to American liberty than any Muslim extremist will ever be.
171 - Richard Brodie
How can you simultaneously claim to be a champion of diversity, while claiming that people who surround themselves with a diverse group of friends have serious identity and self-esteem issues?
I'm sorry I didn't make myself sufficiently clear. By "personal level" I was referring to the family, and specifically intermarriage. Without segregation at that level, there would ultimately be no diversity left for people like yourself to "surround yourself" with!
What I champion is not diversity within a country, but rather a worldwide community of nations with securely diverse races and cultures.
172 - zingzing
richard, you are truly fucked up. diversity does not mean color. enough white people will keep on fucking white people and enough black people will keep on fucking black people, and yellow yellow red red latin latin etc etc. intermarriage creates more diversity, not less. do you see us all becoming a shade of gray? ugh. you need to crawl under a rock, never speak to anyone who will listen to you and never, ever procreate with intentions of ever teaching those creations a damn thing about what you think.
kisses. (i'm in an interracial relationship, and i say it's fun. she has different colors in different spots they i do. and different things too.)
173 - Dave Nalle
I don't know where you got your fact?? But there pure crap.If you can read, read this: casapac.com
This page includes 'facts' which are so obviously untrue that they are clearly just fabricated. It actually says that illegal aliens earn 1/10th what their counterparts do in equivalent jobs. Do you really think that illegal aliens earn less than $1 an hour? You think they would come to America to earn less than they can earn in Mexico? That's just not credible and also shown to be untrue in numerous studies.
It's interesting, the same incorrect information about illegal aliens and crime in Colorado are repeated by a number of anti-immigration groups in that state.
One of the figures the all use is that 20% of the prison population in Colorado are illegal aliens. But if you do the research with actual data you will find that only about 2000 illegals are actually imprisoned at any given time in colorado out of a total prison population of
What's more, most of them are imprisoned for short periods of time and many of them are the same individuals incarcerated more than once in the course of a year, because a small number of illegals commit most crime done by their group, but it tends to be minor crime repeated over and over, for example, driving without a license and public intoxication.
And the 20% figure is just laughable from the get-go. The total prison population in Colorado is a bit over 40,000. 2000 imprisoned illegals is only 5% of the prison population, about the same percentage they make up of the general population in Colorado. To verify this data see these two PDFs
thebell.org
ojp.usdoj.gov
What your link to casapac shows is that there is a great deal of deliberate disinformation being disseminated on this subject and that many people are buying into it whole-hog because it fits their basically racist agenda.
Dave
174 - Dave Nalle
LOL, Brodie referenced ZOG. With every comment he gets more and more exposed for the neo-nazi he really is.
dave
175 - Richard Brodie
I'm in good company with all your knee-jerk "anti-semitic" charges. The two academics interviewed in the "Israel Lobby" link (post #167) had this to say concerning the Australian ZOG trying to suppress publication of their "critique of the Israel lobby in the United States":
PROFESSOR JOHN MEARSHEIMER, UNIVERSITY OF CHICAGO: Well, we referred to the charge of anti-Semitism in the piece as the 'great silencer'. What happens is that when individuals criticise Israel or organisations criticise Israeli policy, what almost axiomatically happens is those individuals are called anti-Semitic or if they're Jewish, they're labelled 'self-hating Jews'.
(and this from a pro-Palestinian JEW)
ANTHONY LOEWENSTEIN, AUTHOR MY ISRAEL QUESTION: If you're Jewish and you criticise Israel, or criticise even a policy of the Israeli Government, you're a self-hating Jew or anti-Semitic or you're unpatriotic or treasonous. I've been accused of all those and far worse. If you're non-Jewish, you're an anti-Semite or anti-Israel hater.
- just like Victor tries to characterize me as being " a greater threat to American liberty than any Muslim extremist will ever be." It's pathetic how you are all so unable to see how manipulated you are!