In Tangipahoa Parish here in Louisiana, the teachers and adminstrators continue to pray in school. This infuriates the ACLU who has continually taken the School Board to court to stop them from praying.…
"A sinister cabal of superior writers."
ACLU wants people who pray removed from society - Comments Page 3
Article comments
— go to most recent comments76 - adam
Shark, your post with the Bible quote about praying in the closet, is surely the FUNNIEST comment ever. I think I'm going to laugh the whole day.
77 - RealCon
Sink your teeth into this one and see if this bus can roll a little more…
Margaret H. Marshall, Chief Justice of the State Supreme Judicial Court of Massachusetts said yesterday that it remains the only state where gay and lesbian couples can legally marry. (It was a 4-3 decision)
Marshall endorsed comments made last week before the Senate Judiciary Committee by Joan H. Lefkow, a federal judge from Chicago.
Judge Lefkow called on members of the Senate Judiciary Committee to “publicly and persistently repudiate gratuitous attacks on the judiciary.”
Marshall told graduates and their families in her keynote address. ''I would urge you to do the same."
What? Chief Justice Marshall wants to muzzle us?
Now there is a good example of an activist judge gone bananas.
link
78 - Nancy
I'm trying to restrain myself from flushing my bible down the toilet over all this ....
79 - RealCon
Nancy -- if you have a Bible -- use judicious restraint
If you don't have a Bible -- try your head...
80 - Nancy
Ooooo...getting snarky, are we?
81 - Nancy
BTW, why is it that professed Christians are the least christian people I've ever met? The most 'christian' person I ever met - at least in terms of following JC's dicta - was Jewish.
82 - RealCon
Now -- Nancy, after flushing the toilet -- wants us to get into a pissing contest over whether Jews are more "christian" than Christians..
Good play, Nancy...
83 - Lisa McKay
What? Chief Justice Marshall wants to muzzle us?
Since when does repudiate mean to muzzle?
84 - RealCon
re·pu·di·ate
To reject the validity or authority of:
To reject emphatically as unfounded, untrue, or unjust: repudiated the accusation.
To refuse to recognize or pay: repudiate a debt.
To disown (a child, for example).
To refuse to have any dealings with.
Take your pick…
85 - Lisa McKay
I knew what it meant, RealCon. On what planet does it equate to muzzling? If I reject the validity of something you say, I am not preventing you from saying it, am I?
86 - RealCon
muz·zle
To restrain from expression: tried to muzzle the opposition
87 - Lisa McKay
Um, restraining someone from expressing a point of view and rejecting someone's point of view are very different things.
88 - RealCon
Let’s go back to what was said:
Judge Lefkow called on members of the Senate Judiciary Committee to “publicly and persistently repudiate gratuitous attacks on the judiciary.”
Marshall told graduates and their families in her keynote address. ''I would urge you to do the same."
I guess you just missed the point --
What do you think Chief Justice Marshall was trying to promote?
“Free speech"?
I think not.
89 - Lisa McKay
I think that's exactly what she's promoting. She's asking people to publicly speak out about attacks on the judiciary. I think it's you who is missing the point, but then I think you already know that.
90 - RealCon
Now -- the problem you have is -- you want to equate “people” with the “Senate Judiciary Committee“-- they are far from being the same…
Marshall was not asking “people” to speak out about attacks on the judiciary.” but she is looking to get something codified… Do you understand the distinction?
And are you aware that it is verbal attacks that are to be “repudiated”? What can the Senate and the government do -- except “muzzle” the people?
I think it is you who is missing the point, and I’m not sure you have it yet.
91 - Shannon
Ding! ding! ding! And the Taking Things Out Of Context And Skewing Them To Support Their Own Beliefs Award goes to......... RealCon!
http://my.brandeis.edu/news/item?news_item_id=103830
Does it sound like Chief Justice Marshall is muzzling anyone? Among her notable quotes:
"I am concerned about attacks leveled at the very foundation of our legal system: the principle that judges should decide each case on its merits, according to the rules of law applied the same way to everyone, and independent of outside influence," Marshall said. "I worry when people of influence declare that the role of a judge is to conform his or her decision to results of opinion polls. I worry when people of influence use vague, loaded terms like 'judicial activism' to skew public debate or to intimidate judges. I worry when judicial independence is seen as a problem to be solved, and not a value to be cherished."
92 - bhw
Shannon, you need to realize something. Shortly after 9/11, when Ari Fleischer said that all of us needed to watch what we say, he wasn't muzzling us. He was telling us what it means to be patriotic.
But when a judge who rules against the Bush administration's stance on ANYthing speaks out, disagreeing with the Republican message, it's not only unpatriotic, it's a form of muzzling the true patriots.
Hope that clarifies things.
93 - bhw
er, make that "needed to watch what we said" ....
94 - Shark
re. RealCon vs Lisa & the dictionary--
RealCon, just stop, dude! Please, fer the love of gawd, STOP!
(You lost before you got started.)
Thanks in advance,
The Management
95 - RealCon
Ah -- Shannon -- the “history teacher” -- again…
In our first encounter it was, “History 101” that you taught…
Later, when it suited your purpose -- it was, “medieval Germanic religious history - specifically the conversion of the Saxons.”…
Sounds like quite a gap -- but please -- don’t bore me with details -- I really don’t care…
To the current point --
Among Justice Marshall’s “notable quotes“ --
Notable quote #1... "I am concerned about… (being)… independent of outside influence…”
You appear to believe that -- Marshall is not influenced by the opinions of certain social pressure groups??? That is really a laugh!!
Marshall is so far out in left field -- that she caused over a dozen states to protect themselves from her “homosexual marriage” decision -- She created new law out of whole cloth… And she probably caused Kerry to lose the election… (The law of unintended consequences played out well here -- at least we got the lesser of two evils).
Notable quote #2 … "I worry when people of influence declare that the role of a judge is to conform his or her decision to results of opinion polls.”
What Marshall should worry about more is when people of influence (judges) believe that the role of a judge is to conform to proponents of “social activism”…
Notable quote #3... “ I worry when people of influence use vague, loaded terms like 'judicial activism' to skew public debate or to intimidate judges.
Marshall should worry more about when judges use 'judicial activism' to create laws where none existed…
Notable quote #4... “ I worry when judicial independence is seen as a problem to be solved, and not a value to be cherished."
Marshall should worry more about when her “judicial independence “ is really “social activism” and is viewed as such by a sizeable majority -- and starts to realize that she is the problem -- and that she is way out in left field…
Marshall’s quotes above do nothing to detract from her wanting to get something codified to “muzzle” dissent. … Do you not understand that? (I’ll bet you still don’t).
96 - Shark
Anyone else notice that the author of this entry, "Dana Fatic" can be rearranged to read:
"Da Fanatic" --?
~DOH!
(Just tryin' to be helpful.)
PS: Gotta run; my Ulysses is boiling over!!!
97 - Dave Nalle
Somehow your last response just didn't make any sense, BHW.
I understood the first paragraph, and I suppose it's not entirely unreasonable, but the second paragraph doesn't seem to fit.
Dave
98 - Shark
From Shark's Dictionary:
Activist Judge -- a member of the judiciary who interprets the law in a manner which opposes your right-wing, nut-bar opinion.
===========
Yer welcome!
99 - RealCon
Re: Comment #92
I am no fan of the current bunch in Washington -- but let’s be honest --
When Ari Fleischer said that all of us needed to watch what we say, he believed he was telling us what it means to be patriotic… That’s his humble opinion -- and we can take it or leave it… There is no force of law behind what he said… (I’m sure you can comprehend that)…
But when a judge issues an “opinion” -- it is not his or her “humble opinion”… It is a legal ruling enforceable under the law…
The issue is not whether the opinion favors the right or the left -- it is an issue of where did the opinion come from -- what part of the Constitution is it based on… (I’m sure you can comprehend that)…
At least -- I hope so…
Hope that clarifies things.
100 - bhw
I'm not sure what doesn't fit, Dave. RealCon is accusing a judge in MA of trying to muzzle speech by saying college graduates should "publicly and persistently repudiate gratuitous attacks on the judiciary."
I was trying to show what real muzzling is.
To RealCon, a judge who urges people to reject attacks on the judiciary is stifling the speech of the attackers [aka, Republicans/conservatives]. THAT's what makes no sense.
101 - Dave Nalle
>>Activist Judge -- a member of the judiciary who interprets the law in a manner which opposes your right-wing, nut-bar opinion.<<
Snark, there are just as many activist judges on the right and on the left. You can look at the judiciary objectively and be just as troubled by activism from either side. It doesn't matter whether the decision make Tom Delay or Nancy Pelosi happy, if it's arrived at for political rather than purely juridical reasons, then it's activism and it's not acceptable.
Dave
102 - RealCon
Comment 94 posted by Shark
I enjoy Shark’s posts --
He’s always good for a laugh…
Shark -- please don’ t ever stop…
Thanks in advance…
103 - RealCon
Comment 98 posted by Shark
From Shark's Dictionary:
Activist Judge -- a member of the judiciary who interprets the law in a manner which opposes your right-wing, nut-bar opinion…
Very good shark -- very good… What else is in your 25 word dictionary?
104 - RealCon
Re: Comment 100 posted by bhw
Bhw says that -- RealCon is accusing a judge in MA of trying to muzzle speech by saying college graduates should "publicly and persistently repudiate gratuitous attacks on the judiciary."
So Bhw has won the Grand Prize of the Day --
An exclusive -- fully-paid - two-week course on how to distinguish phrases like “college graduates’ from “Senate Judiciary Committee”.
If bhw gets a passing grade he will receive additional honors -- which will be announced at a later time…
105 - Shannon
Been to college lately, RealCon?
I was teaching 101 (aka Western Civ); my own personal specialty is medieval Germanic. Unless in your world, teachers are only allowed to teach our specialties? That'd make for some interesting academic policy.
106 - Temple Stark
ah - yet another accusation of lying by an overactive, smug prat.
Slow down there RealCon
107 - RealCon
Re: Comment 105
Shannon asks me -- “Been to college lately? --
Wow -- I am really impressed!!! That puts me in my place!!! He knows all about college… Wow!!!
Psst -- (whispering) -- Shannon asks that to let me know that he was “teaching 101 (aka Western Civ); and (his) own personal specialty is medieval Germanic.”
And then Shannon proudly pronounces -- “Unless in your world, teachers are only allowed to teach our specialties? That'd make for some interesting academic policy.”
Now what does that add to the conversation? But Ye Gads and Holy Smoke!!! Whatever it is --- I am really impressed!!!
P.S. -- Not that it matters a rat’s behind -- but I did teach at one time in a university -- before I formed my own company and retired comfortably at a very early age…
108 - RealCon
Re: Comment 106 posted by Temple Stark
Ah, yes -- another nonsensical, unsupported, harangue by who knows what…
There isn’t a clue of where this person is coming from or going --
And it is presumed that this person doesn’t know either…
Slow down and make some sense before you post…
109 - Dana
Shark,
Do you have an issue with my name? I thought that we were talking about the ACLU.
Margaret,
As far as intellectual dishonesty, I did not misquote or take the ACLU rep out of context. I know that they are talking about putting the offenders in jail. I didn't even imply it was anything else. I just have a problem with the ACLU saying that at all.
110 - gonzo marx
and my basic Question to you still stands Dana..
are you then in favor of not placing people that violate a Court Order multiple times in jail?
i realize that the sentencing would vary depending on state law and infraction, but there are many crimes that vilate direct court orders that require jail time for even a single infraction, much less multiple instances of blatant disrefard for a courts rulings..
contempt charges, restraining orders and the like are two examples that come to mind...
the folks in question here have every right to perform acts of civil disobedience to make their point for their Beliefs...but they have NO right to expect exemption form the consequences of the Actions in violation of a Court's order...no matter the Cause
i am truly interested in your Opinion, and that of any gentle Reader on this particular Topic
it can say quite a bit about an individuals Ethics...
your mileage may vary
Excelsior!
111 - bhw
An exclusive -- fully-paid - two-week course on how to distinguish phrases like “college graduates’ from “Senate Judiciary Committee”.
I saw the Brandeis link posted by Shannon, and in my haste, I assumed the remarks were made at Brandeis' graduation. My mistake.
If bhw gets a passing grade he will receive additional honors -- which will be announced at a later time…
bhw is a she.
And she has already graduated from college and grad school with honors, thank you.
Now that I've cleared up those important life details, I notice that you still have no evidence for your assertion that the judge in question is "muzzling" anyone.
112 - Shark
I got my GED. Does that count?
113 - Shark
Hey, let's start a thread where we compare W-2 forms, number of published works, number of college degrees, and dick sizes!
I'll go first. Mine are:
50, 5, 2, and 12
~but not in respective order.
114 - Dave Nalle
Shannon: "I was teaching 101 (aka Western Civ); my own personal specialty is medieval Germanic. Unless in your world, teachers are only allowed to teach our specialties? That'd make for some interesting academic policy."
Wow, Shannon. We sound like we have similar backgrounds. I had to teach a lot of Western Civ too, but even worse - I volunteered to teach Colonial America to get more class hours. My speciality is medieval England, btw. Fortunately I escaped academia after 20 years and am free now.
Snark: "Hey, let's start a thread where we compare W-2 forms, number of published works, number of college degrees, and dick sizes!"
Is there a point in doing this? We all know that I win in every category. Oh wait, I don't have a W2 form anymore. Let's compare 1040s.
Dave
115 - RealCon
BHW - my apologies for mistaking you for a he -- I beg your forgiveness…
However, in this case I must withdraw the exclusive -- fully-paid - two-week course on how to distinguish phrases like “college graduates’ from “Senate Judiciary Committee”. It is an all-male course -- (it may contain coarse and abusive language)…
But I award you an exclusive -- fully-paid - two-week course on how to distinguish the (?) i.e., the question mark -- from the (.) (period). (It is a co-ed course - which could result in coarse language depending on whether there are liberals in the class…)
And since you have already graduated from college and grad school with honors (thank you) -- I am confident you will do well in this dynamic two-week course.
Now that I've cleared up those important details, I will address the point of this particular harangue --
You assert that I said “the judge in question is ‘"muzzling’ anyone.”
What I wrote in post #77 is -- “What? Chief Justice Marshall wants to muzzle us?”
I posed a question in Post #77 -- you made a statement in Post #111...
Hence -- the award as made above…
You want evidence of “muzzling” her opposition”…
One more time -- the evidence is Justice Marshal repeated Judge Lefkow’s request before the Senate Judiciary Committee to “publicly and persistently repudiate gratuitous attacks on the judiciary.” -- followed by Justice Marshall repeating the request by Judge Lefkow, i.e., to “publicly and persistently repudiate gratuitous attacks on the judiciary.”
If that is not “muzzling” what is? And who is the intended target?
116 - gonzo marx
RealCon..
to repudiate is what i do when arguing with you here on BC after i utilize Facts and Logic to show how wrong you can be on occasion in your mad diatribes
to muzzle is what happens after you have paid Mistress Twink to pop the rubber ball gag in your mouth and fasten it real tight
now can you spot the difference?
thus Endeth the Lesson
Excelsior!
117 - Dave Nalle
Chief Justice Marshall has been dead for almost 200 years - who the hell are we actually talking about here?
And from what I can tell Lefkow didn't suggest muzzling anyone, she just wants people not to go out of their way to inflame intolerant, violent nutcases.
Dave
118 - bhw
RealCon, are you a dick in real life, or do you just play one on Blogcritics?
119 - RealCon
Re: Comment 112 posted by Shark
Shark says : “I got my GED. Does that count?”
No.
For you GED means -- Gets Easily Dumfounded (especially when posting)
120 - RealCon
Re: Comment 113 posted by Shark
Shark says -- Hey, let's start a thread where we compare W-2 forms, number of published works, number of college degrees, and dick sizes!
Shark just had a recount…
It turns out his numbers are either negative -- or very close to zero…
121 - RealCon
Re: Comment 116 posted by gonzo marx
Gonzo -- where have you been -- I missed your rants all day -- and now I see you took an overdose of your nasty pills today…and washed the stuff down with a little invective juice…
Be careful…your symptoms could get worse…
Nasty pills are very bad for the brain… very bad… could cause further retardation…
Hope you get better…
122 - RealCon
Re: Comment 117 posted by Dave Nalle
Of course not Supreme Court Chief Justice Marshall -- who we all know has been dead for almost 200 years -- we are talking about Chief Justice Margaret Marshall of the Peoples Republic of Massachusetts…
What Judge Lefkow suggested was “muzzling” anyone who -- after appearing in her court -- disagreed vocally with her decisions…
123 - gonzo marx
me?
nasty pills?
oh no, my dear , deluded Con
scroll up to things like comments numbered 103,107,108,115,119 and 120...to name just a few , for some real nastiness
i was being nice...add to that that even comatose with my head amputated and tossed in a pickle jar, i would still out-funny your own pitifully peurile attempts at feeble humor
but insinuating that i may suffer "further retardation" has earned you a first in BC istory!!
you are the first "person" to EVER win a second Insidious Troglodyte Award
this is bestowed in Recognition of your having less Compassion than an upholsterer at Dachau
thanks for playing...please try again
Excelsior!
124 - Randy Kirk
Can I play.
In the next little while, the conservatives will likely have vast majorities of judges at all levels. Now we will be able to make it up like the libs have for the past 50 years.
125 - gonzo marx
Randy..i am glad to have you state your Opinion at any time..
but let's look at the last 50 years or Presidents, and add up the years
go ahead, give it a whirl...
you will find that the GOP has quite an advantage in terms of years they have controlled the White House, a little further digging will show that they have a much larger proportional majority of Court appointees in total numbers of the Federal Courts
so, you statement is spurious as well as being Factually Incorrect
the so called "vast majority" of Federal Judges have been appointed by Republican Presidents, who have controlled the White House for the Majority of the last 50 years
hope that helps...
Excelsior!