Shortly before he died in 2002, and many years after the demise of The Clash, Joe Strummer was quoted as saying that he makes music "for his own age group." Is this a statement that resonates with you, i.e. do you feel that certain music necessitates maturity on the part of the listener and / or the creator?
Harmer: Absolutely. I hated Sandinista by the Clash when it first came out because it wasn't punk rock the way I wanted it—loud, fast and rude. Years later I discovered what a masterpiece that record was. What else? The Beach Boys. No way I could have sat thru Pet Sounds or Smile at age 18. Country Music? I would rather have stripped the hair from my arm pits with duck tape before torturing myself with country music. Boy was I wrong. Johnny Cash is the first punk rocker baby!
DJ Luna: Music speaks to anyone that listens.
LaBlanc: Pete Townsend wrote a classic parody on this topic that he recorded with The Who as "My Generation." I guess it's subtle, satirical, tongue-in-cheek wisdom was lost on Joe. He broke the first commandment of Rock: "Thou shalt never take thyself too seriously."
Patty Boss: I feel that all time and all ages can communicate fully through music, although I love to be familiar with an artist as they mature, and feel similar twists and phases of life with them, in synchronicity. For example, Beck used to feel to me fun and silly and intrigued when I felt fun and silly and intrigued. And now, as his voice is deeper, and some of his songs seem to be reflecting a new type of depth, It's easy for me to identify with this new tone and feel a reflection of themes of family and of having children. In addition to this type of resonation, hell yes, music made for one's own generation and culture and context is often one of the most, if not THE most important element defining self when coming up.
Lolo: I probably would never have agreed except for the fact that I’ve reached that seemingly inevitable stage where you can’t relate to “what the kids are listening to these days.” I kind of hate that I’m letting myself get there, but more and more often I look backward to find music that appeals to me rather than looking forward. I don’t know who Pink is, and I don’t give a shit. I don’t like her name and it’s easy enough for me to write the whole thing off. I’d rather go off and discover Aretha’s back catalog. On the other hand, what is music for my generation? I think it might be the kind of music they play at the dentist’s office—lite rock, soft rock, VH1 stuff. If that’s the case, then I’m not too hip to that idea at all!
Article comments
1 - Eric Olsen
fascinating as always mpho - very absorbing discussion, thanks!
2 - Brad J.
Really interesting interview.Too bad you
lost a grip of credibility with the age
old assertion about Elvis being racist.
Those comments that his supposed racism
was built around were misquotes to begin
with and with time have been perpetuated
into urban legend status.At least this
is what Elvis biographers Chet Flippo &
Greil Marcus have claimed in the books
they have done on Elvis "Graceland" and
"Mystery Train" respectively.
You should present the quotes and facts
that you feel make 'E' a racist and try
to explain from there if you can when
you make as strong a statement as that.
From all I've read or heard about Elvis
he wasn't racial at all. He was raised
in the old south in a time when many
people used the ugly term "N****r" even
though they weren't really racist.It was
just an unfortunately overused word,too
common in the vernacular down south.This
of course does not excuse the usage of
the word (nothing does)just that's the
way it unfortunately was at that point
in time.Thankfully it's changed some for
the better.
He went out of his way to see many, many
black artists perform,an act that would
and could get one branded with the heavy
social stigmata of being a N****r Lover"
which was social suicide.He used black
slang,dressed very Pimp/Flash and was a
regular on Beale St. on Saturday nights
whih was the heart of Black Memphis and
practically the heart of the Black Mid-
South for that matter.
If he was that much of a racist I highly
doubt that he would've or could,ve been
so immersed in black culture the way he
was without any hesitation or worry of
the consequence these don't seem like
the acts of a racist to me. Not that it
could not or did not happen. I have read
an account of R & B legend Rufus Thomas
performing at a KKK picnic in Miss. back
in the early 60's.It just seems really
and highly unlikely that this was the
case with Elvis.
That's my opinion is all and my only
points of reference in this matter are
two books I read years and years ago,but
that is an awfully strong statement to
be bandied about so flippantly.
3 - adam
I didn't even know this racist urban legend about Elvis existed. Fact is, he dressed and sang black. He lived on the edge of the black-white divide in town growing up, and soaked up black music and culture, which was why he became the artist he was.
4 - curl
I like this post a lot! Like Mr. Harmer, I thought the first question was kind of stupid, but then when I read the answers it really made me think. I have a friend who never listens to music at all cause she alwayws has the tv on. i think she needs the sound but she'd rather have people talking than people singing. i never really thought about it but now it makes me want to ask her what's with that!
5 - Mettle
It's funny that luna says Instead of the “four-on-the-floor” beat, it switched up a bit, making it possible to get way more creative with the beats. Most dance music from hip hop to disco is so so uncreative. Where's the invention? Disco sucks!! Gimme something that shreds and try to dj that.
6 - Lonnie
What an interesting panel and great comments from everybody.
Pboss says "Beck used to feel to me fun and silly and intrigued." That's a great description. Those are all things I want music to do to me. That's why I used to love Madness and Cyndia Lauper and still love 80s music. It's just fun and silly and sometimes you wonder what's underneath their hair, like A Flock of Seagulls. What was that all about?
As a separate comment, the thing about disco sucks in unnecessary. I like how everybody in the article seems to embrace a lot of different things.
7 - mpho
Brad, I appreciate your comments, and I can see where you're coming from. Let's face it, contrary to the beliefs of urban mythologists, Elvis is dead so we'll never know what the real story was. However, I do wanna say that I felt comfortable writing what I did for several reasons. One is that despite the lack of quotation marks, I was actually making a song reference, whic given the overall topic, can be deemed an appropriate gesture.
Adam says he's never heard Elvis being referred to as a racist. Well, I never had either--until Public Enemy's bodacious "Fight the Power" was released in 1988 or thereabouts. The now infamous lines go something like this: "Elvis was a hero to most / But he never meant shit to me / Straight up racist that sucker was simple and plain / Motherfuck him and John Wayne / Cause I'm black and I'm proud / I'm ready and hyped plus I'm amped / Most of my heroes don't appear on no stamps"
The thing is, until then, I didn't know that as a black person I wasn't "supposed" to like Elvis. Just a few years prior, I had learned another lesson about what sort of music I "should" be listening to. I can't remember exactly how old I was--middle school age. A good friend of mine showed up at my birthday party without a gift. I wasn't hung up on it, though he seemed rather sheepish about it. When his mom came to pick him up, my parents sent me out to the car with him to greet his parents. Mrs. Jenkins berated her son in front of me for leaving the gift that was intended for me in the car. In what was one of the most awkward moments of my life, he silently handed me a poster tube and said, "my mom made me pick this for you," then he turned away from me beet red and in tears. It was a poster of Stevie Wonder. His mom said, "Oh Jeff, for crying out loud, they like that kind of stuff, don't you dear?"
From that moment on, I was filled with shame and embarassment whenever I was confronted with "black music"--to the extent that I've really only embraced old school R&B and soul in my adulthood. When rap emerged, a lot of blacks took pride in themselves in way that they hadn't before. I avoided it like the plague. I wasn't ready to be a nigga with attitude. For cripes sake, I couldn't even watch Michael Jackson's "Billie Jean" video without wanting to crawl under a rock if white people were around.
Those feelings have resurface from time to time. In college, I remember going into town with a white friend to make a buy from a black guy. In the car, I tuned in Yes's 90215 and was in musical heaven. The black guy looked at me in complete disbelief then turned to my friend and said, "Y'all, ruinin' her with this shit."
It was only until I moved to Detroit that I started getting over my musical malaise. I took delight in going to record stores with my white friends who were into "black music," while I perused the white stuff. Once a black gentleman came up to me and asked me if I knew where Frankie Beverly & Maze would be. I pointed to my white friend Suzanne and told him, she'd know more about it than I would.
I bring these things up only because that line about Elvis is seared into my brain. It doesn't matter if it's fact or fiction. For the record, I still like his music. I love Public Enemey, and and I love Stevie Wonder, too.
8 - Lonnie
Wow, that's incredible and really powerful what mpho has written. I think it's really sad that someone would have that sort of experience as a child. I'm sure mpho is not alone though I have never heard of it. Actually, my family is Persian and sometimes I've been embarassed at Indian restaurants even though I'm not Indian. But people can be really ignorant so I know what mpho means. I had to learn to love my heritage enough not to be bothered by someone else's.
9 - jarboy
dayum, what's up with you people writing your own blogs in someone else's blog instead of a comment?
10 - Aaman
Excellent post, mpho - my vote for editors' picks
11 - mpho
Aaman, grazie.