What have you written or edited that makes you some sort of professional writing-related critic? You post like you've worked for some major publishing house for years. Here's just some of what you wrote:
Eric, you can keep writing your nonsensical drivel and parading as some sort of responsible, sensbile music journalist, but let me assure you that you are not. Thats my opinion. You'll be amazed how many people share my opinion, even a journalist with almost same views as you on some things but not with the same level of ignorance and irresponsibility when putting it to print. He just can't be bothered to write on here.
This "journalist" friend of yours "can't be bothered" to do the one thing he is paid to do: write? Amazing journalist he must be! LOL
Yes, you are entitled to your opinion of Eric's piece and any of his past articles; you are totally within your right to criticize and disagree with Eric's opinion. But I don't think evidence supports what you are saying about him as a professional, that's where you get derailed.
You may not like his writing as a reader, but on a professional level, I don't think you have a leg to stand on with some of your commentary. Fine, just say you don't like his writing and don't agree with him, and don't like him, whatever, but don't try and bring unsubstantiated third parties in to make your point for you because that's beyond lame.
He is not a hack. He has credentials. You are the one who doesn't, capiche? I think he was baiting you a little bit with mentioning your name, but I think he was also poking in good fun and you can't be teased about your blind Madonna love without going crazy.
Now if you do have some writing-related credentials, then please produce them and this so called "double standard" of mine might actually make some sense. Until that time, I will continue to believe that I hit the nail squarely on the head and you are just flaming me as you have flamed others around here.
So flame on, again, Sandra. I'm totally expecting you to go postal on me like you did before.
Leopards and loons don't change their spots.
27 -
Eric Olsen
Mar 24, 2004 at 3:18 pm
Thanks TD, I appreciate your carrying the flame so ardently. I, unfortunately, can't pursue the topic at the moment because I am preparing drivel to foist upon a major media outlet.
The fact that she burned crosses in the Like a Prayer video did not make the song bad. The fact that she was kissing women in the Justify my love video, did not make the song bad.
And they didn't make the songs good, either.
I think Madonna has very marginal musical talents. But she has great business acumen and marketing smarts, as well as an incredibly strong work ethic. She is entirely self-made in a male-dominated industry, and she deserves credit for that.
However, her longevity in the industry has to do with popularity, which is not necessarily the same thing as quality, musically speaking.
29 -
duane
Mar 24, 2004 at 3:57 pm
Sarah invokes Pete Sampras' tennis career as a sports analog to Madonna's music career when she says, "You do not win 14 slams and remain number 1 for 6 yrs in a row if all you've got is a big serve." Sarah, this is entirely fallacious reasoning. When Sampras wins, he wins by an objective criterion, namely, the score. It doesn't matter how his hair looks, or if he has a flair for color coordination, or how many shoe commercials he appears in. He is successful at tennis because he is good at tennis. Our opinion of his ability must be consistent with his win-loss record.
OK, that should be easy enough for you to understand. Now, next point. You think Madonna has a "score," too, namely, her record sales. You want to equate that with her ability as a musician. That's your error. If there were some kind of contest, one-on-one, where her musical ability were pitted against other musicians, she would suffer countless humiliating defeats. Most high-school marching band members would "wipe the court" with her.
And yet, Madonna sells records. We know that. That's the end result of marketing, connections, a good business sense, a nose for style and trends, and, most importantly, IMAGE. She has the financial wherewithal to hire good writers, producers, and musicians. I don't deny that she's successful. I maintain only that her success is not strongly correlated with her musical aptitiude. Allow us to respect Madonna as a successful businesswoman, while acknowledging that she is a musical weakling.
And I would really recommend that you try to keep a lid on your penchant for personal criticism. Although you feign indifference, your long-winded posts suggest otherwise. Why not try to preserve what little credibility you have left and play nice for a change?
30 -
duane
Mar 24, 2004 at 3:59 pm
I see that I am echoing bhw. Hat's off to you, bhw.
duane - I like your points, but I have to ask: am I missing something here? Who is "Sarah"? Do you mean Sandra?
34 -
duane
Mar 24, 2004 at 4:20 pm
TDavid, yeah. Sorry Sandra.
35 -
Sandra Smallson
Mar 24, 2004 at 6:41 pm
Tdavid, I guess you and your cohorts are all musicians that is why you all have legs to stand on when you tell me what musical ability Madonna or any other artsit has. Ofcourse, you are all speaking from a professional point of view because you are all musicians? and Politicians, and filmmakers, etc etc. LOL. I can not believe you people type these things out and dont see how foolish you sound.
Eric Olsen is an irresponsible journalist and should re read the pitchfork media post over and over again so that in his next polluted piece via the main stream media he may become more self aware. Thank goodness he is a complete nobody. Just imagine if he was of any significance in the broad span of things?! What a travesty. Same goes for a number of you. End of story.
The rest of you flatter yourselves if you think I am going to argue with you about Madonna as a musician again. Why argue with people who have set views on things and who labour under misunderstandings and misconceptions before they even type the first word. Madonna is a musician whether you like it or not. If she does not deserve to be one in your view, too bad. Live with it. She more than deserves to be one in my view and in the view of many others. Diff strokes for diff folks. I leave this discussion. You can all continue writing about Madonna if you like. The level of stupidity is as always, overwhelming but what's new.
36 -
Sandra Smallson
Mar 24, 2004 at 6:43 pm
And duane, can u stop stalking me? Why follow me around this site? Geez. Do u have no shame? I have been ignoring you and yet you insist on following me everywhere seeking my attention. Take that appendage BHW with you when you disappear.
I was introduced to Sandra's World (see #39) a couple months ago. Party time, excellent! Excellent!
Seriously, it's odd how Sandra sort of reminds me of Madonna's music career.
Now maybe I should go on and on for two paragraphs about how stupid "all" of us are and silly and well really none of us know who we are because this is just one long, long, long ass run on sentence with no purpose but all of you don't get it because I'm not going to stay here and argue with any of you, even if you write back then I'll still say Madonna is the best and you all have small packages and are stalking me and need to get lifes and I love this site but I think you are all clueless and Eric's writing sucks and I know because I have a friend who is a journalist who said so and Phillip doesn't understand religion and I just can't talk to any of you because you keep following me around here and I'm going to keep writing until I've made my point at least ten times, no wait, make that fifteen times because if you don't like Madonna you all must have problems having sex and I'll just keep writing and maybe this is really just a keyboard exercise and --
(gasp)
Madonna and Sandra in a tree ...
Add "new material needed" to the shopping list for both of them.
I tend to want to be nice to you Ms Sandra, but my patience with women claiming or implying that they are being "stalked" online, and particularly on this site wears REAL thin, real quick. That crap rates just about as abusive and dishonest as Diva's constant whining about "racism."
This is a public space with public comments. If you make strong, obnoxious comments like yours in this thread, you're going to get mocked and criticized.
Expect it and accept it, or shut your piehole. Usually you have something interesting and worthwhile to add to the conversation, but you just seem to have kind of lost your mind here.
43 -
duane
Mar 24, 2004 at 10:27 pm
Thanks for the welcome, TDavid. I take it I'm in good company.
44 -
Lomu
Mar 26, 2004 at 9:06 am
Madonna has been voted one of the 50 greatest and most influential musicians of all time by a panel of acclaimed musicians. Bono, Chrissie Hynde, Elvis Costello and 52 others.
They got her most vocal fan to write something on her. By the looks of it they should have searched you out Sandra.
I am narrow minded. I like Jazz. Miles Davis type jazz. I do not like the new breed of jazz musicians. I do not like pop music or rap or r&b or country music.
I am not disingenuos in any sense to say Madonna is not a musician. I do not own any of her Albums except her Immaculate Collection and the ballad compilation. Mostly for the wife but I do enjoy some of it. I would attend her concert if the tickets did not cost a whopping $300. The wife is attending the concert. She is taking our twin daughters. That is $900. If I went along, it would be $1200. I have a mortgage to pay off.
Sandra, I like your post on comment 35. We can all give opinions on anything to everything. It may not be a professional opinion but it is an opinion. A professional opinion has been given by 55 of Madonna's fellow musicians and I am sure you have a smile on your face like the cat that got the cream. Maybe you do not care what the bloggers are saying. You may see the RollingStones article as a statement of fact as far as you are concerned. Check it out.
I am impressed that Ms Smallson took the high road in this discussion and left you guys to it. It really was an unnecessary discussion.
For the record, I am not on Sandra's side or any side for that matter. These are just my thoughts on this topic. I simply found it an amusing coincidence that after seeing this topic for the last few days on this site, I should stumble upon RollingStones with musicians calling Madonna a musician and rightly so for Pete sake.
I am impressed that Ms Smallson took the high road in this discussion
Lomu, I can't tell if you're tongue is in your cheek or not! If it's not, then that's freakin' hil-ar-ious.
46 -
duane
Mar 26, 2004 at 2:04 pm
Yes, Lomu, let's reminisce and take a little stroll down Sandra's "high road." Shall we? Come along, Lomu.
"But once there is Madonna or Sandra Smallson, you rear your ugly head. You must have a permanent hard on and may desire a threesome. On behalf of both let me assure you we would rather sleep with Ellen Degeneres."
"I can not believe you people type these things out and dont see how foolish you sound."
"Eric Olsen is an irresponsible journalist...."
"Thank goodness he is a complete nobody."
"The level of stupidity is as always, overwhelming...."
"And duane, can u stop stalking me?"
"Take that appendage BHW with you when you disappear."
"...was there any need to repost that ridiculous and senseless article of yours again?"
That's what you call the high road? Then you must live among subterranean troglodytes.
I hear Madonna and Britney are going to do a small club acoustic tour next ....
WHEN HELL FUCKING FREEZES OVER
48 -
Shark
Mar 26, 2004 at 5:58 pm
my two cents:
Dick Tracy album = highlight of Madonna's recording career; she shoulda stuck to doing Betty Boop. Seriously, that stuff was great.
Lomu - Miles Davis? Jazz? Isn't that ...narcotic music?
BTW: The poll you cited is probably excellent proof that contemporaries are pisspoor judges of the historical value of anything that occurs during their time.
49 -
Lomu
Mar 26, 2004 at 6:10 pm
Duane do not involve me in your little man petty tiff with Sandra. I can read and I know what she has written. I know what you have written. I do not know why you and Tdavid feel the need to research the archives of Sandra's posts on Blog. It seems you have far more time for her than she has for you guys. It may not be how it is but it is how it seems.
I am impressed by Sandra leaving the argument when she did. She did take the high road while you all carried on like little boys researching her past posts and trying to see who could write the wittier comments amongst yourselves.
Eric you should be bigger than this. You have been unable to rise above it. If Ms Smallson thinks you are an irresponsible journalist, it is her opinion. I do not know the rightness or wrongness of it. I did not post on this topic to involve myself in that. All I can say to you is that your recent post seems to substantiate some of the doubts she has raised about you as a journalist.
You call Sandra a jabbering loon, flagrant idiot who knows nothing about anything. She says you are an irresponsible journalist who is a nobody. It seems you are very affected by what she has said to join this little men gathering of saying silly things.
Are you trying to bait her? I hope she does not pay any attention to any of you. I think this site has enough of little men running around trying to belittle people who do not see their point of view. Shark calls Macdiva, Mcdemon. The rest of you throw your fair share of insults at Smallson but once she responds it is like she is the only one who has thrown hyperbolic insults.
I don't know if the Madonna and Britney club tour was a joke. Whatever it was, I do not see how you can not see it only shows that there just might be some truth to Smallson saying you are like Pitchfork media.
A Madonna fan doubts your journalistic clout for a variety of reasons. You start poking fun at Madonna. It belittles you.
50 -
Lomu
Mar 26, 2004 at 6:19 pm
Shark, anyone who thinks Jazz is narcotic music and can not appreciate Miles davis is a waste of my time. Moreover, anyone who thinks the highlight of Madonna's career was the Dick tracy Album reads from a different page of the hymn sheet. You know what I'm saying!
I think it is fair to say that the reasonable man would rather take the opinions of contemporaries than the opinions of little men or a failed stand up comic. I have said enough. Exactly the reason I do not contribute often to this site. I am likely to become one of you. That is nothing to be proud of.
51 -
Eric Olsen
Mar 26, 2004 at 6:43 pm
Lomu, you and Sandra deserve each other. I will leave it at that.
The only reason I was drawn into any of this is that I wrote a postive review of both Madonna and Britney - you can read it above - and she behaved as if I had slagged them both to hell and back. She has said nothing whatsoever about any of this that makes any sense at all.
Since I write weekly for one of the largest media outlets on the web, I get mail all the time disagreeing with my opinion on this or that. I have zero problem with disagreement - it's just opinion - but I do not have people - never, not once - attacking my integrity as a writer, nor denying that I have something to say, and then never - not once - substantiating any of her accusations.
When people show up and shit on the living room rug, at first we are astonished, then we are angry, then when they won't clean it up we suggest they get the fuck out of the house.
This is the second time this individual has taken a big dump, for no apparent reason, right in he middle of the house. How do you think we should respond?
52 -
Shark
Mar 26, 2004 at 9:31 pm
Lomu, you need a friggin' humor transplant.
Coupla things:
1) you jumped into BC by insulting people because they insult people. How brilliant is that?
2) I was listening to jazz when you were in diapers, son.
3) I would say a "reasonable" man would ignore contemporary popularity polls when trying to estimate the historical impact of a living artist. In 50 years, Madonna won't be more than a minor footnote in history -- and only then, because of her marketing skills.
4) I have said enough. Exactly the reason I do not contribute often to this site. I am likely to become one of you.
You and your tightly wound sphincter will be sorely missed.
Get a sense of humor, Lomu. You'll live a lot longer. Take a Holiday, stop acting Like A Virgin.
When it comes to encountering new characters on the web, I take about .0000001% of the flamebait that I read from them in the comments section seriously.
This is not saying that I don't remember or recall when folks like these Material Girls say or do humorous things. You might improperly label this "research" but I call this simply having a memory and holding Everybody accountable In This Life for their prior words and actions.
Don't You Know that Sandra and the Diva are missing a career in comedy?! They are clearly Borderline.
As for your "little men" comment, isn't that supposed to be Sandra's line? Love Makes The World Go Round.
(rimshot)
Yeah, yeah, Amazing, I won't quit my day job. Here's a road map to taking the high road.
Promise To Try.
54 -
Shark
Mar 27, 2004 at 7:03 am
TDavid, that was hilarious!
I was -- dare I say -- LOL.
"...stop acting like a virgin"
Oddly enough, truer words were never spoken.
55 -
Lomu
Mar 27, 2004 at 10:23 am
Eric, there are many unsubstantiated opinions on Blog. Some of them could be yours. Some of them could be mine. Maybe Sandra did not feel it was a positive review. Whatever the case, it is her opinion and she may think it is substantiated. You know who you are and you know what you are. You should not allow the opinions of a reader reduce you to substantiating some of her accusations. Which with all due respect, I think you have done in some of your comments on this thread. I am sorry if I caused you any offence. I did not mean to. I am giving my opinion of this particular thread as I see it.
Shark, you were in diapers 47 years ago? You must be all of a 100 years old now. Well done. I do not see where I have insulted anyone. Please bring it to my notice. Madonna has been around since 1983 if the date on the remastered copy of her first Album is to be believed. 50 years from now, I think she will be far more than a foot note. In her life she has already accomplished so much, a living legend and in the Guiness Book of Records to the delight of the wife. The deeds of all humans are often over exaggerated after they are gone. The next generation will be over-stating Madonna as an Artist as we over-state every other Artist that has gone before. I do not know of any dead Artist who did not suffer the sort of criticism you give Madonna when they were alive. Now, they are exalted. All the Artists that have made an impact will be over-stated when they are gone. History teaches us that. You are wrong there, ma boy.
TDavid, well done. I am impressed by your knowledge of Madonna song titles. The wife assures me Promise to Try is a gem. I will look for it. Thank you for the heads up. Sorry. I had to call the wife to identify some of the song titles I could not decipher. If you had to do research on the titles, that is more impressive. It gives credence to my statement that you have a lot of time on your hands. For Sandra and Madonna. Lucky girls.
56 -
Lomu
Mar 27, 2004 at 10:47 am
Sandra, I know you must scan through this thread. You must be curious as to what is being said. Your will power is inspiring. I invite you to join in the merriment of this thread. I'll give you an incentive. The attitude of the old men is turning me into a Madonna fan.
I have borrowed my daughter's collection. I am listening to her Cds. I may pay the $300 for her tour. I am reading archives of articles and interviews. I am beginning to think I am doing the Madonna elective in Women studies I hear they have in an Amsterdam University. I always wondered why Germaine Greer and the other feminists were always at each others throats about the influence of Madonna's Art. Talk about cultural impact.
If my business partner ever finds out what I am doing with my time off. It is quite fascinating and interesting. How she has grown as an Artist and steered her own course inspite of the people trying to influence her career choices. It is a good thing none of our friends here can do anything about it. There is a lot to be respected about the girl from Detroit.
I will quote Lyrics not titles.
" This world is not so kind
people trap your mind
it's so hard to find
someone to admire
It's no good when you're misunderstood, so why should I care, what the world thinks of me, won't let a stranger give me a social disease"...Madonna (Nobody Knows me. 2003)
She must be clairvoyant. Those lyrics suit the discussions on this thread down to the T. You have a convert. My wife and daughters are eternally grateful. Drop us a line. You must see you are dearly missed.
57 -
Shark
Mar 27, 2004 at 12:35 pm
Lomu, I thought you took your ball and went home?
Shark, you were in diapers 47 years ago? You must be all of a 100 years old now. Well done.
I'd respond, but it doesn't make any sense. Math much?
I do not know of any dead Artist who did not suffer the sort of criticism you give Madonna when they were alive.
That's because they were ignored and/or forgotten by history. Jeezus.
Lomu, we'll have to agree to disagree on this one, but I'll kiss yer ass if Madonna records are played with any consistency in 50 years.
(Other than as nostalgia for somebody like "the wife".)
58 -
Shark
Mar 27, 2004 at 12:37 pm
THEY'RE HARDLY PLAYED NOW, fer chrissakes.
59 -
Eric Olsen
Mar 27, 2004 at 1:48 pm
I'll agree I should not have allowed myself to be baited.
Madonna has value on several levels: marketing and iconography, yes, but her core body of work will stand the test of time. Whatever her status as a "musician," she is an auteur and has always been in charge of her own music and career. I begrudge her nothing.
Only a mad cow would read the review above and not take it as wholly positive, particularly about Madonna.
Oh, Madonna's records will get SOME interest still in 50 years, but not as much as, say, the Monkees- a manufactured pop construct with much better SONGS.
61 -
Eric Olsen
Mar 27, 2004 at 2:01 pm
I like the Monkees just fine, but Madonna is in another universe of significance altogether. The fact that most of her music is derived from dance music styles in no way reduces her importance. Madonna will be in the Rock and Roll Hall of Fame as soon as she is eligible - the Monkees aren't and never will be (for what that's worth).
A "Madonna elective in Women studies?" Oh God, what a screamingly pretentious load of crap. What is there to STUDY? This sounds very much like an excuse for some faux-intellectual jackasses to sit around making out how her self-prostitution constitutes some Profound Feminist Statement. Wow, she's been her OWN pimp. I'm impressed.
Perhaps a marketing class based on her career might be useful.
63 -
Shark
Mar 27, 2004 at 4:22 pm
Let's see...
Head vs Swept Away
Ca-ching! Slam dunk for the Monkees!
heh.
BTW: regarding Lomu's thesis, polls, R&R Hall of Fame, contemporaries' judgements, etc:
In art, the Paris Salon might be an equivalent place to look; many, if not most of the 'great' artists of the time were enshrined/accepted by the Salon competitions and were later either forgotten or marginalized as sentimental, commercial hacks by scholars, collectors, fans, and historians. And it turns out many of the painters rejected by the Salon are now some of the biggest names in art history.
Similar things happened w/many 19th century writers who were lionized in their day -- and currently can't be located on a bookstore shelf.
Yer turn, Lomu.
64 -
Lomu
Mar 27, 2004 at 4:39 pm
Shark, do you have a radio? What sort of music do you hear on the radio these days? If you had a radio you would not have made that comment. We do have to disagree on this one. You are beginning to stretch yourself out on what to say and your opinions are sounding thinner and thinner. I can not remember the last time I heard Miles davis on radio. I can not remember the last time I heard the Beatles on radio. Matter of fact, I can not remember the last time I heard Prince on radio. Radio plays hip-hop now, Shark.
Listen when they are playing the oldies. Try Z100 or Rick Fox. You will hear so much Madonna you will be tapping your fingers to the melodies and you will know the words soon enough. If you are the age you claim, you will be dead in 50 years. Your children will tell you about it in the afterlife. Ah, as we speak, there is Shirley Bassey covering Madonna's "You'll see". Never liked Dame Shirley Bassey. I think I have had enough of this discussion as well.
Eric, that is the right attitude if I may say so. It is strictly a matter of opinion what you feel about the status of someone in their profession. The only reason I joined this discussion is because of someone saying Madonna is not a musician. She fulfills the requirements, she is one. What you think of her ability as one is entirely up to you. Your opinion is not fact. If your opinion was fact we would not be having this discussion at all.
You do not hear people arguing if Clinton was the President in 1992. He was the president. That is a fact. What is not a fact, is what personal opinion you hold about Madonna or Clinton. The problem is with people who fail to see that opinions are not facts.
65 -
Shark
Mar 27, 2004 at 4:55 pm
Radio?
What the hell does that have to do with anything?!
Lomu, I'm sorry, but your lack of logic and/or an articulate point makes me feel like I'm debating a tree. We're wasting time; we should just leave it at:
* You love Madonna and think she's going to have a really significant impact on future generations.
* I 'like' Madonna and think that in the overall scheme of musical history, she'll be a footnote... or more likely, a photograph.
Madonna? Ain't that the bint who got cuffed for rubbing her arse in Toronto? And she has the nerve to attempt it again when the Brass Rail and Jilly's is right down the street?
Wot? there's music involved? Isn't there always music with peelers?
67 -
Sandra Smallson
Mar 27, 2004 at 5:11 pm
Lomu, you have been good to read:) Ofcourse I have scanned through sometimes. I just can not be bothered to join in the "merriment":) Still can't be bothered. As Mr Olsen has told you, we've been there and done that. As far as substance to my opinions on Mr Olsen, been there, done that. You have read Pitchfork media post? If you haven't, please try. When you do, connect the dots with my accusations and I do not think it will be rocket science. Trust me. On the other hand, let him tell you what "major media outlet" he writes for weekly. Try and keep up with them and make up your own mind. I am not here to influence anybodys opinions on anybody. Not on Olsen. Not on M. I certainly was not looking for more Madonna fans. She has fansites I can visit if I want. She has more than enough. Still, if you have a new found appreciation, all's well that ends well:) It's a gift I have, i achieve things without trying;)
My contribution is to tell you that the Album version of Nobody Knows me does not hold a candle to the version in the Remixed&Revisited EP. It's called the old school mix..ask your wife or daughters if they've got the CD. Listen to that mix. It is fantastic. Enjoy:)
68 -
Lomu
Mar 27, 2004 at 5:16 pm
In art, the Paris Salon might be an equivalent place to look; many, if not most of the 'great' artists of the time were enshrined/accepted by the Salon competitions and were later either forgotten or marginalized as sentimental, commercial hacks by scholars, collectors, fans, and historians. And it turns out many of the painters rejected by the Salon are now some of the biggest names in art history.
You have made my point for me, Sharky old boy! Dead Artists who were criticised in their day and now exalted.
Let us leave it.
Lomu, you have been good to read:) Ofcourse I have scanned through sometimes. I just can not be bothered to join in the "merriment":) Still can't be bothered. As Mr Olsen has told you, we've been there and done that. As far as substance to my opinions on Mr Olsen, been there, done that. You have read Pitchfork media post? If you haven't, please try. When you do, connect the dots with my accusations and I do not think it will be rocket science. Trust me. On the other hand, let him tell you what "major media outlet" he writes for weekly. Try and keep up with them and make up your own mind. I am not here to influence anybodys opinions on anybody. Not on Olsen. Not on CL. I certainly was not looking for more Courtney Love fans. She has fansites I can visit if I want. She has more than enough. Still, if you have a new found appreciation, all's well that ends well:) It's a gift I have, i achieve things without trying;)
Sandra Smallson said: Eric, go and read Tom Johnson's post. It is for "critics" like you. Though he did not mean it for you, I think those he refers to are made of the same ilk as your irresponsible self.
I wish I'd seen this a few days ago, so I could set this straight when more people would see it. My post had NOTHING to do with Eric, who is and always has been a very fair critic and I really don't appreciate something I wrote being twisted into meaning that.
Sandra, Jesus, take a Doan's and relax for once. Madonna will survive a few people not praising her as the musical messiah you seem to think she is.
72 -
Sandra Smallson
Mar 28, 2004 at 6:56 am
Tom Johnson, I think YOU need to take a chill pill and take the cape off. Goodness gracious!
CAN YOU NOT READ? I clearly said in that quote that you have responded to..that "THOUGH HE(being YOU) did not mean it for him (being Eric) I think..(I being ME, ME = not you = not Eric = ME)he is of sme ilk with said people you criticise. What you posted has not been twisted. Did I change the words? I simply applied it to a journalist that I=ME=NOT YOU felt had the same traits as those you described. What you think about Eric as a journalist is irrelevant to me. I think the complete opposite.
Now, I am sure Eric can survive a few people not praising him like the paragon of journalism that you seem to think he is.
73 -
Lomu
Mar 28, 2004 at 1:52 pm
Eric, what paper do you write for? Can I access it online?
Sandra, I have listened to the Mount Simms mix, I think it's called. It's for the clubs my daughters tell me. It's alright. Maybe it's my age showing but I like her quieter songs such as "Oh Father" and the like.
Your last sentence in your response to Tom made me shake my head with mild amusement. You are a sharp one. Nothing gets by you.
74 -
duane
Mar 28, 2004 at 2:00 pm
"You are a sharp one. Nothing gets by you."
Nothing except logic. Good Christ.
75 -
Eric Olsen
Mar 28, 2004 at 3:05 pm
Thanks Tom, I appreciate the kind words; no concern about the post, the hilarity of the "controversy" is that we ALL write about 95% positive reviews here, we couldn't be much less like Pitchfork.
Sandra, speak for yourself
Lomu, MSNBC.com, Cleveland Plain Dealer (Cleveland.com). In the past I have written for Salon, Playboy, Rolling Stone, Billboard, Mojo, Alernative Press, Option, All Music Guide, Hear/Say, many more regional and local, and I have written two books, both of which have won awards.
…
Article comments
— go to most recent comments26 - TDavid
No, actually, Sandra, here's what I'm saying:
What have you written or edited that makes you some sort of professional writing-related critic? You post like you've worked for some major publishing house for years. Here's just some of what you wrote:
This "journalist" friend of yours "can't be bothered" to do the one thing he is paid to do: write? Amazing journalist he must be! LOL
Yes, you are entitled to your opinion of Eric's piece and any of his past articles; you are totally within your right to criticize and disagree with Eric's opinion. But I don't think evidence supports what you are saying about him as a professional, that's where you get derailed.
You may not like his writing as a reader, but on a professional level, I don't think you have a leg to stand on with some of your commentary. Fine, just say you don't like his writing and don't agree with him, and don't like him, whatever, but don't try and bring unsubstantiated third parties in to make your point for you because that's beyond lame.
He is not a hack. He has credentials. You are the one who doesn't, capiche? I think he was baiting you a little bit with mentioning your name, but I think he was also poking in good fun and you can't be teased about your blind Madonna love without going crazy.
Now if you do have some writing-related credentials, then please produce them and this so called "double standard" of mine might actually make some sense. Until that time, I will continue to believe that I hit the nail squarely on the head and you are just flaming me as you have flamed others around here.
So flame on, again, Sandra. I'm totally expecting you to go postal on me like you did before.
Leopards and loons don't change their spots.
27 - Eric Olsen
Thanks TD, I appreciate your carrying the flame so ardently. I, unfortunately, can't pursue the topic at the moment because I am preparing drivel to foist upon a major media outlet.
And great last line!
28 - bhw
The fact that she burned crosses in the Like a Prayer video did not make the song bad. The fact that she was kissing women in the Justify my love video, did not make the song bad.
And they didn't make the songs good, either.
I think Madonna has very marginal musical talents. But she has great business acumen and marketing smarts, as well as an incredibly strong work ethic. She is entirely self-made in a male-dominated industry, and she deserves credit for that.
However, her longevity in the industry has to do with popularity, which is not necessarily the same thing as quality, musically speaking.
29 - duane
Sarah invokes Pete Sampras' tennis career as a sports analog to Madonna's music career when she says, "You do not win 14 slams and remain number 1 for 6 yrs in a row if all you've got is a big serve." Sarah, this is entirely fallacious reasoning. When Sampras wins, he wins by an objective criterion, namely, the score. It doesn't matter how his hair looks, or if he has a flair for color coordination, or how many shoe commercials he appears in. He is successful at tennis because he is good at tennis. Our opinion of his ability must be consistent with his win-loss record.
OK, that should be easy enough for you to understand. Now, next point. You think Madonna has a "score," too, namely, her record sales. You want to equate that with her ability as a musician. That's your error. If there were some kind of contest, one-on-one, where her musical ability were pitted against other musicians, she would suffer countless humiliating defeats. Most high-school marching band members would "wipe the court" with her.
And yet, Madonna sells records. We know that. That's the end result of marketing, connections, a good business sense, a nose for style and trends, and, most importantly, IMAGE. She has the financial wherewithal to hire good writers, producers, and musicians. I don't deny that she's successful. I maintain only that her success is not strongly correlated with her musical aptitiude. Allow us to respect Madonna as a successful businesswoman, while acknowledging that she is a musical weakling.
And I would really recommend that you try to keep a lid on your penchant for personal criticism. Although you feign indifference, your long-winded posts suggest otherwise. Why not try to preserve what little credibility you have left and play nice for a change?
30 - duane
I see that I am echoing bhw. Hat's off to you, bhw.
31 - duane
I see that I am echoing bhw. Good call, bhw.
32 - bhw
Thank you twice, duane.
If nothing else, Madonna is a cultural lightening rod.
Now if Eric would just hurry up and finish "searching within and seeing his faults" ....
33 - TDavid
duane - I like your points, but I have to ask: am I missing something here? Who is "Sarah"? Do you mean Sandra?
34 - duane
TDavid, yeah. Sorry Sandra.
35 - Sandra Smallson
Tdavid, I guess you and your cohorts are all musicians that is why you all have legs to stand on when you tell me what musical ability Madonna or any other artsit has. Ofcourse, you are all speaking from a professional point of view because you are all musicians? and Politicians, and filmmakers, etc etc. LOL. I can not believe you people type these things out and dont see how foolish you sound.
Eric Olsen is an irresponsible journalist and should re read the pitchfork media post over and over again so that in his next polluted piece via the main stream media he may become more self aware. Thank goodness he is a complete nobody. Just imagine if he was of any significance in the broad span of things?! What a travesty. Same goes for a number of you. End of story.
The rest of you flatter yourselves if you think I am going to argue with you about Madonna as a musician again. Why argue with people who have set views on things and who labour under misunderstandings and misconceptions before they even type the first word. Madonna is a musician whether you like it or not. If she does not deserve to be one in your view, too bad. Live with it. She more than deserves to be one in my view and in the view of many others. Diff strokes for diff folks. I leave this discussion. You can all continue writing about Madonna if you like. The level of stupidity is as always, overwhelming but what's new.
36 - Sandra Smallson
And duane, can u stop stalking me? Why follow me around this site? Geez. Do u have no shame? I have been ignoring you and yet you insist on following me everywhere seeking my attention. Take that appendage BHW with you when you disappear.
37 - duane
Good comeback. I stand corrected.
38 - bhw
Um, duane? Does Sandra know something I don't know about us?
39 - TDavid
Welcome to the Stalker Genitalia Club, Duane!
I was introduced to Sandra's World (see #39) a couple months ago. Party time, excellent! Excellent!
Seriously, it's odd how Sandra sort of reminds me of Madonna's music career.
Now maybe I should go on and on for two paragraphs about how stupid "all" of us are and silly and well really none of us know who we are because this is just one long, long, long ass run on sentence with no purpose but all of you don't get it because I'm not going to stay here and argue with any of you, even if you write back then I'll still say Madonna is the best and you all have small packages and are stalking me and need to get lifes and I love this site but I think you are all clueless and Eric's writing sucks and I know because I have a friend who is a journalist who said so and Phillip doesn't understand religion and I just can't talk to any of you because you keep following me around here and I'm going to keep writing until I've made my point at least ten times, no wait, make that fifteen times because if you don't like Madonna you all must have problems having sex and I'll just keep writing and maybe this is really just a keyboard exercise and --
(gasp)
Madonna and Sandra in a tree ...
Add "new material needed" to the shopping list for both of them.
40 - TDavid
Oh, and you too, bhw! Sorry, don't want to leave anybody, male or female, out of The Club.
41 - HW Saxton Jr.
Hey Guys,go easy on simple Sandra.She is
the best comedian at BC.
42 - Al Barger
I tend to want to be nice to you Ms Sandra, but my patience with women claiming or implying that they are being "stalked" online, and particularly on this site wears REAL thin, real quick. That crap rates just about as abusive and dishonest as Diva's constant whining about "racism."
This is a public space with public comments. If you make strong, obnoxious comments like yours in this thread, you're going to get mocked and criticized.
Expect it and accept it, or shut your piehole. Usually you have something interesting and worthwhile to add to the conversation, but you just seem to have kind of lost your mind here.
43 - duane
Thanks for the welcome, TDavid. I take it I'm in good company.
44 - Lomu
Madonna has been voted one of the 50 greatest and most influential musicians of all time by a panel of acclaimed musicians. Bono, Chrissie Hynde, Elvis Costello and 52 others.
They got her most vocal fan to write something on her. By the looks of it they should have searched you out Sandra.
I am narrow minded. I like Jazz. Miles Davis type jazz. I do not like the new breed of jazz musicians. I do not like pop music or rap or r&b or country music.
I am not disingenuos in any sense to say Madonna is not a musician. I do not own any of her Albums except her Immaculate Collection and the ballad compilation. Mostly for the wife but I do enjoy some of it. I would attend her concert if the tickets did not cost a whopping $300. The wife is attending the concert. She is taking our twin daughters. That is $900. If I went along, it would be $1200. I have a mortgage to pay off.
Sandra, I like your post on comment 35. We can all give opinions on anything to everything. It may not be a professional opinion but it is an opinion. A professional opinion has been given by 55 of Madonna's fellow musicians and I am sure you have a smile on your face like the cat that got the cream. Maybe you do not care what the bloggers are saying. You may see the RollingStones article as a statement of fact as far as you are concerned. Check it out.
I am impressed that Ms Smallson took the high road in this discussion and left you guys to it. It really was an unnecessary discussion.
For the record, I am not on Sandra's side or any side for that matter. These are just my thoughts on this topic. I simply found it an amusing coincidence that after seeing this topic for the last few days on this site, I should stumble upon RollingStones with musicians calling Madonna a musician and rightly so for Pete sake.
45 - bhw
I am impressed that Ms Smallson took the high road in this discussion
Lomu, I can't tell if you're tongue is in your cheek or not! If it's not, then that's freakin' hil-ar-ious.
46 - duane
Yes, Lomu, let's reminisce and take a little stroll down Sandra's "high road." Shall we? Come along, Lomu.
"But once there is Madonna or Sandra Smallson, you rear your ugly head. You must have a permanent hard on and may desire a threesome. On behalf of both let me assure you we would rather sleep with Ellen Degeneres."
"I can not believe you people type these things out and dont see how foolish you sound."
"Eric Olsen is an irresponsible journalist...."
"Thank goodness he is a complete nobody."
"The level of stupidity is as always, overwhelming...."
"And duane, can u stop stalking me?"
"Take that appendage BHW with you when you disappear."
"...was there any need to repost that ridiculous and senseless article of yours again?"
That's what you call the high road? Then you must live among subterranean troglodytes.
47 - Eric Olsen
Yes, thank goodness reasoned, respectful discourse has risen above hyperbolic insult.
I hear Madonna and Britney are going to do a small club acoustic tour next ....
WHEN HELL FUCKING FREEZES OVER
48 - Shark
my two cents:
Dick Tracy album = highlight of Madonna's recording career; she shoulda stuck to doing Betty Boop. Seriously, that stuff was great.
Lomu - Miles Davis? Jazz? Isn't that ...narcotic music?
BTW: The poll you cited is probably excellent proof that contemporaries are pisspoor judges of the historical value of anything that occurs during their time.
49 - Lomu
Duane do not involve me in your little man petty tiff with Sandra. I can read and I know what she has written. I know what you have written. I do not know why you and Tdavid feel the need to research the archives of Sandra's posts on Blog. It seems you have far more time for her than she has for you guys. It may not be how it is but it is how it seems.
I am impressed by Sandra leaving the argument when she did. She did take the high road while you all carried on like little boys researching her past posts and trying to see who could write the wittier comments amongst yourselves.
Eric you should be bigger than this. You have been unable to rise above it. If Ms Smallson thinks you are an irresponsible journalist, it is her opinion. I do not know the rightness or wrongness of it. I did not post on this topic to involve myself in that. All I can say to you is that your recent post seems to substantiate some of the doubts she has raised about you as a journalist.
You call Sandra a jabbering loon, flagrant idiot who knows nothing about anything. She says you are an irresponsible journalist who is a nobody. It seems you are very affected by what she has said to join this little men gathering of saying silly things.
Are you trying to bait her? I hope she does not pay any attention to any of you. I think this site has enough of little men running around trying to belittle people who do not see their point of view. Shark calls Macdiva, Mcdemon. The rest of you throw your fair share of insults at Smallson but once she responds it is like she is the only one who has thrown hyperbolic insults.
I don't know if the Madonna and Britney club tour was a joke. Whatever it was, I do not see how you can not see it only shows that there just might be some truth to Smallson saying you are like Pitchfork media.
A Madonna fan doubts your journalistic clout for a variety of reasons. You start poking fun at Madonna. It belittles you.
50 - Lomu
Shark, anyone who thinks Jazz is narcotic music and can not appreciate Miles davis is a waste of my time. Moreover, anyone who thinks the highlight of Madonna's career was the Dick tracy Album reads from a different page of the hymn sheet. You know what I'm saying!
I think it is fair to say that the reasonable man would rather take the opinions of contemporaries than the opinions of little men or a failed stand up comic. I have said enough. Exactly the reason I do not contribute often to this site. I am likely to become one of you. That is nothing to be proud of.
51 - Eric Olsen
Lomu, you and Sandra deserve each other. I will leave it at that.
The only reason I was drawn into any of this is that I wrote a postive review of both Madonna and Britney - you can read it above - and she behaved as if I had slagged them both to hell and back. She has said nothing whatsoever about any of this that makes any sense at all.
Since I write weekly for one of the largest media outlets on the web, I get mail all the time disagreeing with my opinion on this or that. I have zero problem with disagreement - it's just opinion - but I do not have people - never, not once - attacking my integrity as a writer, nor denying that I have something to say, and then never - not once - substantiating any of her accusations.
When people show up and shit on the living room rug, at first we are astonished, then we are angry, then when they won't clean it up we suggest they get the fuck out of the house.
This is the second time this individual has taken a big dump, for no apparent reason, right in he middle of the house. How do you think we should respond?
52 - Shark
Lomu, you need a friggin' humor transplant.
Coupla things:
1) you jumped into BC by insulting people because they insult people. How brilliant is that?
2) I was listening to jazz when you were in diapers, son.
3) I would say a "reasonable" man would ignore contemporary popularity polls when trying to estimate the historical impact of a living artist. In 50 years, Madonna won't be more than a minor footnote in history -- and only then, because of her marketing skills.
4) I have said enough. Exactly the reason I do not contribute often to this site. I am likely to become one of you.
You and your tightly wound sphincter will be sorely missed.
Seeya!
53 - TDavid
Get a sense of humor, Lomu. You'll live a lot longer. Take a Holiday, stop acting Like A Virgin.
When it comes to encountering new characters on the web, I take about .0000001% of the flamebait that I read from them in the comments section seriously.
This is not saying that I don't remember or recall when folks like these Material Girls say or do humorous things. You might improperly label this "research" but I call this simply having a memory and holding Everybody accountable In This Life for their prior words and actions.
Don't You Know that Sandra and the Diva are missing a career in comedy?! They are clearly Borderline.
As for your "little men" comment, isn't that supposed to be Sandra's line? Love Makes The World Go Round.
(rimshot)
Yeah, yeah, Amazing, I won't quit my day job. Here's a road map to taking the high road.
Promise To Try.
54 - Shark
TDavid, that was hilarious!
I was -- dare I say -- LOL.
"...stop acting like a virgin"
Oddly enough, truer words were never spoken.
55 - Lomu
Eric, there are many unsubstantiated opinions on Blog. Some of them could be yours. Some of them could be mine. Maybe Sandra did not feel it was a positive review. Whatever the case, it is her opinion and she may think it is substantiated. You know who you are and you know what you are. You should not allow the opinions of a reader reduce you to substantiating some of her accusations. Which with all due respect, I think you have done in some of your comments on this thread. I am sorry if I caused you any offence. I did not mean to. I am giving my opinion of this particular thread as I see it.
Shark, you were in diapers 47 years ago? You must be all of a 100 years old now. Well done. I do not see where I have insulted anyone. Please bring it to my notice. Madonna has been around since 1983 if the date on the remastered copy of her first Album is to be believed. 50 years from now, I think she will be far more than a foot note. In her life she has already accomplished so much, a living legend and in the Guiness Book of Records to the delight of the wife. The deeds of all humans are often over exaggerated after they are gone. The next generation will be over-stating Madonna as an Artist as we over-state every other Artist that has gone before. I do not know of any dead Artist who did not suffer the sort of criticism you give Madonna when they were alive. Now, they are exalted. All the Artists that have made an impact will be over-stated when they are gone. History teaches us that. You are wrong there, ma boy.
TDavid, well done. I am impressed by your knowledge of Madonna song titles. The wife assures me Promise to Try is a gem. I will look for it. Thank you for the heads up. Sorry. I had to call the wife to identify some of the song titles I could not decipher. If you had to do research on the titles, that is more impressive. It gives credence to my statement that you have a lot of time on your hands. For Sandra and Madonna. Lucky girls.
56 - Lomu
Sandra, I know you must scan through this thread. You must be curious as to what is being said. Your will power is inspiring. I invite you to join in the merriment of this thread. I'll give you an incentive. The attitude of the old men is turning me into a Madonna fan.
I have borrowed my daughter's collection. I am listening to her Cds. I may pay the $300 for her tour. I am reading archives of articles and interviews. I am beginning to think I am doing the Madonna elective in Women studies I hear they have in an Amsterdam University. I always wondered why Germaine Greer and the other feminists were always at each others throats about the influence of Madonna's Art. Talk about cultural impact.
If my business partner ever finds out what I am doing with my time off. It is quite fascinating and interesting. How she has grown as an Artist and steered her own course inspite of the people trying to influence her career choices. It is a good thing none of our friends here can do anything about it. There is a lot to be respected about the girl from Detroit.
I will quote Lyrics not titles.
" This world is not so kind
people trap your mind
it's so hard to find
someone to admire
It's no good when you're misunderstood, so why should I care, what the world thinks of me, won't let a stranger give me a social disease"...Madonna (Nobody Knows me. 2003)
She must be clairvoyant. Those lyrics suit the discussions on this thread down to the T. You have a convert. My wife and daughters are eternally grateful. Drop us a line. You must see you are dearly missed.
57 - Shark
Lomu, I thought you took your ball and went home?
Shark, you were in diapers 47 years ago? You must be all of a 100 years old now. Well done.
I'd respond, but it doesn't make any sense. Math much?
I do not know of any dead Artist who did not suffer the sort of criticism you give Madonna when they were alive.
That's because they were ignored and/or forgotten by history. Jeezus.
Lomu, we'll have to agree to disagree on this one, but I'll kiss yer ass if Madonna records are played with any consistency in 50 years.
(Other than as nostalgia for somebody like "the wife".)
58 - Shark
THEY'RE HARDLY PLAYED NOW, fer chrissakes.
59 - Eric Olsen
I'll agree I should not have allowed myself to be baited.
Madonna has value on several levels: marketing and iconography, yes, but her core body of work will stand the test of time. Whatever her status as a "musician," she is an auteur and has always been in charge of her own music and career. I begrudge her nothing.
Only a mad cow would read the review above and not take it as wholly positive, particularly about Madonna.
60 - Al Barger
Oh, Madonna's records will get SOME interest still in 50 years, but not as much as, say, the Monkees- a manufactured pop construct with much better SONGS.
61 - Eric Olsen
I like the Monkees just fine, but Madonna is in another universe of significance altogether. The fact that most of her music is derived from dance music styles in no way reduces her importance. Madonna will be in the Rock and Roll Hall of Fame as soon as she is eligible - the Monkees aren't and never will be (for what that's worth).
62 - Al Barger
A "Madonna elective in Women studies?" Oh God, what a screamingly pretentious load of crap. What is there to STUDY? This sounds very much like an excuse for some faux-intellectual jackasses to sit around making out how her self-prostitution constitutes some Profound Feminist Statement. Wow, she's been her OWN pimp. I'm impressed.
Perhaps a marketing class based on her career might be useful.
63 - Shark
Let's see...
Head vs Swept Away
Ca-ching! Slam dunk for the Monkees!
heh.
BTW: regarding Lomu's thesis, polls, R&R Hall of Fame, contemporaries' judgements, etc:
In art, the Paris Salon might be an equivalent place to look; many, if not most of the 'great' artists of the time were enshrined/accepted by the Salon competitions and were later either forgotten or marginalized as sentimental, commercial hacks by scholars, collectors, fans, and historians. And it turns out many of the painters rejected by the Salon are now some of the biggest names in art history.
Similar things happened w/many 19th century writers who were lionized in their day -- and currently can't be located on a bookstore shelf.
Yer turn, Lomu.
64 - Lomu
Shark, do you have a radio? What sort of music do you hear on the radio these days? If you had a radio you would not have made that comment. We do have to disagree on this one. You are beginning to stretch yourself out on what to say and your opinions are sounding thinner and thinner. I can not remember the last time I heard Miles davis on radio. I can not remember the last time I heard the Beatles on radio. Matter of fact, I can not remember the last time I heard Prince on radio. Radio plays hip-hop now, Shark.
Listen when they are playing the oldies. Try Z100 or Rick Fox. You will hear so much Madonna you will be tapping your fingers to the melodies and you will know the words soon enough. If you are the age you claim, you will be dead in 50 years. Your children will tell you about it in the afterlife. Ah, as we speak, there is Shirley Bassey covering Madonna's "You'll see". Never liked Dame Shirley Bassey. I think I have had enough of this discussion as well.
Eric, that is the right attitude if I may say so. It is strictly a matter of opinion what you feel about the status of someone in their profession. The only reason I joined this discussion is because of someone saying Madonna is not a musician. She fulfills the requirements, she is one. What you think of her ability as one is entirely up to you. Your opinion is not fact. If your opinion was fact we would not be having this discussion at all.
You do not hear people arguing if Clinton was the President in 1992. He was the president. That is a fact. What is not a fact, is what personal opinion you hold about Madonna or Clinton. The problem is with people who fail to see that opinions are not facts.
65 - Shark
Radio?
What the hell does that have to do with anything?!
Lomu, I'm sorry, but your lack of logic and/or an articulate point makes me feel like I'm debating a tree. We're wasting time; we should just leave it at:
* You love Madonna and think she's going to have a really significant impact on future generations.
* I 'like' Madonna and think that in the overall scheme of musical history, she'll be a footnote... or more likely, a photograph.
66 - Jim Carruthers
Madonna? Ain't that the bint who got cuffed for rubbing her arse in Toronto? And she has the nerve to attempt it again when the Brass Rail and Jilly's is right down the street?
Wot? there's music involved? Isn't there always music with peelers?
67 - Sandra Smallson
Lomu, you have been good to read:) Ofcourse I have scanned through sometimes. I just can not be bothered to join in the "merriment":) Still can't be bothered. As Mr Olsen has told you, we've been there and done that. As far as substance to my opinions on Mr Olsen, been there, done that. You have read Pitchfork media post? If you haven't, please try. When you do, connect the dots with my accusations and I do not think it will be rocket science. Trust me. On the other hand, let him tell you what "major media outlet" he writes for weekly. Try and keep up with them and make up your own mind. I am not here to influence anybodys opinions on anybody. Not on Olsen. Not on M. I certainly was not looking for more Madonna fans. She has fansites I can visit if I want. She has more than enough. Still, if you have a new found appreciation, all's well that ends well:) It's a gift I have, i achieve things without trying;)
My contribution is to tell you that the Album version of Nobody Knows me does not hold a candle to the version in the Remixed&Revisited EP. It's called the old school mix..ask your wife or daughters if they've got the CD. Listen to that mix. It is fantastic. Enjoy:)
68 - Lomu
In art, the Paris Salon might be an equivalent place to look; many, if not most of the 'great' artists of the time were enshrined/accepted by the Salon competitions and were later either forgotten or marginalized as sentimental, commercial hacks by scholars, collectors, fans, and historians. And it turns out many of the painters rejected by the Salon are now some of the biggest names in art history.
You have made my point for me, Sharky old boy! Dead Artists who were criticised in their day and now exalted.
Let us leave it.
69 - Jim Carruthers
And in Bizarro World were all am right:
70 - Leandro Brazil
Hi From Brazil!!!!!!!
71 - Tom Johnson
Sandra Smallson said: Eric, go and read Tom Johnson's post. It is for "critics" like you. Though he did not mean it for you, I think those he refers to are made of the same ilk as your irresponsible self.
I wish I'd seen this a few days ago, so I could set this straight when more people would see it. My post had NOTHING to do with Eric, who is and always has been a very fair critic and I really don't appreciate something I wrote being twisted into meaning that.
Sandra, Jesus, take a Doan's and relax for once. Madonna will survive a few people not praising her as the musical messiah you seem to think she is.
72 - Sandra Smallson
Tom Johnson, I think YOU need to take a chill pill and take the cape off. Goodness gracious!
CAN YOU NOT READ? I clearly said in that quote that you have responded to..that "THOUGH HE(being YOU) did not mean it for him (being Eric) I think..(I being ME, ME = not you = not Eric = ME)he is of sme ilk with said people you criticise. What you posted has not been twisted. Did I change the words? I simply applied it to a journalist that I=ME=NOT YOU felt had the same traits as those you described. What you think about Eric as a journalist is irrelevant to me. I think the complete opposite.
Now, I am sure Eric can survive a few people not praising him like the paragon of journalism that you seem to think he is.
73 - Lomu
Eric, what paper do you write for? Can I access it online?
Sandra, I have listened to the Mount Simms mix, I think it's called. It's for the clubs my daughters tell me. It's alright. Maybe it's my age showing but I like her quieter songs such as "Oh Father" and the like.
Your last sentence in your response to Tom made me shake my head with mild amusement. You are a sharp one. Nothing gets by you.
74 - duane
"You are a sharp one. Nothing gets by you."
Nothing except logic. Good Christ.
75 - Eric Olsen
Thanks Tom, I appreciate the kind words; no concern about the post, the hilarity of the "controversy" is that we ALL write about 95% positive reviews here, we couldn't be much less like Pitchfork.
Sandra, speak for yourself
Lomu, MSNBC.com, Cleveland Plain Dealer (Cleveland.com). In the past I have written for Salon, Playboy, Rolling Stone, Billboard, Mojo, Alernative Press, Option, All Music Guide, Hear/Say, many more regional and local, and I have written two books, both of which have won awards.