Which is more important? CDs with fewer, higher quality songs at a lower price, or as many songs as possible (about 80 minutes) at a higher price? My answer as of the moment would be fewer tracks for less, with bonus tracks and features available through the Internet so you can get them if you want them, but they aren't clogging up the CD if you don't. And while the whole point of the digital revolution is more consumer choice, there is still something to be said for the "official" version of an album, an album as an entity unto itself, especially at a lower price with the "filler" optional via the Internet.
Sony US president Don Ienner said something similar:
- Record labels are urging artists to put fewer tracks on albums because fans are put off by too many average songs, the Los Angeles Times has reported.
"There's been a tendency to overload CDs because the technology permits it," Sony US president Don Ienner said.
....Record labels are urging the clampdown on album tracks as a way of reversing a three-year-long slump in album sales.
"The final choice will always be the artist's, but I feel - and consumer research bears it out - that the public thinks albums have too much filler," Mr Ienner told the paper.
"We all should be concerned about giving music buyers good value, whether they're getting eight, 10 or 20 songs."
....The LA Times said changes would mean a "shake-up" in the music industry, which was structured around albums of up to 16 tracks selling for $12.
The article compared Bruce Springsteen's 1975 album Born to Run - which had only eight tracks - against the recent chart-topping album Speakerboxxx/The Love Below, which had 34 songs.
Some record company executives are now saying album albums should have 10 or fewer songs, the paper reported. [BBC]
Article comments
— go to most recent comments1 - Taloran
This is the telling line - "Record labels are urging the clampdown on album tracks as a way of reversing a three-year-long slump in album sales."
They don't give a rat's ass what the artists produce, as long as people buy it en masse.
2 - Craig Lyndall
Well, I have been saying this for a while. I think that the CD length has ruined a lot of albums because artists feel compelled to fill it all up. They should focus more on writing complete albums regardless of length.
Here are some of my favorite albums of all time.
Pearl Jam - Ten - 11 Tracks
Nirvana - Nevermind - 12 Tracks
Mineral - Endserenading - 10 Tracks
Death Cab - Transatlanticism - 11 Tracks
Pink Floyd - Dark Side - 9 Tracks
Smashing Pumpkins - Gish - 10 Tracks
Coldplay - Rush of Blood - 11 Tracks
Counting Crows - August - 11 Tracks
Acid Bath - Kite String - 14 Tracks
Coinmonster - The Schematic - 11 Tracks
It's like my friend the film major used to say about movies. "You can make a movie shorter by increasing its running time, and you can make a movie longer by decreasing its running time." It's more about substance and how it all fits together instead of actual measurements of quantity.
3 - TDavid
I'm in the camp -- if the space is there, then use it. There are other things the artist's can put on these CDs besides songs to encourage me to buy their CDs. How about wallpaper? Screensavers? Extras like they do with DVDs.
Stuff I cannot get if I buy it through iTunes, Rhapsody, Napster, etc.
4 - Craig Lyndall
That's a fair comment, I am just saying don't include songs that interrupt the continuity of a record. I think we can all agree on that one.
5 - JR
Tales From Topographic Oceans - only 4 tracks (oh wait..)
6 - Mark Saleski
i just bought that on vinyl a coupla weeks ago.
7 - JR
I see that the CD reissue of "Tales From Topographic Oceans" has added material.
8 - Eric Olsen
I would like access to bonus stuff either on a separate CD in the package, or online via a password or whatever, but I would like to see the actual CD reflect the very strongest material, and be put together in a logical manner.
9 - JR
I like how they did the Elvis Costello reissues, with the added material on a second disc and the price comparable to a new-release single CD ($18.99 list, which is still too expensive, but it could be worse).
10 - TDavid
Why the need for a separate CD, Eric, when the space is available and there? I mean, put the CD in your computer and get additional content? To me, it sounds like a win-win-win for the consumer, the record company and the artist (links or promotion to their website).
Just imagine if Blogcritics released music and you could pack in website content (reviews and extra content) on the same CD? Good promotional value there ;)
11 - Tom Johnson
The problem with short CDs is that people don't feel like they're getting their money's worth out of them. No matter how good the music is, they're going to feel like they're getting a better deal on something else that has more songs and a longer running time. The conundrum, as pointed out, is that all that material may not be so strong. I've really noticed this with the Elvis Costello remasters by Rhino. Having all the b-sides/etc. relegated to a separate disc entirely changes how I feel about some albums that I'd felt were just way too long on the Ryko versions. If you didn't know the original CDs, which reflected the vinyl running time limits, you never really knew what the "real" end of the album was. It just kept going and going, mixing in distracting demos and live tracks.
It would be nice if the running time of the album could be reflected in the price, so that 35 minute disc costs significantly less than an 80 minute disc. 35 minutes is just slightly above EP length to me. Why shouldn't I pay slightly above EP-length price, too?
12 - Eric Olsen
TD, I'd like separate to keep downward pressure on prices - you should only have to pay for the "good" stuff, the best the artist has to offer at the time - and to have that "best" material put together into a single entity, formerly know as an "album." I want free access to bonus stuff, but i dont' want it cluttering up my "album."
13 - Craig Lyndall
"The problem with short CDs is that people don't feel like they're getting their money's worth out of them."
They also don't feel like they got their money's worth if they pay good money for an album that has a lot of bad songs on it. If your album can have 3 good singles and the other 7 songs are good filler that take a listener on a journey, your album will be successful. If you pepper them with every piece of crap that was recorded in the studio you will leave a bad taste in their mouth.
14 - Tom Johnson
There's no reason for the bonus material to not be on a second disc. The raw materials are dirt cheap. (Which is why I REALLY balk at having to pay double the price for two-disc sets - it does not cost the record company twice as much to produce two discs of material that was already recorded anyway.) I'd much rather see a good flow of songs than have it all lumped together.
15 - Mark Saleski
i kinda like shorter cds...that's probably because of years of listening to vinyl.
but last night i listened to Let It Be and was struck by how concise it is....short too.
but i don't think concise-ness means that the recording has to be short.
as far as bonus material goes, i don't mind if its tacked onto the end...though i prefer a second disc (like the Costello reissues).
anybody have any cds with the alternate takes interleaved with the original tunes? man, i hate that!
16 - TDavid
I see your point Tom & Eric on the separation but for me it's a matter of convenience.
Keeping track of one CD is easier than two ;) I don't know about the rest of you but it seems like the plastic CD packaging for two CDs is often too fragile and not very handy. You have to dig the CD out to get to the one on the other side. Several times I've bought CDs where the docking holes were already broken from shipping, so the disc doesn't seat properly.
Also, while on this subject, does anybody know where you can buy replacement 2-CD containers?
So to recap, for me anyway, this has nothing to do with pricing, just convenience. If Disc 1 has 200 MB free, then use it I say, don't put it on Disc 2 and call it a bonus disc because as a matter of convenience I don't think that works. To me this bonus disc equates to: easier to misplace/lose/damage disc
17 - Eric Olsen
TD, and I can understand your view also, but for me the convenience cmes from not having to dash to the player to shut it off when the crap starts to flow, or worse yet, as Makr said, when the crap is interspersed with the "A" material.
18 - Craig Lyndall
You can buy CD case replacements from a number of places, I like to use this one.
http://www.sleevetown.com/
19 - TDavid
Well as far as separating data from music content, that's already happening, Eric. If you put a disc in your computer it has the potential to behave differently then putting in your stereo. And of course most car stereos would ignore the data tracks.
But maybe we are talking apples and oranges here? You are talking about additional music tracks and I'm talking about adding bonus (web/computer) data to the same disc as the music if the space is there.
I think in the case of adding more songs, which is the central focus of this piece, then I think that all depends on the artist. As I put in my blog entry earlier (see trackback) there are some artists I wouldn't mind hearing whatever they produce. Yeah, even the crap LOL
Fans are fans, yanno?
I'm curious, for example, what the hell Guns 'N Roses has been up to all these years. Axl Rose claims this new GNR has nearly 3 albums worth of material. Does this mean 30 songs? 40, 50? Whatever, I'll be buying at least the first offering no matter how many songs are on the disc(s).
Also what about Van Halen? I refuse to accept that Eddie hasn't been in their 5150 studio cranking out mucho quality material that will someday be releashed (I sure hope not posthumously)
20 - Craig Lyndall
Mucho quality material like the stuff he did with Gary Cherone? This goes back to another conversation we were having about music holding up to stand the test of time. I don't think Van Halen will stand the test of time. For me personally it is an anecdote at this point anyway only because David Lee Roth keeps popping up. When he dies so does the Van Halen stuff IMO. Then again, I have never been a big or even moderate fan of their stuff, so....
21 - TDavid
That brings up something else about playing music in your computer. You can select which tracks you can skip tracks you don't want to listen to, effectively changing the content on the CD. And of course you can rip/burn only the quality tracks and then make your own CD with your favorites on it.
I'm sure there are some stereos / boomboxes that allow customizing track lists also, but I do acknowledge that this requires additional programming (and thus may not be very convenient for some folks).
I am all in favor of the cafeteria/buffet concept for music (bet nobody could tell! LOL) -- in other words I'll pick and choose what I like and leave the rest for somebody else to choose from. The more choices the artist gives me, the better, IMHO.
It is entirely possible the artist left some really good song on the cutting room floor and by reducing the tracks, then we may miss out on discovering a gem in the slushpile.
Now that we can pay this way through online music services, this is a really exciting period of time for music fans.
22 - JR
"anybody have any cds with the alternate takes interleaved with the original tunes? man, i hate that!"
"Fool No More" on the Fleetwood Mac "Complete Blue Horizon" box set: it has all the false starts (like, eight of them) on the same TRACK as the master take. It's my favorite song on the album, and I have to fast forward three-and-a-half minutes into the track to listen to the only complete version of the song. That was a serious formatting fuck-up.
I've been wondering if I can transfer an edited version of the track to a recordable CD, but the computer guy here at work says my CD burner won't do that.
23 - TDavid
Craig - I don't blame Eddie for Gary Cherone's vocals, do you? Yes, of course the music (VH III) wasn't as good as their other stuff, but not all the stuff with Hagar was spectacular either.
I think someone as mega talented as Eddie Van Halen simply cannot be discounted, no matter how much ring rust he has.
Even Stephen King (ok, different area) has churned out some lemons. The great ones don't always do great things.
Michael Jordan shouldn't have come back and played with the Wizards, but that doesn't mean he couldn't kick most our asses on the court.
I am not sure that there is such a thing as being "washed up" on the guitar until one physically can't play any more. This assumes, of course, that the person playing the guitar is talented like Eddie Van Halen.
And when you have your own studio in your basement or garage or wherever 5150 is located, that convenience lends itself to plenty of availability for creating some "mucho quality material"
24 - Taloran
The album Passion, Grace and Fire by DiMeola, McLaughlin and DeLucia is only 30 minutes or so long. While it leaves you wanting more, I've never heard anyone say they felt cheated because it was too short.
Best to leave the fan wanting more, like Barry Sanders, than hang around too long, like Michael Jordan.
25 - JR
Eddie Van Halen is criminally under-rated right now, as witnessed by the rather bland Mr. Clapton ranking above him even in the respectable "best guitar players" poll by Taloran. I predict that at some point there will be a Van Halen revival as their place in music history becomes better appreciated.
But that last album sounded far too weak for it all to be Gary Cherone's fault.