In fact for me personally speaking I declared Punk Rock oficially dead after I'd seen the Dead Kennedys play in Hollywood with T.S.O.L., The Cheifs & I forget who all else ca. 1981 and there probably a couple hundred of San Fernando Valley headbangers holding up their lighters as they shouted encore, while the rest of the crowd was pelting the stage with beer cups,sneakers,flyers and any & all many of flying projectile. They did encore and Jello had a good chuckle at the hair farmers and the lighters. But these are just the long winded reminisces of a event close to 25 years ago. Sheesh I'm getting old.
Well, anyway for a brief point in time, Punk was something that was fun and interesting, different, unique and driven by intelligent,like minded but not too like minded people who were looking for something that you could call your own for the time being, something that would remedy the doldrums of late 1970's F/M radio. Misfits, artists, musicians, anti-musicians, poets, rejects, drug addicts, gay people. In general, marginalized people, angry people, people looking for kindred spirits in dive bars and anywhere else you could pull of a gig or two before you got booted by the owners.
Or as the case may be literally booted by the cops upside your head or square in the ass. I narrowly escaped arrest after a punk show in East Hollywood at The Polish American Hall at which The Weirdos, Screamers, Mau Maus, Vicious Circle, The Speed Queens and some other bands the names of which escape me at the present played and which L.A.P.D raided for improper permit, so they claimed.
A handful of L.A.'s finest walked into the hall, saw a couple dozen kids doing the alligator and pogoing declared it a riot and charged off into the crowd swinging truncheons & flashlights while people were sent off screaming, running and just scattering to anywhere and everywhere there wasn't a cop coming from. By a miracle of sorts, my friends and I escaped and spent the next couple of hours hiding behind a dumpster in a completely horrible gang & drug infested Mexican neighborhood praying that the helicopters and /or rollers didn't see us. We could not go back to get our car and with our leathers, boots and gear we were just asking for it should the police see us. By comparison, the local gang bangers we ran into were mellow.
Article comments
— go to most recent comments1 - Eric Olsen
very nice HW - I too knew the bride when she used to rock 'n' roll
2 - Bennett
Totally worth reading. I am impressed.
3 - Dave Nalle
Good insights, but as someone who lived through the same era and continued to listen to music, I have to say that I think a stream of genuine punk did live on beyond 1981. There's a lot of pseudo-punk and way too much punk-lite and pop punk, but the real thing is still out there too.
What's your response to bands like Rancid, Social Distortion, Sublime, Dropkick Murphy and even Green Day? Seems to me they tapped into the genuine punk vein in at lest some way.
Dave
4 - Bob
You were spot on with the comment: "In general, marginalized people, angry people, people looking for kindred spirits in dive bars..." That is the early crowd as I remember them (myself included), although in many cases it wasn't bars, but houses, at least in Portland where I first found a home.
---
I never realized I was there the night punk died... it seems the crowd that night had a large number of - shall we say - newcomers who ventured north to the Hollyweird scene.
There were several shows in a 3-4 month period around that one which I believe heralded a changing of the guard. Don't get me wrong, OC was like a second home, in fact we are today commonly referred to as being from Huntington Beach, although we were never based anywhere but Hollywood.
---
To this day I carry a souviner from the Polish American Hall gig. I was met going down the side stair case by several LA sheriffs running up it who decided that I needed a night-stick to the belly to clear the way for them. Unfortunately I had surgery two days earlier and they landed a direct hit on the stiches in my belly button , leaving me with a one of a kind half inny / half outty. You really needed to know that didn't you... just thought I'd share.
--Bob
5 - Eric Olsen
I agree with Dave that there was plenty of good punk in the '80s and '90s, but it was music as opposed to any kind of meaningful movement
6 - Cerulean
I was into Punk Rock in the seventies when there there about thirty people in my state that understood it. We all knew each other. We had to make our own punk clothing, makeup and hair dyes. I thought it was going to herald a revolution that would change the world.
7 - Eric Olsen
you mean I missed it?
8 - Cerulean
I'm not sure who Eric's comment is directed at, but if you have to ask, you probably did.
9 - Eric Olsen
it was just a little rib-tickler
10 - wally bangs
Punk probably died when the first mohawk was spotted in my suburban town around the middle of the 80's. When it penetrated that far, the end was near. Great post HW.
11 - HW Saxton
Thanks for all the responses guys it's
nice to be read once in a while.Bob,we
got lucky at The Polish American Hall.
Somehow we didn't get our asses kicked
in by the L.A.P.D.or the Sheriffs dept.
I wasn't so lucky one night at "The Vex"
in East L.A. A group of us were at Jack In The Box up the street on Brooklyn Ave
when several of LA's finest held us for
about half an hour before letting us go.
We had done nothing wrong but looked
like Punks.
We were lined against a wall frisked and
had our feet kicked out from behind us
causing us to fall into the wall face
first ending up with what was basically
road rash down one side of my face and
a decent shiner to boot. Our only crime
was looking like punks.Boots, bandanas,
overcoats you know, the basic Hollywood
punk look. We did get to see the show
though which featured all Chicano punk
bands that night: The Stains,Hey Taxi,
The Undertakers and I believe Saccharine
Trust.Great old venue in an insanely bad
& dangerous neighborhood: Brooklyn Ave &
Soto St. in the heart of Boyle Heights.
I would not go there in the day time at
this point in my life now,much less go &
wander alleys looking for a place to sit
& drink beer before the show in the mid
middle of sat. nite I'm often amazed I'm
here to post this shit out today.
12 - Cerulean
Hmmmm. I'm sorry about that. We didnt' have violence against us where I lived. For one thing, no one knew what the hell we were. There wasn't really violence at the clubs either.
13 - Shark
Great post, Saxman! And it's really refreshing to read your stuff with no weird line breaks!
=========
And just for the record, I WAS A PUNK BEFORE YOU WERE!
(I sported a safety pin when I was in diapers! So there!)
xxoo
Shark
14 - Mark Saleski
great post.
i loved the chaotic (if forced) nature of early punk.
i usedta drive my friends crazy on friday nights listening to the punk show on the campus radio station (this was, i think...1980). it was called 'Decline of the West' and was just friggin' brutal.
i loved every nasty second of it.
there are bits of NuSuburbanPunk that i like, but don't really bother making the comparison to the old stuff.
15 - Shark
BTW: Just a historical note for the cultural illiterates who've never seen a black and white movie -- and think that a 78rpm is really a large, heavy coaster.
It could be argued that Punks owe a bit of debt to some brilliant, subversive old guys such as Charles Ives, Tristan Tzara, Marinetti, Pratella, and the late-great Russolo -- and later, Spike Jones, Raymond Scott, and *John Cage.
*Who can't forget the melody and lyrics to his infamous musical composition "4'33"?!
16 - gonzo marx
just my 2 guilders worth here..
first "punk" ...Buddy Holly..
last Moment of true "Punk" was 1981..Elvis Costello was on Saturday Night Live..he was told by NBC to play "Less than Zero" which is quite subversive in it's own way..but they did NOT want him to play another of his songs, since they owned quite a few radio stations at the time...
the Band came out, and played 2 bars of the song requested...Costello then stopped the band and said into the camera "i'm sorry folks, but that song isn't really relevant" and then broke into "Radio,Radio"...
they played it with balls to the walls abandon...the show went to commercial..and there was NO second song later in the program
Elvis was banned from American Radio for years
to your humble Narrator...that Moment ended Punk and began "New Wave"
your mileage may vary..
(PS..i have a bad copy of that video on my computer)
Excelsior!
17 - HW Saxton
Gonzo,This post was posted prematurely.
It was only about maybe 1/2 way done.In
Pt 2 I'll feature who I think was really
the first rocker to stylistically and to
ideologically hit upon what I feel are
the roots of Punk Rock. Hint: It wasn't
Bobby Fuller,though he is on my list of
proto-punks. It's not Little Richard,I'm
saving him for a history of the roots
of Bling Bling.It's not Buddy either but
I'm a huge fan of his and Bobby Fuller
was also and was as greatly influenced
by Buddy Holly as The Stones were by Mr.
Chuck Berry.Also,Thanx fer reading this
by the way.Much appreciated.
18 - Cerulean
I think that new wave like Elvis Costello is just as subversive, innovative and important as punk. Where I live the same clubs played Punk, New Wave, and Ska. Elvis Costello is a genius.
19 - HW Saxton
Shark,Thanks for giving this the once
over. You couldn't be more right about
the connection to Dada and Surrealism.
The Cleveland punk band Pere Ubu were
directly inspired to start a band after
reading Alfred Jarry's "Ubu Roi" and a
Northern California punk rock band went
and named themselves after my favorite
B & W film of all time by Luis Bunuel:
"Los Olvidados".Which is easily the best
of the films he made during his stay in
Mexico.I think that it's one of the best
films ever anywhere.Period.Wouldn't you
agree? Nothing like a film with a happy
ending. And that's nothing like a happy
ending. LOL!
PS:Some of the greatest 60's punk bands
were all from TX. Elevators,Mouse & The
Traps,Moving Sidewalks,Josephus,Scotty
MacKay,Red Krayola and on and on. So I
won't argue your point on you being a
'punk" before I was. I couldn't imagine
having long hair in Tejas in the 60's.
It must have been very similar to be a
person of color in the Jim Crow South.
20 - Mat
When I recently quizzed a 19 year old female friend I was intrigued to hear her admit that she liked punk music.
You like the dead kennedys?
no
the stooges?
no
henry rollins?
no
Who then?
Avril Lavigne. I knew it was time to change the subject.
21 - Dave Nalle
But don't you think, HW, that at the point where you're reading Brunel, you've already ceased to be punk?
There's a lot of art rock like the Talking Heads or Devo or Pere Ubu or even the Dead Kennedys which piggytailed on the back of Punk in that period right around 1980, but lacked the urban working class ethos that really drove bands like the Buzzcocks and the Clash and the Ramones.
Oh, and Mat - Henry Rollins isn't punk. He may be _a_ punk, but his music isn't punk.
Dave
22 - Mark Saleski
Black Flag isn't punk? hardcore? is there a big difference?
23 - Dave Nalle
Yes, enormous.
Dave
24 - Shark
DaveKnowItAllNalle: "...But don't you think, HW, that at the point where you're reading Brunel, you've already ceased to be punk?"
It's BUNUEL, son. And no, anyone who opened a film with a closeup of a razor blade cutting an eyeball automatically gets inducted into the Punk Hall of Fame.
25 - Eric Berlin
Punk and hardcore are at least close cousins of one another. Thus the term "hardcore punk."
A friend of mine used to mildly scoff at the "light punk" I listened to at the time (NOFX, The Damned, Suicide Machines) as compared to his scene, which was more on the Downset, Sevendust, and a whole bunch of metal stylings. I like the comparison of light punk and hardcore punk anyway.
I also really love Downset's first album, as an aside.