Anyone catch MTV's 22 Greatest MCs show? The moment they announced number 22 I knew we were gonna have beef. Their list was the result of a public poll, so I have to give a little slack given all the youngsters that likely voted.
(Originally posted on Move the Crowd)…
Article comments
— go to most recent comments76 - Dew
Michael,
You know what I love Bahamadia, I have Kollage and BBQueen, she just slipped my mind while I was replying. I think she is one of the most under-rated and she actually has a message.
As far as Rage goes, I will give her another chance. I had forgotten about Chronic I do vaguely remember some nice bars from that classic. So I will go back and definitely see what she had to offer.
And Joe,
'but none of us are perfect' 6 words summed up what you attempted to say in 2 paragraphs. No rebut necessary we are saying the same thing.
77 - D.Tansy
Oh, Jebus!
Sorry about you'se guys lack of TASTE
and/or comprehension of RAP.
So, Tupac was kilt by the US Fed? It
wasn't his crocodile mouth -vs- Tweety
Bird ass that got him shot to death by
REAL thugs for talking shit? How the
hell did CNN News miss that?
Personally, I liked most of his shit,
he dogged everybody pretty equally, &
he spoke on a LOT more levels than
most people gave him credit for. But,
he talked a lot of SHIT, and STARTED a
lot of SHIT, then wondered why it was
that people wanted to punch HOLES in
his ass.
It came as no suprise to me that he
made it into the coroner's office so
"Jung", and the more probable culprits
were his PEERS, whom he had directly
made threats to, (and enemies of) with
that aforementioned Crocodile Mouth.
It never ceases to amaze me that young
idiots talk MAJOR shit about how "BAD"
they are, and how loud their GUN will
speak, only to find out that they
DON'T have the only gun on the planet,
and all the REAL badboyz are DEAD or
in PRISON.
BANG.
Everlast: "Talked some shit and wound
up DEAD." Can ya DIG it?
Here's MY take on this:
NOT all "music" conforms to YOUR (or
any SINGLE person's) ideas of "what music
is" or "is not." Music is defined in the
ear of the listener, as BEAUTY is, in the
eye of the beholder. Generally, what your
ear is acclimated to is what IS music,
and any other sounds have to be within those
parameters to even be "acceptable".
Towit: If MY ear likes it, it's MUSIC, but
if not, it's NOISE. That 700,000 humans say
this song IS and that one ISN'T, will NOT
change my mind, because 100,000 Lemmings
CAN be wrong.
Okay, first, Vanilla Ice wouldn't make a
pimple on a rapper's ass.
TuPac was NOT Black Jebus. He's DEAD like
Jebus, but that's where the similarity ends.
Sorry about BOTH "saviors".
Eminem is Dr. Dre's token Whitebread. If Dre
HADN'T produced and carried his ass, failure
would've occurred LONG ago. Top POP, crap rap.
Dr. Dre IS, in fact, a HISTORICAL rapper, and
few of the current wannabe's and clowns will
ever reach the heights he's already achieved.
The distinction between "Rapper" and "MC" is
an un-necessary one, the actual distinction
is between RAP and Hip-Hop. Check the ballistics.
"Canibus"... wannabe hardass, big-bad, studio
gang-star. Mean-muggin' don't make a rapper.
If all that's required is talking the talk,
and having the look, most of the wannabe's
would already have it made!
NWA didn't even get MENTIONED, nor did ANY
of the TRUE old-school rappers. The early 90's
came in with a GANG of rappers like DJ Quik,
Dre & Snoop, E40, Too $hort, Ice Cube, Ice T,
Public Enemy, and a list of the REAL too long
to go into here. My FIRST instinct was to run
the list of WOMEN, starting w/ Our Lady of Rage!
By herself, she'd boot most of the names on
EITHER list. Between her and Latifah, and the
likes of Salt & Pepa, well, if that didn't get
the point across, you're THICK between the ears.
Bottom line? These "lists" were compiled without
much serious thought, MTV's created from sheer
IGNORANCE, (VOTE whether you know what you're
saying or NOT) Michael's from personal PREFERENCE,
with at least an AIR of comprehension in the
choosing.
BTW- Lady Liberty is said to have turned her BACK
to Jersey, because she couldn't take the SMELL of
the "Armpit of the U.S."
78 - Natalie Davis
"100,000 Lemmings CAN be wrong."
Heard that. As the kids used to say, word.
79 - Dew
riiiight, so by your own accord, D, you just wasted valuable time saying absolutely nothing...interesting
80 - Michael
The distinction between "Rapper" and "MC" is an un-necessary one, the actual distinction is between RAP and Hip-Hop. Check the ballistics.
I have a feeling we're making the same point, but it's just a matter of semantics.
NWA didn't even get MENTIONED, nor did ANY of the TRUE old-school rappers. The early 90's came in with a GANG of rappers like DJ Quik, Dre & Snoop, E40, Too $hort, Ice Cube, Ice T, Public Enemy, and a list of the REAL too long to go into here.
Well you certainly didn't look at my list(s). Snoop and Chuck D are in my top 22. No, I didn't mention NWA as a group b/c I listed some of the members individually. Ice Cube, Ice-T and Dre are on my honorable mention list. MC Ren should probably be on there as well. I like Quik and $hort Dog, but just not enough to put them on the list. Quik would definitely be on my list of favorite producers though.
Bottom line? These "lists" were compiled without much serious thought, MTV's created from sheer IGNORANCE, (VOTE whether you know what you're saying or NOT) Michael's from personal PREFERENCE, with at least an AIR of comprehension in the choosing.
Yes, my list is from personal preference. I don't pretend to speak for anyone else. All this post was meant to do was show who I think are the best MCs.
As for Eminem, there's no doubt he's gotten a boost from being down with Dre and the fact that he's white. But he can rhyme with the best of them. Check him out on Jay-Z's Renegade or any of the freestlyes he's done (available on Kazaa).
81 - joe
D,
That was so articulate and profound...NOT! You don't know what the hell you are talking about. You have no clue about rap or hip hop. The very fact that you think Salt N Pepa, Too Short, E-40, and half ass rappers like that should be on the list of top rappers, proves you know absolutely nothing.
"Pac started a lot of shit"...LOL, really? What shit did he ever start boy? He never said shit until he was setup and shot at Times Square in '94. He didn't have beef with no motha fuckin body until that day. Biggie's fat ass and half the East Coast rappers started the shit by setting Pac up and then acting like he didn't exist when he went to jail. Half the rappers on the East Coast were there when Pac was shot and no one knew a dam thing. That's like the police coming to the hood and asking about a murder and niggaz say they didn't see nothing. You know they're lying. Biggie told Pac a week before he was shot not to fuck around with the niggaz that later shot him. And Pac was like "what do you mean?", and Biggie was like, "I'll tell you later." And they never talked, and the next time Pac saw Biggie was the night he was shot.
Then Pac goes to jail for Biggie because that fat bitch left 4 guns in Pac's room. Serial numbers scratched out and shit. And Pac took that case, he didn't snitch.
So Pac rushed Biggie's ass. What's the fuckin problem? When PM Dawn got on stage and dissed KRS, what did KRS do? He bum rushed the nigga, am I right? So why are people saying Pac is wrong for doing what he did?
Pac NEVER started any shit with no motha fuckin body. He NEVER said shit about someone until they provoked him. So get your facts straight b. Recognize and realize, because you don't have a fuckin clue what you are saying.
Saying Pac got killed for talking shit and running his mouth? So I guess Biggie, Stretch, Jam Master Jay, Kadafi, and all the other niggaz that were gunned down were gunned down because they all talked shit, right?
You so stupid. Niggaz get shot everyday b. They get shot for no motha fuckin reason. It's just jealousy and hatred for the most part. Niggaz killed Pac because they knew Pac was taking over the whole fuckin rap game and the only way to stop that was to take him out.
When I say the Feds killed Pac, I don't mean they necessarily did it directly, but they were indirectly involved at the least. I believe Orlando Anderson and the Crips killed Pac, and I always have. But the Feds could have easily cut a deal with some gang niggaz. Telling them to knock off Pac. The did it with JFK, and I am sure they had a part in it with RFK, Malcolm, and MLK.
And the Feds sure as hell made no attempt whatsoever to find Pac's killer. That whole investigation was a joke. There were so many holes and leaks in that investigation it was pathetic.
But those pussies who shot Pac are NOT bad asses. They are cowards, and so are the rest of the niggaz that go around shootin people. You wanna shoot someone, go up to their face and do it. Don't be a bitch and do a drive-by. Don't wear army fatigues and ski masks. You wanna be a gangsta, then play by the rules of the game. The crips are nothing but lil niggaz with no balls. Lil dumb ass niggaz that come from shit and never were shit and have no brains of any kind.
I agree with your "music theory" about why people like what they like, and especially about how it don't matter if a million niggaz like something, it don't make it dope.
I also agree that Eminem would be nothing if it wasn't for Dre. I always believed that and it's the dam truth.
I believe Vanilla Ice is not even worth mentioning when referring to rap or hip hop.
But when you go and quote Everlast, that is just wack. That scrap is no better than Ice. I wouldn't listen to a word that came out of that idiots mouth.
And your words on Canibus are just ignorance. You obviously don't know the cat's music if you say that shit. That nigga can take out ANYONE in a battle. He proved it already.
82 - D.Tansy
Dew;
Depends on whether you meant
A. "...wasted valuable time saying absolutely nothing"
or
B. "wasted valuable time saying absolutely nothing interesting"
If A, Yup. I'm good at that.
If B, You can't please everybody, please yourself. Only read
the GOOD stuff.
---
Michael;
To be fair,
I read the list, but only noticed your mentioning RunDMC, Sugar
Hill, The Furious 5, Snoop, and Rakim. Yeah, yeah, Chuck D.
(only JUST looked at your honorable mention) But, there's dozens
more with equal to way better skills. Still, that's just opinion.
And everybodys got one of those.
Now, MC Ren from the BEST perspective was true-blue RACIST, his
forte being his "Kill the crackers" lyrics. Never had much love
for the man, he was just MEAN. Needed Valium.
I don't think Eminem got a boost, Dre is Traveling!
He may have some rhyme in him, and he has the breath to carry
it off, but he's just a Dre cashcow. Like his stuff well enough,
but like I said, POP, not Rap.
Oh yeah, you need to check your kazaa, some really crappy new
additions to their P2P program, adware, spyware, and some much
deeper crap that gives them USE of your open hard-drive space,
RAM memory, and "excess" bandwidth. I use WinMX. Open P2P w/o
all the crapware. Kazaa lies like the U.S. Government.
---
Now, I'm not baiting, I'm just DEBATING. But...
Joe!
I may be WAY off, but I'd bet you're a fairly YOUNG man. 20ish?
Not that that's BAD, or you do or don't know what you're TALKING
about if you're not 55 with scars from 42 of 'em, but I will say
again that MUSIC is constituted by the listener.
Sadly, I have to give you your props on the "You obviously don't
know the cat's music", that's a fact. Don't see him ANYWHERE.
Looked. Searched. Researched. NO play. I was doggin' him on looks
alone. But if you realize that's a BAD remark, (I don't SEE him)
you also realize the dude just doesn't have either the REACH or
the lyrical STRENGTH to be as well-played as, say, Everlast.
Not meaning to imply that Everlast was any kind of rap, only used
the line because it fit exactly what I wanted to say. The Pac,
regardless what actually happened, kept making noise until he
caught the ax. My grandmother used to say; "The more you stir
shit, the more it stinks". I DID say he started shit, but NO
fight is between one man, there HAS to be at least TWO. Whether
he started the probs or just carried them on without end, he
WAS half the fight. Everybody heard him pretty clearly.
He just didn't know when to shut the hell UP.
Tupac actually had the heart of a lion, said what he thought,
talked the talk AND walked the walk. I always thought his words
got the notice they did because he FELT what he was saying, he
LIVED it, and MEANT it. Best for that is Dear Momma, War Stories,
or Hearts Of Men.
But, our young would-be Machiavelli only used those portions of
his lessons as contributed to HIS perceptions. Machiavelli taught
young princes to become KINGS. His machinations were asserted
by those he taught, NOT at his own hand. Tupac was an ORATOR,
exceptional in many ways. But apparantly, DIPLOMACY was not an
art he was versed in.
Mostly, the gang-shit floats beyond me, I can't grasp the idea
of 200 members of Red bashing 200 members of Blue, it doesn't
make sense to me. It would make MORE sense to me to hook 'em up,
and make Purple, stronger than anything standing against either
or both.
While it is POSSIBLE (no impossibilities, only improbabilities)
that the Fed helped bang Tupac, (personal feelings removed) it's
so unlikely as to be funny. Of what concern is Dr. Dre to the
U.S. FedGov? Some, since he's a famous BLACK male, whose voice
alone is recognized by a HUGE amount of the youth of the U.S.
He COULD get a listen just sticking his head out his front door.
But do they (the fed) worry what he might say? Or how? They can't
just run in and put his ass inside a cage?
They (STATE) had Tupac at their disposal LITERALLY when he went
to prison. Had they wanted, he'd of been dead THERE and then. had
they wanted him, he'd be there STILL. Sorry little brother, it
just don't float.
That he WAS about the right thing only meant he was STRONG, most
of those who could lay a bit off on someone else would snitch on
their own MOTHER not to go to prison. Billy Bad-Ass while they
sell dope or pop guns at people, but sing their ASSES off the
first time it looks like they'll see G-pop. Gutless bitches.
So, he was a stand-up dude. But that STILL don't make him Jebus.
OR Malcolm, OR MLK. It MIGHT have, but we'll never know.
LAST, what is it about the Rage you don't like? She's as hardcore
street-level Rap as the Pac in her own right! Ditto Salt & Pepa,
although they eventually went mid-stream POP, and DITTO Queen
Latifah! Then again, we're back to "the eye of the beholder", and
opinions. Depends on what YOUR definition of RAP is.
83 - Michael
Oh yeah, you need to check your kazaa, some really crappy new additions to their P2P program, adware, spyware, and some much deeper crap that gives them USE of your open hard-drive space, RAM memory, and "excess" bandwidth. I use WinMX. Open P2P w/o all the crapware. Kazaa lies like the U.S. Government.
I've used KazaaLite for years for those very reasons. And I've recently switched to the K++ version. Of course I only use them for legal purposes :-)
84 - joe
D,
Are you insinuating that Everlast is a better rapper than Canibus? Please tell me you aren't, because if you think that then you need a psychological evaluation.
You can like Everlast more than Canibus (even though that still would be odd), but you can't say he is even near Canibus in skill level. That is like comparing Michael Jordan with Shawn Bradley. I mean, it isn't even comparable in any sense, and to even mention the two in the same sentence is absurd.
And he are constantly contradicting yourself when talking about 2pac. You give him props and say he was a great orator and he talked the talk and walked the walk, but then you say how he ran his mouth and that is why he was killed. If Pac was killed because of speaking his mind and not biting his tongue for nobody, then that is sick.
And the Feds could not have killed him in jail up in Riker's. He was in protective custody, and they had to let him out when Suge posted a $1.4 million dollar bond for his release. You think the Feds are going to turn down that kinda money just to hold someone that never even committed the crime he was accused of? So they took the money and let Pac go, thinking that he would be back in prison pending his appeal.
And Dr. Dre does not pose any threat whatsoever to the Feds. He is the softest motha fucka in the game. The nigga is closing in on 40, and he doesn't go around talking shit. Yeah, he did back in the day, but that is ancient history. NO ONE in the rap game today is a threat to the Feds, but Pac was. Pac was raising hell all over the fuckin country. His first 2 albums were strictly based on bad-mouthing the government and white america. And he got to the Feds and the government so bad, that the Vice President of the U.S., Dan Qualye, personally mentioned 2pac in his fuckin re-election speech. He was sayin that "there is no place in our society" for Pac's music. So here is the Vice President of the U.S. addressing 2pac, one lone rapper, when there were hundreds of rappers sayin the same shit with more harsh lyrics, like NWA. But the VP doesn't mention them, he mentions Pac. Why? Cause when Pac speaks, people listen. That is the difference between him and other rappers. That, and the fact that he rapped about real life shit and all his songs had a message in them, most often a positive one.
Pac was gonna quit rappin, walk away from everything when he was in jail. But then all these niggaz were dirtyin up his name and talkin shit, so that is why he came back the way he did.
The shit talking that Pac did against the East Coast rappers is because they came out publicly and dissed the West Coast. They were sayin how "the West coast are fakers and pretenders and can't freestyle" and all that shit.
They can't be sayin that shit and think the West ain't gonna respond. Just cause New York started rap, they think they can't hate on the West Coast and say how they ain't nuttin. The West Coast kept rap alive for years when the East Coast was doing some wack shit, like LL Cool J in silver suits dancing wit girls and shit. They were tryin other boundaries and shit, and meanwhile the West was holdin it down wit this hardcore shit.
So the only way the East Coast was gonna recognize the West Coast was for the West to do it on records, on sales, my money, and by representin the West to the fullest.
So thats wat Pac did. He attacked those that attacked him first. He didn't attack no blind soldiers.
Pac started Death Row East, he was gonna take over the East. He had Big Daddy Kane, Christopher Williams, Bobby Brown, etc. And he wanted to get Wu-Tang cause he loved them niggaz and he felt as though the Wu held it down for the East coast, just like Pac and The Row held it down for the Westside.
Oh, and about the crips and bloods joinin forces and becomin one gang and them bein untouchable....the Mafia would take all them niggaz out without even breakin a sweat. The Mafia is smart, they go about killin people in an organized manner. They aint some dumb ghetto niggaz from the hood wit glocks and wearin different colors to support their gang. That is all stupid ass shit. The bloods and crips are just punks, straight up.
85 - Al Barger
Let's dumb this down for a young boy such as Joe. Everlast's album Whitey Ford Sings the Blues is a much greater MUSICAL achievement than anything from Tupac. Particularly, the single "What It's Like" from which D drew the quote will be played by cool people long years after a Canibus or Tupac or any other of these non-musical "thugs" are long forgotten.
This album has songs. Songs have MELODY, rhythm and harmony. You could just stand on the corner and sing "What It's Like" or "Ends." You could do cover versions. They could become standards.
This is because they have decent MELODIC content, a series of notes of varying pitches and duration forming interesting patterns. This is something that 90% of current music and about 98% of rap music just utterly lacks.
This largely reflects a lack of musical values. Marilyn Manson and Tupac neither one would know what a melody was to even be thinking to ATTEMPT to write a tune.
Lack of melody means lack of song. That's not opinion, just plain hard fact.
Tupac would not have recognized a melody if it came up and bit him in the ass.
Everlast at least had one outstanding album with some decent melodic content.
You can just decide to simply define him out of existence by category, ie he's not "rap" as you choose to arbitrarily define it.
OK,fine, but he's definitely much better MUSIC.
You spend the huge bulk of your words on dumb irrelevant personal biography and iconology that has jack shit to do with MUSIC. I don't care about East Coast/West Coast beef, or how much beef Tupac caught in prison. Means nothing to anyone else.
Why should someone listen to a Tupac album even once when they could be listening to, say, Miles Davis or the Beatles? Tupac=verbal macho jacking off versus Miles and Beatles=classic music.
Are you taking notes, son? This WILL be on the test.
86 - joe
LOLOLOLOLOLOLOL
That shit was fuckin hilarious. Dumb ol' Kentucky incest breeding white trailer trash. That is what you are, plain and simple. NO ONE gives a fuck what kind of prissy, corporate white america music you like. You are a complete and total loser. I am sure you have been told that on more than one occasion little man, and you will continue to hear it for the rest of your pathetic existence.
Just come right out and admit that you are nothing but a racest piece of shit. Have some balls kid. At least I could respect that you are honest. But you can't even admit that to yourself. Denial is a long and painful road son, the price...your soul.
Now I can clearly see that this has nothing to do with you being a Tupac hater. This has to do with you being a hip hop/rap hater, and a racest altogether. Your true colors have shined through whitey.
You think you are slick by throwing in Marilyn Manson's name, just to try and cover your racism. LOL, nice try kid. I can see right through your flower ass.
So tell me, don't those white masks and robes that you where make you hot? Especially when you are burning all of those crosses? What kind of material is that anyway? Cotton? Denim? I was just curious to know, and I figured who better to ask then a proud member of the Ku Klux Klan like yourself.
Do yous hold meetings and rituals? What kind of satanistic behaviors do yous participate in? Well, it is common sense that you like to kill and hang niggaz. But besides that. I know you also hate Jews, Catholics, Muslims, Gays, and virtually anybody who isn't a WASP.
Oh, and just to get your head out of your ass, I will give you some FACTS on Everlast and Tupac.
Everlast is a NOBODY. A NOTHING. A SCRAP. He hasn't sold shit and never will. His albums are trash and his lyrics are trash. He has no talent and that is why he couldn't even go platinum. That faggot is lucky if he went Gold on anything he has ever done.
So it seems that EVERYONE in America (and the whole world for that matter) is intelligent enough not to buy an Everlast album because they know he is not worth ten cents.
On the contrary, Tupac has sold more albums in a month than Everlast has sold in his life. Tupac has sold more albums than ANY rap/hip hop/r&b nigga EVER. NO ONE even comes close and NEVER will. 50 Million albums sold worldwide and counting. Tupac is ALREADY in the top 20 most selling artists of ALL-TIME. He has outsold bigtime names like Bon Jovi, Gloria Estefan, John Denver, Phil Collins, Def Leppard, Bob Dylan, Shania Twain, Boston, Rod Stewart, Michael Bolton, Boyz II Men, Tom Petty & The Heartbreakers, Linda Ronstadt, Pearl Jam, Ozzy Osbourne, ZZ Top, Janet Jackson, Bee Gees, John Meloncamp, Nirvana, Nsync, Backstreet Boys, Dave Matthews Band, Earth Wind and Fire, Motley Crew, Britney Spears, Christina Aguleria, Paul McCartney, R. Kelly, TLC, Barry Manalow, The Doobie Brothers, Frank Sinatra, Beastie Boys, Lionel Richie, Jimi Hendrix, etc, etc, etc. And all these musicians have been around making music for 10, 20, 30 years before 2pac even started rappin, and Pac still has outsold everyone of them, in a country that is 12% black.
The only reason why The Beatles, Elvis, Garth Brooks, Madonna, Led Zepplin, Billy Joel, Elton John, Bruce Springstein, The Rolling Stones, The Eagles, Pink Floyd, and all those musicians have sold more albums than Pac is because they are all white and live in a society where 70% of the population is white.
But go look at how many of there albums are bought by black people. And then go look at how many white people have bought 2pac albums.
See, Pac can sell albums to the most ghetto, gangsta niggaz in the hood, all the way up to the upscale white dudes livin up in the burbs.
These other artists have stricly one source of production, and that is white america.
How many black people buy the beatles? elvis? the eagles? or any other white musician? Answer: Slim to None. Maybe 5% of the whole black population.
But at least 30% of the white population buy 2pac albums. Shit, white people buy more rap/hip hop albums than do black people. Whites make up 75% of all rap/hip hop album sales. If it wasn't for white people, rap/hip hop wouldn't exist because no money would be coming in from there albums and the whole industry would be flat ass broke. But that's a whole other story.
Bottom line: You don't know what the hell you are talking about, and everything you state is nothing but an OPINION of yours. You say you state facts, show me these facts printed in some kind of reliable source. Show me the facts tough guy. You can't because they are nothing but idiotic opinions by some racest hick from Kentucky who doesn't know shit about music.
I, on the otherhand can produce sources that backup everything I have said in this post about record sales, statistics, etc.
Just take a look at the RIAA's list of top all-time selling artists (if you even know what the RIAA is).
And Tupac will NEVER be forgotten kid. He has been deceased for nearly 7 years and he is still on top of the industry. He still has album after album being released year after year. He has books by the dozen being written about him. DVD's and Video's by the dozen, tributes from nearly every rapper, fan clubs all across the country, niggaz bitin off his style, his beats, his image, etc.
If Pac was "a dumbass thug" then how come everyone in the industry is bitin his shit like he is fuckin picasso? Tell me that big boy. How come big time musicians how called Pac a legend? You think it is just regular people callin Pac a legend and shit, nah. All the rappers in the industry have the upmost respect for Pac.
It is just low-life scum like you that try to dirty up his name when you don't know jack shit about him.
Keep hatin kid. Jealousy will get you nowhere in life.
Just keep on burning crosses, because that is the only thing you are good at.
87 - Natalie Davis
You sound like the racist and hater, son.
Oh, and in regard to this:
"How many black people buy the beatles? elvis? the eagles? or any other white musician? Answer: Slim to None. Maybe 5% of the whole black population."
That's bull, plain and simple. How old are you?
88 - joe
Yeah, I am the hater and racest. That makes lots of sense. You aren't too bright either I can see.
And I am 21, how old are you?
Age means nothing, knowledge does. So it doesn't matter if I am 10 or 80. What matters is what kind of education and knowledge one has, and I have a very good one, thank you.
And my FACT about black people buying white musicians music is true hunny.
Show me documention from a legitimate source that says otherwise. Until then, shut your hole.
And I would appreciate it if you stop biting my shit. "Son" and "Plain and simple."
Are you not capable of writing original sentences?
89 - D.Tansy
Joe;
Everlast ISN'T a rapper, I didn't use his line because I was
saying he IS a rapper. I used the line ONLY because it fit
exactly what I was trying to say at that moment;
"Talked some shit and wound up dead".
That's all, don't read anything else into it, wasn't comparing,
just using his line.
I shouldn't have said a WORD about Canibus, I know his name an
saw his pics, the cover of two albums, and generalities about
him. But I've never heard the first note of any song/rap/music
BY him, I can't FIND the dude.
Because I have NOT found his stuff, I can't directly speak on
it, but I can say, Everlast HAS published music easily found
and already well-listened. That MAKES the dude more well-known
than Canibus.
On the Pac, he gets HIS props because he earned 'em the HARD
way, because he was Stand-up, and REAL. Sadly, DEAD as hell
because he didn't know when to SHUT UP.
He could'a called the shit off, there are always ways AROUND
a fight, you have to want NOT TO FIGHT. He chose to carry that
ball, and he bum-rushed the coroner's office because of it.
Saying the man was GREAT, and DOWN, and REAL doesn't contradict
the fact that he PUSHED A STUPID AGENDA of doggin' mf's across
a continent, "I screwed your wife" was the NICEST of the shit he
wrote into his LYRICS. Just DUMB SHIT.
I was using Dre as a role-model black celeb, not picking him
specifically as a possible threat. I had forgotten the idiot-
assed Dan Quayle shit. Couldn't even spell POTATO.
Lyrical update: Psyche Evaluation is pretty good, coming up:
Canibustable. Further updates as they happen...
Hey, your words SOUND clear, but I still think you got life a
bit f-ed up. One of the reasons the gangs get the grip they GET
is because young and stupid is UNPREDICTABLE. Yeah, the MOB
has the "professionals", dudes that make their's by knowing the
How/where/when of takin people OUT. But their's is ORDER, and the
youngsters represent CHAOS in every sense of the word.
That's the difference between NIGHT and DAY, both sides deadly
dangerous. Both have strengths and weaknesses, 6 MILLION ways
to die, choose ONE.
Albert, you've lost your mind. I never said anything LIKE that
Everlast's single track outdid everything Tupac Shakur did. Not
even CLOSE, Everlast has "A" song, perhaps worthy of note, but
not even in the same CLASS with Pac. One of Pac's WORST would be
more than enough to make Whitey Ford WANT to ride the back of
the bus. Sorry 'bout your hero.
Yet again, let me reiterate:
MUSIC IS IN THE INDIVIDUAL'S EAR.
None of your crappy little "rules" define what I will or will
not like. Because YOUR ear doesn't recognize MY music AS music
only means your tastes are LACKING. I no more believe your shit
on "Music Appreciation" than I believe you'll be filling your
hard-drive with some Tupac and Mystikal. (But you OUGHTTA)
You know why you WON'T? Because someone WAY in the past told you;
"THIS is music, and THIS is NOT, and THIS is why." WRONG!!!
"Clouds are white and fluffy". NOT all of 'em. Grass is green,
and looks like THIS". NOT always. Any idea how many TASTES there
are? What's BAD about your last post is, you seem a bit FULL
of yourself, as pertains to HOW other people should REVIEW their
own musical tastes, then modify them to fit YOURS.
Therefore, only YOU get to define what IS and is NOT? That's a
bit ARROGANT, don'cha think? I don't care where you got your
"rules," but from MY perspective, they'll apply when I give a
SHIT what ANYBODY on the planet thinks about MY musical taste.
I like what I like because I DO, not because they conform to
"Robert's Rules Of Order".
Did I forget to mention,
MUSIC IS IN THE INDIVIDUAL'S EAR?
Lyrical update: Canibus on Niggonometry, GREAT shit. The shit you
won't learn in SCHOOL! Okay, so I have another RAPPER on the HD!
He ain't the best I've ever heard, but he's got his OWN going.
If you like RAP, you'll be wantin' to look up Canibus, you NEED
Niggonometry. Parental F-ing Guidance on the lyrics, but we're
all grownups here, right?
90 - D.Tansy
DAMN! I should've refreshed BEFORE I
loaded mine, I didn't realize we're in
here KILLING folk. Can EVERYBODY back
down a step?
This ain't supposed to BE a black/white
thing, it's about MUSIC, not politics or
religion!
Joe; WAY too harsh!
(BTW- racist has an "I")
But AL: you even pist ME off with some of
the shit you said about Pac. If it were
REAL, the man would've never sold a SONG.
Yeah, SONG. SOME folk hear the MUSIC in a
CRICKET'S chirps, and SOME can't hear the
music when they're sitting in the front
ROW.
MY taste in music has as much
creedence as YOUR taste in music, and
any ATTITUDE doesn't CHANGE that. Your
RIGID rules of what "defines" music, and
an all-but assault on a well-loved and
MUCH renowned musician (whether YOU think
so or not) can be taken as an ATTACK,
back the hell UP.
"Methinks thou doth protest TOO much".
Are you seeing something here, that,
because YOU cannot define it, makes you
want to attempt to remove it from ALL
other people's presence because YOU don't
identify?
Jebus! Get a GRIP!
91 - Michael
D,
Excellent points about 'what is music'. I asked Al about his 'music' comments before (You may want to read that post) but he never answered that point.
92 - joe
dammmmm, looks like little albert got shit on by yet another person. LOL, everyone knows you are a loser kid. Your mentality is one of a 12 year old.
Even D told you that your whole music philosophy is warped.
Everlast LOLOLOLOL Like D said, Pac's worst song would tear up ANYTHING Everlast ever made.
Yo D, I get you on the whole gang shit, and I am quite aware that the crips and bloods are chaotic and that is what makes them dangerous. That was my point though. They are chaotic and have no order to their shit. That is a big flaw when it comes to being a hitman. You know they don't have the brains. All they have is their gats.
I thought you said you never heard of Canibus? Now you say that he is pretty dam tight? I guess you listened to 'Niggonometry' huh?
You want some tight ass Canibus songs to listen to? Check these out, and I swear to you that you will say this nigga is one of the dopest niggaz ever to rock a mic.
'Second Round KO' (a diss to LL Cool J)
'Rip the Jacker' (another diss to LL)
'You Didn't Care' (response to Eminem)
'Stan N Can'
'Watch Who You Beef Wit'
'I Gotta Story to Tell'
'2000 B.C.' (B.C. = Before Canibus)
'Horsementality'
'HIV is Gold, AIDS is Platinum'
'Behind Enemy Lines'
'Who Stopped Ya'
'100 Bars'
check them out D and tell me what you think.
93 - Eric Olsen
I really don't want to get into this one and it doesn't need my help, but I would say the extremes represented here by Joe and Al are both narrow and constrained: rap isn't the be all and end all of music, it's a small corner of the greater music universe, but neither is it any less ontologically musical because it emphasizes beat over melody and flow over syntax.
And by the way, there is nothing whatsover cool or empowering about criminality: it's just stupid expolitative shit passed from level to level and I despise its glorification.
94 - D.Tansy
A schpeak from the BIG dog.
See what you DONE?
BUT...
He's absolutely RIGHT. This is only
ONE small part of all the MUSIC (Al)
out there. Your music CAN be mine too,
but not because my definition or taste
or comprehension or regard for music is
any better or worse than yours, hers, or
his.
It's your background, your roots, your
intelligence or lack of it, including
but not necessarily limited to your
education.
It's your MOM's taste, and some of dad's,
your older brother and best friends. It's
what YOUR ear says it is, and it don't
FOLLOW any specific guideline.
Albert, instead of trying to SQUASH a
specific, how about taking a step back,
give the shit a LISTEN where possible,
and try (without analysis) to actually
LISTEN to the shit you're dogging?
With the possible exception of flighty
POP (LL Cool J, Emenem&em, etc) makers,
I'd find it hard to believe you've spent
more than mere MOMENTS giving serious
play to REAL rap.
Without looking it UP, big-boy;
Give me TEN words from All Eyes On Me,
and tell me who the hell DID it?
"Momma Said Knock You Out" AIN'T rap.
It's COMEDY. The Beastie Boys. THERE'S
rap. Okay, well, I'd give 'em SOME, but
they're FAR from the epitome. ESPECIALLY
because YOU say they are.
I've read a lot of what you have to say,
about a great many things. Mostly, I'd
say that what you think is significant
on whatever level you're commenting on.
However, you seem to lose your MIND on
how OTHER folk "should" define MUSIC.
That's harder than getting them to switch
GOD'S, dude! You have life ALL fubar-ed.
This is one of the FEW things I've seen
you write about that is just OUT of your
REACH, there's something MISSIN in there.
(If you know Quik, you know why I "Left
out the g". Can't just LOOK that one up,
you gotta ask someone who KNOWS, or miss
the joke.)
Nobody knows EVERYTHING, man. ("Cept ME,
I'm the hog w/ the BIG nuts)
"Pac can sell albums to the most
ghetto, gangsta niggaz in the hood, all
the way up to the upscale white dudes
livin up in the burbs..."
I loved that line. It needed repeating.
P2P Prog Update: Kazaa Lite K++ seems to
be an excellent alternative to the crap-
laden Kazaa, a lot less adware, and NO
spyware I can discern. Thanks, Michael!
Lyrical Update: Canibus IS the shiznit!
Wicked little bastard, BAD mouth, AND
looks like that! I believe I said:
"Canibus"... wannabe hardass, big-bad,
studio gang-star. Mean-muggin' don't make
a rapper. Allow me to re-phrase that.
Canibus
Really IS hardassed, hardnosed, hardcore
gangsta rap. Out of a dozen of his bits,
I instantly liked Niggonometry, Rip The
Jacker, (specifically a dis of LL Cool J)
and 100 Bars. I'll definitely be lookin
for more from this dude, and checking all
the old cuts!
But, HE ain't Jebus, either!
Hey, Can't we all just get along?
95 - joe
Yo D, you saying you love my line about how Pac can sell albums to all different sorts of people, and I got you to listen to Canibus and you see now that he is ill as hell, yet you don't mention my name at all or give me any props. What's up with that bro?
You know that what I am preaching in here is knowledge and I know what I am talking about, unlike most people in here.
So I am asking you to please give credit where credit is due.
P.S. - Do you think Canibus could beat anyone in a freestyle battle?
Go to Kazaa or whatever you have and look up 'Canibus freestyle' and you should get a lot of tight rhymes.
96 - Natalie Davis
Joe,
First off, I don't take orders from anyone, certainly not from you.
Secondly, what proof do you have to back up your ridiculous claim? As I have not interviewed every human on the earth about their record-buying habits, I do not have hard evidence. I can only go by 41 years of life and 20+ years working in journalism and music. The people I have encountered who identify as African-American have disparate tastes (like everyone else), but most of them have great affection (and own copies of) artists such as Led Zeppelin, Eric Clapton, the Stones, the Beatles, Elvis Presley, Aerosmith, and countless other artists not considered African-Americans. My teenager has African-American friends who listen to artists such as Eminem and Justin Timberlake.
Face it, people buy music -- and rap *is* music, Al; last time I checked, percussion and beats are part of music -- they like. Doesn't matter what the artist looks like. Unless, of course, the purchaser is a racist idiot.
As for Canibus, I respect him. He would wipe me all over the mat in a rhyming contest -- of that, I am sure.
97 - joe
Nat,
It is a known fact that the majority of black people listen to black music. Hip Hop, Rap, R&B, Soul, Reggae, etc.
They listen to music from the 50s, 60s, 70s, 80s, and 90s from artists who are black.
The fact that your teenager and her friends listen to Eminem is not saying they listen to "white" music. Eminem is hip hop, and hip hop is 95% black. Not to mention, Eminem is a wigger himself.
98 - Eric Olsen
I believe the key to appreciating, and more importantly loving, any art form is coming at it with an open mind - that flows in every direction. Most great artists pick and choose from every direction and don't discount anything in advance without giving it an open hearing.
It is right and just to defend your preferred style(s) - whatever it/they may be - against prejudice, but don't fall into the same trap in your defense.
99 - Natalie Davis
Well said, Eric.
Joe, that is a known fact because you say it is a known fact? I don't accept that, sorry; my experience paints a much different picture.
And please keep your racist comments to yourself.
Natalie
100 - joe
Racest comments? Saying Eminem is a wigger is not racest. Do you even know the meaning of the word?
I think you need to take out whatever stick you have up your ass.
101 - Natalie Davis
Of course I know the meaning of the word. The W word, the N word, "white trash," etc. -- they are all the same in my estimation. YMMV.
102 - James B
i pity all u blind fools who fail to realise the amazing music 2pac left for us, he had the brains to teach and change the world. dont give a fuck what you say u stupid ignorant fucks
103 - D.Tansy
Joe;
Canibus IS a rapper, but for the 99%, he's unknown, man. He has the CORE, his
own style, some pretty good cuts, and a
couple of EXCELLENT ones.
But that doesn't mean he could beat just
ANYONE in a freestyle, they haven't all
been HEARD. Right now, there's a young
brother practicing to spank him. Whether
or not he CAN has yet to be seen.
James B;
"he had the brains to teach and change
the world."
BUT... he didn't USE 'em, and that's
worse than not HAVING 'em. What he DID
was "show America how being belligerent
and living the 'thug life' can get your
ass shot and/or locked up."
Can't say THAT more clearly. I'm only
JUST coming to the realization that to
some folk, music is an emotional topic
as painfully poignant as religion or
politics.
That's GOOD, it shows they're paying
ATTENTION. However, NO one artist has
the market cornered, because it's ALL
good in it's own way. I particularly
liked Eric's comment;
"..the key to appreciating, and more
importantly loving, any art form is
coming at it with an open mind - that
flows in every direction."
I had thought to say OPEN MIND to Al,
attaching strict regulations doesn't
make things work better, except to the
anal retentive. Especially in MUSIC.
"and rap *is* music, Al; last time I
checked, percussion and beats are part
of music"
ELVIS isn't Jebus, either!
104 - Eric Olsen
Thanks D, you have made many important and reasonable points in this discussion and seem to have an excellent perspective.
I have learned much from all of you here, especially Michael and Joe, though at 21 our friend Joe could still use some mind-freeing and ass-following, so to speak, but there is nothing unusual about that. Even just taking "black music" as the functioning universe, rap is just a small, if very popular, corner.
105 - Kevin
I won't even touch the black/white issue, but here's my top 25 list (fuck 22 and plugging MTV2).
1- Rakim
2- KRS-One
3- Nas
4- Wu-Tang Clan (well, Meth, GZA, and Raekwon mostly)
5- Notorious B.I.G.
6- Chuck D
7- Jay-Z
8- Ice Cube
9- Eminem
10- Beastie Boys
11- OutKast
12- De La Soul
13- Big Daddy Kane
14- Slick Rick
15- Organized Konfusion
16- Run DMC
17- Tribe Called Quest
18- Guru (from Gang Starr)
19- Canibus
20- Juice Crew (again, mostly Kool G and Masta Ace)
21- Erick & Parrish Making Dollars
22- LL Cool J
23- Tupac
24- Mos Def
25- To finish it off... Roxanne Shante; I had to rep the ladies.
106 - Michael
Kevin,
Nice list. But be warned, the Tupac fanATICS will be blowing up your e-mail b/c of your ranking of him! :-)
107 - convinced
everybody is entititled to there own opinion,but for those who left out Pun on your list obviously havent really listened.Nobody in the history(with maybe the exception of rakim)of hip hop has an mc said that kind of shit with the illest flow ever.he don't have to be #1 on your list but to ignore him is ignorance.my top 10 is as follows:
1.Big pun
2.Rakim
3.ll cool j
4.Biggie
5.Big Daddy kane
6.slick Rick
7.Nas
8.KRS1
9.kool g rap
10.Heavy D(respect this legend as well)
108 - Makaveli FOREVER
this is the most funny fucking forum i have ever seen a couple of 35 year olds albert that faggot who are you to talk bad about tupac you didnt know him and neither did i or anyone else. What i do know is that he is a legend and his music will live on. As for his death suge killed him cause he was the only person who had the knowledge of and the right timing of when there would be no witnesses around. He also got tupac to change his clothes 15 minutes before the shooting occured so that tells you something, that he wanted tupacs bullet proof vest removed by telling him its a hot night. Pac was also no longer wearing the white suit that he had on in the mike tyson fight. He changed into a sports vest which gives him absolutely no way of protecting his body or preventing the loss of blood after being shot. So suge pretty much had this all worked out a week before the murder because tupac sent a letter to suges lawyer stating that he was going to leave deathrow records with the outlawz and all of his recorded songs. If you were in suges shoes you would have been the only one who knew about the million dollars worth of tupac material that was recorded cause he was in the studio half the time with 2pac. So Suge didnt need him alive to make money off it. Suge was in the same fucking car if it was some small time gang members like orlando and the crips they have every reason and advantage to kill both suge and pac but they allowed suge cause he was in on the scam and they got their pay cheque from suge when pacs death was offical. So as for the feds killing him thats the biggest bullshit i ever heard the whole theory is alot simpler than you think it aint rocket science. Suge persuades pac to go with him to mike tyson fight even though tupac didnt want to (he was supposed to go to Atlanta that night with kidada jones to see some relatives) but he decided to go as a last favour for suge as he begged him to and pac knew he was going to leave deathrow so suge thought that this was his last chance knowing of the trouble las vegas is with gang wars to remove any blame from himself. Snoop even said suge Knight killed tupac and he would have known the real truth more than any punks posting on this forum he was a rapper on deathrow at the time and was close to 2pac and suge and he would get word of what happened straight away but hes not a snitch so he keeps his mouth shut and leaves deathrow cause he knew what suge is capable of doing to his artists. But now snoop revealed the truth in an interview is all too obvious suge killed tupac and he definately had biggie killed as well (not that i care about biggie) but this is for real. And Suge is still out there with millions more from pacs unreleased recordings and this bullshit book about his fucked up life what did he ever do that was important if deathrow records never existed pac would probably be alive today but dont cry like a bitch life gos on and suge will continue to kill rappers whos unexplained murders will remain unsolved forever because of the polices fear of THE DON MARION SUGE KNIGHT. Im out
109 - LG
I think you are right about that makaveli Suge Knight did kill him and you tell that by the guilt on his sad face when hes asked that question
'Did you have any involvement in 2pacs murder'
He seems to get really really stressed out and heated in some way he claims that hes afraid that he might get killed if he snitches but thats bullshit hes supposed to be a multi millionaire gangsta DON so how the hell is going to get shot with the army of security and thugs gangstas surrounding him. He knows this and hes just playing the public and everyone.
He employs crooked police officers from LA and New york for millions of dollars to get evidence of his murders disposed of and the whole police force off his back. He was locked up in 1996 a couple of months after pacs death for a 1992 assault probation violation cause thats the only thing the police could stick on him. now that hes released i dread to think which rap star is going to get murdered for running their mouth if its eminem, 50, or dre for being gay then i say good work suge but if its a really established rap star like the outlawz, daz, snoop, or bone then i say fuck suge.
110 - Jimmy young
I think you are right about that makaveli Suge Knight did kill him and you tell that by the guilt on his sad face when hes asked that question
'Did you have any involvement in 2pacs murder'
He seems to get really really stressed out and heated in some way he claims that hes afraid that he might get killed if he snitches but thats bullshit hes supposed to be a multi millionaire gangsta DON so how the hell is going to get shot with the army of security and thugs gangstas surrounding him. He knows this and hes just playing the public and everyone.
He employs crooked police officers from LA and New york for millions of dollars to get evidence of his murders disposed of and the whole police force off his back. He was locked up in 1996 a couple of months after pacs death for a 1992 assault probation violation cause thats the only thing the police could stick on him. now that hes released i dread to think which rap star is going to get murdered for running their mouth if its eminem, 50, or dre for being gay then i say good work suge but if its a really established rap star like the outlawz, daz, snoop, or bone then i say fuck suge.
111 - steve
Kevin you must be the biggest homo the world has ever seen. How can you put chuck D as No 6 on the list WHO THE hell IS THAT? and eminem is No 9 he should be No 29. Rakim he is the most boring mc i ever heard. Where is cannibus what you put eminem above him so you know nothing about rap. And how is biggie No 5 what song are you talking about he died quicker than he wrote (he hardly had any material worthy of a 5 position) you must be talking about that old give me one more chance song thats more shitty RnB Anyway. Maybe you are a p diddy fan who jacks off his videos when hes dancing.
IM going to change that list slightly here is a more correct version
1-KRS ONE
2-Wu tang clan
3-Makaveli aka 2pac
4-outlawz
5-method man
6-nas
7-rakim
8-nelly
9-cannibus
10-big daddy kane
11-de la soul
12-crucial conflict
13-slick rick
14-outkast
15-dmx
16-beastie boys
17-kool g
18-biggie
19-eminem
112 - Natalie Davis
Steve, does that make you the biggest homophobe the world has ever seen? Methinks you have immersed yourself in the cadenced rappings of Eminem for far too long. Sexual orientation has nothing to do with musical tastes.
113 - Michael
Steve,
If Rakim is so boring why is he even on your list???? And if you don't know who Chuck D is then you shouldn't even be posting here.
114 - rik
what do you guys think about michael jacksons arrest, you know this was bound to happen after that documentary on his life about sleeping with 13 year old boys and his own children as well
115 - Eric Olsen
I think he's bad
116 - george fisher
I thought Biggie Smalls paid the southside crips to kill 2pac for dissing him in the hit em up track and sleeping with bigs wife Faith Evans am i wrong or what ?
This gets crazier and crazier every year.
Will they ever solve that murder ?
Were'nt Suge Knight and tupac friends or was there a falling out between them?
117 - Drew K
I'm very much in tune with your list. MTV and the 'new generation' don't know shit about the true MCs. KRS, Kane, Mos Def, Chuck D, & Rakim are my tops. I would also have to have Common Sense in the Top 10. I think that you don't give the Beastie Boys much credit...they're dope! One question: Where is Tribe Called Quest? Q-Tip & Phyfe should be on the list for sure. Also, personal favs: De La, Three Times Dope & The Roots. De La rules! I never got into Pac or Biggie, though. Email me sometime.
My 2 cents,
Drew
Fremont, IN
118 - james
I like this thread. Lots to agree with and lots to disagree with.
LL Cool J, Big Pun, Queen Latifah, and the Beastie Boys are highly questionable choices. Sure, some of these people were influential, but that doesn't mean in terms of raw talent that they're great MCs. Dr. Dre can turn out some tight beats at times, but I can think of plenty of MCs who can rhyme circles around him: Andre from Outkast, Prodigy from Mobb Deep, Q-tip, hell even Phife Dog, and definitely Malik B and Black Thought from the Roots. And Lil Kim, Foxy Brown, Nelly!? That's an insult to hip-hop. I'd rather listen to fucking Onyx than Nelly. Take your Toys-r-Us rhymes back to Aisle 7.
Also, people can't be leaving out:
1. Guru from Gangstarr. For those who know, Guru makes absolute sense at all times: "Theolonious Monk, a melodious thunk/No mistakes were made with the notes he played/His conception, was recondite/A star glowing bright among dim lights/The critics did cite that he sounded alright."
2. And where the hell is my man Butterfly from Digable Planets? How soon we forget how tight the Planets were. How many cats rhyme about Kamus? Butter could glide oily over beats with a slickness I've never heard before. His flow is just ill.
119 - Adero
Here is my list. In no particular order:
KRS-1
Rakim
Kool G. Rap
Guru
Posdunous
Mos Def
Talib Kweli
manCHILD (marsILL)
Slick Rick
DMC
MC Lyte
Lauryn Hill
Big Pun
Vast Aire (Cannibal Ox)
El-P
Aesop Rock
GZA
Killah Priest
Chuck D
Common
CL Smooth
Q-Tip
Scarface
The D.O.C.
Nas
Andre 3000
Blackalicious
Del and the entire Hieroglyphics Crew
Jean Grae
Copywrite
Illogic
Big Daddy Kane
Brother J (X-clan)
Wise Intelligent (Poor Righteous Teachers)
Black Thought
I could go on and on but some people still won't understand what a real MC is.
120 - shaun
ya need to add atmosphere, benefit, sage francis, and mac lethal, but other than that it is a tight list
121 - Harry
Tupac Amaru Shakur represents black Thug niggaz. He is born the same place I was born in brooklyn. Mothafuckaz need to understand that gangbangers are serious at what they do,4 all the shit youknowwhatimsayin'. I want to let every body know when Tupac was alive he wasn't happy.He didn't get any time to fuck some bitches.Tupac and Biggie,if they were alive,they'd shoot the police!
122 - Poochie
yo! Fuck alla ya. Tupac has a GLock wit his name on it.2pac is the hardest nigga in the face of the planet. He didn't hate biggie all the way.2pac hates that gay rapper Jay-z, Mobb Deep, and LL cool J. Yo!LL,you soft mothafucka,eat a dick up,this is "strictly 4 my Niggaz",Fuck Quade,Fuck the cops,eat a mossberg shot.And Ms.Shakur shouldn't worry about her son's Death he's a star now,and forever.Fuck Lil kim,and christina aguilera 4 wearing the Tupac shirt that bitch ain't gangsta, only black Niggaz rock that shit,...22 greatest M.C.s Tupac is more than 22 mothfucka, he's real he ain't fake like Jay-z.
123 - Harry
I say fuck lil kim, she ain't shit but livin' large.All those who wanna be bitches and not vote the greatest emcee who had his beef not wit just junior Mafia but the queen bitch,Every body knows that hip-hop hasn't been tha same when Biggie and Tupac was Humiliated by Stupid Mothafuckas who ruined the rap game. And shutting down what black niggaz had to say,ya can rearrange who ever ya want in the list,cuz tupac is bigger than rap, and he spoke like Malcolm and Martin,and people say stupid shit, them niggaz is dead, and all these Negative information fires you up mothafucka you can't be happy all the time. All people do is go to party's and nightclubs to get shot someday and not live to see life "one day at a time" from tupac resurrection tupac is alive as the toughest of men, a born leader,an artist. Yo! This is it #1 greatest M.C. Tupac out of the 22 and like i said put any rapper in their rightful place, but tupac is first he's the illest in the rap shit.
P.S. some of you niggaz is bitchez 2!! -2pac
124 - Jack Parker
yow, I only wanna say that DR.DRE should be the best ever. I mean, he's the one who 'signed' eminem, tupac ows (or owned) his succes to DR.DRE, I'm not saying Snoop dogg is a great rapper but who should he thank? DR.DRE and go on like that...
Oh yeah, RUN DMC made it in as a group(they are good too) why didn't Cypress Hill make it in? They are so good too.
125 - HW Saxton Jr.
No one mentioned Biz Markie,what gives?