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Intellectual Morons

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Some people are just stupid. And then there are, as Daniel J. Flynn puts it, smart people who “fall for stupid ideas.” When you frame the debate that way it is possible for your opponents to turn it around on you (“Oh yeah, you think my ideas are stupid? Let’s talk about your ideas for a moment”). But what Flynn does attempt is to be somewhat evenhanded, at least insofar as he gores a few sacred cows on both ends of the political spectrum – Alfred Kinsey’s questionable scholarship in the context of his surveys of American sexual practices; Peter Singer (the “father” of the animal rights movement) and his notion that it is wrong to eat an animal but not to have sex with it; Leo Strauss and his neo-conservative disciples who were willing to overlook inconvenient facts to accomplish a bit of nation-building; Margaret Sanger and the “real” foundations of the abortion rights movement, and many more.

Here’s how Flynn begins:

When ideology is your guide, you’re bound to get lost. Ideology deludes, inspires dishonesty, and breeds fanaticism. Facts, experience, and logic are much better at leading you to truth. Truth, however, is not everyone’s intended destination.

This is a book about morons. The morons that we’ll meet don’t have tobacco juice dripping from their chins, sunburned necks, or any other stereotypical manifestations of dimness. As the title suggests, Intellectual Morons focuses on cognitive elites who embarrass themselves by championing idiotic theories, beliefs, and opinions. It is a quite pedestrian occurrence for stupid people to fall for stupid ideas. More interesting, and of greater harm to society, is the phenomenon of smart people falling for stupid ideas. Ph.Ds, high IQs, and intellectual honors are not antidotes to thickheadedness.

I found Intellectual Morons entertaining, amusing, and somewhat enlightening. At the same time, Flynn frequently surrounds his substantive charges with information and claims that in a legal context one might consider unduly prejudicial. For example, valid challenges and questions regarding the scholarship used by Alfred Kinsey in his sex surveys are interspersed with graphic descriptions of Kinsey’s rather bizarre sexual practices to the point where Flynn seems to be saying: “Kinsey was wrong, and here’s why, and even if he wasn’t wrong, he was a pervert so don’t listen to him.” The second part of that line of reasoning is of course faulty at best; Flynn is on stronger ground when he suggests that Kinsey was perhaps seeking validation or affirmation of his own preconceived perceptions about sexuality rather than merely recording them. And one has to admit that some of the objections to Kinsey’s landmark studies – for example, that Kinsey excluded entire categories of the population or otherwise skewed the analysis (for example, by categorizing prostitutes at times as “married women”) – do raise questions about the validity of some of the conclusions.

Personally, I found Flynn’s examination of both Paul Ehrlich (the doomsday prophet of the environmental movement) and Peter Singer (the ostensible “father” of the animal rights movement) to be fascinating. What is most intriguing to me is that these two men – especially Ehrlich, who has arguably never seen one of his predictions come to pass – remain darlings of the purported intellectual elite. Indeed, with each of them – and with the case of Rigoberta Menchu, an alleged “illiterate” Guatemalan peasant whose autobiography, I, Rigoberta Menchu, is a standard text on many college campuses despite numerous questions about the “truth” of her story – they are stridently defended by intellectuals and members of the academic establishment. Their ideas supposedly represent some sort of ideological diversity and are thus immune from criticism or challenge – and those who do question them are suddenly labeled as intolerant or worse.

While Intellectual Morons takes a few shots at non-leftist figures like Ayn Rand and Leo Strauss, in the end it must be admitted that this remains a book by the author of Why the Left Hates America and it reflects that fact. The majority of his ire is directed toward leftist figures whose ideology he regards as harmful. In that regard Flynn skewers a rogue’s gallery of leftist thought, scoring a few direct hits and occasionally running into trouble in terms of making personal attacks instead of sticking with the facts (for example, Margaret Sanger is labeled “a world class liar” before readers are even introduced to her). Those able to overlook some of Flynn’s more vociferous commentary may well find some valid criticism of many of the radical viewpoints that have been cleaned up a bit by intellectuals and offered out for public consumption.

UPDATE: Daniel Flynn, author of Intellectual Morons, operates a blog at Flynnfiles.com.

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About Bill Wallo

  • http://www.foliage.com/~marks Mark Saleski

    sounds like talk radio on paper, if ya ask me.

  • http://dumpsterbust.blogspot.com/ Eric Berlin

    The entire set-up of the book seems a little dishonest to me in its attempt to be “even-handed.” It should come out and say something to the effect of “These leftist ideas are stupid and here’s why.”

    The way that you present Mr. Flynn’s argument on Kinsey would seem to fall into the same trap that he is purportedly railing against: convincing theoretically intelligent readers of ideas ripe with faulty logic.

    Eric Berlin
    Dumpster Bust: Miracles from Mind Trash
    http://dumpsterbust.blogspot.com

  • http://www.walloworld.com Bill Wallo

    There are two charges that can be leveled at the book, one of which I alluded to in my opening paragraph: that Flynn leaves himself open to charges that he is blinded by his own ideology as well. In addition, it is rather light on challenging ideologies of the Right – Rand and Strauss are about the only figures that one wouldn’t consider somewhat Left-ward leaning.

    I tend to agree with your initial point, and thought about (but forgot) to incorporate something along those lines in the review. The book doesn’t really tell the reader HOW people fall prey to “stupid ideas,” but rather focuses on how Flynn considers certain ideologies stupid – and why.

  • http://paperfrigate.blogspot.com DrPat

    This sounds like my kind of book – from what you say, Flynn does give several in-depth presentations of intellectual moronism for both right and left. That the list isn’t balanced is less important than whether he substantiates his contention of moronity. Sounds to me like he may have.

  • http://www.foliage.com/~marks Mark Saleski

    yes, he may have…but given that people who bought that book also bought “why the left hates america”, “how to talk to a liberal” (coulter), and “swiftboat vets”…..it seems highly unlikely.

  • http://paperfrigate.blogspot.com DrPat

    I don’t own any of the other three books, but I will be buying this one, thanks to your review. How does that factor into your review of the book?

    (And how do you know who bought what other books besides this one?)

  • http://www.foliage.com/~marks Mark Saleski

    follow the link over to amazon, they always list that info.

  • http://paperfrigate.blogspot.com DrPat

    I thought maybe that might be it. If Amazon.com (big as it is) were the only source for books, this might be a useful statistic.

  • http://www.kolehardfacts.blogspot.com Mike Kole

    Bill- Nice review on a book I was unaware of. I’m inclined to check it out.

    I would argue that few others on the right besides Rand and Strauss were worthy of review in the way so many on the left were. So few others on the right have actually influenced anyone. Coulter? Nowhere near the influence of Rand. No one will read Coulter in 50 years, but Rand still sells books in the six figures annually, nearly 50 years after Atlas Shrugged was published.

  • http://uis.blogspot.com Aakash Raut

    I really need to get this book… I wish I had more free time right now. I know that Young America’s Foundation was doing (and may still be doing… I’m not sure) an essay contest based upon this book; if it wasn’t for all the overdue essays that I’ve been needing to do, and really need to get written and submitted within the next few days, I might think of entering. But aside from that, it seems like it would be a very interesting read. I really like Dan’s blog at FlynnFiles.com.

    I am glad that Mr. Flynn not only opposes the left-wing anti-war activists, but opposes the Iraq war as well. This latest book of his is notable for being critical not only of the usually-discussed leftists, but of the neoconservatives and Straussians as well.

  • http://paperfrigate.blogspot.com DrPat

    Thanks for the blog URL, Aakash. I had to look back at the original review post to realize it wasn’t referenced there.

  • http://www.walloworld.com Bill Wallo

    Dr. Pat: how well Flynn substantiates his charges may of course be somewhat in the eye of the beholder. I think that where, say, Herbert Marcuse is concerned (the so-called “pop philosopher of the left”) he does a nice job, largely by quoting extensively from the primary source – i.e., Marcuse himself. Same with Leo Strauss, who comes off as a man obsessed with understanding the “hidden meanings” of texts that only he – and not lesser mortals – can understand (largely through numerology and references to the first and last word of a work – maybe that’s how his neo-con disciples found evidence of the WMDs, who knows). On some of the others, his contentions are a bit weaker.

    Aakash – thanks for the blog link. I’ll include it in the review.

    Mark – I noted in the review that Flynn also wrote “Why the Left Hates America,” although I haven’t read that book and can’t comment on it (other than to say, as I did in the review, that Intellectual Morons arguably reflects his own personal perspective as well). I haven’t read anything by Coulter nor the Swift Boat Vets book, and ultimately each must stand or fall alone.

  • Shark

    Wow. I’m shocked — and a bit disappointed.

    Based on the title, I thought it would be about Bush Administration and the invasion of Iraq.

    =========

    Most Ironic Line: “…Flynn skewers a rogue’s gallery of leftist thought, scoring a few direct hits and occasionally… making personal attacks instead of sticking with the facts…”

    Does that mean Flynn can analyze his own book in his follow-up: Volume Two…?

    ========

    Look, the guy wrote a book called, “WHY THE LEFT HATES AMERICA” — which — although it makes EVERYTHING he writes SUSPECT — he’s definitely a great example of the ideology of intellectual morons.

    feh.

    ~Next.

    =========

    Is anyone other than lonely, masturbating Libertarians who live at home with their moms interested in Ayn fucking Rand?

    jeezus. Write a boring intellectual justification for unencumbered SELFISHNESS and you’d think she hung the fucking moon…

    —which, by the way, we’d never have landed on if those same lonely Libertarians had been in charge.

    =========

  • http://dumpsterbust.blogspot.com/ Eric Berlin

    Shark –

    Does that mean Flynn can analyze his own book in his follow-up: Volume Two…?

    Hilarious.

    For the record: I’m getting really tired of hearing about how the amorphous Left hates America, are anti-American, should move to France, and on and on. If having and expressing ideas that may not be those of the current Administration is hateful to this country… then maybe it’s not the country I thought it was.

    For the record II: I enjoyed Atlas Shrugged when I read it years ago during high school. Then again, it was a time I was living with my parents and… you know, not dating a lot.

    Eric Berlin
    Dumpster Bust: Miracles from Mind Trash
    http://dumpsterbust.blogspot.com

  • JR

    Would someone who’s dating have the time to read Atlas Shrugged?

  • http://www.foliage.com/~marks Mark Saleski

    maybe the ‘datee’ thinks it’s hot to have atlas shrugged read out loud.

    hey, it could happen.

  • http://paperfrigate.blogspot.com DrPat

    Atlas Shrugged is fiction, folks. Like Dune, it influenced a certain segment of the populace. Like Catch 22, it hit some nerves. Like Stranger In a Strange Land, even its flaws resonated with readers of its day.

    Rather than go on about the book’s length (yes, it’s long) or its “right-leaning philosophy” (wrong, but “received knowledge” by now, so I know it’s useless to debate the point), why not try to think of a similar seminal work of today?

    What book will we be picking apart 20, 30, 50 years from now that is IT today?

  • Shark

    Um… Dr. Pat — yah, we understand.

    uh-huh.

    Now step away from the ‘hand lotion’ and see if Mom’s got dinner ready…

  • Eric Olsen

    Interesting Bill, thanks!

    “enlightened self-interest” is not the same thing as “self-interest”

    ideology neither assures nor precludes writing ability nor original thinking

    having written (blank) has marginal bearing on the worth of (blank2) other than as background on the writer’s predispositions

    dyspeptic fatalism isn’t a particularly enlightening intellectual position

  • http://www.walloworld.com Bill Wallo

    maybe the ‘datee’ thinks it’s hot to have atlas shrugged read out loud.

    hey, it could happen.

    Personally, I’m thinking that’s a form of sadomasochism on somebody’s part.

    I wonder if it might be okay to say that the amorphous left “doesn’t like America very much right now” or “is presently experiencing feelings of anger toward America?” I know, it doesn’t have quite the same ring to it, but as a therapist might say, it’s still good to get those feelings out in the open, isn’t it? ;)

  • http://paperfrigate.blogspot.com DrPat

    “Whip me, beat me, read me John Galt’s speech from Atlas Shrugged…”?

    Sounds like a pretty lively fantasy life, there, Bill.

  • http://www.foliage.com/~marks Mark Saleski

    i’d say that the amorphous left (of which i’m certainly a member) doesn’t like parts of American foreign policy.

    equating this with hating america is a simplistic distillation (one spread around with much glee on talk radio, right wing blogs, etc.)

  • http://www.walloworld.com Bill Wallo

    Okay . . .

    So here’s a prospective right-wing press release:

    The amorphous left is presently experiencing feelings of anger toward some portions of American foreign policy and a few unnamed elected officials.

    Yup, that’s gonna stir the masses. ;)

  • Eric Olsen

    if you go far enough left OR right there are people who flat-out hate America. That has little or nothing to do with the attitudes of the mainstream 90% of the nation

  • Anthony G

    Leftists, Commies, fags, hippies, and anti Americans if you hate this country so much why won’t you clowns just go to old wortheless France. I will personally pay for all one way tickets to France if you call in right now:1 800 I Hate You American Haters. I will also throw in an Umbrella( You will need it when it is raining naked ladies).

    You guys are so worthless that you worship that fat loser pig Michael Moore.

    America: ONE NATION “UNDER GOD” IN DIVISIBLE WITH LIBERTY AND JUSTICE FOR ALL, exept liberals.

  • http://gratefuldread.net Natalie Davis

    Ohhhhhhhhh-kay.

  • http://www.walloworld.com Bill Wallo

    To Anthony G:

    Thank you, little troll.

    Now, would you mind crawling back under your bridge and waiting for my brother, the Biggest Billy Goat Gruff, to come along and beat the crap out of you?

    We’ll be sure to let you know when he gets here.

  • Anthony G

    Bill Walle,

    Thank you, you have made my day. I just love it sooooooooooo much when you hippie pot smoker hipocrats get mad. Thank you very very very much Mr. Walle.

    P.S. Is your brother a commie also. If he is I am sure he won’t beat the crap out of me. Knowing you liberals you will get a high priced lawer and try to sue me before he raise your beatknick fists.

  • Eric Olsen

    Anthony, you seem to want to be taken seriously. If so, concentrate on the spelling, insulting generalizations and logic. Just trying to help.

  • Nick Jones

    I’ll take a ticket to The Netherlands if you throw in Dutch lessons and a list of possible job openings. Legal hash and prostitution, death with dignity, a national health plan, addicts treated as patients, not criminals, democracy…what’s not to love?

  • Anthony G

    Eric thank you for the advice, but please stop following me around and looking over my shoulder.

    Nick Jones

    Please focus man. I said France not Holland.

  • http://selfaudit.blogspot.com Aaman

    IN DIVISIBLE is an indivisible word, normally

  • Anthony G

    So I accidently made a mistake in posting, but please don’t change the subject. Please post again when you something on the real subject.

  • ANTHONY G

    Since there is a mistake in 25 and since it is getting so much publicity eventhough it is all way up there, I am going to post it again for you liberals.

    Aren’t I a nice guy.

  • Anthony G

    Leftists, Commies, fags, hippies, and anti Americans if you hate this country so much why won’t you clowns just go to old wortheless France. I will personally pay for all one way tickets to France if you call in right now:1 800 I Hate You American Haters. I will also throw in an Umbrella( You will need it when it is raining naked ladies).

    You guys are so worthless that you worship that fat loser pig Michael Moore.

    America: ONE NATION “UNDER GOD” INDIVISIBLE WITH LIBERTY AND JUSTICE FOR ALL, exept liberals.

  • http://selfaudit.blogspot.com Aaman

    I would like to fly business class, Air France, s’il vous plait.

    Incidentally, Evian is a beautiful place, just across Lake Geneva from Lausanne, Switzerland. Vive la resistance!

    More to the point, if you drive out everyone who disagrees with you, you are no longer a democracy.

  • Anthony G

    I am not trying to drive out you guys out of the country, not. It is just that several of the good old liberal celebraties have stated before the election and the previous election that they would move to France if Bush gets elected and then reelected. Rush Limbaugh has offered to fly them to France but they had no comment.

    So if you are serious about flying to France call the number I listed up there and Rush will take care of it. And please stay there, because we only offer one ways.

  • http://jadedreality.blogspot.com spiderleaf

    You guys are so worthless that you worship that fat loser pig Michael Moore.

    Okay, my turn.

    You guys are so worthless that you worship that fat loser pig Rush Limbaugh.

    You guys are so worthless that you worship that fat loser pig Bill O’Rielly.

    You guys are so worthless that you worship that fat loser pig Sean Hannity.

    You guys are so worthless that you worship that fat loser pig Tom DeLay.

    shall I continue or would you prefer to have an actual debate?

  • http://www.foliage.com/~marks Mark Saleski

    don’t feed the trolls.

  • http://jadedreality.blogspot.com spiderleaf

    I know, I know, it’s just so much fun sometimes…

  • JR

    Until they crap on you.

  • http://www.foliage.com/~marks Mark Saleski

    the thing about trolls is that they think they’re crapping on you…but it mostly gets all over them.

  • Shark

    Herr AnthonyG, I got a free ticket for you: it’s a time machine set for Germany, 1933.

    You’ll fit right in, duuuuude.

  • Nick Jones

    If I wanted to live in France, I would have said so, Anthony. Duh.

  • http://dumpsterbust.blogspot.com/ Eric Berlin

    I just posted this at a friend’s blog, but it certainly fits fine here:

    I’m getting very very tired of hearing about people who take a different opinion as the current Administration as being anti-American, hating America, etc. Trust me: you’re not the only one doing it (Anthony), and I think it’s a rather alarming trend. Democracy (and Christianity and most world religions, btw) is about tolerating and even embracing those who have a different opinion than yours. I don’t agree with many conservative (and especially the neo- variety) positions, but I refrain from calling anyone anti-American. Can’t we just assume we’re all pro-American and move on to more substantive and non-school yard level discussion? Jeez.

    Eric Berlin
    Dumpster Bust: Miracles from Mind Trash

  • Nick Jones

    That’s ditto for me. Oh, wait…

  • http://www.diablog.us Dave Nalle

    Excellent review. Convinced me to buy the book.

    Two observations.

    First, it looks like a lot of the people he skewers are not necessarily being taken to task for their ‘liberal’ ideas, but for their pseudoscientific, non-political ideas. That liberals happen to have been attracted to those ideas isn’t necessarily germaine.

    Second, Spiderleaf – Bill O’Reilly isn’t fat.

    Dave
    http://www.elitistpig.com

  • ANTHONY G

    ah ha ha ah ha

    It is soooooooooo funny to see you hippie commie leftist liberals get mad.

    #43

    A couple of years ago for a few laughs I read part of Hitler’s Mein Kampf. And I was not suprised to see how much Hitler’s Socialistic views are simular to your guy’s commie views.

    SpidercommieLeaf

    Um, I do not worship any of those names.
    The person who I worship is Jesus and God,(I bet that word makes your atheist blood boil, don’t it?). But if this is a contest on who can name the most names then you will loose my atheist freind. You worship Dan Rather, Bruce Springstein, Barbara Strysan, Ben Affleck, The Clintons, Osama, Suddam, Jaques Chirac, and just about every hippie in Hollywood and oh yeah I almost left at my fat freind Michael Moore.

    Eric Berlin

    What are you on? I am for our current administration. I support our brave troops. I love America

    America

  • http://dumpsterbust.blogspot.com Eric Berlin

    Um… I’m afraid I have no idea what you’re getting at, Anthony.

    Here’s a suggestion: why don’t you try a little careful reading, a little careful thinking (well, perhaps a lot), and then read again and think again before sharing your thoughts.

    You just might find that you make a greater impact and garner the respect of the commies and non-commies alike.

    ~ Eric B.

  • Anthony G

    Eric,

    On #45 what do you mean by the current Administration? Do you mean George Bush or are you referring to something else.

  • http://dumpsterbust.blogspot.com Eric Berlin

    I mean this one and any one. To me, having a differing opinion is an expression of love for one’s country, not hatred. Accusations of “Anti-American” only serve to dumb down the debate… and border upon extremist discourse.

  • Steve S

    Those conservatives who label liberals as anti-American, do so because:

    1) they either perceive anti-Bush people as anti-American people (yet of course when Clinton was president, they pulled out all the stops to bring down the American Presidency).

    2) or they have been fed so much horse-shit from the right wing crowd that they TRULY have NO idea what liberal ideology is about, and how much closer to true democracy it is, than right wing aristocracy or theocracy.

    Either way it goes, when they go on talking about “anti-American liberals”, it just shows liberals AND moderate mainstream, that they are a fringe group who don’t know what the hell they are talking about, have no facts, and so have to resort to hatred and threats.

  • Steve S

    LOL! Whaddya know, the very next link I went to…..

    Would an anti-American liberal be someone who wants a troop pullout in Iraq and someone who is complaining that Bush misled Congress and invaded a country with no post-invasion plan? Is that an anti-American liberal?

    Oh no, wait, it’s not. It’s the Republican Head of the House Subcommittee on Crime, Terrorism and Homeland Security.

  • http://theugliestamerican.blogspot.com/ andy marsh

    NO idea what liberal ideology is about, and how much closer to true democracy it is, than right wing aristocracy or theocracy.

    Steve – are you saying that the “socialized” everything that liberals want is close to democracy? I think it’s a lot closer to socialism than democracy! It has nothing to do with hatred or threats..it has to do with the govt. providing EVERYTHING to people that can’t or won’t provide for themselves! In the few months that I’ve been here, that’s all I’ve ever seen from your posts, is YOU wanting the govt. to give more, more, more!

  • JR

    are you saying that the “socialized” everything that liberals want is close to democracy? I think it’s a lot closer to socialism than democracy!

    You do understand that socialism and democracy are not opposing concepts, don’t you? Democratic nations can vote socialist governments in and out of power; indeed, many countries have done just that, many times over.

    Even Marx’s idea of Communism was a form of democracy, if (arguably) unworkable.

  • http://adamantsun.blogspot.com Steve S

    Steve – are you saying that the “socialized” everything that liberals want is close to democracy? I think it’s a lot closer to socialism than democracy!

    The liberalism/progressivism that I believe in, gives ALL people EQUAL opportunity. It does not dictate what jobs you must have, it does not consider your property or earnings the property of the state, etc.
    So no, I don’t see liberalism equating socialism.

    It has nothing to do with hatred or threats.

    Read anthony g’s comments. Those are very common from the right.

    it has to do with the govt. providing EVERYTHING to people that can’t or won’t provide for themselves!

    huh? the government doesn’t give people cars, it doesn’t give them computers, no it doesn’t give them everything. It makes sure (or should make sure) that everybody has basic needs met, so there is no hunger or poverty, and then the person is free to climb up the economic ladder from there. In socialism, there isn’t the ability to climb up the economic ladder, you stay where you are told. So no, I see them as different.

    In the few months that I’ve been here, that’s all I’ve ever seen from your posts, is YOU wanting the govt. to give more, more, more!

    Then you’ve been misreading. I don’t advocate the government giving more, I am defending what the government already gives from conservatives who would rip equal opportunity to shreds.

    I’ve said many many times that the government could undergo an overhaul, that it could be scaled down some (but NOT in areas that provide equal opportunity) and that the tax code can undergo a major overhaul. I don’t think you read what I say, but you read what you expect to read.

  • http://adamantsun.blogspot.com Steve S

    Democratic nations can vote socialist governments in and out of power; indeed, many countries have done just that, many times over.

    Democratic nations can vote whatever they want into power. What concerns me is voting a theocratic government into power and then finding you can’t vote it out.

    I’m less concerned with voting communism into power because most people who equate liberalism with communism don’t understand the clear distinctions. The number of people in this country who would support real communism are far less than those who would support a theocracy.

  • JR

    What concerns me is voting a theocratic government into power and then finding you can’t vote it out.

    Does seem to work that way with alarming frequency, doesn’t it?

  • http://dumpsterbust.blogspot.com Eric Berlin

    Therein lies a potential (further) crisis in Iraq: what if the people there freely wish to elect a government that the West doesn’t like so much?

  • http://www.kalyr.com/weblog Tim Hall

    Can anyone name a theocratic government that came to power through a democratic election as opposed to a violent revolution?

    And is there an agreed definition of a theocracy? Iran is usually considered as such, but what about Ireland up to at least the sixties? Arguably North Korea is a kind of theocracy.

  • http://selfaudit.blogspot.com Aaman

    Pakistan’s governments are at least nominally, elected democratically, and are theocratic, in deed if not word.

    If you consider communism a ‘religion’, the state of West Bengal in India has been electing ‘red’ governments for a generation now.

    Interesting view of what is a theocracy really.

  • http://www.kalyr.com/weblog Tim Hall

    Didn’t some of the more Islamist Pakistani leaders (such as Zia al Haq) come to power by coup?

    Borderline whether you call Communism a religion, but the combination of rigid ideology with the personality cults of the likes of Stalin and Kim Jong Il go beyond mere garden-variety communism.

    A hypothetical Albargeristan based strictly on the teachings of Ayn Rand might look very much like a theocracy too.

  • http://adamantsun.blogspot.com Steve S

    Can anyone name a theocratic government that came to power through a democratic election as opposed to a violent revolution?

    While the examples given are probably more understandable to most, what I was thinking of, when I wrote that, was America.

    We have citizens who want to make public education conform to their religious beliefs (not teach things that run counter to their ideology), they want to put God in the White House, they want their moral value system imposed on all Americans of all faiths, orientations, etc. They want their biblical scriptures on the walls of federal buildings, they want…yeah, actually, I was thinking of America.

  • http://theugliestamerican.blogspot.com andy marsh

    I knew that BS was coming when I read that question! And of course, it would be the ‘progressive’ boom that would do it! The U.S. is a theocracy because the president believes in God! What a bunch of shit! Better to have an male whore as president than a man of faith…and the whore was the one that screwed up your precious welfare system!

  • http://www.foliage.com/~marks Mark Saleski

    ah, andy proudly showing his true colors.

    a “man of faith”. the “man of faith” spent an awful lot of time spreading misrepresentations about his opponent.

    that would be called “lying” in my book.

    very ‘christlike’.

    what a country.

    god bless america.

    or something.

  • JR

    He wasn’t a whore, he was more of a slut.

  • http://adamantsun.blogspot.com Steve S

    No, Andy, we are not a theocracy. That is not what I said. We are on the brink though, I do believe so. And no, it (my white house comment) doesn’t have to do with a President who believes in God, but a populace who wants a leader to make decisions stemming from their ideology.

  • http://adamantsun.blogspot.com Steve S

    Better to have an male whore as president than a man of faith

    Um, Clinton or Kerry? Both believe in God. Both are men of faith. See what you are saying right here? You WANT a leader who promotes your religious ideology.

  • http://theugliestamerican.blogspot.com andy marsh

    No..I want a leader with a little bit of self restraint…maybe some morals!one that can keep his dick in his pants! He was the president of the United States…and he’s getting head and shoving cigars up some 20somethings skirt in the oval office? You don’t find anything wrong with that? It doesn’t bother you that the president of the United States had the morals of a chimp in a zoo? Besides all that, she was fat and fugly!

  • http://www.foliage.com/~marks Mark Saleski

    lovely.

  • http://adamantsun.blogspot.com Steve S

    No..I want a leader with a little bit of self restraint…maybe some morals!

    Apparently you want a leader who has self restraint in regards to sex, but in regards to government spending and war, restraint is not a requirement.

    He was the president of the United States…and he’s getting head

    Adultery is wrong, but it’s not the highest crime to me. Deceiving our country about our security, deceiving us about going to war, shaving away our civil liberties are much more important values to me than a blowjob.

    You don’t find anything wrong with that?

    I don’t think it’s right, but there is far worse than that, Andy. Surely you don’t think…oh, never mind, clearly you do.

    It doesn’t bother you that the president of the United States had the morals of a chimp in a zoo?

    Apparently he had the morals of millions of Americans as he’s not the only one to get a blow job. While his sexual morals might be low, I think he was a far greater leader and president than Bush could ever dream of being.

    Besides all that, she was fat and fugly!

    In addition to hatred and threats that come from the Right, let me add intolerance, condescension, judgemental attitude, ridicule and a severe disconnect with priorities.

  • JR

    It bothers me more when the president of the United States has the intelligence of a chimp in a zoo. At least Clinton was smart enough to put his staff on alert when he got reports of “increased chatter”.