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Grow Up, Congressman Wilson

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If I were a fly on the wall in any house in the country I am sure that I would hear, at least once a day, a kid be told to "grow up" or "act your age." I know that when I was younger my mom would tell me that I was "acting like a five-year-old" or "acting like a baby." This is a type of scolding that people are supposed to grow out of, kind of like how you are supposed to grow out of diapers or out of training wheels. It is a change in a person that is expected, or our society will look down upon you.

Acting childish is in fact an insult that I think bears a certain amount of weight. So when Representative Joe Wilson of South Carolina, a 62-year-old man, shouted out in the middle of his President's big speech that was meant to set the tone for historic health care reform and said to the President, "You lie!" I was extremely shocked. You just don't do that. You never call the leader of the free world a liar. Especially not during a speech that was on virtually every channel on television and about a point on which the President was actually being very truthful.

There is, in fact, a specific section in the bill that says outright that there will be no care for illegal immigrants. It sounded as though Representative Wilson was being, well, pretty childish. His calling the President a liar over something that was truth shows that he was either lazy and didn't read the bill, or that he simply couldn't accept the dispelling of the lies that he and his fellow Republicans had spread.

Either option means that he didn't act his age. In the 24 hours since the speech and the outburst, the Democrat who plans to challenge Representative Wilson has received around $400,000 in donations. So I guess Wilson will have to really fight for a seat that he didn't win overwhelmingly in the first place. And if you lose your seat, I ask that you grow up and not act like a baby, Representative Wilson. If you had acted your age you wouldn’t be in this political timeout.

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About Arthur Halliday

  • Arch Conservative

    Which is worse? A president who hides his true intentions from us and lies to us every time he opens his mouth or a guy who calls him on it on national TV while said president is reading from his golden teleprompter?

  • Arch Conservative

    Oh hopefully once you get out of school and have to start making your own way in the world you’ll realize that everything you believe now is a huge steaming pile of horseshit.

  • zingzing

    archie: “Which is worse? A president who hides his true intentions from us and lies to us every time he opens his mouth or a guy who calls him on it on national TV while said president is reading from his golden teleprompter?”

    well, he wasn’t telling a lie, was he? so… and he doesn’t hide his true intentions and lie every time he opens his mouth, that’s just your stupid, hyperbolic paranoia. so the guy who made an ass of himself (like you,) comes out looking worse in this case. how you can even ask that with a straight face just speaks volumes about your ridiculous perspective.

    “Oh hopefully once you get out of school and have to start making your own way in the world you’ll realize that everything you believe now is a huge steaming pile of horseshit.”

    everything YOU believe now is a huge steaming pile of horseshit. or do you wonder why everyone laughs at you so much?

  • http://www.fontcraft.com Dave Nalle

    Zing, Obama is very good at wording his statements so that the lie is deniable. But if you really want to get down to it, he’s still lying. The AP and the NYT have both cataloged the lies in the speech in question, and Wilson made a great rebuttal in an AP interview, basically pointing out that he was in the committee meetings where every attempt to exclude illegals from coverage was voted down on partisan lines, so he knew Obama was lying and couldn’t keep silent.

    I hear his campaign warchest is up $1 million at last count.

    Dave

  • zingzing

    dave, you are very good at wording his statements so that the lie is deniable. and i was at those same committee meetings wilson was aggressively trying to insert the word “illegal” into every sentence, whether it fit or not.

    and what’s wilson’s opponent’s warchest looking like?

  • http://delibernation.com/blog/3 Silas Kain

    If the Democrats fail to bring Congressman Wilson into the well of the House and have him declare his act of contrition, they do not deserve to be the majority party. Wilson should be prosecuted with the same zeal which was afforded Bill Clinton. It’s time for tit for tat.

    Which is worse? A president who hides his true intentions from us and lies to us every time he opens his mouth…

    Well, Arch. Are you talking about George W. Bush? Apply the same standards to your Savior, my friend. The more you go after Obama, the more I will speak loudly for an investigation into the Bush Administration which includes a full hearing at the Hague.

    …or a guy who calls him on it on national TV while said president is reading from his golden teleprompter?

    It’s time for a full airing of all the dirt, Arch. And that INCLUDES Democrats. I want equal prosecution across teh political divide. Every sitting member of Congress has much to account and the American public is too damn stupid to realize it because people like you and Glenn Beck are throwing out smokescreens to divert our attention from the important issues of the day. You can continue your KKK-like mission against Barack Obama. I really don’t care if you get all your feathers ruffled. The bottom line is that the majority of venom spit toward Obama is based in racism. If this President were Caucasian Q. WhiteBoy he would not be suffering the same lack of respect.

    Another troubling factoid is that Joe Wilson’s son is running for Attorney General of South Carolina and supports his Daddy’s tacky, ignorant outburst. If I were a South Carolinian who is Black, Latino or Asian I would be very concerned. Wilson’s spawn as the chief law enforcement officer of South Carolina is a very dangerous proposition.

  • http://corp-minamiji.typepad.com Christy Corp-Minamiji

    Arthur raises a point in this article that, once again, seems to have been buried in vitriol. This country has lost its grip on civil debate. To shout insults in the middle of a speech is immature behavior regardless of the validity of one’s point. (In my opinion, Mr. Wilson had no grounds for such a statement, but that is beside the point.)
    Arch, I assume that you meant that Arthur’s political views were a “steaming pile of…” since I can’t see how an expectation of civil behavior from elected officials could possibly be construed as manure. For the record, I’m regrettably familiar with horseshit, and his opinions bear no resemblance.
    In the interests of full disclosure since I’m new around here, yes,I am a registered Democrat, and, yes, I did vote for President Obama. I also love a good political debate minus the name calling.

  • http://delibernation.com/blog/3 Silas Kain

    This country has lost its grip on civil debate.

    I heartily agree. But how can we get back to a civil debate in the United States? The last man standing on compromise died a few weeks ago. There is no one who serves in this Congress who can hold a candle to the way Ted Kennedy conducted his business.

    I think we need to ask ourselves an honest question here. If this were a White Democrat in the White House, would there be as much vitriol? Obama’s beer summit a few weeks back was a cheap photo opportunity. The truth is that racism lives well in Cambridge Massachusetts. The difference is that the targets of this racism are Asian females. That’s the dirty little secret in Cambridge. The powers that be at Harvard and MIT know it. The Mayor knows it. The Police Chief knows it. The officer who arrested Professor Gates knows it — because he and his brothers are part of the problem.

    A little truth from Barack Obama with regard to racism would go a long way. Like it or not, African Americans, the President is half white. The same applies to Whites. Barack Obama is just as much “ours” as “theirs”. And, in the final analysis, Barack Obama is all of us because he is an American and the office he holds demands a modicum of respect. It’s time for an open dialog on race. Let’s sit down at the table, hash it all out and move on once and for all.

  • http://takeitorleaveit.typepad.com/ roger nowosielski

    This country?

    Just look at the BC microcosm. And we’re supposed to be a cut above because all of us are fairly articulate. And yet . . .

  • zingzing

    roger: “And we’re supposed to be a cut above because all of us are fairly articulate. ”

    what ever gave you that idea?

  • http://takeitorleaveit.typepad.com/ roger nowosielski

    I do suppose, zing, and correct me if I’m not mistaken, that most of us have the wherewithal to discuss issues in a far more effective and convincing ways than the average Joe Sixpack. And I’m not being an elitist, I believe, when I say this.

    Just look at the kind of mob scene that defined most of the town-hall meetings.

    And yet, it seems we can’t do better.

  • zingzing

    “And yet, it seems we can’t do better.”

    i just like to argue. if i were in dc today, i’d be making a necklace out of republican fingers. by the end of the day i’d be teabagging skulls. i think that might get me in trouble, but what with this administration, i might actually get away with it.

    “what do you call a massacre on the mall?”

    “a good start!”

    anyway, that’s why we come here. not for intelligent discussion, but as an outlet for our homicidal, political rage. right?

    right?

    am i the only one here who realizes the truth?

    i see then that i am without peers. you are not fit to judge the likes of me.

  • http://takeitorleaveit.typepad.com/ roger nowosielski

    What’s wrong with going to the gym for a workout? I don’t think, besides, that’s what you’re up to. Haven’t seen much rage coming out of you.

    Point well taken, however.

  • http://takeitorleaveit.typepad.com/ roger nowosielski

    If anything, it’s more like in order to exercise our immaturity and libidinal urges. So what I say to that? – have ravenous sex with the person or object of your unexpressed desired, be they real or imaginary.

    Get your rocks off, for crying out loud, but don’t contaminate this side with infantile urges or pseudo-intellectual pretensions.

  • http://takeitorleaveit.typepad.com/ roger nowosielski

    Seriously, people like that ought to be banned, fuck the First Amendment.

  • http://takeitorleaveit.typepad.com/ roger nowosielski

    In short, zing, I have no sympathy, none whatever, for philistines, barbarians and murderers of the sublime and the beautiful. Call me undemocratic if you will, but I’ll live with that epithet without the slightest unease in my heart.

    But I don’t keep on talking to myself. Enough said.

  • zingzing

    if the first amendment is your object of choice, by all means, fuck it. i think it came alone tonight.

  • http://takeitorleaveit.typepad.com/ roger nowosielski

    You mean, “it reared it’s ugly head”?

  • http://thingsalongtheway.blogspot.com/ Cindy

    zing would be the funnest person to smoke pot with, i think.

  • http://takeitorleaveit.typepad.com/ roger nowosielski

    I happen to think you’re right, Cindy, because then and only then you’d get to know “the real zing.”

  • zingzing

    zing on pot likes to shut up and listen to music. if you want to see drug-induced zingjabbajabba, you have to procure cocaine. i don’t buy the stuff, so you’d better be generous. jesus, that would be AWESOME! i am so in the mood.

  • http://takeitorleaveit.typepad.com/ roger nowosielski

    Cocaine does indeed loosen the tongue (and I don’t mean it in a vulgar sense) and brings forth the consciousness.

  • http://takeitorleaveit.typepad.com/ roger nowosielski

    But so does Johnny Walker Black or Bushmill whiskey.

  • http://thingsalongtheway.blogspot.com/ Cindy

    zing on pot likes to shut up and listen to music

    me too, that’s even better. i don’t usually want to talk i want to listen to music and ‘travel’, or i want to watch the film ‘the wife’ and think (trying to race after and recapture the outrageous expanse of my thoughts as they threaten to escape is not conducive to conversation) so the rare pot occasion is one where i am alone. but i can imagine exceptions in the experience where i’d want to take a break from my solitude…and i can’t imagine a funner person to talk to in the interstices. solitude in company and company in solitude.

    (i think i’ll skip the cocaine, that was way long ago, no value there for me…maybe a whiskey or 3 :-)

  • http://www.maskedmoviesnobs.com El Bicho

    should be a good party

  • http://thingsalongtheway.blogspot.com/ Cindy

    First there was a block party. We can have a blog party ElB; where everyone is invited to get high in their favorite way and contribute to the commentary. (couldn’t possibly be a fun as real life though)

  • Zedd

    Guys,

    Considering that the author of this article is a kid, its pretty irresponsible of you to prattle on about the joys of drug use on this thread.

    Wilson was immature but so are you. We get it… you guys are mad at the world and want to trash it all -anarchy and all that rot – but this is a bit much. You have a responsibility to all children. You have no choice. Whats the point rattling off about universal health care, being humane, the environment or civil liberties if you cant restrain yourselves around our young.

    Grow up!

  • zingzing

    “Considering that the author of this article is a kid, its pretty irresponsible of you to prattle on about the joys of drug use on this thread.”

    did not notice that.

    “We get it… you guys are mad at the world and want to trash it all -anarchy and all that rot – but this is a bit much.”

    the joys of the internet… or of pop culture at large. and i’m not mad at the world. looks like the conservatives are to me…

    “Grow up!”

    never!

  • http://delibernation.com/blog/3 Silas Kain

    In the famous words of Patricia Henry, a drag queen I once knew…

    Give me Librium or give me death!

    For me, the obvious choice is weed. I don’t like liquor. I won’t do hard core drugs — been there, done that in my old days. Weed, on the other hand, is OK. I can’t wait until it’s legal because I’ll be the first in line.

  • http://thingsalongtheway.blogspot.com/ Cindy

    ouch Zedd…didn’t see his age. (wince)

  • http://thingsalongtheway.blogspot.com/ Cindy

    Sorry Arthur,

    To make it up to you, I have a relative who was a sports writer at the NJ Star-Ledger. He’s now a freelancer as he’s getting his first book publishing deal and he just sold an article to the WSJ: Poison Ivy in the Garden State: The glory days of New Jersey corruption, from a colonial cross-dresser to a filing cabinet stuffed with cash. If you’d like to talk to someone with experience in the field. Let me know. He’s a nice guy.

  • Zedd

    zing,

    I wouldn’t categorize the current version of “Conservatives” as angry. Stupid is more like it. I think they are insenced because of severe ignorance. They’ve been trained like Pavlov’s dog to be upset about certain trigger concepts. Whether these select evils actually have any detrimental effect or not is not really the issue. They just know they are supposed to be bad. They also know that they are supposed to love certain things (words) -liberty, the flag, small government, capitalism, prayer, the 10 commandments and the pledge (may have missed one or two). What any of those things represent or mean is irrelevant. They just know that they are good.

  • Zedd

    Awe Cindy… Really sweet. I’m verklempt. Talk among yourselves.

  • Clavos

    Woof, woof!

    Arf, arf!

    Scratch, scratch…

    Sniff, sniff [oh, wow! a bitch in heat!]

  • http://thingsalongtheway.blogspot.com/ Slow-On-The-Uptake

    25 That was hilarious, El-B.

  • http://ruvysroost.blogspot.com Ruvy

    Arthur,

    I read your article, and frankly, the custom of sitting silent in a chamber while the president (or king) addresses it is not universal.

    No leader here (Israel) will get through a speech without serious heckling. Shouting “you lie!”, particularly when it is true, is democracy, and not a violation of manners.

    Do yourself a favor and read about comparative customs in parliamentary chambers. It might prove interesting.

  • http://www.maskedmoviesnobs.com El Bicho

    “You have a responsibility to all children. You have no choice.”

    What a bunch of road apples. I didn’t give birth to him. And are you really so naive to think a modern-day high school student with Internet access doesn’t know people do drugs? Besides, it’s more responsible to tell kids the truth than lie to them because then they distrust you.

    But to help unwad your panties, let me quote South Park’s Mr. Mackey “drugs are bad, m’kay. You shouldn’t do drugs.”

    At least until college.

  • http://ruvysroost.blogspot.com Ruvy

    My kids are beyond the age where I have to teach them not to use drugs. But there are plenty out there who still have the lesson to get across to children – whether they be their own – or those of others.

    Comments #19-26 (and #37), which come from adults who should know better, make that task harder. I see Zedd’s point here….

  • http://www.maskedmoviesnobs.com El Bicho

    “adults who should know better”

    says the adult who calls for death on a daily basis. Spare us the child-rearing lessons because if he was born in the wrong country you wouldn’t care if he got nuked

  • http://ruvysroost.blogspot.com Ruvy

    This – …a great majority of the world seemed to unite over the senseless killing of a few thousand innocent people and decided death with those we disagree should not be the answer…. – from the mind of a dhimmi on the Wahhabi terror attack on 11 September, 2001.

    This – What a bunch of road apples. I didn’t give birth to him…. – from the mouth of an irresponsible dhimmi.

    On the one hand, he would turn the remembrance of the creation of thousands of orphans into a pathetic Hallmark holiday with candy and flowers – on the other hand he rejects responsibility for any children he has not personally fathered.

    This fellow tells me to be quiet because I demand that the deaths of thousands from Wahhabi terror be avenged. He tells me to spare him child rearing lessons? He won’t teach a young man not to use drugs, and he won’t avenge the murder of his own by terrorists.

    Says a lot about him, and all those who agree with him. Says a lot about his culture, too.

    No further comments needed.

  • http://takeitorleaveit.typepad.com/ roger nowosielski

    Zedd,

    You can’t be serious. You know you must pass the drug test before you can write for BC. Besides, all our writers are mature and rarely if ever underage.

  • Mark

    It’s true! Don’t know about you all, but I was taken completely by surprise when the BC editorial staff burst into my home, and at the point of several red pens force fed me all manner of illicits and illegals. Happily, I passed the test though just barely.

  • Arch Conservative

    George Bush is my savior?

    You really don’t know me at all because you haven’t either bothered to read any of my posts Silas.

    First I was a Christian fundy and now W. is my savior?

    For the record I was happy to see W. go and I didn’t vote for Mccain.

    Chuck Baldwin was my savior in 2008 but being an honest man he didn’t get very far in our soundbite society.

    As far as I’m concerned Barack Obama, W, and MCcrazy can all climb in the back of Ted Kennedy’s 67 Oldsmobile Delmont 88 and drive off of a fucking bridge.

  • http://thingsalongtheway.blogspot.com/ Cindy

    36 I think Ruvy has interesting point here.

    What about dissent, Arthur? How do you think that should be handled?

  • http://ruvysroost.blogspot.com Ruvy

    To be absolutely truthful, things like this, a representative shouting criticism at a chief magistrate, do not mean that much to me, but to those of you who would make a big deal over it, you might want to view this brief video. This stuff goes both ways.

  • Arthur Halliday

    Wow, I didn’t think what I wrote would lead to favorite ways to get high, that’s interesting… I’m not THAT young, just not THAT old. And Cindy, thanks for the offer, I think that dissent is the purest form of democracy (like those bumper stickers) just keep it classy. Also I think that it is interesting that this is a common occurance in other cultures, I can certainly see that. I just think that in the culture we are in the US it is unexceptable and people have been ruined for much less rudeness.

  • http://thingsalongtheway.blogspot.com/ Cindy

    Arthur,

    What makes one thing acceptable and not another, in your view? How does a thing become acceptable? Why is it acceptable, for example, in Ruvy’s forum and not in the U.S.?

    (If you’d like to talk to Brad, just contact me at the e-mail accessible through my profile on my blog–click on my name to access the blog link.)

    Also, I am very pleased that I have not contributed to scarring your for life. I had a feeling I didn’t. :-)

  • Zedd

    Cindy, Arthur

    I would chime in by saying that our conduct in most cases is dictated by the situation or environment that we find ourselves in. We don’t poop in every small room that has a white seat in it. Thus it is so with this situation. While other parliamentary settings may permit such conduct and such behavior may actually legitimizes the the activities of that body, in our halls of state, it is unheard of. It is simply not done. It is rude and inappropriate.

    I would ask why it is that this Congressman felt that in this particular situation such conduct would be allowable.

  • http://thingsalongtheway.blogspot.com/ Cindy

    Okay, I will catch you ball Zedd. But how do ‘situations’ dictate things.

    How does a ‘parliamentary settings’ permit things?

  • http://thingsalongtheway.blogspot.com/ Cindy

    (I will give you an ‘r’ for ‘your’ if you will be so kind as to hand me back the ‘s’ that doesn’t belong at the end of ‘parliamentary setting’.)

  • Zedd

    El-B

    Your comment did nothing influence a retraction of the accusation of immaturity on your part. Your comment just canceled every argument that you’ve ever made on BC. You basically said you are not your brother’s keeper. If you can not be bothered to take care for the benefit of others then you should not expect any activity on your behalf as well. You should not have any expectations of society at all. Mature adults understand the give and take; the unspoken contract that we make as members of society, especially for the benefit of our young, all of them.

  • Clavos

    I would ask why it is that this Congressman felt that in this particular situation such conduct would be allowable.

    He probably didn’t care whether or not it was acceptagle.

  • zingzing

    zedd, the kid knows all about drugs. we have a little program in this country (at least i think it’s still out there) called “dare” that teaches us all about hard drugs, euphoria and the like. arthur didn’t hear anything here that he hasn’t heard and seen 100 times before in movies, music, television, books, the internet, and on the streets.

    by the time someone’s in high school, chances are that they have actually tried drugs, nevermind heard of them. to suggest otherwise, or to suggest that arthur here is gonna run out and snort a bigass bump because someone mentions drugs, is a bit silly and your protective mother act is both useless and disingenuous.

    not gonna say we should all talk about how wonderful drugs are, but i also have to scoff at how seriously you take talking about drugs.

  • Clavos

    OR acceptable…

  • zingzing

    “He probably didn’t care whether or not it was acceptagle.”

    police yourself.

  • zingzing

    dammit

  • Clavos

    It’s as naive as thinking teens aren’t getting laid…

  • Clavos

    HA!

    Clavos 1 zing 0

  • Zedd

    Fair trade.

    You understand culture and the complexities that create different ones.

    The behavior in the British Parliaments comes as a result of their own evolution. Am I to understand that you want us to examine why they conduct themselves in such a manner and why we don’t?

    Knowing how we as a species typically deal with serious matters, its more surprising that the British or Israeli setting would be so boisterous.

  • zingzing

    “Clavos 1 zing 0″

    well played. but you’re vulnerable. you perch upon precarious heights and walk on eggshells at the same time. i will have my revenge.

  • Clavos

    Life is nothing without heights and eggshells…

  • http://thingsalongtheway.blogspot.com/ Cindy

    59 Am I to understand that you want us to examine why they conduct themselves in such a manner and why we don’t?

    Nope.

    How could they ‘evolve'(any of them)?

  • Zedd

    zing,

    I believe he knows that people who get high like it. I believe he knows that people who have other vices, enjoy those vices. It’s childish of you to believe (or argue) that his knowledge of that gives you the right to discuss a matter that YOU don’t discuss with most adult freely, at work or in most settings, on this thread.

    I don’t think he hears his parents talking about the joys of getting high. Why would you see it as your calling to do so.

    The truth is that you didn’t realize how young Arthur was and didn’t want to admit your error AND because the “seventh grade you” reared its ugly head and you wanted to be cool so you offered this embarrassingly silly retort. Being grown up is cool as hell zing. You get to stay up as late as you want and you get to say smart stuff without feeling embarrassed. You get to do whatever you want, including influencing the next generation positively. Embrace it. Admit your goof, apologize to the young man for disrespecting him and move on.

    Noticed no one else chimed in on your crack enthusiasm? Meaning grown ups realize how stupid your use of elicit drugs is. Those that have endulged stated that they only endulged when they were younger (dumber)

  • http://takeitorleaveit.typepad.com/ roger nowosielski

    Zedd,

    The whole thing started as a joke. Pick it up from the beginning of the sequence in question and you’ll see. No harm was intended; and zing always jokes anyway.

  • Franco

    11 – roger nowosielski

    I do suppose, zing, and correct me if I’m not mistaken, that most of us have the wherewithal to discuss issues in a far more effective and convincing ways than the average Joe Sixpack.

    I’m sorry, the wherewithal to discuss issues in a far more effective and convincing ways but “correct me if I’m not mistaken”?

    Have another Sixpack roger.

  • http://takeitorleaveit.typepad.com/ roger nowosielski

    Franco,

    You’ll need a gallon of cheap vino to make yourself understood, buddy. Not before.

  • Zedd

    I got the joke and it was funny. I do think zing is funny and weird at the same time like most regulars on BC (but funnier certainly).

    I’m a Mom Roger. There’s a time for everything. There just is.

  • http://takeitorleaveit.typepad.com/ roger nowosielski

    I’m glad we can all be friends again; and for any improprieties with respect to our youthful author of this article, may I apologize profusely on behalf of all.

  • zingzing

    “The truth is that you didn’t realize how young Arthur was and didn’t want to admit your error”

    i did. read my comments.

    “Being grown up is cool as hell zing.”

    of course it is. doesn’t mean you can’t act like you’re not now and again. that’s fun too. don’t take everything so seriously. you don’t need to parent every kid in the world.

    “You get to stay up as late as you want and you get to say smart stuff without feeling embarrassed.”

    and you get to condescend! wow!

    “Admit your goof, apologize to the young man for disrespecting him and move on.”

    disrespect? you don’t even believe that. fuck it if i’ll apologize for something i didn’t do.

    “Noticed no one else chimed in on your crack enthusiasm? Meaning grown ups realize how stupid your use of elicit drugs is.”

    no one said anything about crack. and do you think i really do a bunch of blow? come on zedd, don’t believe everything you see on the internet.

    “I got the joke and it was funny.”

    nah, you missed it.

    zedd, i don’t believe this kid’s life is affected one way or another based on anything that anybody says here. and truthfully, neither do you. stop momming it up around here. no one needs that. you’re just making me feel indignant and like i wanna just do anything you tell me not to do. keep this up and i’m going to tell him how to make xtc and meth just to spite you, and i don’t wanna do that.

    you have been warned…

  • zingzing

    roger: “may I apologize profusely on behalf of all.”

    except me. lalala.

  • http://delibernation.com/blog/3 Silas Kain

    Arch, I took back my comments. I apologize for characterizing you as a fundamentalist Christian and a George W. Bush apostle. I take back all of my uninformed commentary of you. What does remain true, however, is that your point of view, in my mind, is irrational, outdated and contributes more to the dismantling of the Union than to preserve it. To err is human, forgive Divine. I apologize. Too bad others can’t take my lead like that scum sucking ignorant douche bag from South Carolina who deserves nothing less than to be voted out of office and sent to Gitmo for rehabilitation.

  • zingzing

    don’t mention rehab, silas…

  • http://www.maskedmoviesnobs.com El Bicho

    “Your comment did nothing influence a retraction of the accusation of immaturity on your part.”

    Really? Considering that wasn’t my intention, that’s not a surprise.

    I have argued the refs gave Super Bowl XL to the Steelers. Is that argument canceled as well? Although considering I wasn’t seeking your approval, I am not sure your opinion matters.

    And I didn’t say I wasn’t my brother’s keeper, but I am not going to hold my tongue because of what the children might see.

    “You should not have any expectations of society at all.”

    I don’t. Helps to keep from getting disappointed by it, like ignorant folks like you who are against gay marriage

  • Zedd

    zing,

    “and truthfully, neither do you”

    WRONG. I believe we are impacted by every experience. Only teenagers and silly Baby Boomers (off course) believe otherwise. The teens are forgivable but the oldies are getting really tiresome (twenty more years and they’ll be gone or in nursing homes thank goodness and we can all move on sensibly).

    Pops, I mean zing, you pretty much responded to every point that I made and made amends in an offhand sort of way. Your forgiven.

    I am right & you were wrong. Na-na-na boo boo! No take backs.

  • http://www.maskedmoviesnobs.com El Bicho

    Ruvy, your representation is absolutely false. I told you to give your murderous blood lust towards Hillary Clinton a rest for one day, which of course was asking too much from a twisted individual as yourself.

    If the young man has ever been sick he has used drugs, so your too late on that front. And yes, I find your “Say ‘No’ to Drugs” view naive and idiotic considering you would have no problem obliterating the young man if he lived in the wrong county.

    And what murders by terrorists have you avenged, or are you just a hypocritical blowhard with an Internet connection?

  • Zedd

    El B,

    Whatev….

    Make a halfway lucid argument sometimes will ya. Spewing and whining all over the web… blek.

    On the topic from a year ago, you never understood what I was saying and looks like you don’t have the capability to.

    As to this tete-a-tete I really wasn’t expecting anything from you. Alas, it just had to be said.

    Anywho….

  • http://thingsalongtheway.blogspot.com/ Cindy

    Zedd,

    I think perhaps you’ve left off the possibility that things may not be a matter of being so cut and dried and clear.

  • zingzing

    zedd: “WRONG. I believe we are impacted by every experience.”

    in some sort of manner, sure. but if arthur here is a raging drug addict in a few years, it’s not my fault. or even close.

    “Pops, I mean zing, you pretty much responded to every point that I made and made amends in an offhand sort of way. Your forgiven.”

    good?

    “I am right & you were wrong. Na-na-na boo boo! No take backs.”

    well, glad you dropped the momitude.

  • Clavos

    Glad I don’t have any children…

  • http://thingsalongtheway.blogspot.com/ Cindy

    looking around BC tonight, i am glad i don’t have any adults. lol

  • Zedd

    Cindy,

    I think perhaps you’ve left off the possibility that things may not be a matter of being so cut and dried and clear.

    What that El-B is really a genius beneath that thick layer of tantrums and hissy fits?? That he’d give Rousseau, Socrates and Durkheim all a run for their money??

    Cindy all jokes aside, that is what I am always saying. It rarely is ever so cut and dried. We’ve so gotten used to simple ideas about who we are that it’s difficult to imagine that we are a lot simpler and a lot more complex and both states are not necessarily paradoxical. Because of our romanticising history and historical figures we are quick to look for hard and fast rules, totally ignoring that we as humans right now know ourselves and our own personal complexities. We believe that the myths of how we arrived to where we are should dictate how we make decisions about the future.

    I am simply a proponent of us thinking things through and trusting that we have the capability today to figure things out. That there were no good old days and that the giants of old exist today. So with any social conundrum, we should employ logic to hammer it out instead of falling back on cliches and distorted ideas about what is means to be human.

    So many really simple ideas have been made complicated by the overuse of platitudes or faddish ideas of the time. So many complex ideas have been dulled by the same. I’m just for thinking things through and using collaborative methods to reach a meaningful conclusion . I am a big fan of the socratic method not necessarily for instructional purposes only but for discovery, even though I think Socrates was a bully (or show off) and cheated sometimes.

  • http://thingsalongtheway.blogspot.com/ Cindy

    Zedd,

    You sound just like a philosopher. I’m having a hard time following.

  • http://thingsalongtheway.blogspot.com/ Cindy

    Well I guess I follow a little. But philosophy is about the last thing I can think of, as I just O.D.ed on it.

    Is philosophy a drug? :-)

    I’ll try again tomorrow.

  • Zedd

    Cindy,

    Did you say the “d” word! Slowly I turn (cackle, cackle), inch by inch… :o)

    You are having difficulty following because I am a horribly lazy writer.

    I will try again, perhaps tomorrow.

  • zingzing

    “Slowly I turn (cackle, cackle), inch by inch… :o)”

    god, i love that skit. (the i love lucy version is awesome.)

  • Clavos

    I’m just for thinking things through and using collaborative methods to reach a meaningful conclusion.

    Why meaningful? Sometimes, a cigar is…

    just a cigar.

  • Clavos

    wow, zing, your “slowly I turn” bit comes up hits #s 3 and 4 on Google (and I do mean yours, there are numerous others as well.

  • zingzing

    i do like the lou costello version as well. wonderfully violent. but lucy’s is the first i saw. and i love lucy is the greatest sitcom ever. god, i love that show. so random at times.

  • http://delibernation.com/blog/3 Silas Kain

    Unless it’s from Cuba. Then it’s illegal.

  • http://ruvysroost.blogspot.com Ruvy

    Ruvy, your representation is absolutely false.

    There’s nothing false about my representation. It rings as true as silver dollar. If you really want to go into that argument again, I’ll reproduce the comments. Copy/paste is not that hard….

    I find your “Say ‘No’ to Drugs” view naive and idiotic considering you would have no problem obliterating the young man if he lived in the wrong county.

    I think you meant to type “wrong country” but considering your small-minded comments, I cannot be sure. I live by what I say. I didn’t and don’t use recreational drugs, and have managed to teach my sons not to as well.

    And I guess you do need to have your nose rubbed in what a dhimmi you are, and what a dhimmi mentality you have, so I will reproduce my comment to you from SJ Reidhead’s article – one you never answered.

    But first a final point. I do what I can to fight terror. That is why I am a police volunteer, and why I go on patrol regularly to protect the village I live in from terrorists. You’re the blowhard with the internet connection.
    ————————————————————————————————————————————————————————————————————————————

    El Bicho,

    The 11th of September is my birthday. Even if you forget it, I never will. On my fiftieth birthday, I went to downtown Jerusalem with my wife to celebrate – we weren’t exactly sure how, but we left the boys to explore the Absorption Center where we lived in East Talpiot. We had arrived in the country one week earlier, and downtown Jerusalem was still filled with wonder for me. It took a while to get off the high of making aliyah. We went to a money changer to change some dollars into shekels.

    The money changer asked if we were Americans. I nodded. In his broken English, he tried to get across something about a plane and a building – finally hitting upon the Hebrew word for ‘twins’- t’umím|. I finally understood what he was saying – that a jet had hit the Twin Towers in New York – and I told him he was crazy.

    We took our money and went up ben-Yehuda Street, looking for a place to celebrate, and saw a pizza shop with a huge poster of the New York skyline and a TV. We wandered in and before we ordered, I tried to explain in my awful Hebrew what the money changer had explained to us in his awful English. He smiled and picked up the remote and turned on CNN.

    There it was, in living color. It was morning in New York, and only one jet had hit one of the towers. I couldn’t beleive what I saw. After eight years, I still cannnot believe what I saw. I could not believe that I was in J-lem, where so many terror attacks had taken place, and I was watching a terror attack on Manhattan on the TV. Another jet hit the other tower. After some time, one of the towers just collapsed, and then the other one collapsed.

    A crowd had gathered in the pizza shop, watching the ongoing horror in New York. When I still lived in Brooklyn, I had worked in a freight forwarding company just across the street from these buildings, and after typing import documents, I would deliver many of them to the World Trade Center; the Arab Chamber of Commerce, to certify that the goods talked about were not from Israel; Zim Lines, where lots of imports from Israel came; Atlantic Container Lines, where teenagers would stamp my bills of ladings and dock receipts.

    I didn’t like the Trade Center – architecturally, it was an ugly symbol of “modernity” – glass and concrete that swayed in the wind on the top floors. The place had no class. If someone were to knock it down WHEN IT WERE EMPTY that would have been fine with me. But what I saw wasn’t fine with me.

    YOUR ENEMIES – MY ENEMIES – had just knocked down the biggest building in New York – where I was born – and Arabs in Gaza were cheering.

    Thousands died that day in lower Manhattan from that terrorist attack. But your government never went after Saudi Arabia, holding them responsible for the terror – as they should have been held responsible.

    No.

    For eight years your damned government has been going after US IN ISRAEL as if the terror the Arabs influenced by the Wahhabi scum in Riyadh were all OUR fault. Instead of nuking Riyadh, like your government ought to have, your government exposes us to nuclear attack and acts as if we are the evil ones here; the ones who tortured and drove Christians out of Bethlehem; as if we were the ones who provoked a murderous civil war in Lebanon where thousands have died; as if we trashed the church in Bethlehem. Your government trains Arabs to kill Jews, and threatens to unleash them upon us if we do not comply with your government’s demands. It has unleashed them, in fact. One such American trained Arab killed Rabbi Binyamin Kahane and his wife as they were driving only a few miles from where I type this right now. YOUR SECRETARY OF STATE BACKS ALL THIS CRAP, THIS HYPOCRITICAL BULLSHIT! She has made herself into an enemy of my people. So, I feel bad if some terrorist does not manage kill the bitch. I wish some terrorist had killed Rice as well, for the same reason!

    I WANT MY ENEMIES – AND YOUR ENEMIES – TO DIE!! SO SHOULD YOU!!

    …a sensible person would think that on the anniversary of 9/11, when for a few minutes at least, a great majority of the world seemed to unite over the senseless killing of a few thousand innocent people and decided death with those we disagree should not be the answer, you could for one day, especially this day, keep your homicidal desires to yourself.

    Now maybe 9/11 meant nothing at all to you. It’s not mandatory it should. You may even find good in it because it resulted in quite a few Arabs getting killed who won’t bother you and your people.

    I am sure you have a diatribe coming to inform us why Hillary deserves to die for whatever actions she (and what, possibly her husband?) undertook that have undermined Israel. But since you made clear it was no joke, you have shown your way of thinking is just like that of the 9/11 hijackers. You are part of the world’s problem and not its solution.

    Don’t you wave your hypocritical moralizing bullshit at me! You haven’t learned a damned thing from the deaths of all those FELLOW AMERICANS killed by Wahhabi terrorists 8 years ago.

    You deserve whatever hell befalls you – you do not even comprehend yet the enemy you face. You are still at war, and for you to think otherwise displays you for the total blind fool your are. Englishmen, attacked by Wahhabi terrorists act like cows. Spaniards, attacked by terrorists, act like cowards. Would you also act like a cowardly dhimmi? THE MURDER OF 3,000 AMERICANS ON 11 SEPTEMBER 2001 WAS NOT SENSELESS, YOU FOOL. IT WAS PURPOSEFUL, DESIGNED TO BREAK YOUR WILL TO FIGHT! THESE PEOPLE DIED IN VAIN ONLY IF YOU REFUSE TO DESTROY THE ENEMY THAT KILLED THEM AND THREATENS YOU! DON’T DESECRATE THEIR MEMORY!

  • http://ruvysroost.blogspot.com Ruvy

    That (comment #89) was one hell of an interesting comment there, Silas.

  • zingzing

    ruvy: “I live by what I say.”

    god, i hope not.

    “I didn’t and don’t use recreational drugs, and have managed to teach my sons not to as well.”

    so you think.

  • Arthur Halliday

    What if we just accept that our view’s are gonna be different from those of other’s based on experiences that we’ve had that other’s haven’t that? We are NOT hating on Israel (or at least I hope not) and that needs to be clear. Also, I think some people are overreacting to comments. Chill, it’s just a blog. And I have no doubt that ruvy is clean and that he teaches his kids not to either. That is the real way to teach kids not to do drugs. We all laugh at the stupid programs they have in school, at the end of the day it is about the people you surround yourself with and the influence that your parents have on you combined with your sense of right and wrong.

  • Ted

    The reason Obama is so terrible is because he is the first president ever to have the hubris to say one thing while hiding his true intentions.

  • Anadult

    Obama is a liar. He is very glib and has a chip on his shoulder and so does his wife.
    WISE UP!

  • zingzing

    ted: “The reason Obama is so terrible is because he is the first president ever to have the hubris to say one thing while hiding his true intentions.”

    yeah. ok. sure. just what are his true intentions then?

    anadult: “Obama is a liar. He is very glib and has a chip on his shoulder and so does his wife. WISE UP!”

    how did he lie?

  • Anadult

    He’s been lying from the beginning of his presidency. Read the health bill. He says illegal aliens will not be covered in this bill. There is no provision stating this in that bill.

  • zingzing

    is there a provision stating that they will be?

  • http://drdreadful.blogspot.com Dr Dreadful

    Ted: The reason Obama is so terrible is because he is the first president ever to have the hubris to say one thing while hiding his true intentions.

    Um, yeah, sure. And Scott Peterson was the first murderer ever to deny that he did it.

    Twit.

  • http://drdreadful.blogspot.com Dr Dreadful

    Anadult (hmm): He says illegal aliens will not be covered in this bill. There is no provision stating this in that bill.

    There’s also no provision stating that we will all get a free Mustang. Does that mean we will, in fact, all be getting a free Mustang?

    Oy, squishing intellectual pygmies just isn’t as much fun as it used to be.

  • zingzing

    be realistic, doc! maybe a free pedicure, but a mustang? i demand that the no-mustang clause be written in toot sweet.

  • Clavos

    Mustang hell!

    I won’t settle for less than a Lamborghini.

  • http://drdreadful.blogspot.com Dr Dreadful

    Mustang hell!

    Do they have to wear bridles?