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God…or the lack of it?

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An interesting post I stumbled across left me absolutely convinced that true and undying faith for God doesn’t equate to intelligence…from Disposable Christian. To cut the chase short…here’s the post he made…

“There are a few of us who have conquered sinful lust. It has been 358 days today since I last entertained a lustful thought or suffered the ill manifestations of conscious lust. One of the most offensive thoughts in relation to this battle that every Christian man fights is the notion that those who win are somehow weaker in passion or desire than those who do not. I abhor the lie that says, “I just have too much desire. It has been my biggest problem for such a long time.” I despise the implication that these ‘men’ are ‘just too great of lovers to overcome the sin’. I say their passions are misplaced and their love is wrong. I ask, does it even make sense? Would God in Jesus Christ, commanding purity, reward obedience with impotence? Would the everlasting bridegroom pair adultery toward Him with fidelity toward an earthly wife? If marriage is worship, how would activity reserved for its context be lesser in intensity in those with greater passion for God? Is sinful lust compatible with the first and great commandment– to love The Great I AM who is Love with everything you are? I’m talking about the thoughts of Christian men in churches and small groups, “accountability groups,” all over the world. Pastor Rob wasn’t talking about them specifically but was speaking generally about passion when he said, “If you say your passion for God is increasing but your passion for other [sinful, sin-related] things is not decreasing, you are lying.” I passionately agree.”

I’m sorry…but I assume this loser’s intepretation of a lustful thought or suffered the ill manifestations of conscious lust would be mentally stripping off a woman’s clothes? Ok if it is…this 2-eyed manifestation of Jonathan Levinson (for Buffy fans out there) is just about the biggest pussy since the grinning Cheshire Cat made his appearance in Alice in Wonderland…forever capturing the kids’ imagination…

But I digress…now tell me…how is a man able to go even a day without thinking of nocturnal activities with a fantabulous woman who makes your gonads go huh? Yes your faith is strong…it’s embedded in the innermost region of your unconscious beliefs…make no mistake about it…it’s something u wake up and fall asleep to…”God watches over me when I sleep”…so yeah…I guess he must be somewhere in your Rapid Eye Movement (REM) stages…

I wonder…how is purity and chastity going to make your life better when you have absolutely no fucking clue on the stuff that ya missing out on? Is masturbation considered unclean? I’ve had a couple of male friends confessing that they’ve never…in their entire soddin lives…masturbated…

Riiiiight….

If God was always right and wants the best for us…why wouldn’t he want us to enjoy the fruits of life? The sweet nectar of pre-marital sex…the beautiful blooming flowers of masturbation….the picturesque view of multiple sex partners…or the crystal clear waters of polygamy? Speakin of which…if a spouse has just lost his other half…and has been monogamous and faithful his entire life…would it be considered dirty, wrong and downright sinful for him to remarry? Wouldn’t deuterogamy be unclean too?

I beg to differ…but there’s just too many things in life that are worth giving up for…in fairness it’s for the better…God loves us…or does he?..We are reminded of the harmful repercussions of smoking…and when we do give up smoking…we are killed by an errant driver who crashes into us…We’ve never cheated on our spouse and enjoyed the same sex partner in our lives…only to find the other half in bed with someone else…We’ve never engaged in unprotected sex…only to die of AIDS from a glob of influenza of an infected person…so tell me…how is God fair?

Perhaps there really is a reason why I’ve stopped going to church on Sundays…the early morning convenings and the public display of affection by spirited sing along sessions (Yes…I’m Methodist)…what does that prove? Instead of enlightenment…the days in church have brought about more disillusionment in me…for often I wonder to myself…if we really do believe in God…why do we have to bust our ass every fucking Sunday morning to sing some lame ass songs thought up by some 40yo-geezer who couldnt even win a spelling contest…I mean…has anyone out there seen the song lyrics? They’re so Grade 12…if that geezer can think that up…I’ll have won a Grammy last year…

God is in us…so why sing out loud and proclaim to the world? Shouldn’t faith and emotional strength be something that you gently nurture individually over years of hardship and turmoil? It’s not like God’s gonna grant us…in Singapore’s case…a better standard of governing…where Democracy is actually represented…God I beseech you…let there be Capitalism in Singapore…and Rights of Speech…the First Ammendment Act’s the best thing that ever happened to United States…why deprive the rest of the world with it? Do you love Americans more than us?

God…do you really love us?

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About adrock2xander

  • Alan Wolfe was right: “American atheists seem to have consigned themselves to those obscure corners of cyberspace where no respectable thinker ventures.”

  • Look, the Bible says you’re not supposed to be screwing around, or even thinking about it. Your argument is not with some poor Disposable Christian at Blogspot, it’s with the Bible.

    Why, it seems to Adrock like God would want you to hump everything in celebration of His creation. That’s nice, but it’s not Biblical. If you’re going to be a Christian, then you need to restrain yourself.

    Actually, it’s not THAT difficult to do. I remember my youth minister many years ago, a fine older gentleman name of Franklin Gordon. He had commented to some of us in passing about how attractive a woman was who had passed by.

    Being 14 and really smart, I called him out for noticing the hot chick. Mr Gordon explained perfectly reasonably that it is possible to properly appreciate the beauty of God’s creation without indulging in lustful fantasies.

    It’s normal and natural to notice a good looking woman, but it is well within the abilities of even a 17 year old boy to control his own mind, and turn away from specifically fantasizing sex acts with every attractive woman you see.

    Now, I’ve long since given up the faith of my fathers, and I may feel free to indulge those thoughts without fear of heavenly reprisal. Nonetheless, Brother Gordon’s distinction has stuck with me as a useful point.

    There are plenty of times when it does not behoove to be thinking sexual thoughts about co-workers, or your sister in law, or your buddy’s wife. Hey, I can largely turn those thoughts if not totally OFF, then way down.

    And if there WAS a God wanting the best for us, would he tell us that the best thing is to hump everything we see whenever a passing urge arises?

  • Fuck God — and you shall / shall not live in sin.

    Or, um … My head hurts.

    Presumably having to write that he has not had a lustful thought, he had to think about whether he had … and, he did.

    Not having lustful thoughts – well, it just doesn’t seem human.

  • Eric Olsen

    Well-channeled lust is lust well, channeled.

  • To Rodney Welch, to quoted Alan Wolfe: “American atheists seem to have consigned themselves to those obscure corners of cyberspace where no respectable thinker ventures.”

    First things first…Mr Welch, im not an American. Secondly, what makes u think im an American? Thirdly, it seems to me that you are another white bigoted imflammatory red-neck who thinks USA is the only country in the world. Forthly, stuff your pro-white thoughts into your ass and perhaps flip open an atlas. Fifthly, look for the continent of Asia. Coz that’s where i am. Sixthly, look for the tiny island state of Singapore. Seventhly (is there even such a word lol), start tellin yourself that Asians in Asia have the capacity to flesh out their thoughts in English…and most times a lot better than most whites…

    Plz…dont be a bigot…

  • I’d say something, but why follow someone who has made my case so perfectly?

  • boomcrashbaby

    adrock2xander, sounds like you are having a lot of doubts about your religious beliefs. As a person who believes in God (and likes to think I have a good relationship with him), but has become completely disillusioned with the church, maybe I can offer you a perspective to think about, because it sounds like you had a lot of the doubts I did.

    how is a man able to go even a day without thinking of nocturnal activities with a fantabulous woman who makes your gonads go huh? Yes your faith is strong…it’s embedded in the innermost region of your unconscious beliefs…make no mistake about it…

    Yes, your faith is strong (in the quote above), but so is your biology. Human nature.

    One of the biggest reasons why I became disillusioned with the church, is because it tries to tell you what to think. It requires us to make incredible sacrifices in this world, for a world we know not. It’s one thing for a society, a religion, or a God, to say ‘do not do this or that’, but to go about saying ‘do not think this or that’ is to take away free will or choice.

    In my own soul-searching, years back, I came to the conclusion that God was about free will. God wants you to choose him, not be forced into it. That’s what I believe, anyway. And because you have to choose between good and evil, you have to know good AND evil.

    I don’t consider a lustful thought to be evil, but you are speaking from a ‘moral dilemma’ perspective, and I’m responding in kind. Sexual attraction is so much more than something we can shut off with a lightswitch. We can choose to not act on our thoughts, but to want to turn off the rush of hormones that go through us when we see someone we consider attractive is impossible at best, and self-destructive at worst.

    in fairness it’s for the better…God loves us…or does he?..We are reminded of the harmful repercussions of smoking…and when we do give up smoking…we are killed by an errant driver who crashes into us….so tell me…how is God fair?

    Where did you get the impression God was fair?

    the First Ammendment Act’s the best thing that ever happened to United States…why deprive the rest of the world with it? Do you love Americans more than us?

    God…do you really love us?

    Make sure you don’t confuse your Bible with actual history. According to the Bible, God parted the Red Sea, He flooded the world, He murdered first borns, but he did not blast the First Amendment into rock for Uncle Sam to come carryin it down the mountain. I just think it’s wrong to assume that God plays favorites. Besides, putting God in government is precisely what takes away the first amendment, look at the middle east.

    The key to heaven is your relationship with God, not your relationship with the church.

  • If you believe in a god, that is…

  • Sandra Smallson

    First of, why is it that non-believers spend more time talking about God than actual believers? Are you hoping that someone will convince you that the fella exists? Unsure of something?Please, be my guest, do not believe in God. Why trouble your heads on the matter over and over again? If you are disillusioned and no longer believe or you have never believed, why not focus on what it is you do believe in, or find something TO believe in? What do you achieve from all the amateur psychoanalysis of those that do believe, the actual faith, and everything that has to do with believers? I don’t know why people bother to convince non-believers..if you are all so cocksure there is no God..look, Go to it. Good on you.

    However, it is obvious that you guys are just in confusion and wandering souls because if I had a pound for every time a so called non-believer started a God discussion in my life I would be a millionaire several times over.

  • Sandra Smallson

    Boomcrash, why blame the church? I find that with people like you who feel that some of the “rules” are unreasonable in today’s world, you feel the need to blame the Church. Do you believe in the Bible? The new Testament? If you do, blame the Bible. Blame Jesus’s disciples that wrote the Bible. Do not blame the Church. The Church is simply applying their moral code which is contained in the Bible for ALL to read. It’s an easy way out to blame the Church so it doesn’t seem as if you are blaming God directly. From what you have listed out as reasons for your lack of enthusiasm for the Church, your fight is with God. The Church is not saying anything God did not say. Therefore, you are disillusioned with God. Don’t be afraid to say it. We all have our moments. I have the same thoughts you do. I find some of the restrictions highly unreasonable and sometimes nigh impossible to adhere to.

    All those things about first born sons, flooding the world etc..are in the old Testament. The whole point of Christ was to wash away our sins, bring new teachings and die for us. Many things were changed..such as an eye for an eye..changed to, if you are slapped, turn the other cheek. The point is, unless you have a problem with those that wrote the Bible, you can not have a problem with the Church.

  • boomcrashbaby

    Boomcrash, why blame the church? I find that with people like you who feel that some of the “rules” are unreasonable in today’s world, you feel the need to blame the Church.

    Two people can read a section of the Bible and get two totally different perspectives about it. Take the story of Sodom and Gomorrah just as an example. There are people who read that and take from it that God destroyed the cities because some men wanted to rape other men. This, they use as reasoning to condemn homosexuality, yet another person will read the story and decide that God wanted to punish the cities for the rape and the gender of the individuals were irrelevant. A third person can get a totally different reasoning out of it.

    Do you believe in the Bible? The new Testament? If you do, blame the Bible. Blame Jesus’s disciples that wrote the Bible. Do not blame the Church. The Church is simply applying their moral code which is contained in the Bible for ALL to read.

    Sorry Sandra, this has to be the biggest oversimplification of all time. The Church is applying their interpretation of the moral code contained in the Bible. If the Church went by what the Bible actually said, you wouldn’t be sitting at your computer reading this, because you wouldn’t know how to read. You’d probably be wife number 6, pregnant and helping the other 5 wives cooking in the kitchen.

    From what you have listed out as reasons for your lack of enthusiasm for the Church, your fight is with God. The Church is not saying anything God did not say. Therefore, you are disillusioned with God.

    I probably won’t convince you of ALL the reasons for my disillusionment with the Church. Forbidden love is only part of it. But nevertheless, I should respond to this for the record. I don’t believe the humans who make up the Church, from the Pope on down to the minister who got his license from a mail order catalog have been given any more direct access to the will of God than the homeless man or the corporate CEO who only goes to church on Easter. I don’t believe that the Bible is the Word of God, as written by God, but the Word of God, as written by fallible humans who mean well but are still subject to the constraints of placing everything we learn into a human perspective.

    Here’s another example of my disillusionment with the Church, read it and tell me how I can blame God for it. There are many people who believe God is omnipotent. He sees, knows and is aware of everything. Even what goes on in the deepest recesses of our mind, right? This is what the Church teaches.

    Ps.44:21
    “For he knoweth the secrets of the heart.”
    Pr.15:3
    “The eyes of the Lord are in every place.”
    Jer.23:24
    “Can any hide himself in secret places that I shall not see him? saith the Lord. Do not I fill heaven and earth?”

    I’m not going to list all the examples, however, if you take the Bible as the Word of God, literally then you can also see that there are many examples where God clearly does NOT know all things.

    Gen.3:8
    “And Adam and his wife hid themselves from the presence of the Lord, amongst the trees of the garden.”
    Gen.18: 20-21
    “And the Lord said, Because the cry of Sodom and Gomorrah is great, and because their sin is very grievous, I will go down now and see whether they have done altogether according to the cry of it, which is come unto me; and, if not, I will know.”
    Num.22:9
    “And God came unto Balaam, and said, What men are these with thee?”
    Job 1:7, 2:2
    “And the Lord said unto Satan, Whence comest thou? Then Satan answered the Lord, and said, from going to and fro in the earth, and from walking up and down in it.”
    Hos.8:4
    “They have set up kings, but not by me: they have made princes, and I knew it not.”

    Do you see Sandra, how the Bible can be anything to anybody? How it says everything and nothing, and how we all can gain our own enlightenment from it? To think that only organized religion has figured out the right way is abdicating free will. The Pope recently sent out a command to all his generals to not give communion to politicians who are pro-abortion. Since you believe in the teachings of Jesus, can you tell me where in the Bible, Jesus recommended shutting the church door on ‘sinners’, rather than offering them a compassionate hand into the Kingdom of God?

    The point is, unless you have a problem with those that wrote the Bible, you can not have a problem with the Church.

    I have a problem with those who think they are the only ones who can correctly interpret the Bible. That has nothing to do with those who wrote the Bible or those that the Bible talks about, including heavenly entities. Sorry, but I am quite at peace with God.

    I mean well by this, and don’t intend for anyone to take it personal, however it might sound like my disillusionment with organized religion is really a disillusionment with God, but only to those who cannot separate the two.

  • boomcrashbaby

    First of, why is it that non-believers spend more time talking about God than actual believers?

    Maybe it’s because they are the ones actually giving spirituality some deep thought?

    Why would an ‘actual believer’ need to give something much thought beyond that which they are told, and therefore it must be…?

  • Observer

    [I]However, it is obvious that you guys are just in confusion and wandering souls because if I had a pound for every time a so called non-believer started a God discussion in my life I would be a millionaire several times over.[/I]

    If I has a penny for every uppity theist that asserted they were right by using passive-aggresive anecdotes, I’d be a billionaire.

  • Sandra Smallson

    Observer, I don’t see where I have claimed to be right but you clearly must feel in the wrong to think I have asserted I am right. I embrace all forms of madness when it comes to atheists or the disillusioned. Pray to your scientist, he or she will help you out.

    BoomC, I think that you will find that there are several parts of the Bible that condemn homosexuality and the Sodom and Gomorah section is not the landmark for that particular matter.

    Interpretations..ofcourse the Bible can not be taken literally. Ofcourse, two people can read the Bible and get two different ideas of what is being said. How does that emphasise your point? The Bible, we believe was written by the disciples. Now, they were human beings. Did they exaggerate? Did they mislead? Who knows?!

    What you fail to acknowledge is, THAT is part of the faith. You DO NOT have the luxury of picking and choosing what you think they must have meant because you believe that makes more sense to you. If you believe in God and you believe in his teachings then call it blind faith, call it what you will, you believe that the Disciples wrote as they saw. You were not there. Neither was the Pope. It is all part of the belief and the faith.

    Ofcourse, the church is applying their interpretation of the Bible sent down from generation to generation. Whose interpretation should they apply? The Bible is there for you to read. It’s a package deal. If you have a problem with churches because their interpretation of the Bible differs from yours, then what is your interpretation? Do you believe that God sanctions homosexuality? Do you believe that God sanctions fornication and adultery? Do you believe that God Sanctions lying , stealing? Personally, I am pro choice but do you truly believe that the God you say you worship sanctions abortions? The killing of a seed , foetus, child? Do you believe that the Bible has been misinterpreted and God sanctions abortions? Then Thieves might as well feel God sanctions stealing. Killers might as well feel God sanctions killing…and so on and so forth. It just does not and can not work that way, Boomcrash.

  • Sandra Smallson

    We are here extoling the virtues of a man who gave up millions to go and fight for his country. I am also impressed with people who have given up their lives to spend their days on earth preaching the word of God and praying and helping people. That takes some doing. Would I rather be doing what I am doing now or be in a chapel saying the 15 decades of the rosary? Ofcourse at my puter. Therefore, those who choose to dedicate their lives to God impress me far more than anyone who gives up money to fight or a person like me who couldn’t attend a charity gala bcos I did not want to miss the Sex & the City finale.

    Boomcrash..LOL..you are truly confused, or is it, disillusioned…lol. I am not even going to go into great detail of those examples you have shown me because it just amuses me. On one hand you are telling me about not taking the Bible literally, on the other hand you are showing me contradictions that can only be seen as contradictions if you read the Bible LITERALLY.

    God knows everything. If you think that it is a misinterpretation to say that, because the fella asked some questions in Sodom&Gomorah etc, then I don’t know what to say to you. That level of disillusionment/confusion is at too high a level for me, I’m afraid.

    I am aware that people have different interpretations of the Bible. Which is why we have diff denominations of Christianity. What I know though, is that the core facts are basic and remain clear cut. No amount of human knowledge can dispute that. If as the world evolves, humans think they can pick and choose which part of the Bible makes sense to them, then so be it. There is nowhere in the Bible where it says the journey to heaven is a cake walk.

    No Church shuts out sinners. The Church is filled with sinners. Both congregation and preachers alike. Everybody is ready to jump on the trash the Catholic church bandwagon when a pedophile is found out or when the Pope gets himself involved in Politics. Nobody says anything about the hundreds of good deeds that Catholic charities carry out daily, the world over even currently in Afghanistan. Nobody talks about Catholic charities housing young girls who have had abortions and have nowhere to go. Young girls who are pregnant or have just had babies and have nowhere to go. The church can not be blamed. They have to do what they are there for. They can not interprete the Bible to suit changing times. Living in sin is the norm now, the church is supposed to suddenly say it is not something that God frowns upon? Come off it! What sort of faith or church is it that changes to suit the world? How is it then a faith? How does it stand for anything? Such an idea is ludicrous and the idea that people would feel better about churches if they only just interpreted the Bible in a way where it made sense in today’s world just shows how insane the world we live in today has become.

    If you are not in a State of grace, you are not supposed to take communion. The Pope clearly feels that people who sanction killing a child, as he sees it, are not in a state of grace and should not take communion. The catholic church does not support abortions. I don’t think any Christian church claims that it’s leaders have more direct access to God than the people of the earth. This is some sort of myth and conspiracy theory the disillusioned have added to their long list of grievances.

    The bottom line is, it was an apostle of God that created the church. A Place to worship. The Church is not God. I am not saying that people who don’t go to church are not believers or are doing wrong. Those who DO go to church are aware that God and the Church are two seperate entities and go to worship God in the curch with their fellow worshippers.

    It is such complete rubbish to say that church goers and believers are being brainwashed or being tokd what to believe. Nonsense. Utter complete nonsense. It is the disbelievers disbelief and inferiority complex at work there. They can not believe how a community of people can have such blind faith in something. It’s impossible to have such belief in something so intangible. There must be an explnation. They’ve been brainwashed. They just believe what they are told. Poppycock!

    For sure, I was told IT from when I was born, I grww up and found that I did believe IT. Even when many tried to dissuade me, I found that IT worked for me so I have stuck to IT. Some may have been told IT and grew to find that it’s not what they truly believe so they have taken a different path. That’s fine. Like I said, I embrace all forms of madness, even my own:) At the end, we’ll find out who was on the right track:) I am confident about my faith and what I believe in. I am not without doubts like every other person but when it comes down to it, I think I can safely say I’m on the side of the road I want to be on.

    Boomcrash, Believers do not have to spend too much brainpower thinking about God. They believe he is IN THEM. Geddit?! We don’t need to search for spirituality in all sorts of things..from red ropes, to scientists, to trees, or daila lamas..we have found it in God and within ourselves. It is part of us. It’s not about being told anything and thinking therefore it must be..it is knowing that IT IS. It is those who do not believe, that spend time wondering why, when, where and how come it is? This is why they find themselves looking for spirituality in the oddest places. Spirituality is a stae of being. It is in you. Your relationship with God. Roaming the earth claiming to have found it in all sorts of places or things is makes absolutely no sense whatsoever.

  • boomcrashbaby

    BoomC, I think that you will find that there are several parts of the Bible that condemn homosexuality and the Sodom and Gomorah section is not the landmark for that particular matter.

    It was not my intent to say that I have drawn my conclusion of homosexuality from the Sodom and Gomorah episode. The intent, of that and of the omnipotent example, was to point out that people can interpret parts of the Bible differently.

    Ofcourse, two people can read the Bible and get two different ideas of what is being said. How does that emphasise your point?

    You don’t see a problem with that, when one of those two perspectives is written into law, or if someone is punished socially, like being denied communion? Well, I do.

    You DO NOT have the luxury of picking and choosing what you think they must have meant because you believe that makes more sense to you.

    I know the church does not give me the luxury of my own Scriptural interpretation, Sandra.
    That is why I am not a church member. But I still believe in God, and I still have a relationship with him, sorry if doesn’t fit in with your ideology of being possible.

    If you believe in God and you believe in his teachings then call it blind faith, call it what you will, you believe that the Disciples wrote as they saw. You were not there. Neither was the Pope. It is all part of the belief and the faith.

    Yes, neither HE nor I were there. And he is God’s portal to the next world and I am a heretic. I know.

    Do you believe that God sanctions homosexuality? Do you believe that God sanctions fornication and adultery? Do you believe that God Sanctions lying , stealing? Personally, I am pro choice but do you truly believe that the God you say you worship sanctions abortions? The killing of a seed , foetus, child? Do you believe that the Bible has been misinterpreted and God sanctions abortions?

    My religious decisions are irrelevant as I am not pushing my beliefs. I don’t want to tell him this way or that way will get him into heaven. Trust in him to be intelligent enough to read the Bible, and then let make his own interpretation. THAT is faith.

    Then Thieves might as well feel God sanctions stealing. Killers might as well feel God sanctions killing…and so on and so forth. It just does not and can not work that way, Boomcrash.

    I agree. Because they already feel that way right now. They feel God sanctions killings and so they blow up buses or drive planes into buildings. But by your philosophy, since they’ve been around for centuries, their philosophies passed down from generation to generation, THAT is an equally valid way to God. Sorry, Sandra, not MY God. Applying an interpretation of religious text into societal conduct is pretty much completely to blame for the mess the world is in today.

    It’s possible to have a sense of morals, of knowing the wrongness of taking another life, without it having to take root in religious ideology. But somewhere along the line, religion conquered morality. So now it’s widely believed that only a religious code of ethics would prevent humans from slaughtering each other. We need religion to tell us right from wrong. We just couldn’t do it any other way. I know.

    Oh, Lord, thy irony. How you must laugh.

  • barticus

    Sandra……what you said is absolutely true! It made me smile to read it. God is within the hearts of men. I am so fortunate that he has not given up on me.

    I will never give up on him or…..give him up!