Now, my last thought – I have observed that every great society had the harbinger of its decline in two occurrences – one, emotion taking over from reason; and second, religion/structured faith interfering with science. When Vedantic society lapsed into idol worship and lost the significance and also the meaning behind the reasoned exploration (or even the rationale behind idols); and became dogmatic, it lost its way. People were more emotional. Bhakti gave way to attached emotion which further lost its way into a high level of sensitivity for one's deity. The sensitivity precluded all reason and logic.
Persia was the same way. From being the world leaders in science and mathematics to becoming a society where science is supposed to be anti-Islamic is a long journey.
That is precisely what is happening to the US – science or spirituality, as I see them, are similar and they are explorations basically. Overlaying structure, whether of morality or faith, on them damages the exploration irreparably! Morality, in my personal view, is the biggest roadblock to the spiritual journey! More about that in the next post.
Article comments
1 - Ruvy in Jerusalem
Aaman, this article is one of the more significant ones that I've seen on Blog Critics. I would expect that many of the writers at Desicritics would have some familiarity with the concepts being discussed.
I can only hope that the folks here can pick up on the importance of the concept explained so well in it. Kol hakavód! (all honor to the author).
It would be helpful to know if there are links in English that talk intelligently about Vedantic science (as opposed to idol worship).
2 - Aaman
You can ask the writer about it, Ruvy, at Desicritics.
3 - dkaps
Ruvy:
Thanks for the kind words here!
I think the best source for understanding Vedanta is the Complete Works of Swami Vivekananda ()
I feel Vivekananda was arguably intellectually the most accomplished of analysts in recent times! I will, however, look up the web for some good links that do justice to the concepts!
Cheers,
dkaps
4 - needleinmyvein20
i believe that in society that religion and science should be equal i dont like how religion controls our politics. but i also dont like how science controls our schools systems and they only teach evoulution.
5 - dkaps
Needleinmyvein:
You are expressing an interesting argument... and I personally feel that the entire "Intelligent Design" vs Evolution debate is rather facetious!
The reason why I say this is because - Evolution without Involution and Involution without Evolution are meaningless! What use is Intelligence if it doesnt lead to the best course for the possessor. And Evolutionary entity that makes an intelligent design MUST assume that there was a "code" in the very seed of the organizm!
Cheers,
Dkaps
6 - dkaps
Errata:
"Evolutionary entity that makes an intelligent design "
should have read
"Evolutionary entity that makes an intelligent choice"
7 - Ruvy in Jerusalem
dkaps,
Errata: A phrase that marks a scholar.
I agree with you that the debate going on over the validity of evolution over the "seven day theory" of the Hebrew Bible is rather facetious, owing to the fact that most of the people on the "seven day" (actually "six day") side don't understand the Hebrew Bible but only understand translations of it, and most of the people on the evolution side of the argument have failed to take into account that the geologic record, while indicating that life extends back billions of years on this planet, does not back up the slow evolution of species postulated by Darwin, but rather a pattern of explosive developments after long periods of time.
Those Jewish scholars whom you might call our equivalent of Vedantic scientists postulated that the universe was approximately 15 billion years old; and that the 11 verses of Genesis that comprise the "creation" story, while true, were really something designed for explaining the realities of creation to children and simple minds. The truth was hidden within the text - underneath it, so to speak.
The basic concept here is that you look at a scroll, the writing on the scroll, and what you are really seeing is the very top layer of several layered cake. The apparent "errata" in the text are the clue that there are layers of truth underneath the writing that faces you upon the scroll.
One such scholar, Rav Moshe ben Nahmán (the Ramba"n for short) worked out a description of the creation of the universe based on the data he extracted from the Bible about 800 years ago. If you take into account that he had no knowledge of quarks or subatomic theory (the Ramba"n talked about a mustard seed) and lay it side by side with the "big Bang" theory of cosmologists, you see startling similarities.
This is the concept laid out by Dr. Gerald Schroeder in his book "Genesis and the Big Bang."
Have the explorations of Vedantic scientists yielded something similar?
8 - Aaman
Ruvy,
Darwinian evolution is not the only model for the changes we know occur continuously. The mutation theory would follow the explosive change you refer to.
Incidentally, The Economist recently had a good issue on Evolution.
9 - Ruvy in Jerusalem
Aaman,
This is true. But in the boxing match we continually see replayed in the States, it is "evolution" in one corner of the ring and "creationism" in the other. This is the reason for citing them.
10 - dkaps
Ruvy:
Thanks for the detailed comments!! I have approached the subject of Vedanta and Science on my blog in various posts over the years (check out: http://www.drishtikone.com/?q=node/217)
I will try and write a post on this subject on desicritics also.
There is one interesting incident that I recall that I would relate here. During my undergrad days, a Chemistry Professor, who had been around the block for a while, narrated a comment from Satyendra Nath Bose (of the Bose-Einstein Theory fame) that he made in a conference long time back. According to this Prof, Dr. Bose said that Einstein was probably inspired for his Photo electric effect from a story he read on Vivekananda and his Guru, Ramakrishna Paramhansa, written by Victor Hugo (of Les Miserables fame). In that Paramhansa, the Guru, helps Vivekananda "experience" the "light". And then comments that the entire energy was transferred and will have to be rejuvenated.
What this made him think was if the "Universal Energy" can go in "packets" and not "percentages" - is it likely that light maybe doing the same way? And that may have been the genesis of the thought of "photons".
I am not sure as to the veracity of the story or the scientific backdrop... but I have checked the broad timeslines and whether Victor Hugo had written any such story. It did seem to me that Mr. Hugo was interested in that subject and may have.. but I could not find the story in question.
But I thought it was interesting and something that was not heard any where else.
Cheers,
dkaps
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