If you can read this, my bitch fell off my keyboard.
We in the D.C. area just go treated to another tiresome rolling Geritol commercial. Thousands of RUBs [Rich Urban Bikers] came to the area on their Harley Davidson motorcycles, polluting the area with the sounds of troubled G.I. tracts.…
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— go to most recent comments76 - Chad
After reading this now I know why I own and ride XB9R Buell Firebolt and a Ducati Monster S4R.
77 - KAWASAKI RIDER FOREVER
HARLEY DAVIDSON IS THE BIGGEST DISGRACE EVER TO AMERICA. NOT TO MENTION THE BIGGEST PIECE OF SHIT EVER MADE. I LIVE IN A SMALL TOWN 1,000 PEOPLE HERE ONE DUMB ASS BUYS A HARLEY AND 15 OTHER STUMP FUCKS BUY THEM ALSO. AND THOSE OF YOU HARDLY RIDERS THAT SAY THE POS (PIECE OF SHIT) HARDLEY DAVIDSON DOESN'T LEAK OIL BULLSHIT THEY LEAK LIKE NO OTHER, HAVE WITNESSED THIS WITH ALL THE DUMB ASSES IN MY TOWN THAT WENT OUT AND BOUGHT THE P.O.S.. IN MY OPINION THE ONLY GOOD HARLEY IS THE ONE THAT HAS BEEN CRASHED OR GETTING SMASHED BY THE CAR SMASHER. SO HOW MANY OF YOU WORTHLESS HARLEY RIDERS HAD TO GO OUT AND BUY THE HARLEY DAVIDSON SPECIAL (IT CONSIST OF $45,000 PICKUP AND THE $30,000 ENCLOSED TRAILER WITH ALL THE OPTIONS OF OIL RESISTANT FLOOR, BED, AND THE HARDLEY A MOTORCYCLIST THRONE, AND MANY MORE MINOR OPTIONS.) PRETTY SAD WHEN 9 OUT OF 10 HARDLEY RIDERS HAUL THEIR BIKES MORE MILES THAN THE P.O.S RIDE THEM. THEN AGAIN IF THEY ARE DUMB ENNOUGH TO BUY AN OVERPRICED OUT DATED P.O.S I DON'T THINK I WANT TO SEE THEM OUT THEIR ON THE SAME ROAD AS I AM RIDING ON CAUSE THEIR MENTALLY CHALLENGED ASSES PROBABLY WOULD CRASH INTO ME ON A CURVE.
JUST REMEBER FRIENDS DON'T LET FRIENDS RIDE HARLEY'S
78 - Robert Maxey
When you get right down to it, Harley-Davidson is just a bike. It is the last survivor in a long line of American motorcycle manufacturers; save the current crop of custom bikes and those built by outfits like Bog Dog. It is still just a frame, tires, tranny, seat, lights, and an engine.
Do not forget, at one time, there were more than 150 American manufacturers of motorcycles. I happen to be writing a History of American Motorcycle Manufacturers, and I have had a chance to look at more than my fair share of brands, since 1974.
I have looked at and rode Vincent's, Broughs, Mondials, BMWs, Cushmans, Moto G's, Hondas, and a few current make non-HD American bikes. I can tell you that every brand has problems.
Yes, the other builders can say "made in America." That really cannot be argued. That being said, HD is still in a class of its own and that heritage is not something any current maker can seriously challenge.
You see the ads for Japanese bikes that are sold using the biker image. I will never buy a Japanese bike because of the way the Japanese treated HD. Their publicly stated belief was at one time, the V-Twin was a less than ideal geometry to use because it was outdated, yet the Japanese eventually started building V-Twins and eventually used an American image to sell the bikes.
Also do not forget what HD did when it came to the wholesale dumping of Japanese bike in this country. They went to the US government and asked for help. Eventually, HD grew strong and voluntarily had the provisions removed. That actually helped the Japanese.
What sets HD apart is its history and that perhaps makes it unfair to call a Harley "just a bike." HD has an amazing history that should be respected for its longevity and the advancements it has made to the world of motorcycles. You can hate the bikes, but you should respect the company and what it has contributed to the world. You should also hate the bike for the right reasons; not to mention, you should understand what it is you hate about the bike on a fundamental level.
Do not hate HD because of their cost. If you owned a company, you would maximize your profits.
I have forgiven them for the V-Rod, after all.
Incidentally, some people complain about the V-Rod and say it is not truly American. They forget the Aermacchi years.
HD has manufactured some amazing bikes over the decades and they have a pedigree no modern maker will ever take away from them or likely equal. I do not think any alternative "HD" maker will be here in a hundred years; most certainly, they will not do what HD has done in its long life.
I think HD will be the eventual winner because they are a strong brand and let's face it, many people will always prefer HD to all other brands, regardless of where they are made or who makes them. I am not saying they will be around in 100 years. It is likely, however. There will probably be a few other makers along side as well.
You should also consider the vast number of models HD has produced since 1903; not to mention some amazing power plants like the Panhead, Knucklehead, the "K" engine, the Flathead, the powerplants used to drive torpedoes, Shovelheads, and others. Most of these old bikes have good resale value that no Japanese bike has. Perhaps no other American manufacturer's bikes will sell for what you paid for them in thirty years.
Also consider the other products HD Incorporated (not the Harley-Davidson Motor Company, mind you) has manufactured or still manufacturers to this day. For example, high technology wiring harness devices, panel delivery vehicles, high tech controllers for torpedoes, guidance system components, and other interesting products.
HD discussions often polarize people, and I think it is useful to occasionally remind people that HD is more than just a company. Harley is a very special company that is unique in all the world. Harley-Davidson is a very special American manufacturer with no equal. We want more American manufacturers with an extremely loyal customer base, do we not? Will we be better off if everyone thought like you and stopped buying American products?
Just read the thoughts being expressed here; you really cannot discuss Harley without the inevitable "HD sucks" comments. Defenders will disagree and the gloves go on. Then again, the lovers and fans can see nothing wrong, and in some cases, they are not accurate, either.
In many cases, we read and hear the same old platitudes. Few detractors can offer up any legitimate reasons why "Harley Davidson Sucks." They complain about the cost or the "RUB" but never any serious reasons.
HD will not escape its history and indeed, they offered up a few lemons over the years, as have all other manufacturers. Let us not forget the AMF years; that usually draws a crowd ready to fight and argue.
According to some people, all AMF Harleys suck. Not necessarily, true. Some great bikes came out of the factory in those days and are still running strong today. Much of the "AMF Harley Sucks" crowd has zero experience with bikes produced during those years, so they should not speak so loudly.
I know many AMF riders and not one of their bikes suffers leaks. Not one of them.
I hear how great Big Dog bikes are, but I also know several buyers who are pissed off because of problems with their BD bikes and they will never buy another. It would not be fair to hammer BD for an occasional lemon. Would it? From what I have observed, BD wants to please customers and they apparently are quick to fix the problems.
A few bad BD bikes does not make BD a bad manufacturer. Every manufacturer falls short from time to time and produces a less than wonderful motorcycle. Including Harley. Why is it all we hear is how bad HD is?
For the record, I do not like BD (and all of the others) bikes, but I must commend them for building bikes and developing a growing public interest in motorcycles. My reasons for not liking them is I do not like anything that new. I prefer old bikes with Flathead engines and plenty of cast iron. I will never buy a new Harley, either. The last Harley I bought was a 1980 Sportster basket case.
Unfortunately, some "experts" say many things that are inaccurate. Their opinions are often formed by what they have read on the web or learned second had from other, equally ignorant owners and riders. I know people who hate Harley and they have never, ever ridden a bike.
One example, the notion that the 1952 Model "K" was nothing more than a Sportster is an often quoted bit of incorrect information. Ask any K Model owner or read the specs and shop manuals. Ask me, for that matter.
Or they want to go 170 MPH so they do not buy HD because HD sucks for not building a rocket on two wheels. Then we go for a ride at 130 or so and they change their mind. 170 would scare me.
I hear it all the time. Harley should build rocket bikes and because they do not, they suck. How bloody stupid and ignorant do you have to be to suggest that a bike that goes 170 is at all important, and because a company does not build such a bike, they are to be faulted?
So what bikes have HD manufactured that are (my opinion) so wonderful? Well, look at my current loves. A 1943 WLA military model. The bike is solid as hell, starts with a few kicks, can travel across the US of A with very little concern, all day long, at 60 MPH. If it breaks, roadside repairs are a snap. It is a true crowd pleaser.
If I need parts, they are as close as my fax machine or a telephone call. In fact, I can get parts for a WLA easier than for most current model bike made in Japan. Heads, cranks, cylinders, tranny parts, gears, wheels, tin, brake parts… whatever I need is a telephone call away and in my shop in a few days. I can even get NOS blackouts for the lights. Oh, and a machine gun mount.
There are other models I have experience with: 1944 "U" Navy, 1969 Servi-Car, 1936 61EL, 1951 74FL Hydra-Glide, and a few Knuckleheads. As with the WLA, these bikes are easily repaired, parts are readily available, they will run forever if cared for, and contrary to popular belief, they do not leak oil.
They also have another benefit --I can probably trade any of them straight across for anything on the HD showroom floor. Chances are, I could trade them for a brand new BD. Want a crowd to leave the latest and greatest custom? Pull up on a restored Panhead or a 1951 Hydra-Glide.
If not a vintage Harley, lets consider another American brand, the venerable Indian. I am not talking about the current crop of Indians, but a 1947 Chief or perhaps a Scout or 4-cylinder. Not only do they draw a crowd; they hold their value, perhaps far better than a modern HD or BD. The new Indians are nothing more than a version of a modern HD with skirted fenders and the name Indian on the tank.
At one time, there was a rivalry between Harley and Indian. If we had the net back then, you would hear the same arguments we have over HD Vs Japan. Indian owners often did not like the Harley. There are also arguments between real Indian owners and the new Indian owners. Just as angry.
Parts are a telephone call away and if you want a new one, you can order a kit of parts from Bob Stark at Starklite. Yes, Bob will sell you every part needed to build a stock and 100 percent original Chief. Plastic fenders, or metal. The engine has been road tested and they are perfect.
I mention Indian because a common complaint is parts are not available, the bikes are too slow, far too outdated, and no one can fix them, so they suck. This is not true. Not by a long shot. A friend of mine wanted a new Japanese whatever and so he bought one. He must wait for parts, where I can get parts in a few days.
As for your post:
(You) "We in the D.C. area just go treated to another tiresome rolling Geritol commercial. Thousands of RUBs [Rich Urban Bikers] came to the area on their Harley Davidson motorcycles, polluting the area with the sounds of troubled G.I. tracts."
(Me) If it were not for the RUB, you might not have a Harley. This can be debated. Also, I do not like the term RUB. Usually those that use that term want to be the rich in RUB. My old HD is not noisy, by the way. FYI, the sound you hear is music.
(You) "Here's why I hate Harleys and the dweebs who ride them"
(You) "For encouraging dentists to wear leather."
(Me) HD has been selling leather since forever, and it is a good idea to wear leathers. So your point would be what? Perhaps flip-flops, and shorts?
(You) "For giving away a case of DentuCreme with every new hog."
(Me) So silly, so very silly. No comment.
(You) "For disenfranchising real tough guys. The true scum and lowlifes that made Harley fearsome either can't afford them or are ashamed to ride them. [Maybe they can become part of a protected class.]"
(Me) "real tough guys?" What does that mean? The Brando days are over and the real biker tough guy is probably nicer than most of the dentists wearing all of that silly leather. I dog sit for a real biker and he is nice. The dog is less than nice, but that is another story.
Are you saying that "the true scum and lowlifes" are now frightened to ride a Harley? I do not know what you mean by your comment, but if you see a group of Hells Angles along side the road, please, by all means, voice that opinion. Get that plot ready.
You also seem to be saying that there are no tough RUBs. Wanna Bet? I'll introduce you to some truly mean RUBs and you can point out their shortcomings. Then you will need that case of Dentu-Cream you mentioned.
You are hung up on one tiny portion of the "Biker World." You equate Harley with tough biker. There are tough bikers and there are tough "RUBs." I suggest you leave them all alone and suffer in silence, or learn to drink your food through a straw.
(You) "For their thumping pipes, which serve no function, except to disrupt the peace."
(Me) Depends on the engine and the pipes. Some bikes are loud yet they meet current noise limit laws. Ever hear a XR all out?
(You) "For riding two abreast, because they have no balls."
(Me) You cannot possibly know how tough anyone is and if they have one or two balls. Some of us have had serious accidents and have only one. Hint: Never weld naked, 'nuff said. Relax and take a deep breath.
(You) "For diluting an authentic piece of Americana."
What has been diluted? HD has been in business for a very long time and they have always sold accessories and clothing; they still do and they sell it by the metric ton daily. We have seen new plants spring up, an increase in units sold, clothing and accessories sales through the roof, new dealerships, thousands of new customers. Please, give me a break; the brand is stronger than ever. Diluted ... do we even understand the term?
I would guess you are not one damn bit familiar with the single cylinder Italian bikes HD imported or the wonderful Topper Scooter, are you? Toppers ran out at 65 miles per hour, by the way. Very cool, but it is a silly little scooter. Like Vespa.
What about the 1955 ST based on a German design, the Sprints, and the M-50s. Do not forget the 1967 CRTT, it was faster than some Sportsters and it was as fast (115 MPH) as a 1980 XR750, which had a top speed of 115 miles per hour.
Some of these bikes would be laughed at these days for being so very non big bad greasy RUB biker kind of bike. At least by ignorant people with no historical knowledge.
I can well imagine how you would react to HD announcing they were importing a non-HD manufactured single cylinder bike from Italy. Would that further dilute this Americana you speak of?
(You) "For the fat asses I see spilling over the ever wider seats."
(Me) Fat Asses? What does that mean? Remember, us skinny guys do not like full dressers because they scare us. Too heavy. Perhaps a tattoo will help me? Or are you against a little ink, too.
(You) "For the stupid looks on their faces when they drive down the street. Look at me, I'm cool!"
(Me) Or, "look at me, I have arrived and I can finally afford a real bike." You know, the exact same look you had when you bought your first Harley. Iffin you did, that is.
(You) "For their endless, and now meaningless, displays of flag waving patriotism. It is a soulless piece of the branding effort."
(Me) I must take great offense at that comment. I have friends with guns currently stationed in the Middle East and we all love to wave flags. Do not go there sport; you will piss off quite a few people that think flag waving is important.
So educate me please. What is wrong with flag waving and endless patriotism? I am buying a URAL sidecar rig, so I guess you will think me to be a communist because of where the bike is made. What nationality should a proud American, on an American manufactured bike be waving? Canada or perhaps Indonesia?
(You) "For how shiny and endlessly chromed out their their bikes are -- another sign they are just part of a laundry list of toys -- and not an intrinsic part of their lifestyle."
(Me) Come on, a little shiny bit here and there is nice. I really can't speak about chrome, however. For me, it is Cad plating, japan lacquer for the forks, and OD Green paint. Or Navy blue, but black is nice, too.
What the hell does "lifestyle" mean anyway? Not everyone wants to be a part of this mythical bad ass biker world you think all HD owners are desperate to live in.
(You) "For the wimps from Ohio and North Carolina who drive them here on trailers -- pulled behind minivans!"
(Me) Or from Utah, hauling a trailered Brough-Superior to the Las Vegas auction. And to trailer back the Harley-Davidson "U" I have my eye on and I am very lucky. And, I like minivans. I prefer my 1947 Ford, however.
(You) "Harley has become a joke."
Well, something has, but probably not Harley. Your rant did not touch on anything substantially or fundamentally wrong with the bike and its shortfalls. Just a tirade about the idiots and fools that are somehow destroying your skewed mythological view of the biker world.
If you are going to hate HD, post a few legitimate reasons.
God, what a long post. I'll shut up and offer an apology to everyone here.
Bob
79 - Robert Maxey
(Someone said) "When you can convince me that the "Harley" you bought for 40 grand can surpass the technology of a bike that cost less than 1/2 that, is faster and more reliable, will not rattle my teeth out, and won't leak oil all over my garage, I will pay that. Until then, realize that just because it is made here in America, doesn't mean it is worth 40 grand. Keep your pussy comments to yourself as I ride and import and can still kick a HARDLY riders ass any day of the week, on or OFF the bike!!"
Some American bikes are worth forty grand. However, one must evaluate the bike and how important a certain level of technology might be to you. For example, how fast do you really need to go? Is a bike that runs out at 90 MPH any better than one that runs out at 160?
As for reliability, most bikes will be reliable if cared for. Most of the bikes I see with issues have not been cared for. For example, irregular oil changes or incompetent wrenches.
Consider that a 1940 Indian Four is worth that much (actually, closer to fifty grand) as are a few others. Most people will not spend that much on a bike regardless of who makes it and most people will not spend that in a bike made when their papa was a kid.
I would pay forty grand for any of these bikes: the Indian Four, some Broughs, or a Black Shadow. Not one of these bikes are high tech excepts for the Vincent, perhaps.
Consider this: not every Harley runs rough. Certainly, not every Harley leaks oil and certainly, you cannot kick every Harley…excuse me, Hardley rider's ass. That is just e-bluster and e-boasts. I'll give you this: you probably can kick my ass.
A full dressed Harley with a sidecar probably hits close to the forty grand mark, and I can guarantee it is a smooth runner and does not leak oil. If it is taken care of, that is.
Robert - Salt Lake City, Utah
80 - Robert Maxey
(Someone said) "Hondas are made and assembled in the USA but cant advertise that because HD bitched about it. Ever notice that HD carbs are now made in Japan and that most of the clothes and gear thay sell is made every place but the USA. WTF is up whith that?"
Let us explore your obviously qualified statements, shall we?
First of all, Harley does not dictate the Made in USA policies. The Federal Trade Commission does. I do not know what HD bitched about or the outcome, so please provide a reliable source for your assertion. I want to know where you got your information.
Hint: the rule you are looking for is the FTC's "Made in USA" policy, so start there.
Harley might have complained, but they would not complain if their complaints were not valid. And what if they did complain? If some foreign concern is playing unfair, HD has every right to take action and they damn well should complain. And you somehow see this as bad?
Ever had a job outsourced? Do you want American concerns to succeed?
Frankly, I do not like mostly foreign made goods being sold as being somehow American. Do you? Honestly?
If it is/was a valid claim, obviously they had the FTC policy to back up their claims. So prove your case and tell me why this is a bad idea.
As for foreign parts, so what? Lots of HD parts are foreign and have been for years. Do some basic research. So what!
Clothing is another matter. I have a few leather jackets that are made in the United States. My bearings are U.S. Made, as are my gaskets and my oil. Tanks and fittings, some electrical parts... lots of USA parts.
I can also tell you that HD wants American suppliers. I know because I have done business with them before.
What would you do if you were making products? Would you buy American for $100.00 or foreign for $35.00? Would you buy a superior Japanese product for half of what an inferior American made part would cost you?
HD is a business. They have employees and stockholders. All need to be paid or make money. HD also needs parts to sell, so again, what would you do? Stop making products because no American manufacturer can provide parts in quantity?
I will tell you one thing HD did do. President Reagan once imposed a 45 percent tariff over a five-year period on Japanese heavy motorcycles to help Harley Davidson. Not every Japanese bike, mind you. Four years later, Harley Davidson asked that the tariff be removed because Harley no longer needed the provisions.
What does that tell you about Harley? Perhaps they are not as evil as you seem to think they are?
Bob - Salt Lake City, Utah
81 - Robert Maxey
(Someone said in all capital misspelled verbiage) "HARLEY DAVIDSON IS THE BIGGEST DISGRACE EVER TO AMERICA. NOT TO MENTION THE BIGGEST PIECE OF SHIT EVER MADE. I LIVE IN A SMALL TOWN 1,000 PEOPLE HERE ONE DUMB ASS BUYS A HARLEY AND 15 OTHER STUMP FUCKS BUY THEM ALSO. AND THOSE OF YOU HARDLY RIDERS THAT SAY THE POS (PIECE OF SHIT) HARDLEY DAVIDSON DOESN'T LEAK OIL BULLSHIT THEY LEAK LIKE NO OTHER, HAVE WITNESSED THIS WITH ALL THE DUMB ASSES IN MY TOWN THAT WENT OUT AND BOUGHT THE P.O.S.. IN MY OPINION THE ONLY GOOD HARLEY IS THE ONE THAT HAS BEEN CRASHED OR GETTING SMASHED BY THE CAR SMASHER. SO HOW MANY OF YOU WORTHLESS HARLEY RIDERS HAD TO GO OUT AND BUY THE HARLEY DAVIDSON SPECIAL (IT CONSIST OF $45,000 PICKUP AND THE $30,000 ENCLOSED TRAILER WITH ALL THE OPTIONS OF OIL RESISTANT FLOOR, BED, AND THE HARDLEY A MOTORCYCLIST THRONE, AND MANY MORE MINOR OPTIONS.) PRETTY SAD WHEN 9 OUT OF 10 HARDLEY RIDERS HAUL THEIR BIKES MORE MILES THAN THE P.O.S RIDE THEM. THEN AGAIN IF THEY ARE DUMB ENNOUGH TO BUY AN OVERPRICED OUT DATED P.O.S I DON'T THINK I WANT TO SEE THEM OUT THEIR ON THE SAME ROAD AS I AM RIDING ON CAUSE THEIR MENTALLY CHALLENGED ASSES PROBABLY WOULD CRASH INTO ME ON A CURVE. JUST REMEBER FRIENDS DON'T LET FRIENDS RIDE HARLEY'S
Lets take a quiet moment to critically review and think about the value of the above post.
I would like to know why Harley…excuse me, Hardleys, are so bad. Perhaps you are buying the wrong brand of bike? You know like Wistinghouse TVs, A Rolefux Watch, Stump Fuck Brand Reusable Condoms, or Gubwiser Beer. Your problems might simply be a matter of buying the wrong brand by mistake.
You need to be on the lookout for Harley-Davidson and avoid the apparent Hardley-Davidson knockoffs sold on the side of the road in yer neck of the woods.
Look for big shiny stores, bright shiny orange and black signs, joyous and happy, shiny people …er, stump fucks, and spittle and drool from all the kinfolk looking through the winders at the big, shiny bikes in the general store…er, dealership.
Your comments seem to be quite useless because you did not say much. Just lots of yelling, cussing, and all in caps. People yell and scream but they cannot tell me what makes a typical Harley so god awful evil. Perhaps it is a money problem more than a problem of crappy American made bikes. It usually is, after all. That is why the Ferrarri sucks and until I can afford one, they always will suck.
Yes, Harleys are too expensive. On the surface. Factor in the longevity of the bike and a Harley can be cheap in the long run.
So what is your real issue? Does the excessive chrome blind you while haulin 'shine from county to county as one of them damn Hogs (that is a big city word for Harley) flies by? Perhaps you are pissed at the RCBs. Rich Country Bumpkins bother me, too.
Perhaps some things will always be too expensive, like shoes for all the youngins' and false teeth for ma and pa. Please do not yell at those of us that can take the greyhound to the big city and buy nice shiny new shoes. Metaphorically speaking.
Oil leaks, yes. They are a problem. However, I have seen very few leaky bikes in my years of eating bugs and dodging coppers; or in your neck of the deep woods, the Revenuers.
I have actually read a report that seems to indicate most leaks occur in bikes sold to stump fucks living in small towns of perhaps 1,000 people and they take their bikes to the John Deere dealer for repairs.
Your statistics "9 out of 10 haul their bikes more than they ride them" is not quite accurate and seem rather odd. Can you cite some stats and facts? I love facts.
Wow, 90 percent of all Harleys are bad? The only people I know that haul bikes are restorers and collectors. Occasionally a few riders that do not want to ride all the way to an event.
I have no problem hauling a bike to an event in a trailer. So what is the problem?
Bob - Salt Lake City, Utah
82 - B
If Harley riders would respect all bikes and not trash talk every time they meet someone on an import of any type they would be respected more. However, HD riders are famous for the "when you gonna get a real bike" comment and that is what pisses people off. Primarily because in all reality the Harley is the lesser bike most of the time when talking horsepower, weight, smooth ride, etc... Many people buy products based on performance and most imports (cruisers and sportbikes) outperform Harleys. Stop calling everyone elses bike crap compared to your harley. Most of the "crotch rockets" produce more horsepower with half the displacement and half the weight. These are "real" bikes. These are very modern and technically advanced pieces of machinery. "when you gonna get a real bike" my ass, when is harley going to make a bike that performs up to its name. I would buy a Harley if they could produce one that was a good performer and had a fair price.
All in all I don't have anything against a HD rider until I hear that famous comment and then I write that person off as a fool. Problem is that I have yet to meet a HD rider who hasn't asked my that famous question.
b
83 - Tired of noise pollution
Like many posting here, my main complaint is the noise. Somehow it seems to be a problem with a huge percentage of Harley Davidsons, more so than any other make I've seen. As best as I understand it, the noise has somehow become part of the image. Admittedly I don't care much for any of the image, the tough guy look, the über patriotism, the hairy unkempt appearance, etc. But most of that is your own business. If you like spending much of your free time talking about your cycle, that's your business. If you want to not shave or shower for long periods. If you can keep your meth usage to yourself.... fine by me. just keep me out of it.
But how is it that so many Harley owners feel that it is acceptable to blast the rest of us with their exhaust? I've heard the excuse that somehow loud pipes are supposed to save lives. But for one, noise pollution is a proven contributor to problems like hypertension, diabetes, low test scores for children etc. And I just don't buy the "loud pipes save lives" argument. The exhaust is projected behind the vehicle, the spot where any other driver has the best view of you. I've ridden a bicycle through a dense urban environment and can tell you the best safety mesure is bright clothing and good lighting. I did wish I had a horn on occasion, but thankfully did not contribute to noise or air pollution for my years of commuting by bicycle. Also, in terms of safety, Harley's don't have anti lock brakes, and are prone to overheating in hot climates (or so I've read.)
And oddly enough, sometimes motorcycle riders were the worst in terms of trampling on my rights (like ridding in the bicycle lanes in heavy traffic and running red lights.) Where I live, they seem to congregate in poor areas where people are least able to get noise laws enforced, (mostly in Oakland, Richmond, and Vallejo.)
Frankly, I don't care if you are gay, straight, a meth addict or a wine connoisseur. You can be fat and hairy and desecrating the flag by draping it down your frizzy unwashed hair. That's your business. But when your "look mom" exhaust wakes up my kid in the middle of the night, that is my business and it's society's business. We need to work on having real penalties and enforcement for people who violate noise laws. I'm not ready to suggest vandalizing loud bikes (have you seen the Harley Davidson Noise Pollution stickers throughout SF?) But if there is no enforcement, I can't blame people who do take the law into their own hands.
84 - walker99
Dag! Just ran across this site, and I am amazed at the number of folks who are trashing Harleys, who appear not to know anything about either the Harley machine or big V-twins in general! Those of you who ride - I mean really ride - know that RIDERS respect each other - and no one is that hung up on WHAT you ride, only THAT you ride. I have a big metric V-twin. It's smooth, powerful, pretty, reliable, etc, etc. I still love Harleys, and I also love my own ride. And you know what? The other RIDERS here respect and take care of each other!
This forum is not even worth my time - filled with punks who criticize a major part of Americana and a major part of our collective lifestyle while they don't know anything about it.
You Harley riders? Don't waste your time on this stuff! Heck, I'm not!
....amazing.
85 - Tired of noise pollution
What do we need to know about riders? We don't need to ride to know that there are a lot of very disrespectful people out there. Folks who take pride in waking up my children in the middle of the night by blasting their "look mom" pipes. Harley's will hopefully top the trash heap of "americana" like gas guzzling cars, meth, rap music, and fast food. Our culture need not be defined by the worst this country has to offer.
Be respectful of others and you can continue to ride your overpriced oil leaking piece of "americana" withought folks like us writing in.
86 - B
Walker, you say Americana, well Harley used to be just that. Now they are just outdated bikes. Shame on us for thinking this crappy technology should be refered to as "the great american motorcycle" (I am embarrased that this is American)-(can't we do better than this?). They aren't even made from American parts either. They are assembled here (poorly) and that is about it. I would hope that "Americana" was not defined by what HD has become (a second rate overpriced motorcycle). HD has also become dependant on a "German" company called Porsche to make an engine so that they can have something that remotely resembles a decent bike. The new V-Rod is the only Harley that can really be considered a "good" bike and its "heart" is German. How "Americana" can that really be????
87 - GarryUSbonds
Im am amazed at the anti-HD posts here, but as this is an anti-HD site, (see the owner of this blog), I souldn't be.
I own three bikes, a HD, a Triumph and a Honda. The all have different rides and for whatever mood Im in I will ride that bike, period. Im not trying to impress anyone and I don't give a fuck what anyone thinks, espcially on this blog.
However I will give my fair unbiased opinion on what this blog is about, IMO. Dumbass riders, trying to be or not trying to be.
I think most all riders are cool to each other, save the posters on this blog.
I give a wave to most all riders and get the same in return. I have found that most HD riders will wave when Im on my non HD. I know there are some that have safety concerns or didn't see me or who are assholes, however they are in the minority, IMO.
I find it humorus that a lot of the metric riders on this bolg complain that HD riders bikes are loud. I've heard plenty of metrics with headers on and they are very loud, even louder than HD's, as they make more of a high pitch sound.
I see very often metric riders, usually in groups, riding very fast between lights, jumping in and around cars, riding on the shoulder and doing wheelies. Its very dangerous to them, but if they don't care then I don't care, but also to innocent drivers in cars, or even pedestrians.
I rarely ever see HD riders doing dangerous and stupid things like that. Thats why I find it so amazing that you guys complain about noise or a HD image, (which most of which is in your own head because of your own insecurities), while your little metric group behaves so dangerously, which is far worse than noise.
You losers that complain and group all HD riders into one group need to get a life. I know most of you are just posers anyway and don't even own a bike, if you did you would't worry about HD riders you'd realize that we are all in a loosely nit brother hood of riders.
I know in years past you'd never see metrics and HD riders going up the road together, I do see it now days, I know you guys hate that, lol.
88 - sonja valentine
the 2 geeky guys playing with their remote control cars
on my block make more noise than most Harleys.
(especially the newer models)
89 - Kizzume
Carburator anyone? It's taken until the 90's for HD to introduce fuel injection--and they made it sound like it's on the cusp of new technology.
One sees people working on HD's more than mid-80's Fords!
Since 1983, "American" vehicles suck in general. They're made cheaply, the engines are disposable, they have low performance unless you want to fry out the engines by the time the warranty wears off, and almost none of the parts are actually made in the United States, but we're supposed to "buy American" so we can support some billionaires sitting in expensive office chairs doing business remotely on their yachts while paying just pennies to people in China who do all the work.
When it comes to the noise of HD's, I would have to agree that they only make a lot of noise when the owners purposely make them loud. Older harleys may be an exception, but even the older harleys can be made quieter if the owners spend the money to make them quieter. In certain places and at certain times, I don't mind the loud pipes thing, but it'd be nice if the loud pipes was an option that could be turned on and off so the bikers who want to rev up their bikes at 6am or at 1am and ride down the street and back and then put the bikes back away could make them quieter at those times. Many harley riders think they're proving how badass they are when they rev up their purposely-extra-loud bikes at inappropriate areas at inappropriate times, but they're really just proving how much they are assholes. I'd say that 5% of bikers with loud pipes like to do that sort of thing, and they ruin it for the ones that are considerate.
I like the whole look of harleys, I like the big bearded unkempt biker look, the rebellious look, I like the cultural aspects of HD, but the bikes themselves are pieces of crap, just like all new "American" vehicles. Unfortunately, the Harley biker look has been changing from the whole rebellious look to a rich look--I've been seeing more business-suit-types riding harleys over the past 5-8 years than I have the bikers that don't want to follow societal norms. It's kind-of what has happened to rock--rock no longer has anything to do with rebellion, it now just represents commercialism.
I don't put the culture of HD in the same boat as rap music or fast food--but I would put them in the same category of "American" gas guzzling SUV's that wouldn't guzzle gas if the oil companies weren't so busy buying the patents for fuel-efficient engines and paying off the automakers. It's sad that vehicles made in 1975 get about the same gas mileage as vehicles made currently that are the same weight--oh, but they're not as bad for the environment now--yeah, that's it....
90 - Jack Me Hoff
First off, I currently do not own a bike, other than a enduro bike, however I've owned a few Triumph's.
On this debate I lean towards agreeing with the Harley riders. Lets ake out the fact that the only beef most of the crotch rockets riders have is that they seem to feel insecure. The only thing they can say is how much HD's cost, or how loud they are, or in your opinion the reliability of the HD's, or the whole imgage thing. Why would you guys care? Its not your business. The only reasonable point you have is the noise, however that is moot as I've heard PLENTY of crotch rockets with headers and they are even more loud and they are more annoying, IMO.
It seems like the crotch rockets guys tend to be younger and more immature, for the most part. Since they are younger they tend to make less money at this time. Most feel the the HD riders are part of a special thing, and they feel like HD is "American", and what they ride isn't. I think this leads to the insecurity issues.
This leads me to what is the bigger...much bigger issue, safety. The crotch rocket guys are MUCH, MUCH more dangerous than any HD rider I've seen. For example, yesterday coming home in my truck, out of no where, on a two lane divided rural road these three crotch rockets were on my ass. No problem, let them ride my bumper, I wont lose that battle,LOL.
Its a rural road, lots of curves, no passing zones, houses and side streets. Anyway, on a no passing section this one asshole decides to pass about 4 cars, (we are all driving about 50mph). He gets around all of us and barely is able to get back in his lane before a truck heading in the opposite direction has to pull off to the shoulder!!
Then the other asshole crotchrocket decides to pass us all on the shoulder!! There are turnoffs etc on this road. So this asshole goes blaring by us all and is able to get in front.
So the last asshole is actually able to pass in a passing zone, but can only pass one car before another one is heading towards him. So he cuts back over and he passes the rest of the cars on the shoulder!!
Talk about immature, irresponsible shit headed dorks. You can talk about HD riders spending too much money, (again the jealousy issue), them buying into the image thing or whatever. I can honestly say I very, very rarely see a HD guy doing anything close to what I saw the other day. Infact I don't think I've ever saw them do anything as stupid as that.
The bad thing is I see crotch rocket guys doing crap like that way too much. I know a majority of the rocket guys are not like that, but there are way too many that are. In fact most non riders I know compalian about guys who ride those "racing type bikes", as they say. I never hear anyone complain about HD riders, except for the nosie, which means they can hear them.
You guys need to watch out about casting stones in a glass house.
91 - Kizzume
I'd prefer being woken up by loud pipes just-for-show at 5 or 6 in the morning than dealing with those scenarios of crotch-rocket riders any day, scenarios that are unfortunately typical.
92 - Kizzume
I needed to say that my complaints about the loud pipes is a small one--in fact, even though I think those people who do the miniature 5-6am loud-pipes parade in the middle of a residential area are inconsiderate, I believe those people know how to have a good time without actually hurting anyone else. I have had a respect for the biker community for a long time.
Unfortunately, the respect is not quite as high as it used to be. Especially since the early 90's, it seems that a certain income level is expected to be a biker now--and a certain level is even expected at biker events. The cost of motorcycles in general has effected this dramatically. Harleys aren't the only bikes that are overly-expensive now.
Yeah, people are jealous of having the money it takes to buy a Harley. They're jealous of the money and the prestige of being "in that club", not just the Harley itself.
Before one had to be of a certain mindset to either be a biker or someone who hangs well with bikers, now one just has to make a lot of money and have the ability to tactfully brag while attempting to look comfortable wearing jeans and a t-shirt instead of a suit or casual slacks and polo shirt for casual fridays.
Just think about how many "dive" biker bars have closed over the past 15 years as compared to previous, and the message is clear: to be a modern biker you need to make a lot of money, and you don't do that by being a rebel.
Craziness and weirdness don't make a very good business model.
Am I poor? Yep, and hopefully that will change.
93 - Ray
If any of us old skool bikers have pissed any cage drivers off I say mission accomplished and fuck you. The amount of money I spend On my bike is my business. So you don't like Harleys, who gives a fuck what you like. Robert Maxey your right on.
94 - Jeff
I ride a HD. I've ridden a HD for 30 years. All I've ever riden are Sportsters. I've bought 4 brand new. The latest is a 2004 custom. Now where do I fit. The "real" HD riders consider it to be half a bike. Oh, it's the fastest half because there is a rare Dyna, Softail, Electra/RK that can keep up with me. Can it pop the front wheel at 30 MPH and show off, no, can it corner like a crotch rocket, no, but is it fun, yes. I keep them stock for the most part and no loud pipes. I ride because it's my life style not because it's "cool". There are motorcyclist and there are RUBS and immature riders that embarrass us all. I would hope that just because I ride a HD doesn't make me a HD HOG junkie. I ride a HD because I like the sound, the power, and most of all thrum of true original. I wave at all other bikers regardless of what they ride. We are part of a fraternity of people who enjoy the ride not the destination. Other than my own mistakes, my HD scoots have never left me stranded, ever. The 68, 78 models did leak oil but my 86 and now the 2004 sporty don't. For all you HD riders out there with the loud pipes, at age 50 like myself, you'll be wearing hearing aides. You don't need them for safety, that's a myth. The sound is behind you not in front, your just pissing others off. I hate waking up at midnight to the sound of a HD. My opinion only.
Ride Safe
95 - B
OK,. First (jack me hoff), yes there are a lot of irresponsible sportbike riders out there. They are jerks, but the +40 crowd has the fastest growing death rate among motorcyclists. The +40ers think they have all this money and then go buy the biggest Hardley they can and then die cause they won't wear a helmet or learn how to ride a real bike first. They are just as dangerous as the stupid stunter Sportbikers. Both are dangerous to other vehicles on the road. There is nothing worse than an idiot on his motorcycle that does not know how to ride it.
Second, there really isn't this insecurity among us Sportbikers. We really don't care, we know Hardley's suck and wouldn't spend the money if we did or didn't have it. We get pissed because Hardley riders go out of their way to insult our bikes and talk about their "real" bikes. This happened to me the other day (agian)and I just let him think he won (I am so over it). I don't care too much because all it does is show their ignorance. All the Hardley marketing is based on image and thats a bunch of crap. Why can't they market based on performance or quality. It is because hardley's can't perform up to any other bikes in there class. How is it that Cycle Rider magazine had to put a 1200cc sportster up against a 900cc Triumph. Well, the Hardley would have lost miserably and Harley Davidson (the company) wouldn't allow that. So the Mag. had to cheat for Hardley so it could win. How manipulative is that????????? Its all a marketing scam. Hey, buy this bike, its the best bike out there, ...................until you take it out on the road and actually ride it. hahahahaha total BS.
Finally, there are many overpriced bikes out there. Look at Ducati and Aprilia. They are both 2-3 times the cost of a typical sportbike and yet are outperformed in most cases buy these cheaper bikes. Again, it is image and I don't fall for that BS. I don't like those bikes because they really don't justify the extra money based on thier performance either. How about people just realize what they bought and paid for and not knock anyone elses choice, while at the same time admitting that just cause they bought this certain bike it doesn't make them or their bike superior to any others. Just STFU about who has a "real" bike and leave it at that. I find it funny that the Hardley guys are so upset when everyone doesn't agree that Hardley's rule. Just realize that we all haven't fallen for that marketing crap the same way you all did.
96 - Kick N Ass
You sportbike rice rocket dorks suck so bad. Hey Jackoff, where did you get your numbers about the 40plus guys dying more? Can you post the link? If not then shut your cum catcher.
All I know is I see rice rocket dorks blasting around very dangerously, cutting and weaving around traffic, doing wheelies, etc. The only knock the crock rocket dorks have is our bikes are too loud and cost too much....Ha,ha,ha. Sounds like a case of a bunch of poor dumb ass babies, crying about everything they are jealous of.
Grow up you cry baby crotch rocket dorks, get a job that pays you good money and buy a real bike...lol.
F-off you Loserboys.
97 - B
KickNASSHOLE The truth hurts doesn't it. I know it is hard and you get all upset and shout all this gay shit. Your funny... Jealous of Hardley's To be jealous you must first desire it. Hardley's look like shit you fucktard... hahaha now I am funny...
by the way It is true that the 40+ croud is the fastest growing death rate. 150% increase cause all you fucktards on your slow POS bikes without your feakin helmets die when you can't control your heavy ass slow as shit bikes.
98 - Big Bad Brad
First off Mr. KissNASSHOLEs, you are obviously a person who lacks intelligence. The word you seek is, "you're", not, "your". If you had made it past the 6th grade you would've learned that. You typed, "Your funny....". The use of the word "your" is incorrect in this instance, here's an example of how to use the word correctly. "KissNASSHOLEs, your mother gives good head".
Now for the word, "you're", "KissNASSHOLEs, you're a moron who has the brain of a Jethro".
See the difference you nitwit?
I would think the increase of deaths among older bikers is this, there are more bikers in this age group. A few years ago you rarely saw a biker over 40. Now its common and I personally think its cool.
If the death rates for the younger riders is pretty much the same for the past several years I would guess its not because its low, its because there has and always will be young riders.
Riding bikes isn't for the faint hearted. You don't have to be a warrior but you do have to know you're taking more of a chance of getting hurt on a bike than a car.
When we are young we think nothing can happen to us. Thats why wars are fought usually with young men. As we get older we tend to slow down a bit and think before we react, USUALLY.
In recent years more riders have been in the over 40 group. I'd say the increase has been due to both newer riders and also riders simply riding longer and getting older.
Its not because they are riding dangeroulsy or what not, its just there are more of them, lots more.
BTW, Im not in the 40 group, yet...lol. Give me about 7 more years and I too will be there.
So this is to those of us in the UNDER 40 bracket, we all need to respect each other, no matter what type of bike we ride. I think a vast majority of us do respect each other, its just a few morons on this blog, including the owner of this site, that feel inferior to HD's for some reason.
Don't think most HD riders are "dissen" you or whatever. Its mostly in your heads. I happen to own a FatBoy, a FX, a Kawasaki and a BMW so I see it from all angles.
In my honsest opinion the BMW and HD riders tend to ride the most sane. I get waves on all bikes from every group. The metrics tend to push the envelope and ride on the more dangerous and unsafe side, at least more than the BMW and HD guys.
99 - B
Your an idiot. If the best you can do is pick on the use of the word "your" then my point is proven. You can't argue anything pertinent and therefore have to sweat the petty things. Anyway, the over 40 crowd which you aren't but seem to be acting like, have a higher death rate because they get on thebiggest cruiser they can find cause "its cool" or "badass". They get these bikes because they are told to get them so that they will fit in with the other lemmings, they don't have minds of there own. Then they pull up next to you or me and act like they are the shit. Depending on the level of Asshole in them they are either polite or start with the trash talk. Most start with the trash talk. I don't like them endangering me because they can't handle the bike. I am a responsible rider and could give two shits what anyone rides. However, when the insulting begins and there is no basis or truth behind it I get pissed off. You know that your Harley's are crap compared to your other bikes when you talk technology or performance or just about anything. You are probably one of the few that can understand both sides of the story, yet you still have been brainwashed a little or you would never have bought the Harley.
100 - B
By the way, feel free to check my grammar You might find something wrong.
Metrics are able to push the envelope a bit. Harleys can't push shit, they barely run.
101 - B
Your going to comfuse all we ignant folk here. Let me ax you somfin.
Is you gonna grammar check all the threads here??? I jus don't git it.
Your crazy
your getting mad at a website
your still a loser
your not a good teacher
P.S.
You're MOMMA!
This is fun.
102 - B
HARLEY'S STILL SUCK DONKEY BALLS
I CAN'T STOP! I'm turning into t TROLL!
103 - Big Bad Brad
Case in point...you're a jerkoff dude. Does mommy and daddy know you're playing on the computer?
104 - Bruce
Harleys are so cool! I'm a gay dentist and me and my gay lawyer and gay doctor friends just love these big gay bikes and the freedom they provide. It just hurts my feelings to no end when I hear you mean boys talking bad about my beloved harleys. I think me and my special friends should ride over and bitch slap you. Ride to live and live to ride you sexy bitches! Brucie on my big Fat Boy!!!
105 - toothless crankster
My Harley is bitchin. It's real loud, it's got a thing called a nacelle, they hid a shock under the seat so my friends couldn't see it. The key is by my bottom. There are two hoops to hold a big chrome american padlock. They are the finest bike in the world. They have a little piece of bent metal with screws in it around the bottom of the front fender that's real good. I get a massage at every stop light and the fat under my arms jiggle a lot and when people look at me and I know, just know, that I am bitchin too. I nod and smile when people look at my bike and feel proud, knowing just like dog owners are proud when they show off there dogs, that I've done absolutely nothing to feel proud about except plunk down a whole bunch of money for nothing. Yeah, I'm bitchin!
106 - Eric Olsen
My uzi weighs a ton
107 - getta
Doc,
You are a conformist coward idiot with dick fear who doesn't have a clue about bikes because you ride a bike that is the epitome of all that is wrong in America,in fact are it's enablers.If you gave a shit about America you wouldn't alow such a piece of crap to identify as being made here, step out of the sheepish idiot crowd and you'll see that harley is reason for shame and that is your fault because you and those like you would actualy by a turd if it had a harley badge.American thunder?More like American flatulence . And you can't kick any ones ass so shut it twit
108 - Meister
It's the wannabe "bad-ass", haha, HD folks that are so darn pathetic. Seriously some of these guys look so stupid I can't help but feel sorry for them. And the attitude - wow! I rolled up behind a group of HD weekenders and the big gal in the back kinda glanced my way, shook her head, and ignored my "Good morning" and wave. Same goes for the squid sport bike riders in flip flops and short pants. Get over yourselves, you're not fooling anyone!
Gear up properly and ride!
109 - Duane
Hey, they're rebels, man. It ain't cool to be friendly, wimp. They don't buy in to your conformity shit. They love their freedom and the open road. They don't have to wear a pansy tie and sit in a cubicle 40 hours a week. Fuckin' A. Now walk on home, boy.
Or not. Whatever you like, sir.
110 - Jimm
"Sure, nine out of ten people would want a Harley if you asked them,
but then again, nine of ten people don't know s#!t about bikes."
-JGullato
111 - Octain
Harley haters go here.
Really is ashamed there are more haters in the world than there is Jap bikes on the road.
http://forums.delphiforums.com/CycleBash/start
112 - Harley Rider in Georgia
Want some cheese to go with that whine?
Better yet tie a kerosene soaked rag around your ankles so you can keep the insects off of your Candy Ass!
People ride what they like to ride, its America so live with it.
So you dont like Harleys....Big Deal.
You amuse me.
113 - GUNNER
Common people, I have been riding for 31 years starting with motorcross. Indecently early dirt bike riders make the best street riders and most understand about being truthful when it comes to fun and function and that Harley Davison resides in the cult fiction dilution of first crush motorcycle fantasy, and has absolutely nothing to do with form, function, engineering, performance or quality. To the old who chop their Harleys I have deep respect because they understand their reasoning for expressive art. But for the dingdong head wan Abe’s out their that line up without a clue about motorcycle dynamics truly waste road space and place themselves and others in danger. Unfortunately like sheep that run off a cliff in herds few Harley riders learn and always comment “my Harley cost a lot to maintain and is uncomfortable to ride but I get a lot of looks from the street corner crowds (ME!)”.
I actually had a Fat Boy pull up next to me on my Bandit 1200s and rumble that sorry excuse of a power plant for a race, a mere twist and the guy was in my rear view mirror wondering why his so called “125 HP” machine couldn’t even begin to keep up which is just the norm of the Harley performance iceberg. Sweet Dreams dreamers.
Gunner G. USCG Ret
114 - Dirt
So many things to say, I'll try to keep it short.
At the moment I ride an '82 Suzuki GS 750. It runs great, no problems. But to be honest, I'm saving up to buy a new bike, and it won't be a Harley. The reliability and quality of ride isn't there for me. I'm looking at a Triumph or more likely a Victory. BMWs are nice too. I ride a JAP bike, but quite honestly, when I look at the new ones, they all just seem soulless and without character, sort of like the tuner cars out on the road nowadays. BTW, my understanding is that Victory now has more Made in the USA parts than Harley. If that's true, then it's Harley's choice to buy foreign parts, not because they can't find good quality parts here in the US as one post commented. Also, why can't Harley (who has been at this game for over a century) match Victory for quality? That Freedom Engine is incredible.
As for the riders? Yeah, I run into some who have nothing but disdain for anyone who rides a non-Harley. I see less and less of them though. The ones who buy the aftermarket pipes, so they can be heard from a mile away? Grown kids who still need to show off. I think they should be ticketed teh same as the cars with excessively loud pipes, or blaring stereos.
Later
115 - Rooster_Dude
I agree with several here - Harley's and the people who ride them are trash. Everyone has to have a Harley. "Look at me with my leather and loud pipes. Don't you think I'm cool? I don't need a helmet. Why be safe when you look sooo cool? And who cares if my bike is disturbing your peace - I look cool!"
Fools - every single one of them.
Also, I hate those crotch rocket type motorcycles and the guys who ride them. The other day, a couple of these idiots are doing wheelies down the freeway at 65mph! No helmets, of course. Now if they want to smear themselves all over the road, that's their own choice. But their wreckless riding endangers me and my passengers.
Like I said - fools - everyone of them.
116 - Herman Munster
Why the hate metric riders? Where's the love dudes? Playing the devils advocate let me say this: It seems like the metric guys are suffering from penis envy. For some reason they have this whole thing in their peanuts, (brain for you dumbass people out there), that HD riders are badasses, or whatever other thing they have created in their OWN MINDS.
Dudes, everyone who has made a post accusing HD riders of blah, blah, blah, do you know what you sound like? How can someone make an intelligent comment about people they don't even know.
If they are riding a HD, wearing some leathers and have a loud bike then they MUST be, (fill in the blank). Do you guys know how STUPID you seem to anyone with any intelligence?
Perhaps most of these anti-HD posters are little kids who don't even own a bike, I don't know. Im sure the moron who started this blog fits in the same catagory.
I know plenty of metric riders and HD riders. I will say that a lot of the metric guys are a bit insecure over the HD guys, why? Relax boys, lets all share the road. If you guys have faster bike, yea, way to go but so what? Isn't half the trip the ride there?
Penis envy is a strange thing, lol.
117 - larry mack
OH YES, WHAT HAS HAPPENED TO HARLEY PEOPLE?
It used to be that the biker bar had the cheapest beer and loosest women. NOW the biker bars are the in place to hang out if your are dressrd like a biker forget if you have ever been on a bike, who cares if the beer is $4 a bottle, the chicks wouldnt show titty because it would mess up their hair and maybee pull their TEMPARAY tattoos off, besides someone from the office might see. The 21st century biker cant be seen in a sleezy bar, with a girl of questionable rep.(or someone elses wife), drinking a domestic beer,or riding a bike in adverse weather.And for Gods sake dont say nigger! IF HE DONE THESE THINGS HES NOT A BIKER AT ALL. When the hell did bikers become politically correct? When did we become respectable? When did we move into the upper income brackets? And above all WHY DID THEY LEAVE ME BEHIND?
Ive had these new bikers park next to me on their evos, look at my bike, point at the kick starter and ask what it is! Look at te frame and ask how i can possibly ride a bike without shocks! with out a stereo! without blinker lites! And above all without a helmet. FUCK THIS EDUCATION SHIT/as far as I am concerned ABATE still stands for American Bikers Against Tolatarian Enactments!
Ive seen bike shows that have an antique class for 1991 (yes 1991) or older. WEll HD conciders this OBSOLETE. Go to the Harley shop and try to get a set of points, 70wt oil or a 6V bulb. I get points and oil from a aftermarket shop and my 6V bulbs from BMW shop HD wont even order them let lone stock em!
HARLEY HAS SOLD US OUT FOR PROFIT Much like many of the 60s bands. People who have a HD for a status symbol spend more money than those who actually ride them. IE $200 plus mirrors, $45 tshirts.When was the last time you were in a Harley shop that seemed like a motorcycle shop and not a botique in the mall.
See no EVO Hear no EVO Speak no EVO and above all RIDE NO EVO
118 - dog
what happend wiht indians? all i read was about harley!!! where are the classic chief?
119 - johnboy
harleys built these days simply suck period. i bought a new one 6 months ago. i thought i bought my dream vehicle that turned nightmare. factory paint has flaws the warantee wont cover. when the frame broke at 2600 miles they they tossed my warrantee out the window because my bikes lowered 1.5 inches. the parts were purchased from the dealer and currently stocked. the dealership owner and service writer agreed that the workmanship of the welds was embarasing at best. but the pencil pushing factory rep saw an aftermarket part (though properly installed)and said no warrantee. screw the customer service service was a joke. fuck harley it just another corperate scumbag with no real heart. they havent had an original idea in 20 years any way. the little bit of driveability they do have if from ripping of honda designs. the only new bike in their line up is the vrod. any one remember the v-max, half the price and would whip a harley ass anytime. rot in pieces hd your days are numbered. who wants the same bike their grandpa anyway.
120 - DoomPirate
[edited] Way to pick a bike with flaws already present. Your story has flaws, i doubt you even bought a harley. [edited] Evel Knieval proved just how durable and reliable Harleys are. Larry, Stop with the fucking stereotypes. I'm 17 and of asian ethnicity and I'm getting a harley. My friend Matt is getting one after he is finished with his 4th year in army. My friend Aaron who's 18 is also buying one. [edited] A BIKE IS A BIKE. No one falls under a stereotype just because they own a harley, the own it because they want to enjoy riding *gasp* bike.
121 - wasatisee
Found this blog by accident and after reading on found myself laughing at the stupidity of it all. So I had to add a few pennies to the pot.
If you buy an old Chevy, you don't drive it like a new Vett and visa versa. You buy something that is meant for the purpose it is intended for. If it is for Transportation, Fun or Just to boost your ego,thats up to the one who busts their butt making the $$ to afford what they are buying.At least they are working! As for idiots, wannabe's, and just plain jerks...it doesn't matter what make/model/year it is, Bike/Car/Truck/Boat,it just doesn't matter, jerks or what ever else you want to call them are everywhere and driving/operating and riding everything, you only have to look. All this squabbling is just another way to make yourself look like one too. Life is too short, so get on with it or you will find yourself in front of this box spewing out this trash while it slides on past you.
122 - gypsy
strong lauguage garners equal response.Just what is is that you folks are all jacked up about? Your bull getting gored? Pretending that anything made of steel ,rubber and plastis has a soul insults the entire universe, We cant even prove that we do! Harley certainly has its fateful adherents .How may auto owners tatto their brand name on themselves? not many I suspose.Yes, thereare a lot of overweight guys and gals riding their overweight ,chromed and decorated HOGs and posing for the pedestrians and cage drivers.So what? These people are no threat to you UNLESS you make it so. The damn cagers scare me to death ,I know that my bike ,which ever one I am on, is no match for those things,dodging is in order.As wasatisee alludes to , we all need to chill the nasty retoric. I think I will pop open a cool one ,grab a rag and dust of my Vincent and think of a nice country ride, Peace to you all ,Gypsy
123 - steve
Harley Davidson's are lame. They are overrated bikes. The Japanese and European bikes have superior technology. Anyone who buys a HD is merely buying a name.
124 - Meh
"Harley Davidson's are lame. They are overrated bikes. The Japanese and European bikes have superior technology. Anyone who buys a HD is merely buying a name."
What if you do not NEED the technology for your purpose? If you are buying a race bike then you can afford to throw it away when it is obsolete, but not all of us race.
HDs are what to own if you want to keep the same machine for decades (I have) and have inexpensive (relatively) and comprehensive (HD is unequalled here) aftermarket parts support.
You can build a complete HD clone without buying a single factory nut, bolt or washer.
They are torquey, docile, narrow (you don't lose much that matters when they crash), easy to work on, and most importantly easy to completely overhaul.
Their "form factor" (to borrow a computer term) is comfortable, and they are effortlessly tailored to any size rider.
Japanese and European bikes of 1988 had superior tech to my 1988 FXR, but that FXR has over 90,000 miles of abuse and was easily to overhaul. The bottom end is good for another 90K. Most of those "superior" machines are gone from the roads because they are so expensive to repair that it isn't worth fixing them. Their engine design is such that the labor alone is often prohibitive.
When they change models, the old Japanese and Euro bikes lose the inherent support of a large pool of common machines. That pool is what makes aftermarket companies tool up to produce parts in volume!
"Gee mister, that's boring!"
Yeah, but it's real too. The automobile comparison is to the small block Chevy. It isn't the highest tech engine on the planet, but it wins on street and track because it stayed standard for decades.
I wrench on all brands, but I keep my HD (and my BWM R90/6) because they stand the test of time and I don't get paid to fix my own scooters! :)
As far as rhetoric, I don't define myself by my choice of bike anymore than my choice of computer video card.
They are mass-produced products make by corporations who only care about parting me from my money.
IF it serves me, I'll buy their stuff.
If not, screw 'em.
From another post:
"what happend wiht indians? all i read was about harley!!! where are the classic chief?"
Indian committed suicide by not producing an overhead valve engine and by retaining a sliding-gear transmission. The sloppy nostalgia over those pretty fenders nowadays obscures the fact that Indian, like the Brits, bitterly refused to improved their product and got killed in the marketplace. They were pretty, but they weren't very good bikes.
Harley came very close to doing the same thing, but thanks to adopting Japanese quality practices (and buying modern Japanese machining centers, so much for Cincinnati Milacron...) they rescued the company.
On marketing:
"Bikers" were way too poor to support the company. HD had always made big bucks from very straight citizens, hence models like the FLH Shrine, dressers, and the police bikes. Poor folks did some great work customising and thus promoting HDs, but they weren't where the money was.
Folks who spend money and can afford to be repeat customers are what the Motor Company requires to stay solvent, so their strategy of co-opting aftermarket innovations (disc brakes, the Softail frame, the Softail NAME, belt drives, solid-disc aluminum wheels, fuel injection, 21" front wheels on glide frontends) and pasteurising "biker" experience for mas consumption was smart. They targeted the "Corvette" market, which isn't affected much by the economy, and won.
"Ive seen bike shows that have an antique class for 1991 (yes 1991) or older. WEll HD conciders this OBSOLETE. Go to the Harley shop and try to get a set of points, 70wt oil or a 6V bulb. I get points and oil from a aftermarket shop and my 6V bulbs from BMW shop HD wont even order them let lone stock em!"
By automotive standards, those items ARE obsolete. Sorry, but few new-car dealers carry parts for old cars either. This is precisely why we have an aftermarket. Aftermarket support is more flexible than any dealer. Why would you even think of going to a dealer for old bike parts unless you knew they had a stash in the back? You wouldn't do it with a car. That's what NAPA and commercial parts manufacturers are for. If you are going to mess with old vehicles of any type being a self-sufficient mechanic is part of the game, as is sourcing your own parts.
There is so much online support I haven't visited a dealer in years, nor do I care to.
125 - 41willyscoupe
Harley is junk and always have been!... I now drive a 2003 FLHTPI and 66 FL.... Both are junk and cant keep up with my Kawasaki Drifter on a good day!... But Ill keep driving my Harleys cause you guys say Im cool like you cause i ride one.. hahahaha bahaha Damn Yuppie Assholes... get a life you fag dildo sucking goofs! HAhahbebahahahaa High Dollar Junk. thats all, Plain and simple truth!... Facts are facts! All you got to do is email the DOT and see for yourself