How can in this day and age of technology, cultural awareness, education and global media, a religion that calls itself "the religion of peace" be so violent?
Some scholars and critics of Western culture use the crusades as justification for the blood spilt in the name of Christ to excuse the continued perpetuation of religious atrocities - "the Christians used violence to rid themselves of non-believers, why shouldn't we Islamist (radical Islamists of course)?"
Certainly the Catholic Church and various other religious institutions have committed crimes against humanity in the name of their God throughout the centuries.
BUT, haven't the majority of religions learned that violence goes against the teachings of their various leaders, prophets and scripture? I think the answer is yes, by and large. How often do we see Pastors, Rabbis, Monks, Priests suggesting we take up arms against non-believers? In my church we are taught to embrace our brothers and sisters, using love and understanding to express our devotion to God.
What is different? What has changed? Why do 3 billion non-Muslim people of the world feel that violence for religious purposes is wrong, while 1/4 of our planet still finds it acceptable.
Wait, before the moderate and liberal followers of Islam or those who are so culturally aware and sensitive to the feelings of others become incensed, please hear me out fully.
I do not intend to suggest that ALL Muslims advocate violence. I know from personal experience that there are plenty of Muslims who follow a different line of understanding of the Koran and its teachings. BUT WHY DO I NEVER HEAR OR SEE THE OUTRAGE for violence committed in their religion's name?
Is it the Jewish media? The Vast Right Wing Conspiracy? Al Quaeda Operatives?
Article comments
— go to most recent comments1 - Eric Olsen
Absolutely right Dawn, very well thought out and written, and of critical importance on this day above all.
2 - mike
"They" hate us because we prop up their police states, like Egypt, invade their countries, like Iraq, to steal their oil, and underwrite Israeli apartheid against the Palestinians.
99% of all Muslims deplore terrorism, and say so regularly, expressing disgust for bin laden in almost every forum published in Arabic, a language you don't read.
You cite Bernard Lewis in your list of books. He is a racist.
3 - The Theory
With any religion (Christianity, Muslim, whathaveyou) that believes in a god and has peaceful teachings you will have fanatics who think that violence is the only way to "give god's message" to the people. And I think this occurs because the person in question grows to believe that he/she has a personal link to god and then interpert their every whim as being Straight From God. So they completely ignore thier religion's teachings and use the logic that "if i think god is telling me X, then it must be more important".
4 - Eric Olsen
good point Theory, exceptionalism is at the root of the problem
Mike, they hate us because our civilization works and theirs hasn't in about 500 years, and because their basic tenets call for theocracy and Christianity suggests separation of church and state. Bernard Lewis is, in fact, an Islamophile who eventually became disgusted with where a religion he admired has ended up.
Also, I don't know what 99% you're talking about, but if you break the questions down to specifics, an alarmingly high percentage think suicide bombing is swell, that all infidels are inferior, even subhuman, and ultimately must be converted or killed, and that Osama bin Laden is a man of vision. You only see what you want to see.
5 - mike
You'll need to cite sources to back up your claims of this "alarmingly high percentage."
Lewis's ignorance of Islam is widely documented, especially in the writings of Edward Said. BL is given to sweeping generalizations about Arabs that would be derided as anti-Semitic if directed against Jews or racist if directed against blacks. On factual matters he is often flat wrong.
Facts are funny things. One of their current effects is to reduce the War Party's propaganda to gibberish.
6 - cjones
I find it infantile for anyone to think that 'they' and I will safely assume you (Eric) are referring to Muslim extremists 'hate us' and again I will assume you are referring to American's because our civilization works and theirs doesnt. This is a blanket statement and it undercuts too much of the complexity of the two cultures (Islamic - Western). I believe everyone loves American freedom even the psychopaths who are trying to blow up everything with an American flag on it.
I honestly think they hate Bush. I think they hate American foreign policy. I think they hate this borderline racist belief that American life is more valuable than anyone elses. I think they hate the fact that it seems that everyone else is suffering where many Americans biggest concern is satellite or cable, Chinese food or Italian. Yes there are many lunatics but there are just as many fanatics in gov't who produce polished hate agendas in the name of foreign policy. Most Americans dont care to be informed about it so people like Bush can easily call anyone who disagrees with him 'The Bad Guy'. He might as well call them the boogey man and give us another lollipop tax break to shut us up. Please look at the issues and not the attitudes and you will come up with a more balanced perspective of why a human being would kill himself to make a point.
7 - Dawn
I concede that all the religions have misused their scriptures for violent purposes. But on the mass scale as we have seen in this century and the previous one, Islamofacism has waged an all out assault with modern weapons on CIVILIAN targets in an age when we are supposed to be a little more civilized - this strikes me as a pandemic in the Islamic culture.
I just don't hear the voices of Islam condemning acts of terrorism like one would expect from a religion of "peace".
It's all so hypocritical.
8 - Joe
CJones- Good point, but from your writing it appears that you seem to think that the Bush presidency predates terrorism or islamist fanaticism.
9 - Dawn
cjones and mike,
I am sorry, but a culture where the majority of the people advocate tolerance and good will IS indeed superior to that which is utterly biased against a whole gender, anyone whose view or religion differ from their own, and who feel that terror and violence against civilians is acceptable.
I am so deeply sorry for my being so lucky as to be born in country that places freedom, opportunity and religious choice high on its list of priorities.
Should my daughter strap on a bomb-belt and blow up dozens of other children to prove her solidarity with those oppressed?
What the hell kind of logic sympathizes with murderers? You are no better than those you seek to validate. If you can't see the difference in our inherent agendas as a nation, as opposed to individual acts by certain government officials, then you run the risk of becoming a radical ideologist yourself. Then what's next? Blowing people up who are just trying to get to work, visit a sick relative, send their kid to college?
What has happened to the outrage we should feel towards violence against our own species?
Extreme liberalism is as dangerous, and sometimes even more so because the feelings come from righteous indignation, as extreme conservatism.
Do not idolize those who murder innocent people, lest you become grouped with them.
10 - Eric Olsen
CJ, I have to respectfully disagree that the Islamists love American freedom - they despise it, it undercuts everything they believe in and stand for. And the fact that Western in general, and American culture in particular are thriving and vibrant, where Islamic culture is decrepit, galls them most of all. They (Islamists) have hated freedom since long before Bush, long before American foreign policy had any bearing on their lives. It is freedom of religion, of thought, of speech, equality of the sexes, separation of church and state tha they hate. Bush has nothing to do with it, other than that he has finally called them on it and begun fighting back. All people may be created equal, but all cultures are not.
11 - cjones
Excellent catch Jon and I apoligize if I didnt seperate the current situation with my opinion of the origin of Islamic fanaticism. No, Bush is not the origin of Islamic fanaticism in any way but his mentality as well as the mentality of his circle has as its origins the same root the led to this particular phase of Islamic or Arab extremism. Whatever the current term is. American foreign policy is not the origin of Islamic fanaticism but it is the major feul kindling the fire right now. For hundreds of years there have been European conquerers who assumed ownership through force of the many weaker nations regardless of belief. Bush is no exception but he is not the first and probably not the last. I believe the Arabs feel they have been reduced to the point where their struggle has been reduced to terrorism but the Western world has institutionalized their ideals and beliefs and therefore hid them through foriegn policy and organizations that push the result without defining the cause or accepting responsibility for the effect. Thanks for the correction.
12 - Eric Olsen
Mike, you are correct to ask for figures and I am working on something right now. I would very much appreciate it if someone could help me with poll figures from the Islamic/Arab world.
13 - Al Barger
Religion of peace my ass, Mike. Mohammed was a warrior. Nothing peaceful about that. Beyond that, the proof of the pudding is in the eating, and the modern Muslim pudding is putrid.
Catchphrases and slogans do not constitute evidence and logic, Mike. Using some crappy Chomskyite wording to make excuses for Muslim wickedness, and to blame it on US in particular, merits nothing but contempt.
Your little pat anti-American analysis does not jibe with facts on the ground.
I'm not going to make a claim to know all about what "most" Muslims think, but those thousands of people absolutely cheering in the streets on 9-11 don't look like they represent less than 1% of Muslims.
If the the big majority, or even a big minority were really, really opposed, I can't help but think we'd be hearing them shouting from the rooftops. If the shoe were on the other foot and it was Christian splinter groups doing these wicked things, bet your ass that even the dreaded Pat Robertson and Jerry Falwell would be everywhere all at once rebuking them in the name of Christ.
Labeling the continued mere existence of the state of Israel as "apartheid" is somewhere beyond run of the mill willful blindness and somewhere in the range of pure unadulterated wickedness. Make no pretense that anything less than the complete destruction of Israel will satisfy the Palestenians.
Numerous public opinion polls show two thirds and higher support among the Palestenians for the homicide bombings.
There is great wickedness in the world, and it is mostly among those who are doing the obviously wicked things. Wicked is as wicked does. You don't get much more wicked than blowing up women and children just because you can. It's Muslims doing this, and more Muslims supporting them in numerous ways.
Ayn Rand spoke of "the hatred of the good for being the good." That perfectly describes these nasty monsters.
This does not describe all Muslims or Arabs, but surely plenty enough of them. If the shoe doesn't fit, then I won't try to force it on an innocent person. But there are plenty of people there who'd make Imelda Marcos look like she's barefoot.
14 - cjones
Dawn, I never meant to imply that I agree with anyone killing themselves to make a point and I am not sure where liberalism comes into play. I just have a point of view that takes into consideration the "why's" of this whole mess. I believe Americans advocate tolerance because they have never had their rights infringed upon, they have always been the ones doing the infringing - just ask a Native American or an African American. I also doubt anyone blows themselves up just to "be down" with the movement. Your point of view seems emotional at best. Violence towards your own species is horrible but keep in mind you would be drinking stinkin' tea and paying taxes to Britain if violence didnt serve a purpose. Just ask the first George - the founding father. He was a General.
15 - cjones
BTW Dawn, excellent Blog. Keep up the good work. This one really got me thinking and it is gonna make me do some research.
16 - Dawn
I keep hoping in my heart that the Muslims do want peace and are afraid to demand it in their names and perhaps that is what President Bush was hoping by freeing the people of Afganistan of the Taliban.
I don't want to universally hate a whole group of people because of the actions of some of them. I just want to know without a shadow of a doubt that they aren't secretly cheering our demise.
Our demise would mean more death of innocent people on both sides of the fence and I just can't see how that is going to solve anything.
How have things improved for the Palestinians since the initial outbreak of terror began in the spring of 2001?
I would like one scholar of Islam who advocated terrorism to show me how this war on the innocents has improved their lives?
17 - debbie
Dawn, I agree with you 100%.
As for the comment that they hate "BUSH" and that is why they act this way is "RUBBISH". They acted this way before Bush became President. They acted this way when Clinton was President, (I hate to admit this) but I remember that they acted this way when Carter was President. This is not about "BUSH", everything in the world does not revolve around "BUSH".
There are some people that compare the Palistinians plight to our revolution in creating our country. I don't see the comparison. We did not deliberately seek out women and children to blow up. We fought the government soilders for the right to govern ourselves not to "eliminate their existance from the face of the earth." How do you even compare the two? Everytime they blow up civilians I care less about their plight. They celebrate, sing and dance in the streets the death of other human beings. This is sick!! How many people in our country did you see singing and dancing, when they die????
I'm sorry, but COME ON!!!
If you want to see something telling just look at the difference in the way they react to their deaths. Isreal cleans it up immediately, comforts each other and works through their grief, Palistinians gather chanting death slogans, shooting guns in the air and inciting more violence. The more this goes on the less I care about the Palistinians plight. After a while you just get fed up. I used to have more understanding about them fighting for freedom, but now I'm just thinking that they really just believe that "Isrealis do not have the right to exist" and should be exterminated.
18 - julia
Certainly the Catholic Church and various other religious institutions have committed crimes against humanity in the name of their God throughout the centuries.
BUT, haven't the majority of religions learned that violence goes against the teachings of their various leaders, prophets and scripture? I think the answer is yes, by and large. How often do we see Pastors, Rabbis, Monks, Priests suggesting we take up arms against non-believers? In my church we are taught to embrace our brothers and sisters, using love and understanding to express our devotion to God.
Do not idolize those who murder innocent people, lest you become grouped with them.
Oh, I'm sorry, this is not right.
There are, across the world, pockets of war in the world where religion of every conceivable stripe is being used as an excuse for murder, and there always was.
Islam was, as a matter of fact, historically more tolerant of jews than christianity ever was.
In "muslim" countries, people who have been kept poor and hopeless have, as ever, been told they'll get pie in the sky when they die. Now they're being told that the man holding the pie hates us, and they can do themselves some good taking us out.
Why do you hear about it and not the others? Because it's being funded by oil money. Because the people who we put in place to run those countries have obscene piles of wealth that they've taken from their countries and left the masses of people living in the middle ages (not a pretty place in anyone's religion). It's very convenient for them to have a highly televised villain across the sea to point at. They don't point out that it's largely our money they're using.
Why don't you hear the muslim voices crying out against this?
I'm guessing none of your best friends are muslim.
The voices in the muslim world who are crying out for an end to the appalling conditions that they're held in by their oil-producing feudal states are not great favorites of their rulers or our media or our government, all of whom have a stake in things as they are.
We have our own evil, ignorant terrorists in this country we live in. Lots of them think they're pleasing their god.
It would take a really heroic act of reductivism to think that recognizing all of this constitutes lionizing the people who attacked my city.
Actually, it's kind of an insulting thought.
Ann Coulter thought the Oklahoma City bombers should have hit the New York Times. She's had an expensive education, she's rich, and she's a popular mover and a shaker in current conservative thought.
Do you really want to try to make the case that stupidity and evil is a religious attribute? That the people in Iraq who are firing at us are all doing it for Allah instead of against the people who hold guns on their grandfathers?
We funded the Taliban. We funded al Qaeda. If their views are the views that screams the loudest in the muslim world, whose fault is that?
To my mind, you are letting an awful lot of the people who are responsible for this mess off the hook.
19 - Brian Flemming
Dawn,
You wrote:
Will you please provide links to the posts in which you have personally expressed outrage about specific acts of violence committed in the name of Christianity in, say, the past 50 years?
To quote the ever-popular Atrios:
20 - Dawn
No, Julia, I am not letting the 19 terrorists who commandeered planes through force and death and then rammed them into buildings killing terrified innocent people off the hook.
They are dead. And I seriously doubt that "their" God encouraged this or condoned it.
Using religion to commit atrocities of any kind is completely unacceptable.
Not condemning these acts unilaterally as a member of this religion is completely unacceptable.
I am allowed to be angry and upset, and I am also allowed to challenge this mass religious hysteria and ask for answers.
I am still waiting for a legitimate reply from an Islamic religious scholar.
Left wing rhetoric that is based on anti-American sentiments will do little to change my point of view.
21 - Dawn
Brian,
I have argued vehemently with those who are Pro-life and use the Christian philosophy as an excuse for violence against those performing or aiding those who perform abortions. I have posted many things about that.
I listed the Catholic Church and the Christian Coalition as one of the most horrific figures of the 20th century. I have condemned anyone who uses religion to terrorize or kill another.
Sorry Brian, quoting Atrios will go in one ear and out another.
If you care to check my record, my blog is open to your scrutiny.
22 - debbie
"Islam was, as a matter of fact, historically more tolerant of jews than christianity ever was."
Huh???
23 - Joe
I was just about to say that Brian makes it pretty clear he's not a regular reader of your blog, Dawn. And what's the big idea, Brian, I'm the troll that gets to be demanding and ask questions around here, not you.
24 - cjones
Debbie, there is no comparison between the origin of American and the Palestinian cause. The only scenario that comes close is what happened in South Africa and its still quite different for the simple fact the South Africans accepted defeat until the world came to their aid. It seems the Palestinians arent so lucky. They are not going to quietly die away like the Native Americans. You can make comparisons every day to justify your position but the bombs keep coming as long as you ignore the underlying causes. And btw Dawn why does considering American history and foreign policy constitute left wing rhetoric and Anti American sentiment. Should Germans consider the Holocaust left wing sentiment and Anti German rhetoric or the fact of the matter!
25 - julia
That's nice, Dawn, and I enjoyed the "anti-american sentiment" thing (boy, you really do have reductivism down to an art, don't you?)
I was there, dear. I know what happened. If you believe that railing against evil Islam instead of trying to understand what uses Islam has been put to since WW2 so it won't happen again will soothe your amour propre, have at it.
Just don't pretend you're doing it for the dead.
Debbie: read a book.