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Credit for Illegals: Is it Really as Dumb as it Sounds?

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I have been avoiding politics lately for various reasons, but a story is in the news and has urged me to speak my mind. It is the typical multi-layered story that causes lots of press and outrage on the surface before anyone even bothers to think about it. Bank of America has decided to issue credit cards to illegal immigrants and this decision has caused waves of outrage and disgust from the average person, but should it? Is this really as dumb as it admittedly sounds?

A credit card is a trust based form of currency. It is simply an instant loan from a bank to an individual to assist in purchasing and is also used as a form of identification. To many, illegal immigrants have shown they are not to be trusted because they already broke the law to get here and are breaking more laws staying and working here so it makes no sense to validate them by giving them credit cards. I think it makes perfect sense to give them credit cards personally and I think you will see why.

The biggest problem facing those trying to enforce the immigration laws are that those breaking those laws remain under the radar. They cannot get Ids, they cannot get Social Security cards, and they cannot get credit cards. This forces them to remain underground and untraceable. Once they cross the boarder they vanish from all law enforcement and immigration agencies and they will not resurface again. This leaves stopping them at the boarder as the only option left to INS and they obviously need more because they are not stopping anyone.

Our society is becoming more and more of a cashless society everyday. The amount of things a person cannot do if they have no credit is growing daily. These people have worked very hard to get here and are already criminals in the eyes of the law so it is not that far a stretch for them to break more laws to stay here- stealing identity for example. If they could get credit cards they would become part of the system. They could not vanish because every purchase could be traced. There is no way to trace cash. We would force the illegal immigrants to come above ground.

“But the government cannot get the records of credit card companies to do those checks.”

I believe they could without changing any laws or taking anyone’s liberties away. The Constitution gives only the government the right to coin money. As we continue on our path to becoming a paperless society the credit card is becoming the currency of the nation. As I said before, you must have a credit card in America to do most things. This means that right now our currency is owned and controlled by private companies and not the government.

I believe it is time for Bank of America and Citibank and all other credit companies to lose the privilege of printing money and it should return to the Feds. It is one of the few times I support returning power to the federal government. We already have our elections in the hands of companies instead of the people and look how wonderfully those have been going, but that is for another article another day. Today I am just saying that giving credit to those here illegally will force those who want to remain underground above ground and reduce (not end) the amount of identity theft committed by those who are otherwise law abiding illegal immigrants who want to become part of the country.

Why create another barrier and force them to break more laws?

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About Brad Schader

  • JustOneMan

    No its Dumber than it sounds…this gives more rights to illegals than legal Americans…

    A legal citizen trying to secure a credit card at the Bank of UnAmerica MUST present a valid social security number if not its called FRAUD. Anyone speaking spanish can walk in make up a name and get a credit card…oh yea that makes sense!

  • http://kanrei.blogspot.com Brad Schader

    Anyone speaking spanish can walk in make up a name and get a credit card

    You seem to think that is not happening now. The difference would be that as of now every illegal immigrant must do this whether they are here as criminals or just people looking for a better life.

    Besides, the main thing is that they would be tracable if this were to happen. Right now they are cash only. How are you going to find someone with no ID and no record of purchases?

  • JustOneMan

    tracable?…you guys have no idea the some illegals live in the country…10 people living in a 2 bedroom apartment, no apt. lease since they always pay cash, no home or cell phone numbers ( they buy cell phones that your reup your minutes at the 711 in cash), their employers do not list them on payroll records, etc, etc, etc…

    So please tell us how do you trace someone who just has to make up a name and secure a credit card?

    In the end as it always does..the hard working middle class with pay more to subsidize ILLEGALS invaders…while Bank of UnAmerica rakes in the money..

    JOM…

  • http://kanrei.blogspot.com Brad Schader

    So please tell us how do you trace someone who just has to make up a name and secure a credit card?

    Have you ever gotten a credit card? It takes a little more than just “making up a name.” If you hate immigrants then just say so. You are backing up your arguement with nothing fact based and everything hate based.

  • Nancy

    It doesn’t matter what their motives are for being here, whether criminal or not; they are ILLEGAL. Period. No further comments should be necessary. They should have no access to services of ANY sort, and those that aid & abet them, shield or shelter them for any reason should be prosecuted to the fullest extent possible, with humongous fines or jail time if they are US citizens, and automatic, unappealable expulsion if they are not.

  • JustOneMan

    Brad…where the fuck are you coming from…I love LEGAL immigrants..both of my Nannys and Grampas were immigrants…ILLEGAL is ILLEGAL..what dont you understand..

    JOM

  • Aku

    This is not stupid at all. If you look at the terms offered by Bank of America and Citibank for these credit cards, they view illegal as high credit risks. These are far, far from platinum or gold cards.

    1. The illegals need a checking account with a certain amount of money in it at the bank in question. So they already have some of their cash to all back on if they don’t pay.

    2. The credit limit is low. Illegals can’t charge up a storm and skip town.

    3. Interest and fees are VERY high.

    These are the same terms you offer any person with high credit risk.

    As to the reasoning of the piece, it is specious.

    The minting of coin/printing of money brings new money into the system without a corresponding debt. A credit card does not do this. It does not matter how much credit cards are used or necessary (I even doubt this part of your argument. I can do just about anything I can do with a credit card with cash or money orders. They are just not as convenient. But that is besides the point).

    JOM:

    If you want to apply for a credit card with the same terms as this one without a social security card I am sure the banks would let you. How is this granting more rights? Plus, business do not grant rights, governments do.

    Nancy

    Until we have actual enforcement of laws to that effect, there is no reason why Bank of America should not sell to illegals when Kroger can.

  • JustOneMan

    Aku..again you are missing some major points.

    They are here illegally…so the Bank Of UnAmerica is aiding and abeting a person in the act of a FEDERAL CRIME…

    JOM….

  • JustOneMan

    Aku..again you are missing some major points.

    They are here illegally…so the Bank Of UnAmerica is aiding and abeting a person in the act of a FEDERAL CRIME…

    JOM….

  • http://kanrei.blogspot.com Brad Schader

    The credit as currency was a side note. I tend to fall victim to tangets. My main point is that right now illegal immigrants are cash only and thus below the radar. Credit cards places them in the system.

    JustOne has yet to show how this would give more rights. I left out the word “illegal” in my response to him and I am sorry for that. I am not implying you are a bigot.

  • http://kanrei.blogspot.com Brad Schader

    Just,
    Only Americans have credit cards?

  • JustOneMan

    OK Brad…lets make it allow

    1)ex-cons to posess a hand gun,

    2)convicted pedophiles to work in grade schools in close contact with children,

    3) People to drink beer and/or martinis while driving

    …oh wait a minute… arent these things illegal?

    Ladies and Gentlemen of the Jury…I rest my case!

    JOM

  • http://kanrei.blogspot.com Brad Schader

    Just,
    That is such a leap of logic I cannot even comment on it. It makes ZERO sense.

  • JustOneMan

    leap…illegal is illegal…you refusal and/or inability to comprehend this is based upon your lack of logic and/or intellect

    JOM

  • http://kanrei.blogspot.com Brad Schader

    Insults- the end of reasoned debate. Have a good day Just.

  • Aku

    “They are here illegally…so the Bank Of UnAmerica is aiding and abeting a person in the ct of a FEDERAL CRIME…”

    SO is Kroger when they sell illegals grocereies, so? Where is your rage aganst them?

    My point being that until those laws are enforced, this is a moot point.

  • JustOneMan

    Brad..its just that you cannot defend your baseless illogical position.

    JOM

  • http://kanrei.blogspot.com Brad Schader

    LOL Just,
    Read the article first, then try addressing points I make instead of closing your eyes and saying over and over “it’s illegal.” Black and white are fine shades, but should not be all you see.

  • zingzing

    jom- ex-cons not only can possess hand guns, they can get a concealed carry license.

  • zingzing

    jom– your arguments make no sense. you realize this, yeah?

    you can say “illegal is illegal,” but that’s not much of a point to make.

    where is the harm in taking immigrants cash and giving them a credit card?

  • JustOneMan

    zing your half right..

    Convicted felons cannot legally own handguns, but four out of five criminal convictions in the United States are for misdemeanors and a misdemeanor conviction, until recently, had no impact on the right to own or use a handgun. Domestic violence laws are changing that…

    The point is since these guys are illegal we shouldnt even be dicussing their right to have a credit card..

    tell the to go home..apply to gain legal entry..get here legally… go to the bank.. and legally get a credit card..can i make it any more clearer?

    JOM

  • zingzing

    that’s how you feel. unfortunately, (and even your glorious leader george w bush understands this,) reality often does not conform to legality.

    immigrants, some of them anyway, use our health services. some immigrants pay social security and medicare taxes using false SSNs. wouldn’t it be better if they all paid those taxes, no matter what their legal status?

    you should be celebrating this. it offers some reliable way to track illegal immigrants. they create a paper trail. this type of information could be used to catch them, i would guess.

    credit is a service, a commodity, just like anything else. if you aren’t upset about them buying gasoline, or food, (because they are going to do these things, illegal or not,) why are you so upset about them using credit?

    on guns–the fact is that there are so many loopholes in the laws that a man convicted of trying to kill his wife can, within a couple of years, walk around with a fucking .45 beneath his jacket. it’s ridiculous.

  • http://kanrei.blogspot.com Brad Schader

    it offers some reliable way to track illegal immigrants. they create a paper trail.

    The bulk of my argument supporting this which only shows Just only read the headline and not the story.

  • zingzing

    yeah, well, there you go. that’s his way.

  • Nancy

    It certainly gives food for thought – to me, at least. Zing #22, you’re certainly right on the mark there.

  • zingzing

    nancy, i’m glad you finally seem to be getting beyond the “it’s illegal!” argument. it is illegal. that’s a given. unfortunately, that does absolutely nothing to solve the problem.

    you, unlike jom, at least have some reason in you.

  • zingzing

    btw–i don’t mean to compare you to jom in any meaningful way. that would be… an insult.

  • http://kanrei.blogspot.com Brad Schader

    This is from the above piece.

    If they could get credit cards they would become part of the system. They could not vanish because every purchase could be traced. There is no way to trace cash. We would force the illegal immigrants to come above ground.

    Just,
    Please show me the lack of logic or intelligence I showed.

  • Nancy

    Worse than an insult, Zing-! ;) No, I DO see the reason in your arguments, even your pleas for those who are here illegally because their home situation is untenable, I really do; I just don’t buy it, because the end of all order is anarchy, total ignoring of laws meant to keep those (who would otherwise violate the rights of others) in line – and that applies to those wanting to come here, too. If they can’t be trusted to start off obeying the law, how can they be trusted to be the kind of people we want as fellow citizens? At the same time, I agree wholeheartedly, the system, she is broke – as you should know if you have read any of my past comments. It SHOULDN’T take 14 – 20 – 25 years for some poor slob to get citizenship papers for himself & family. That’s an outrage. But those who are here illegally should not be winked at & tacitly encouraged by giving them or their kids legally-required taxpayer-subsidized schooling, public housing assistance, medical care, etc. The INS shouldn’t be carrying out a ‘catch & set free’ policy, and employers (especially the big corporations like Swift & Canon) shouldn’t be allowed to get away with welching on their employment taxes by hiring these people, because it victimizes both the taxpaying US public, as well as (in the long run) the illegals themselves, by creating a virtual slave economy in all but name – but pro-illegal arguers never seem to understand that, as long as immediate short-term goals of unlimited illegal influx are gained. Not to mention it undermines the few gains the unions & US citizens used to have when it came to employment. Personally, if a corporation decided to outsource their jobs overseas, I’d create a law that declared them to be foreign, & tax the shit out of them w/tariffs as if they were, instead of requiring the same people who have been cheated out of their jobs to additionally support corporate welfare into the bargain.

  • Nancy

    Gotta go: weekend volunteer standby duty. Ciao, all.

  • Aku

    Nancy,

    Learn paragraphs please. That block of text makes my brain hurt.

  • Jerry

    I’m not so sure that it’s not the truth that really hurts!

  • Aku

    Heh?

  • Nancy

    Just how would you split it up, Aku? It’s all part of one thought line.

  • Zedd

    Illegals have BEEN getting credit cards.

  • Zedd

    Brad

    Sed :The biggest problem facing those trying to enforce the immigration laws are that those breaking those laws remain under the radar.

    Not so. The biggest problem are employers who don’t want to pay Americans fair wages. The jobs that have been done for centuries by Americans are now held by illegals. The notion that Americans wont do them is a lie. Who’s been doing them all along? Low skilled AMERICAN workers.

  • Clavos

    The jobs that have been done for centuries by Americans are now held by illegals. The notion that Americans wont do them is a lie. Who’s been doing them all along? Low skilled AMERICAN workers.

    How do you know that Zedd?

  • ToranagaSama

    I didn’t event get past the first few lines of your ponderings, because there’s just not point to them.

    It comes down to one basic and important reality.

    Affording legitimate credit to illegal aliens by superior and politically influential American financial institutions is a GROSS vesting of the interests of illegal aliens to the United States.

    Think about it the issue of illegal aliens residing in this country has not yet, politically, been resolved.

    Yet, now the Bank of America, as well as any institution which follows its lead will have a VESTED interest in maintaining illegals within the borders of the United States and/or the legalization of illegal aliens.

    This means, if it isn’t already so, that the Bank of America with its billions of dollars, paid lobbyist, political contributions, and influence will work in the interest of illegals and against the interests of the people of the United States.

    Illegal aliens should not be here, and should be deported en masse. Yet, now the Bank of America has a vested interest contrary to the law of the land.

    I need to do the homework on this, but question the legality of this.

  • Dan

    “it offers some reliable way to track illegal immigrants. they create a paper trail.”

    Brad, if the point is to use the card as a tracking device to apprehend them and send them back, it makes no sense. Why would illegals want to create a paper trail, if it meant being sent home?

    From the perspective of Bank of America, it makes even less sense in that once deported, an illegal would likely default on the balance.

    The wife called and cancelled our Bank of America cards. The agent wanted to know why, and when told, the agent said the media was only giving one side of the story.

    I don’t know what the other “side” could be, other than the usual humanitarian sniveling, but it felt empowering to strike a blow.

  • Nancy

    I think you’re right: those bastards in the CEO suites have sold out the people of the US for a handful of silver. Maybe the workers should lynch THEM, too, along with the political maggots.

  • Clavos

    From the perspective of Bank of America, it makes even less sense in that once deported, an illegal would likely default on the balance.

    Maybe. But BofA, Citi, Wells Fargo, and others all issue cards all over the world, especially in Mexico, so they have the infrastructure and means by which to collect.

  • ToranagaSama

    Gosh, I don’t understand some of you people, particularly those who ignore realities and engage in justifications.

    Illegals are illegal and that’s it. Why is there any further discussion? WHAT is there to discuss?

    I don’t understand, how in the 80s my city, NYC, closed half of its schools and sold the buildings, because the schools were underutilized. Resulting in huge savings.

    Fifteen years or so later, and now schools are grossly overcrowded, and billions of MY tax dollars are being spent in an attempt to build schools and catch up with the school population explosion. It will take years to catch up, if at all.

    Now, if I choose to have a child, I, a generational American citizen, a lifetime resident of this great city, will be faced with the choice of sending my child to grossly overcrowded and underserved school or foot the bill, in addition to the taxes I pay, for private schooling.

    What has happened? Has there been some incredible explosion in the American population causing school overcrowding? Nooooooo.

    But there has been a 19th century like explosion in the immigrant population—both legal and illegal. HUGE!

    Sooo, someone explain why must *I* pay, and why must a child of my suffer a subpar education?

    Schools in this city are so crowded and underfunded that Gym classes, Music classed, most non-essential classes are being cancelled.

    So how is this serving me?

    Similarly, the same can be said for hospitals and EVERY public service.

    So, do *I* hate immigrants?

    Oh, and back to the subject of credit cards. Ok, so you want to use the cards to “track” the illegals, right? ROFLOL!!!

    That’s the stupidest bit of reasoning I’ve heard in awhile. So, ok, now that they have credit cards and we know where they are, so now what?

    Are we going to round them up and deport them? Obviously not!

    Soooo, what is the point? Obviously, there is none. This “tracking” nonsense is total BS, camouflage meant to obfuscate the true reality. We had drivers licenses, Visas and other papers re the 9/11 suicide bombers—-did it help? Obviously not!

    So, please stop with the Oh, we can “track” them nonsense.

    You people just don’t make sense.

    We have a prison system BURSTING at the seams full of American citizens. Of course, many are hard core criminals, but most are people who have lived young lives of mistakes.

    So an ex-con coming out of prison wanting to go straight and live a right life—how can he do this? HE CAN’T GET A JOB! Not because of his record–nnoooo.

    It used to be a guy like that could get out and find so lowly job, say as a Fry Cook in a dinner or something. Perhaps a custodian, a window washer some such begin again job.

    But NOT today, ALL of those jobs are filled with the continually oncoming stream of legal AND illegal immigrants. You all know this. Got to a restaurant, all the jobs, save for the *front* positions, waiter, host, etc. are filled by immigrants. Not an American to be found.

    Please, don’t hand me the BS line that these are jobs Americans won’t do—-BULLSHIT!

    Every working class job in this nation, normally manned by an American both skilled and unskilled is being taken by an immigrant both legal and illegal.

    How is this serving an American with little interest in college or a college type job. What are we to do with millions we have in prison? Do you think they’re going to evaporate? Or do you desire to pay for their incarceration forever?

    Immigrants take jobs that Americans used to do.

  • Clavos

    Immigrants take jobs that Americans used to do

    Horseshit. Plain and simple.

    In areas like Florida and California, such jobs are going begging; there aren’t enough immigrants OR native born “Americans” to fill them.

    Jobs have shifted around in this country since the revolution. They have been leaving the Rust Belt for decades now, while the South has been creating jobs at a rapid pace for that same period. If someone has difficulty finding work in New York, there are plenty of jobs elsewhere.

    During my work career, I have lived in four different states, following my work. Immigrants understand this and are willing to move where the work is; that’s exactly why they’re here.

    Unemployment in the USA is at historically low levels nationwide. There’s work available for both native born AND immigrants.

    Your argument loses all of its cogency when you start railing against legal immigrants, as you did in rant #42; we’re ALL immigrants in this country.

    According to anthropologists, even the “native Americans” are, though they’ve been here longer than anyone else.

    Being anti-immigrants is just racism in disguise.

  • Nancy

    Anti-immigrant or anti-illegal immigrant, Clavos? Please specify. If the latter, I will fight you tooth & nail over that one, because I am 200% FOR legal immigrants of all kinds. They make this area liveable & interesting, & are valuable contributors to every aspect of our society. If you mean illegals, I don’t care if they’re lily-white Swedes or pitch-black Nigerians or somewhere-in-between Hispanics, I don’t care if they’re illiterate or PhDs: they shouldn’t be here, & it is in no way racist to hold that view. It’s law-&-orderness: there are those who have done the right thing & put in their paperwork & are waiting for legal entry, while these jerks jump the line so to speak. Nor do they pay their fair share of taxes for public services, but drain resources that should be limited to bona fide US citizens & legal immigrants. It’s not racist to resent those that sneak in, in violation of the LAWS of the US, just as it’s not racist to resent those US citizens who violate the LAWS of the US regarding drug dealing, bribery, or tax evasion. I am glad to see that FINALLY BushCo is charging 3 employers with felony counts of tax evasion, fraud, & harboring illegals, for failing to pay employment taxes, setting up dummy corporations to hide monies, & for deliberately ‘importing’ illegals to try to avoid paying a decent & honest wage & the resultant taxes.

    As for moving, say from NY to the south, it takes money to travel, which most poor Americans don’t have. Illegals generally are transported either by coyotes or by some other party (like those employers) who pay to have them brought on site; poor Americans don’t have that luxury; in addition to which the law requires these cheapskate maggots (the employers) to pay a decent wage – which is why they have illegals in the first place: because they want to use virtual slave labor, which is what they get when they hire illegals: people who can’t complain, can’t fuss, have no recourse if they are cheated out of their wages, and basically have no rights, because if they do the employer simply has to turn them over to the INS – and the illegals know it, because these viperous employers make sure they know the consequences of asking for their rights. In the same way, these employers don’t want to use Americans, because Americans are aware of their minimal rights. They WON’T allow themselves to be abused or employers to get away with (literally, as some have) murder, forced prostitution, forced labor, cheating on wages, etc. It’s about time. BushCo has been turning a blind eye to the antics of these corporate vultures for years now, because most of them are connections of BushCo, or political contributors.

    Illegal immigration isn’t just about breaking one law; it involves breaking a whole network of laws, & inevitably moves into the realm of serious crime.

    If the employers were willing to pay a decent wage, instead of cheating employees out of rightful earnings & social security credits, they’d have loads of good American workers available.

  • Clavos

    Nancy,

    My comment was directed at TS, who, among other things, wrote the following: But there has been a 19th century like explosion in the immigrant population—both legal and illegal. HUGE!

    And this: But NOT today, ALL of those jobs are filled with the continually oncoming stream of legal AND illegal immigrants. You all know this. Got to a restaurant, all the jobs, save for the *front* positions, waiter, host, etc. are filled by immigrants. Not an American to be found.

    And this: Every working class job in this nation, normally manned by an American both skilled and unskilled is being taken by an immigrant both legal and illegal.

    Also this: Immigrants take jobs that Americans used to do.

    I made it clear in my comment that I was addressing the obvious bigotry above. I said: Your argument loses all of its cogency when you start railing against legal immigrants, as you did in rant #42; we’re ALL immigrants in this country.

    And this: Being anti-immigrants is just racism in disguise.

    Note that I never mentioned illegal immigrants.

    Finally addressing a point you make in #44; You say: As for moving, say from NY to the south, it takes money to travel, which most poor Americans don’t have. Illegals generally are transported either by coyotes or by some other party

    Those illegals, who are MUCH poorer than the poorest American, are paying the coyotes THOUSANDS of dollars (more than first class airfare) for their transportation. And, if the employer does pay the coyote, the immigrants are forced to pay it back by working; to the point many become de facto slaves.

    Do you remember the stories of the Okies moving from the Dust Bowl to California and other western states to find work? They were the poorest citizens in the country in their day. Most poor working people have a car (as did many of the Okies); what’s wrong with loading it up and DRIVING where the work is?

    If you’re in danger of starving (and I mean you, specifically, Nancy), and can’t find work where you live, even if you’re flat broke, you’ll find a way to get to the work, won’t you? Of course you will.

  • http://www.alipac.us CheshireCat

    Bank of America is giving credit cards to illegal aliens with no credit history and no Social Security number. Close your account and join the boycott. Visit the site and learn about banks that are not doing business with illegal aliens. Don’t be the last American with money in that bank.

    The boycott website is set up. The man organizing the boycott is William Gheen

    JOIN THE BOYCOTT!

  • zingzing

    “Bank of America is giving credit cards to illegal aliens with no credit history and no Social Security number. Close your account and join the boycott.”

    oh no! what a waste of time. what’s the point? really. what is the point of closing your account?

    oh yeah, better not shop anywhere else. like the grocery store that does business with the illegals. the gas station, the hospital, the makers of southwest sauce, telephone companies, the manufacturers of lightbulbs, the asphalt you (and THEM) drive on, the underwear company (learn to wipe), the toenail clippers!

    don’t do anything! hole up!

  • CheshireCat

    Mexican banks refuse to accept Mexican issued Matricula Consular Cards, as a valid form of identification, but American banks do. You must see the video.

    See a list of American banks that do and do not accept the Matricula Cards as a form of ID.

    Join the boycott!

    Don’t be the last American, with money in a bank that aid and abet illegal aliens.

    Ches