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Could GOP Leaders Possibly Believe Their Own Rhetoric?

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Is it possible that Republicans truly believe that President Obama is both a socialist, and a fascist, who wasn't born in the United States, and that providing affordable health care to American families is a plot to destroy America? Could they possibly believe that Dick Cheney kept America safe, or that George Bush was protecting the American way of life? And is it possible that they consider their incendiary rhetoric simply innocent speech, and don't recognize that during this time of severe hardship, they could very easily incite insurrection within the country? It's not likely.

Thus, it is way past the time for anyone who truly loves America to realize that the Republican leadership is a threat to our way of life — and as always, I want to emphasize the huge distinction between true conservatives, and those currently running Republican Party.

The current Republican leadership is a vastly different breed than anything we've ever seen in America before. Even during the Civil War, though wrongheaded, the insurrection of the South was led by people who truly believed in their ideals. But this group of insurrectionists have no ideals. This is a group that is perfectly willing to tear America apart for no other reason than to promote their own power and personal greed. In short, they're nothing less than common thugs engaged in a nationwide protection racket against the people of the United States.

In the recent contest in New York's 23rd Congressional District, we just saw that, contrary to Reagan conservatives' eleventh commandment of "Thou shall not speak badly of another Republican,"  this group was more than willing to eat their own, against the will of the vast majority of Republican voters, for what they consider "party purity." Where have we seen that before?

And the mere fact that the GOP is willing to espouse outrageous propositions, then use incendiary rhetoric to incite reactionary wingnuts to try to shove their agenda down America's throat, clearly demonstrates how dangerous the GOP has become as a political entity. It shows that they hold the intelligence of the American people in absolute disdain, and that they believe that propaganda, if repeated often and loudly enough, will overwhelm America's common sense. And again, it also betrays a chilling and grossly irresponsible willingness to throw America under the bus in an attempt to regain power, during a time when the country needs solidarity more than ever.

The GOP has left President Obama with two wars, the worst financial decline since the Great Depression, and a national infrastructure that is literally falling apart. Yet, instead of responsibly stepping up to the plate to help find viable solutions for the hardships they've left on the American people, they're indulging in obstructionism, the protection of fat cats to the detriment of the average American, and the incitement of social bigotry through the use of subliminal messaging. These are clearly the actions of people who are totally devoid of any sense of patriotism.

While the GOP claims to be fighting for "small government," that's transparently not the case. The fact is, while they want a government too small in its oversight capabilities to regulate their corruption and greed, they were more than willing to violate the law to ensure a government that was expansive enough to spy on American citizens. And while they claim to want lower taxes, they only want lower taxes for fat cats and corporations, while they fight to ensure that those very same corporations are allowed to, literally, "tax" the average citizen out of life and limb by inflating prices of gas, food, housing, and health care. So even if they do fight for lower taxes, it's only so they can transplant those funds from government coffers to their own.

They also claim to believe in state's rights, but that's only for a state's right to deprive the citizens of any rights that the corporations failed to abolish at the national level. That accounts for the proposed amendment allowing states to "opt-out" in the event that a public option is passed to health care. The right to block affordable health care at the state level would be their final opportunity to protect their cash cow, the insurance industry.

But the key to selling their bogus claims is dependent on deluding the American people into thinking that a huge ground swell of Americans support their fraudulent point of view. The GOP tries to do that by whipping some of the most undereducated people in the country into a frenzy, and then promoting raucous demonstrations as photo ops. By doing so, they're betting on the fact the American people are so dumb that they don't realize that with a population of 308 million people in the United States, it's easy for Fox News to squeeze enough people into a television screen to make virtually any issue seem like they have a ground swell of support from the masses. By using that technique, one can even show a ground swell of support for child molestation.

There are 686,515 sex offenders in the United States. If the GOP could turn out (excuse the pun) all of those sex offenders before a camera, they could use that photo op to make the case that these sex offenders represent a majority of the American people. And that's exactly what they're doing, but instead of using sex offenders, they're enlisting Fox News to gather up every social bigot and wingnut they can find to squeeze before the camera.

It's time for America to wake up (liberal and conservative alike) and put a stop to these people. They're gradually chipping away at American ideals and replacing them with their own. In eight short years they've amended the American ideal that torture is un-American to read, "Well, that depends," that America should only invade a sovereign nation in self-defense to read, "Unless we don't like them," and that all Americans have the right to privacy and due process under the law, to "accept if some bureaucrat decides that ain't cool."

The behavior of the GOP suggests the following:

1."The great masses of the people will more easily fall victim to a big lie than to a small one."

2. " I believe that I am acting in accordance with the will of the Almighty Creator

3."The broad masses of a population are more amenable to the appeal of rhetoric than to any other force."

4."The [Republican party] should not become a constable of public opinion, but must dominate it. It must not become a servant of the masses, but their master!"

5."Sooner will a camel pass through a needle's eye than a great man be 'discovered' by an election."

All of the above quotations comes directly from Adolph Hitler in Mien Kampf.

So this is not just an exercise in hyperbole. It is essential that Americans take this assault on our way of life seriously. It is incumbent upon all Americans — again, both liberal and conservative — to look back at how far we've drifted away from our ideals during the Bush era. Even Bush himself said, "I have no problem with a dictatorship. Just as long as I'm the dictator." Just imagine the kind of firestorm that would result if President Obama said something like that.

So if you're a liberal, consider the gross assault that the GOP mounted against our constitution and civil rights. If conservative, consider the GOP's reckless waste of the nation's resources, as they passed billions of dollars out to their cronies without a shred of accountability, while forcing our troops who were wounded in battle to pay for their equipment left on the battlefield, and forcing them to pay for their own meals while lying wounded in the hospital. And this, by people who, almost to the man, moved hell and earth to avoid their own military service. Dick Cheney had five (5) deferments.

Here's a note to Rush Limbaugh from Rep. Michele Bachmann before her anti-healthcare rally, as reported by thinkprogress.org: "We'll have a meet-up at the Capitol steps and then the insurgency begins."

So it is past time for all Americans to put their difference aside to fight an internal enemy who is much more insidious than al Qaeda. It's time to recognize that it can happen here — and if we don't wake up soon, it will.

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About Wattree

  • http://www.republicofdave.com Dave Nalle

    So this is not just an exercise in hyperbole.

    Yes it is. It’s that and not much more. Except for your blatant violation of Godwin’s Law, of course.

    You seem to have no grasp on the nature of the GOP, its past actions, its intentions or really anything that happens in the real world. You seem to have instead been programmed with an agenda of hate and misinforamtion, perhaps by the socialist propagandists at thinkprogress.org.

    Let me just do one thing to help you out and set you straight on the NY-23 situation. It was not the GOP leadership which opposed Scozzafava. The GOP leadership picked her, backed her and raised money for her. Hoffman’s candidacy was backed by radicals who are largely independents and openly hostile to the GOP. Listen sometime to what those people say about Michael Steele and about the GOP leaders who picked Scozzafava. Glenn Beck, for example, is outspoken about not being a Republican and attacks traditional Republicans on a regular basis.

    What you saw in the Scozzafava debacle was the GOP assaulted by the extreme right, and the end result was that the GOP was proven right and the extremists were proven wrong.

    As for the rest of the claptrap about corporatism and hypocrisy, take the beam out of your own party’e eye before going after the splinter in the GOP’s eye.

    Dave

  • http://blogcritics.org/writers/christine-lakatos/ Christine

    There are 686,515 sex offenders in the United States. If the GOP could turn out (excuse the pun) all of those sex offenders before a camera, they could use that photo op to make the case that these sex offenders represent a majority of the American people. And that’s exactly what they’re doing, but instead of using sex offenders, they’re enlisting FoxNews to gather up every social bigot and wingnut they can find to squeeze before the camera.

    This is one of the most hateful articles that I’ve ever seen on BC. This puts some of the Rush Limbaugh hyperbole, who I personally can’t stand, to shame.

  • http://wattree.blogspot.com Wattree

    Dave, you said:

    “Let me just do one thing to help you out and set you straight on the NY-23 situation. It was not the GOP leadership which opposed Scozzafava.”

    Let me set you straight, Dave. The radical wingnuts are actually the ones who are running the GOP. That’s why Scozzafava had to be pulled. When I refer to GOP leadership, I’m not referring to Michael “the puppet” Steele, I’m referring to Limbaugh, Beck, and Palin. I thought that went without saying, since any fool should know that.

  • http://delibernation.com/blog/3 Silas Kain

    Bill Maher made a very good point last night on Letterman. He said (paraphrasing here)the Democrat Party is moving to the right and the Republicans are just extremist, religious fanatics who belong in a loony bin.

    He’s right. And, for the record, he’s not as progressive as “conservatives” make him out to be. He is more consistent with Goldwater than the majority of self-loathing, sexually frustrated Hitlerians currently controlling the GOP.

  • zingzing

    hitlerians? that’s a good one. gonna write that down. i mean “right” that down. just in case.

    in case of… (we’ll see what they come up with)

  • http://wattree.blogspot.com Wattree

    I’m very sorry you see my position as hateful, Christine.

    I don’t hate anyone, and if you continue to read me you’re going to fnd that out pretty quickly.

    I’m a bottom line person,and I call my column “Beneath the Spin” because I specialize in saying those things that everyone else find it convenient to ignore, because that’s generally where the truth lies.

    I anger Blacks, Whites, Hispanics, young, old, Jews, Gentiles, rich, poor, liberals, and conservatives, because my oly agenda is to follow the truth wherever it leads.

    I may not always be correct in my assessment of the facts, because I have long since recognized that I corner the market on neither intellect nor wisdom. But what you can always depend on getting from me is the unvarnished truth, as I see it.

    One of the publications that I write for, and will be running this article this article next week, is ultra conservative. I get along with it’s readers quite well, because they know that even though they may disagree with me, that I’m never vindictive.

    Therefore, if I write something that you disagree with, please educate me. Because I would rather be educated than to win a debate, any day. Test me on that.

  • http://blogcritics.org/writers/christine-lakatos/ Christine

    Wattree: well other than the sex offender reference…

    Thus, it is way past the time for anyone who truly loves America to realize that the Republican leadership is a threat to our way of life — and as always, I want to emphasize the huge distinction between true conservatives, and those currently running Republican Party.

    Even though you breifly laid out a distinction there, I hardly think that Palin, Beck and Limbaugh are running the GOP. And most intellegent people do know that. Even us conservatives!

    The rest of your article is a serious critique of the GOP, which is fair game, however, which is it the few or the entire GOP? Sounds like an attack on the entire group considering you started with Bush and Palin wasn’t even known then.

    Comparing the GOP to hitler reminds me of those few hate mongers that brought their stupid hitler signs to the Tea parties. So how are you different?

    Lastly,
    So it is past time for all Americans to put their difference aside to fight an internal enemy that is much more insidious than al Qaeda.

    Is the GOP, then, worse than hitler and al Qaeada? Wow, that is quite an indictment. Need I say more?

  • http://www.republicofdave.com Dave Nalle

    Let me set you straight, Dave. The radical wingnuts are actually the ones who are running the GOP. That’s why Scozzafava had to be pulled. When I refer to GOP leadership, I’m not referring to Michael “the puppet” Steele, I’m referring to Limbaugh, Beck, and Palin. I thought that went without saying, since any fool should know that.

    Limbaugh, Beck and Palin are hardly the GOP leadership. None of them holds any official position and Beck claims he isn’t even a Republican. Once again, you are confusing the most extreme elements of the conservative right with the Repoublican Party. They are not the same thing. The Republican party is diverse and includes some people from that part of the political spectrum, but far more who are moderate or more traditional conservatives. This is not a theory or speculation, it is fact. Check out polls of the actual beliefs of people in the GOP sometime.

    At the same time that Scozzafava was being supported by the GOP leadership they were also supporting equally moderate candidates like Chris Christie in New Jersey. No one tried to interfere with Christie’s candidacy and he won his election to a far more significant office.

    The Scozzafava situation was entirely about abortion. That’s it. Pro-lifers went after her and made up most of the other complaints and roped in others based on their distortions. Their plan failed and they’ve lost some credibility as a result.

    If anything this strengthens the moderate elements in the GOP like Michael Steele.

    Your article and your subsequent comments show a fundamental ignorance of the Republican Party and recent political events.

    I’ll leave others to take you to task for your heinous bigotry and ridiculous hyperbole.

    Dave

  • zingzing

    “Is the GOP, then, worse than hitler and al Qaeada? Wow, that is quite an indictment. Need I say more?”

    welcome to our world.

    and, no.

  • http://blogcritics.org/writers/christine-lakatos/ Christine

    Zing: welcome to which world? and, no????????????????
    Not following, but you know me I take everything literally other than when it is followed by a LOL.

  • http://wattree.blogspot.com Wattree

    Dave,

    When you mentioned Godwin’s Law, my first reaction was, “Who the Hell is Godwin, and why should I care about his law when it comes to expressing my opinion?” So I looked him up, and I was right to ask myself tha question.

    First of all, his law is ridiculous, and who is he to make a law that I should follow anyway? Let me give you another law – let’s call it Wattree’s Law. Never give else more credit for their ability to think than you reserve for yourself.

    And BTW, there’s a codicil to Godwin’s Law:

    “However, Godwin’s Law itself can be abused, as a distraction, diversion or even censorship, that fallaciously miscasts an opponent’s argument as hyperbole, especially if the comparisons made by the argument are actually appropriate. A 2005 Reason magazine article argued that Godwin’s Law is often misused to ridicule even valid comparisons.”

    But I must admit, I am disappointed with myself that I’d never heard of it before. So I guess I owe you a vote of gratitude for adding to my education.

    Thank you.

  • http://www.republicofdave.com Dave Nalle

    Wattree, the codicil certainly doesn’t apply here, because your argument is all hyperbole with very little validity. I’m not going to dignify it by explaining how ridiculous your hitlerian comparison is, but the fact that you make it suggests a distorted view of reality or a lack of historical knwoledge.

    Dave

  • http://blogcritics.org/writers/christine-lakatos/ Christine

    Wattree: Pardon my gramatical and spelling errors. I usually have the honor of Clavos’ and Dave’s editing! And it is way past my bedtime.

  • zingzing

    christine, in right-ous land, obama=hitler.

    hitler.

  • zingzing

    “and no” means we don’t answer your question affirmatively. although i would say that you people (you peoplle!) are the cause of a lot of the terrorism that does happen. if only you’d fucking calm the fuck down. we don’t have to kill these people, we have to understand them. stop bombing them. stop waging war. stop fucking up our world. what the hell is wrong with you? you’re just as bad as they are. so cut it out. you aren’t terrorists, but you act like them.

    if we could get rid of the war-mongering conservatives, we’d be at peace. and do you know what peace is? it’s GOOD. so stop fucking up this shit, assholes.

  • http://wattree.blogspot.com Wattree

    Dave, Christine:

    maybe if you read an earlier article of mine yu may have a better take on my view the current the GOP. I have a deep understanding Republicanism. In fact, I’d be willing to bet that I’ve explored conservatism and the GOP (in which I always make a distinction) thoroughly than most Republicans.

    My son and daughter’s Godfather was a Rabid Reagan conservative – an Irish conservative – and they don’ come more conservative than that. Larry (now deceased) was so conservative that he thought unemployment insurance a slippery slop towards socialism. He didn’t even call the USSR communist – he called them Bolsheviks – and he considered Richard Nixon a closet liberal who sold out to China.

    While he loved Reagan, he thought Ron was wishy-washy and had spent a little too much time in Hollywood. He considered Nancy the true conservative

    We used to get a pint of gin and discuss (argue) these issues deep into the night – every night. So I think I know just a little bit about the GOP and the conservative movement.

    So I think that you just don’t understand my definition of conservatism. If you get the chance,read this article, and I think you’ll understand where I’m coming from a little better.

  • zingzing

    i do get a sense of joy from this.

  • http://jetspolitics.blogspot.com/ Jet Gardner

    I very much liked this article (no surprise), and the fact that our rather large and vocal resident right has begun screaming “HERETIC!!! BLASPHEMER!!!” at the top of their lungs is no surprise.

    As I’ve said many times before, I used to be a Republican until the religious right bought the GOP lock, stock and barrel.

  • Arch Conservative

    Is it possible that a black man could so wholeheartedly support the Democrat party, which has, through welfare, oppressed more black Americans than the GOP could ever dream of oppressing?

    Apparently it is.

    I think Watree assumes that being a Republican and being a conservative are on in the same in the USA circa 2009. He couldn’t be more wrong though.

    In fact, a large part of the reason Obama won, aside from the novelty of his skin color, the antipathy toward Bush, the Acorn fraud and the illegal alien vote, was conservatives abandoning John McCain and the GOP.

    Many conservatives were greatly dismayed by Bush’s spending and Mcamnesty the Maverick’s positions on a whole host of issues and the GOP paid dearly for it.

    I’m hoping that they got the message and will now do whatever it takes to prevetn Barry and Pelosi from turning us into France West.

    “When the people fear their government, there is tyranny; when the government fears the people, there is liberty.”

    We all need to work harder to install fear in those on both sides of the aisle in Washington.

  • http://blogcritics.org/writers/christine-lakatos/ Christine

    Wow, that is one of the calmest comments by Arch! And Zing, you are right we all need to calm down and that includes refraining from accusing the other side of being “hitler” and likened to Al-Qaeda. Both sides have their corruption, greed and extremists, yet having the good of each side balances out our country. A good thing.

    Wattree, I tried to get access to that article…”page not found”.

  • http://marksaleski.com Mark Saleski

    I’ll leave others to take you to task for your heinous bigotry and ridiculous hyperbole.

    happy irony day everybody!

  • Arch Conservative

    I don’t see where Christine called or even compared Obama to Hitler zing.

    I did however See Silas comparing the GOP to Hitler.

    The way I see it Obama is not Hitler..he’s more of a pathetic skinny, Chavez wannabe.

  • http://jetspolitics.blogspot.com/ Jet Gardner

    Am I the only one who sees clearly that if you argue with Arch [gross and insulting expletive deleted by me] Conservative, you are validating his opinions disguised badly as fact?

    To argue with him/it is to argue with a brick wall and just as productive.

  • http://blogcritics.org/writers/christine-lakatos/ Christine

    Thanks Arch, in fact in a few of my articles I condemned the “hitler” signs coming from some of the Tea party events. And even condemned it here too on this thread!

  • http://www.republicofdave.com Dave Nalle

    Wattree, your link to your other article doesn’t work. But if you are redefining conservative or Republican you might want to do that in the article itself, as it’s very confusing.

    Dave

  • Arch Conservative

    Don’t beat around the bush jet?

    Which opinion did I badly disguise as fact?

  • http://jetspolitics.blogspot.com/ Jet Gardner

    To respond would be to validate you… sorry… no

  • http://jetspolitics.blogspot.com/ Jet Gardner

    Wattree has confused Dave Nalle, I’ll have to mark my calendar!

  • Arch Conservative

    Not that you’d care Jet but I’m watching CSPAN now and all the Democrat ugly cow women are lined up before the mic to cheerlead abortion.

    Where’s Michelle Bachman? The debate would go by a lot quicker with a little eye candy.

  • http://jetspolitics.blogspot.com/ Jet Gardner

    Dear God; Arch capitalized the “J” in Jet this time. Are you going soft on me?

  • http://jetspolitics.blogspot.com/ Jet Gardner

    Let me rephrase that…

  • http://jetspolitics.blogspot.com/ Jet Gardner

    I have a very workable solution to abortion Arch… shoot your dick!

  • Glenn Contrarian

    Funny how whenever someone compares the conservatives’ words and actions to the Nazis (regardless of the accuracy of the comparison), Dave comes up with “That’s a violation of Godwin’s Law!”

    But do we see any such condemnation by him of the almost DAILY “Obama’s like Hitler!” accusations by the Republicans and the conservtive pundits?

    Nope. Not once.

  • http://jetspolitics.blogspot.com/ Jet Gardner

    “A liberal is a person who believes that water can be made to run uphill. A conservative is someone who believes everybody should pay for his water. I’m somewhere in between: I believe water should be free, but that water flows downhill.”

    -Theodore White

  • Glenn Contrarian

    Arch says Not that you’d care Jet but I’m watching CSPAN now and all the Democrat ugly cow women are lined up before the mic to cheerlead abortion.

    I guess someone needs to let Natalie Portman and Angelina Jolie know that they’re “ugly cow women”.

    Man, what an EFFECTIVE political argument: “Their women are ugly!”

  • http://jetspolitics.blogspot.com/ Jet Gardner

    Therefore only sexy women are capable of passing good and worthwhile legislation…

    what is the world coming to?

  • http://wattree.blogspot.com Wattree

    Okay, Dave. Let’s try it this way:

    Limbaugh-Beck and the GOP Patriots Against America

    If anyone had any doubt about whether or not the GOP has become anti-American, all doubt should now be laid to rest. Rush Limbaugh, the titular head of the Republican Party, slipped into an altered state of bliss after hearing the news that the United States lost its bid for the 2016 Summer Olympics. The man was completely beside himself with glee. God only knows what would have happened if we’d also been attacked – his body fluids would’ve had to be cleaned off the studio floor. I watched the video of Limbaugh’s antics over and over again in total disbelief. It’s literally unbelievable what’s happened to the Republican Party.

    This man is not a true Republican, and comes nowhere close to representing conservative values. No true conservative would celebrate an American loss of anything, no matter what the competition, who we were competing against, or what the circumstances were surrounding the competition. You can say what you want about the Republican Party and conservatism, and I’ve said a lot of mean things, but a true conservative ALWAYS comes to the defense of America.

    For those progressives who are too young to understand my breaking ranks to come to the defense of conservatism, it’s important to understand that as a baby boomer I know and understand the conservative mind-set, because as baby boomers we all started out raised as conservatives – society was geared that way.

    For baby boomers, the first thing we did when we arrived at school was to recite the pledge of allegiance; the second thing was to recite the Lord’s Prayer. Then after the Lord’s Prayer it was social studies, where we learned that America never loses, has never done anything wrong, and anyone who said differently was evil. That’s conservatism, and I believed every syllable until I became old enough to start thinking for myself.

    During the fifties all children were raised with the very same values. So just like any other child in America, I pulled for the cowboys against the Indians, and rode with John Wayne as we single-handedly went about slaughtering the bad guys – which was anyone who didn’t happen to look, think, or act like us. And as I looked up at the screen, even as a Black child, I was completely convinced that I was a part of “us.” It was only later in life that I began to recognize that I represented “them.”

    It was only due to the shock of that recognition that many of us became progressives. We made it our mission in life to turn the conservative myth of America into a reality. So the difference between true conservatives (as oppose to racists) and progressives wasn’t a disagreement over the American ideal, but whether or not that ideal was a reality for all.

    So I throughly understand the conservative mind-set – been there, done that. Conservatives can be insensitive, and in my opinion, delusional about what America represents, but the Republican Party has always been fiercely patriotic. So I can say without hesitation that Limbaugh, Beck, and these current batch of demagogues who currently run the GOP are definitely NOT true conservatives, or conservatives of any definition.

    There was a time when a Dick Cheney wouldn’t have even been able to work as a gofer in the Republican Party. A true conservative would’ve never put up with a man who took five deferments to avoid defending this nation, then publically admit that he didn’t serve this country because “I had other priorities.” Yet, in today’s Republican Party he was able to make that statement with total impunity, even as he lectured America on patriotism.

    No, that’s not the GOP I knew. A true conservative would never have tolerated such a man – a man who moved hell and Earth to avoid his own servce, now wants to teach us how to protect America. Such a man would never have been allowed to carry the Republican banner.

    Can anyone imagine Cheney telling General Eisenhower that I didn’t defend my country because “I had other priorities”? Ike would have told him in no uncertain terms that there ARE no priorities more important than serving your country. And there’s absolutely no doubt in my mind that if Ike had been president, Cheney would have been unceremoniously shot for outing a CIA agent.

    Ike was both a true conservative, and a true American. He had an unwavering set of convictions that didn’t vary as the wind blows, and more importantly, he had the courage of those convictions. Unlike Beck, or Rush Limbaugh who avoided serving this country by claiming a boil on his ass, Ike was the kind of man that one could have serious disagreements with, but still feel compelled to call him sir.

    Ike said that he understood these people, because he helped to create the military/industrial complex in an effort to mobilze America during WWII. But as one of his last acts in office he warned America to keep its eye on them, because their greed could become a threat to both America, and the world. Thus,Ike anticipated Cheney’s corrupt disregard for America and the world, long before the Cheneys and Limbaughs seized control of the Republican Party.

    So am I smply indulging in hyperbole? Think about it. Is there anyone who was alive during the fifties and sixties who believe that conservatives would allow the Republican Party to be taken over by draft dodgers, and worse yet, allow draft dodgers to send our troops to a senseless death? I don’t think so.

    Even as a progressive, as a former marine I think I’m safe in going on record for Ike and every American in Arlington Cemetery as saying that it is unforgivable that America let our young troops and their families down like we did. We let this bunch of demagogues send these young people to an untimely grave. And for what? The horrible, and inescapable facts are, they died for no other reason than to enrich a bunch of cronies who made it a point to not only avoid their own military service, but made very sure that their children avoided any harm as well.

    Conservatives? No, I don’t think so. These are a bunch of conspirators against America who used the nation’s pain over 911 to victimize this nation and accommodate their own greed. Like the vultures they are, they decided not to let a good crisis go to waste.

    And they knew exactly what they were doing. As the bodies of our brave young troops were carried off the battlefield, they were honored in secret, because the dishonorable men who sent them to their deaths didn’t want America to see the true price of their vulturous greed. For if these young people did indeed die for this country instead of simple greed, where were the bodies of the sons and daughters of those who sent them? Aren’t they also patriots, and don’t they also love this country? Oh, Of course they do, but their job is to luxuriate in the lobbies of the nation’s country clubs, paying lip service to patriotims, and drinking martini toasts the brave sacrifice of all the little dead people.

    Where is Liz Cheney? She’s all over the media these days claiming how much she loves America. Can’t she drive a truck? If she can’t, I’m sure the marines would be more than happy to teach her.

    So does this batch of GOP scoundrels truly love America? Let’s take a look at that through a simple analogy. For the sake of this discussion, let’s think of America as a football team. Suppose a member of our team didn’t like the coach and was angered because he had to ride the bench during the Super Bowl. What would you think of him if he started openly pulling for the other team, then once our team lost, he ran out on the field and started dancing and celebrating? Could he ever convince you that in spite of his actions, he loved our team? I don’t think so.

    Well, that’s exactly what’s taking place in America with Limbaugh, Beck, and all of their new-and-revised Republican colleagues. So as progressives, we should stop referring to these insurrectionist turncoats as conservatives, because by doing so we do a gross disservice to a long and honorable tradition, and a LOYAL opposition – even though we may seriously disagree with the tenets of that tradition.

    If these neo-fascists were truly representative of conservative thought, Barack Obama would not be in office today. Let there be no doubt about it. This man was not elected by progressives alone.

    Eric L. Wattree
    wattree.blogspot.com

    Religious bigotry: It’s not that I hate everyone who doesn’t look, think, and act like me – it’s just that God does.

  • http://jetspolitics.blogspot.com/ Jet Gardner

    It is often argued that religion is valuable because it makes men good, but even if this were true it would not be a proof that religion is true. That would be an extension of pragmatism beyond endurance. Santa Claus makes children good in precisely the same way, and yet no one would argue seriously that the fact proves his existence. The defense of religion is full of such logical imbecilities.

    H.L. Mencken

  • Arch Conservative

    “Can anyone imagine Cheney telling General Eisenhower that I didn’t defend my country because “I had other priorities”?”

    You have a point but then could you imagine a modern day ACLU loving lefty telling FDR that he couldn’t recite a prayer during his radio address on the eve of D-day becuase it would be politically incorrect?

  • http://www.thecobraslair.com Cobra

    Arch Conservative writes:

    “Is it possible that a black man could so wholeheartedly support the Democrat party, which has, through welfare, oppressed more black Americans than the GOP could ever dream of oppressing?”

    Since there are more WHITES on welfare than Blacks, and more WHITES on total government assistance than the ENTIRE African-American population, do you consider WHITES to be oppressed?

    This is more specious GOP rhetoric.

    –Cobra

  • Arch Conservative

    No it’s a fact Cobra.

    Welfare creates government dependency and discourages self sufficiency.

    It’s plain to see which you value more.

  • http://jetspolitics.blogspot.com/ Jet Gardner

    A conservative is a man with two perfectly good legs who, however, has never learned how to walk forward.

    Franklin D. Roosevelt

  • Clavos

    @ 1-41:

    yawn

  • Clavos

    make that 1-42…

  • http://jetspolitics.blogspot.com/ Jet Gardner

    Clavos, my father always taught me that intelligent people never get bored.

  • Glenn Contrarian

    Arch –

    Welfare creates government dependency and discourages self sufficiency.

    I guess that’s why every country that has a higher standard of living than America also has a much stronger social net, such as universal health care and their local versions of welfare, than America.

    Which do we believe – Arch’s rhetoric? Or the success of the countries doing what Arch thinks results in poverty for all?

  • http://wattree.blogspot.com Wattree

    “You have a point but then could you imagine a modern day ACLU loving lefty telling FDR that he couldn’t recite a prayer during his radio address on the eve of D-day becuase it would be politically incorrect?”

    Irrelevant. Whether or not a prayer should be recited entails a philosophical difference on the meaning of a constitutional prohbition. Where stating that one had “other priorities” above serving one’s country then lying to send other people’s kids to die in a war for profit is not only immoral, illegal and hypocritical, but cowardly. So we’re talking about apples and demagogues.

  • Arch Conservative

    “I guess that’s why every country that has a higher standard of living than America also has a much stronger social net, such as universal health care and their local versions of welfare, than America.”

    I guess that’s why more people emigrate to America than any other nation on earth and far far more people come here to live their lives than leave here to go live somewhere else.

  • Arch Conservative

    No it’s not irrelevant Wattree. You claim to seek the truth but you’re only concerned with extremism on the right while wholly ignoring the extremism on the left. You’re just another ordinary, run of the mill leftist hack.

    Congratulations.

  • http://jetspolitics.blogspot.com/ Jet Gardner

    America was a great nation before we had 12 years of republican control of the congress and 8 years of George Bush. Most imigrants don’t know that and assume we are still the land of the free and home of plenty.

    Of course it’s all Obama’s fault for not instantly fixing 12 years worth of damage to the economy and job market the moment he took office

  • http://jetspolitics.blogspot.com/ Jet Gardner

    With the reliable Fox news broadcasting around the world that Obama in the space of only 10 months has ruined the economy, has death squads looking for sick old people and he’s destroying billions of jobs a year; why would anyone want to come here?

  • Arch Conservative

    1/20/13 Jet. I already bought the champagne.

    The end of a very bad joke.

  • http://jetspolitics.blogspot.com/ Jet Gardner

    You’re right Sara Palin at the top of the ticket would be a bad joke

  • http://jetspolitics.blogspot.com/ Jet Gardner

    Besides cheap champainge turns to vinegar after a couple of years… look at the stuff you bought to toast 2009 back in 2007!

  • http://wattree.blogspot.com Wattree

    “Welfare creates government dependency and discourages self sufficiency.”

    Does that go for corporate welfare as well? And besides that, if you experienced the level of discrimination that many black people must endure, you probably wouldn’t survive – even with welfare.

    Thus,whenever you confront a Black person that’s on the same economic level as yourself, chances are, you’re not confronting a peer, you’re confronting a person whose intellect and/or perseverance had to be superior to your own, considering what he or she had to do to get there.

    Maybe you should think about that since you choose to equate welfare with Black people. And also remember this – every experience in life, whether positive or negative, is a source of knowledge. Thus, all of the hardships that Black people have endured in their effort to survive in this society makes them more, rather than less.

    That’s one of the true reasons that the Republicans hate Obama. He was supposed to be inferior, but now that he’s making them look like incompetent fools, they’re desperate to bring him down. But they need to get used to it, because Barack Obama is not just an aborration.

    But that said, I want to make it clear that I’m not implying that one group of people are in anyway innately superior to any other group, but it is a law of nature that when any natural entity if faced with extrodinary challenges, nature provides that entity with extrodinary coping skills in order to survive.

    Now all I have to do is get Black youth to understand that concept, so they’ll understand the importance of developing those skills.

  • Arch Conservative

    You’re right Wattree…by virtue of being born a white male I have never had to deal any adversity or difficulty in my life. I was of course, born with a silver spoon in my mouth, and had everything given to me while I did everything I could every minute of every day to kepp the black man down.

    The more you write the bigger the caricature you become Wattree.

    I didn’t equate welfare with black people. I equated welfare with being one of, if not the biggest obstacle for black people to get ahead in life.

    As someone else on this thread pointed out though it’s not just black people but white people who receive welfare. Welfare, as we have seen in this nation has had as it’s main consequence, the creation of complete and total dependency upon the government regardless of the race, sex, or color of the recipient.

    And how exactly is Obama making anyone look like fools? it seems he is looking like the fool when he sets deadlines for health care reform and they come and go with no success, or when he begins his comments addressing the massacre of soldiers by giving shoutouts.

    He’s not just an aborration? You’re right, he’s not. We’ve been seeing useless, big government liberals for the past 40 years.

    I hope you’re still around in 2010 after the midterms Wattree. Then we will see how great your messiah is.

  • Clavos

    Clavos, my father always taught me that intelligent people never get bored.

    I get bored a lot, Jet.

    Draw your own conclusions…

  • Glenn Contrarian

    Arch –

    I didn’t equate welfare with black people. I equated welfare with being one of, if not the biggest obstacle for black people to get ahead in life.

    Is that so? How’s the standard of life for blacks now as compared to before LBJ’s “Great Society”? What’s the proportion of those on welfare/food stamps now as compared to the decade after welfare and food stamps became available?

    My mother and I were once on food stamps. We hated it. If you’ll do something different and ASK the blacks who are on welfare and food stamps, you’ll probably find they hate it too, that they’d MUCH rather have a good job.

    But that goes against your prejudice against so-called “socialist ideals”, and we all know how much you like to protect your prejudices.

  • zingzing

    archie: “I don’t see where Christine called or even compared Obama to Hitler zing.”

    and i don’t see where i said she did. extrapolate… extrapolate… i know you can do it.

  • http://www.thecobraslair.com Cobra

    Arch Conservative writes:

    “Welfare creates government dependency and discourages self sufficiency.”

    ..then Arch Conservative writes:

    “As someone else on this thread pointed out though it’s not just black people but white people who receive welfare. Welfare, as we have seen in this nation has had as it’s main consequence, the creation of complete and total dependency upon the government regardless of the race, sex, or color of the recipient.”

    Oh boy. More Right Winged Conservative Mythology. Here are the FACTS:

    “A prevalent welfare myth is that women who received AFDC became permanently dependent on public assistance. Analyses indicate that 56 percent of AFDC support ended within 12 months, 70 percent within 24 months, and almost 85 percent within 4 years (Staff of House Committee on Ways and Means, 1996). These exit rates clearly contradict the widespread myth that AFDC recipients wanted to remain on public assistance or that welfare dependency was permanent.”

    Arch Conservative writes:

    “It’s plain to see which you value more.”

    LOL! I value children being fed, clothed and sheltered. Again–the FACTS:

    “Children, not women, are the largest group of people receiving public assistance. Less than 5 million of the 14 million public assistance recipients are adults, and 90 percent of those adults are women (U.S. Bureau of Census, 1995).”

    Tell me, Arch Conservative–is your platform REALLY for snatching food from babies and kicking single mothers and their children out into the street? That would be the result if your anti-welfare rhetoric ever came to fruition.

    The IRONY of this mini-discussion is that MOST of the time, the conservatives I converse with have absolutely no CONCEPT or PROBLEM with government subsidizing CORPORATIONS & the WEALTHY…

    ” The actual cost of welfare programs-about 1 percent of the federal budget and 2 percent of state budgets (McLaughlin, 1997)-is proportionally less than generally believed. During the 104th Congress, more than 93 percent of the budget reductions in welfare entitlements came from programs for low-income people (Center on Budget and Policy Priorities, 1996). Ironically, middle-class and wealthy Americans also receive “welfare” in the form of tax deductions for home mortgages, corporate and farm subsidies, capital gains tax limits, Social Security, Medicare, and a multitude of other tax benefits.”

    Yeah, not to mention DEFENSE CONTRACTORS, which soak up a large chunk of the 20% of the Federal Budget devoted to the Defense Department.

    That’s not as sexy to complain about, as opposed to poor single mothers and their children…but right wingers do it anyway.

    Shameful.

    –Cobra

  • Clavos

    Yeah, not to mention DEFENSE CONTRACTORS, which soak up a large chunk of the 20% of the Federal Budget devoted to the Defense Department.

    Well, since defense contractors are the Defense Department’s suppliers, that makes sense.

    Now the 20% is another matter. If I were in charge, the military would be withdrawn from every overseas assignment, including the wars, and then 75% would be laid off. The remaining 25% would be put to work repairing the infrastructure.

    We don’t need a military anymore; all we have to do is stop stepping on the Third World and they’ll all leave us alone.

    Take the money currently being spent on defense and give it as foreign aid to Third World countries, especially those most opposed to us.

    Buy ‘em off.

  • http://wattree.blogspot.com Wattree

    Arch,

    “You’re right Wattree…by virtue of being born a white male I have never had to deal any adversity or difficulty in my life. I was of course, born with a silver spoon in my mouth, and had everything given to me while I did everything I could every minute of every day to kepp the black man down.”

    In pursuit of intellectual honesty, please quote where I said any of the above. I don’t recall saying any of that. But of course, I must be mistaken, because as an honorable and God fearing conservative, I’m sure you wouldn’t resort to the dishonest practice of twisting my words to build a strawman and mount a specious argument. That would support my thesis of the disingenuous nature of the Republican mindset.

    Hmmm, by virtue of his being born a white male he has never had to deal any adversity.
    Wow, I just can’t believe that I was dumb enough to say something like that. It’s unforgivable – not to mention racist. But I’m sure he wouldn’t lie.

    I’ll be awaiting the quotation, and let me apologize in advance for saying something so stupid.

  • Arch Conservative

    No quotation, just a post dripping with implications.

    “Thus,whenever you confront a Black person that’s on the same economic level as yourself, chances are, you’re not confronting a peer, you’re confronting a person whose intellect and/or perseverance had to be superior to your own, considering what he or she had to do to get there.”

    Any reasonable person would conclude that the author of that comment believes whomever they were addressing had never faced any real difficulty or diversity in life.

  • Glenn Contrarian

    Arch –

    Maybe you’ve seen hard times, but by virtue of you being a white male being born and raised in America, it is unlikely that you have a real comprehension of what it is like to grow up as a non-white male in America.

    I do have some of this comprehension…but my situation is extremely uncommon.

    Your own statements show you are one of the vast majority of white males who do not have this comprehension.

  • http://jetspolitics.blogspot.com/ Jet Gardner

    …and most likely never will

  • http://ruvysroost.blogspot.com Ruvy

    Let’s see…. The “blessed of Hussein” wants to delegitimize Fox News – and this wonderful guy wants to outlaw the GOP.

    That works out to Fascism to me.

    Wattree, it has happened there – and you are just another symptom of it – an itty bitty hakenkreuz amongst a whole slew of hakenkreuzer.

  • zingzing

    who wants to oulaw the gop?

    and fox news delegitimizes itself.

    how do you define fascism? because it does have a definition.

  • http://delibernation.com/blog/3 Silas Kain

    “Is the GOP, then, worse than hitler and al Qaeada? Wow, that is quite an indictment. Need I say more?”

    In a word, YES. Under the current “leadership” I find scant difference between them and Hitler, Mussolini or Torquemada. They legitimize themselves by parading around under the banner of Judeo-Christian values while employing tactics that Adolph and Benito used.

    Unfortunately the current GOP leadership has no interest in beating swords into plowshares, rather they would beat swords into coat hangers so that back room abortions will once again be the only option available. This is not the Republican Party I joined with enthusiasm in 1980. It has become an archaic institution which produces leaders like the artificially tanned John Boehner, the effeminate Eric Cantor and, of course, my favorite Pretty Boy Ricki-Lee Perry who will beat Kay Bailey because of the press opportunities he’s taking advantage of during Fort Hood.

  • http://delibernation.com/blog/3 Silas Kain

    During the fifties all children were raised with the very same values.

    Wow, I almost went into convulsions on that one. Children in the 50’s weren’t raised with “values” — they were trained to believe that “white lies” were OK; that Catholic priests were never inappropriate; and that when they were sexually abused by family members they were told it must have been something they did or it was swept under the rug completely. Those were the days of McCarthy, anti-Communist rhetoric and rampant racism in the shadows of World War II’s victories which could never have been accomplished without the help of African Americans. The insanity of the 50’s led to our own cultural revolution in the 60’s which is ongoing.

  • http://wattree.blogspot.com Wattree

    Silas,

    That was exactly my point – that we were all raised with the “Stepford Wives” mentality of conservatives. Therefore, most baby boomer progressives understand conservatives much better than conservatives understand progressives. Because we’ve been there, done that.

  • http://www.maskedmoviesnobs.com El Bicho

    “it is unlikely that you have a real comprehension”

    He makes that apparent in most discussions

  • http://wattree.blogspot.com Wattree

    Ruvy,

    “Let’s see…. The “blessed of Hussein” wants to delegitimize Fox News – and this wonderful guy wants to outlaw the GOP.”

    You just done the very same thing that Arch did earlier – mischaracterized what I’ve said, and my intent. What, is miscomprehension some kind of conservative disability, or is building specious arguments the only way that you can justify your position?

    First of all, Fox NEWS is a misnomer. The GOP Department of Propaganda. And I didn’t say I wanted to outlaw the GOP. I said the GOP are outlaws, and they are – literally. In fact, murders.

    They murdered over 4000 American troops for profit, violated the Geneva Convention, committed treason by revealing the identy of an American agent, committed perjury before congress, and defrauded the American taxpayer. Shall I go on?

  • http://jetspolitics.blogspot.com/ Jet Gardner

    Fox News in an entertainment network, not a news network. Oh it started out as one, but then MTV used to be 24-hour music didn’t it, but they still have the word “music” in their name.

  • http://ruvysroost.blogspot.com Ruvy

    Wattree,

    is miscomprehension some kind of conservative disability, or is building specious arguments the only way that you can justify your position?

    I’m not a conservative, I’m a socialist. Let’s be clear about that. I’m not some new left piece of shit (you got enough of that stink in America’s “czardom” and its “groves of academe”) – I’m a socialist who has only contempt for the United States government. And if you view the GOP as outlaws or as murderers, than saying you want to see them banned is not only not a mischaracterization, it’s a compliment to your moral sensibilities – such as they may be or such as they may even exist.

    Oh, by the way, I’m an Israeli, not an American, and bluntly put, the cowardice and vacillation of the United States, in addition to the pathological Jew-hatred of its State Department and FBI puts your government in the toilet, so far as I’m concerned, right next to the huge pile of shit – the single mafia-like organization that poses as two political parties in your country.

    It’s a tad late, here; if I had the patience, I’d go into a long denunciation of the United Soviet States of America, a country that is not only the biggest debtor country, but also the biggest betrayer of its allies. Had I more energy, I’d be overjoyed to continue, but more important things have to come first – like sleep.

  • Glenn Contrarian

    Wattree –

    That was exactly my point – that we were all raised with the “Stepford Wives” mentality of conservatives. Therefore, most baby boomer progressives understand conservatives much better than conservatives understand progressives. Because we’ve been there, done that.

    AMEN!

  • http://jetspolitics.blogspot.com/ Jet Gardner

    You’ve been reading Winning Friends and Influencing People” again haven’t you Ruvy; I can tell?

  • Clavos

    They murdered over 4000 American troops…

    The Dems, yes the Dems, in the persons of JFK and LBJ, were the instigators of the murder of over 58,000 Americans in Vietnam, plus untold numbers of Asians.

    America has been murdering its citizens in stupid wars since the end of WWII, regardless of which party of murderers is in power.

    We need to stop sending our military around the world to murder and be murdered — we don’t need a military like that.

  • Clavos

    Fox News in an entertainment network, not a news network. Oh it started out as one…

    No it didn’t. It started out, was, and is, a revenue generator for Rupert Murdoch (his biggest and best, in fact), nothing more, and it has and will continue to program whatever sells that the law allows.

    And I’m a fan — of Murdoch and of Fox.

  • http://jetspolitics.blogspot.com/ Jet Gardner

    I’d have never have guessed Clavos

  • http://delibernation.com/blog/3 Silas Kain

    Fox News in an entertainment network, not a news network…

    I don’t know about that. I find it to be a result of a brilliant marketing campaign by Murdoch and his henchmen. Murdoch recognized that those of us in the Western world have an insatiable appetite for the sensational. So, they take the news, give it an edge and what you have left is a great advertising medium. Fox News ain’t about news. It’s about revenues. I guess you could say that Fox is a reveNEWS network, along with MSNBC. The reason CNN’s ratings are dwindling is because they’ve tried to steer clear of the Murdochian paradigm.

    The only Fox broadcaster I can watch is Shep Smith — and, unfortunately, if he came out of the closet Fox would dump him. I used to like Bill Hemmer when he was at CNN and once he went to Fox his Roman Catholic plumage strutted out more than a proud peacock. Folks, if you want real news, watch BBC, go the the AlJazeera website or other European news agencies.

  • Kayne East by about 10°

    Hey! Whats all this Obama not born in Amarica business? Kenya isn’t America? Maybe not YET! 51st state b*tch*s. Boo yah.

  • http://jetspolitics.blogspot.com/ Jet Gardner

    An entertainment network tells its key audience things it wants to enjoy and in a way it wants to hear it. A news network tells its audience all of the news.

    Have you ever heard of Fox news telling its audience something it didn’t want to hear in a way it didn’t want to hear it?

    …thought not

    Oh what? the 2008 election? Who do you think encouraged the “birthers” into believing that Obama wasn’t really the president? Who joyously reported that Obama wasn’t really the president when Bush’s idiot appointee as Chief Justice of the supreme court screwed up the Oath of Office; causing him to take it a 2nd time in private just in case some assholes wanted to say he wasn’t really sworn in?

  • http://jetspolitics.blogspot.com/ Jet Gardner

    Come to think of it Fox’s Oreily attempted to assert that the 2nd swearing wasn’t valid because he didn’t swear on the bible the 2nd go around, and he even brought in a “body language” expert to analyse a STILL PHOTO of the swearing to try to prove that Obama didn’t mean it!

    Anyone with ears watching a u-tube of the event would see that Roberts screwed up the oath and Obama unprepared for Roberts’ mistake tried to correct him.

  • http://delibernation.com/blog/3 Silas Kain

    Poor Chief Justice Craig, oh I mean Roberts. Don’t pick on him, Jet. He was and remains to be confused.

  • http://ruvysroost.blogspot.com Ruvy

    Folks, if you want real news, watch BBC, go the the AlJazeera website or other European news agencies.

    If I want the pure Arab ass-kissing version of “the snooze”, I’ll go to the BBC, al-Jazeera and the Euro-trash versions of the MSM. All you are getting is taqqiya, Jet. Do their lies taste good, make you feel better?

  • http://jetspolitics.blogspot.com/ Jet Gardner

    Ruvy, have you considered changing your handle to “Arch Isaeli”?

  • John Wilson

    “The Dems, yes the Dems, in the persons of JFK and LBJ, were the instigators of the murder of over 58,000 Americans in Vietnam, plus untold numbers of Asians.”

    Not the way I remember it.

    25,000 were dead when Nixon took office, the rest of the 58,000 occurred on his watch.

    About 3 million vietnamese died.

  • http://ruvysroost.blogspot.com Ruvy

    Ruvy, have you considered changing your handle to “Arch Israeli”?

    No, Mr. Gardner. I like my handle, just fine. But, from now on, when reading what you write, I consider the sources.

  • http://ruvysroost.blogspot.com Ruvy

    John,

    When you view the Republicans and the Democrats as the different heads of the same mafia monster of politics, you start to look at the other influences over foreign policy in the States.

  • Clavos

    @ #87:

    Notice I said those two were the instigators, it was they who got us involved in that morass in the first place, and for absolutely no good reason — none.

    In the end, it was Nixon who got us out of there, but it was the rich boy from Massachusetts who put us in Vietnam after the French had gotten their asses kicked! And the hayseed bumpkin from Texas who escalated our presence beyond all reason.

  • http://jetspolitics.blogspot.com/ Jet Gardner

    In point of order Clavos, Republican Eisenhower began sending “Consultants” to Vietnam in 1959… Kennedy took office in 1961 and would’ve been viewed as soft on communism had he pulled those that were already there out.

    In 1961 more and more soldiers had to be poured into the region to keep a nation reeling from the McCarthy (of which Bobby was part of) witch hunts for communists happy.

  • http://ruvysroost.blogspot.com Ruvy

    Attention, boys and girls!! [raps the table for order in the house]

    Professor Gardner is now going to lecture us all on the exciting subject of VIETNAM! Let’s all give the prof a hand, boys and girls!

  • http://ruvysroost.blogspot.com Ruvy

    Before the lecture begins, we cut to a commercial from Al-Jazeera, Allah’s news network!

    [man with keffiye looking sincerely into the camera]

    Allahu Akbar!! Kill the Ameriki! Freedom go to hell! Long live the umma!

    [Camera cuts away from the man, now drooling, to flowing Arabic script on screen]

    Watch Al-Jazeera, the News Network from Allah!

  • http://ruvysroost.blogspot.com Ruvy

    And now, directly from Columbus Ohio, in the great United States of America, Professor Jet Garner!

  • http://jetspolitics.blogspot.com/ Jet Gardner

    I think I saw that on Saturday Night Live once.

    he typed with a warm smile.

    Your John Belushi is nearly spot-on!

  • http://jetspolitics.blogspot.com/ Jet Gardner

    Well, since it’s sunday and I seem to have the lecturn:

    “And he shall judge among the nations, and shall rebuke many people: and they shall beat their swords into plowshares, and their spears into pruninghooks: nation shall not lift up sword against nation, neither shall they learn war any more.”

    The Book of Isaiah 2:4

  • http://jetspolitics.blogspot.com/ Jet Gardner

    …and rather than waste my newly discovered doctorate in middle eastern affairs…

    A scorpion came out of the desert to the banks of the Nile, whereupon he accosted a crocodile. “My dear chap,” he said to the crocodile, “could we form an alliance to get to the other side of the Nile?”

    The crocodile answered, “Do you think I am stupid? I would be at your complete mercy. You could sting me and kill me at any time during the crossing.”

    “Of course not,” said the scorpion. “I promise not to sting you, because if I did sting you, I would drown.”

    The crocodile thought for a second and then agreed this made sense and took the scorpion on his back. About midstream, the scorpion became agitated and stung the crocodile.

    As the two were about to go under, the crocodile turned to the scorpion and said, “Now we will both die. What possible explanation or logic is there for such an act?”

    “There is none,” said the scorpion, “this is the Middle East.

  • http://jetspolitics.blogspot.com/ Jet Gardner

    Bob Dylan had an interesting insight on Israel…

    Well, the neighborhood bully, he’s just one man,
    His enemies say he’s on their land.
    They got him outnumbered about a million to one,
    He got no place to escape to, no place to run.
    He’s the neighborhood bully.

    The neighborhood bully just lives to survive,
    He’s criticized and condemned for being alive.
    He’s not supposed to fight back, he’s supposed to have thick skin,
    He’s supposed to lay down and die when his door is kicked in.
    He’s the neighborhood bully.

    The neighborhood bully been driven out of every land,
    He’s wandered the earth an exiled man.
    Seen his family scattered, his people hounded and torn,
    He’s always on trial for just being born.
    He’s the neighborhood bully.

    Well, he knocked out a lynch mob, he was criticized,
    Old women condemned him, said he should apologize.
    Then he destroyed a bomb factory, nobody was glad.
    The bombs were meant for him.
    He was supposed to feel bad.
    He’s the neighborhood bully.

    Well, the chances are against it and the odds are slim
    That he’ll live by the rules that the world makes for him,
    ‘Cause there’s a noose at his neck and a gun at his back
    And a license to kill him is given out to every maniac.
    He’s the neighborhood bully.

    He got no allies to really speak of.
    What he gets he must pay for, he don’t get it out of love.
    He buys obsolete weapons and he won’t be denied
    But no one sends flesh and blood to fight by his side.
    He’s the neighborhood bully.

    Well, he’s surrounded by pacifists who all want peace,
    They pray for it nightly that the bloodshed must cease.
    Now, they wouldn’t hurt a fly.
    To hurt one they would weep.
    They lay and they wait for this bully to fall asleep.
    He’s the neighborhood bully.

    Every empire that’s enslaved him is gone,
    Egypt and Rome, even the great Babylon.
    He’s made a garden of paradise in the desert sand,
    In bed with nobody, under no one’s command.
    He’s the neighborhood bully.

    Now his holiest books have been trampled upon,
    No contract he signed was worth what it was written on.
    He took the crumbs of the world and he turned it into wealth,
    Took sickness and disease and he turned it into health.
    He’s the neighborhood bully.

    What’s anybody indebted to him for?
    Nothin’, they say.
    He just likes to cause war.
    Pride and prejudice and superstition indeed,
    They wait for this bully like a dog waits to feed.
    He’s the neighborhood bully.

    What has he done to wear so many scars?
    Does he change the course of rivers?
    Does he pollute the moon and stars?
    Neighborhood bully, standing on the hill,
    Running out the clock, time standing still,
    Neighborhood bully.

  • http://jetspolitics.blogspot.com/ Jet Gardner

    In conclusion Ruvy, know this and remember it:
    I’ve been insulted and called a pervert by Americans
    I’ve been beaten and bloodied by Americans
    I’ve been hated, despised and cajoled by Americans
    I’ve been spat on by American bible beaters
    I’ve been lied about and to by Americans
    I’ve even been been told I’m unamerican by Americans

    But there is only so much anti-american bullshit rhetoric I can take before striking back at the source, even from someone whom I consider a good friend.

    I am after all… an American, despite those who would wish otherwise

  • http://jetspolitics.blogspot.com/ Jet Gardner

    96-99 delivered in a calm, measured and patient tone. Sorry if you were expecting hysterics. Maybe next time…

  • http://www.EurocriticsMagazine.com Christopher Rose

    Jet, I’m slightly gobsmacked that you find that Dylan lyric either interesting or an insight. The old whiner is one of the USA’s most over-rated people of all time and this lyric is lazy, trite and superficial.

  • http://ruvysroost.blogspot.com Ruvy

    Chris, that you would find Bob Dylan’s The Neighborhood Bully trite and superficial is no surprise. You have completely forgotten your Jewish roots (such as they are) and have no comprehension of the ancient people who stand alone against the rest of the planet – including you. The old whiner, as you refer to him, was the inspiration for a whole generation of singers and poets, and is a legend in Minnesota.

    I’m not going out of my way to defend the man, nor my own artistic preferences. I’m stating facts. A further factoid for you. I met one of Dylan’s cousins when I taught in a “reform” temple (what Brits call “liberal”). I asked the 13 year old what he thought of his cousin. “He’s a boring old man”, quoth the youth. I had expected to hear something different, but considered the source, and considered how a thirteen year old might view an old whiner from the north of the state, a black sheep in his family.

  • http://ruvysroost.blogspot.com Ruvy

    …there is only so much anti-american bullshit rhetoric I can take before striking back at the source, even from someone whom I consider a good friend.

    I am after all… an American, despite those who would wish otherwise.

    I prefer the measured tone over the hysterics, Jet. It’s easier to respond to. And don’t ever forget what I’m telling you.

    I was born in the United States, and once upon a time, was proud to be an American. My condemnations of America are never delivered with joy. They condemn my own family as well as others; my own family refuses to leave the States – they refuse even to answer me. They will die in the gehenna that will over-take America in not too long when your economy flat-lines. That doesn’t give me any pleasure. But I must face facts coldly, no matter how unpleasant they are.

    When war strikes here, many fellow Israelis will die, and you will see American troops sent here. Pray for the Americans rushed here to “keep order” by a panicked Obama administration – they will surely die, judged in the Valley of G-d’s Judgment in the south of Jerusalem. Let their good deeds speak for them before they die, that they might receive mercy in Judgment.

  • pablo

    Christopher Rose 101

    Thanks for the comment and re-affirming my opinion of you.

  • Clavos

    Oh goody!

    Let’s have a Dylan discussion!

    Here’s my first contribution:

    He can’t sing. Never could, and the older he gets, the worse he sounds.

  • STM

    Dylan?

    The Hand That Signed the Paper, by Dylan Thomas

    The hand that signed the paper felled a city;
    Five sovereign fingers taxed the breath,
    Doubled the globe of dead and halved a country;
    These five kings did a king to death.

    The mighty hand leads to a sloping shoulder,
    The finger joints are cramped with chalk;
    A goose’s quill has put an end to murder
    That put an end to talk.

    The hand that signed the treaty bred a fever,
    And famine grew, and locusts came;
    Great is the hand that holds dominion over
    Man by a scribbled name.

    The five kings count the dead but do not soften
    The crusted wound nor pat the brow;
    A hand rules pity as a hand rules heaven;
    Hands have no tears to flow.

  • Clavos

    Back to Vietnam:

    Jet, the military personnel sent by Ike were very few in number, no more than a relative handful, and were not combat troops, they did not engage in combat. The rich boy tripled the number of troops in 1961, and tripled them again in 1962. LBJ really escalated US involvement: In 1965 he sent 200,000 Americans to Vietnam (I was one of them). Our first significant battle was the battle of Lz Xray – Ia Drang Valley, in November of 1965, the subject of the book,We Were Soldiers Once, And Young, by General Harold Moore. His prologue begins:

    This story is about time and memories. The time was 1965, a different kind of year, a watershed year when one era was ending in America and another was beginning. We felt it then, in the many ways our lives changed so suddenly, so dramatically, and looking back on it from a quarter-century gone we are left in no doubt. It was the year America decided to directly intervene in the Byzantine affairs of obscure and distant South Vietnam. It was the year we went to war. In the broad, traditional sense, that “we” who went to war was all of us, all Americans, though in truth at that time the larger majority had little knowledge, less interest and no great concern with what was beginning so far away.

    @ # 87:

    About 3 million vietnamese died.

    Plus more than 2 million Laotians and Cambodians.

  • http://ruvysroost.blogspot.com Ruvy

    He [Bob Dylan] can’t sing. Never could, and the older he gets, the worse he sounds.

    I agree 100%. But he could write something fabulous, and if someone else wanted to sing the song, fine. A Billy Joel he wasn’t. But he set down in words the essential point about the “neighborhood bully”: we’ve outlasted the Babylonians, the Greeks and the Romans – and we’ll outlast you, too.

  • http://ruvysroost.blogspot.com Ruvy

    A thought for you poor lost Yankee pups: you have a dysfunctional system. How else would you get a choice between a black-skinned, half white, Harvard elitist who thinks just like the white Anglo-Saxon Protestant aristocrats who have been dumbing down America for 7 decades, a fellow trained by a Gramsci radical no less(Obama); and a half senile fool who can’t think two moves ahead of his opponents (McCain)?

    It was dumb luck that this half senile fool settled on Sarah Palin for a running mate. She is the closest thing to a real human being to run for high office since Harry S Truman. And to be blunt, she’d make a great president for you – precisely because she isn’t the product of the overblown shitocracy you have running your country right now. I don’t like her religion, I don’t agree with her ideology, but she’d be running the United States, not Israel, and we are not the 51st state – thank G-d!!!

    Think about it – a dysfunctional system: a president who hasn’t got a clue about governing, an opposition that hasn’t a clue about opposing, a media that has sunken to the level of sycophantic lap-dogs who bite each other, but not the thieves who feed them snippets of news, the politicians who should be their real targets.

    That is what you have, folks. And with each Columbine, with each 9/11, with each army base shooting, with each financial collapse, each fall of morale of the military and the citizenry, it gets worse and worse.

    Mazel tov!!!

  • http://thingsalongtheway.blogspot.com/ Cindy

    Christine,

    This is for you. Hitler vs Stalin

  • Glenn Contrarian

    Ruvy –

    Sarah would be a ‘great president’? When she thought Africa was a country and not a continent, didn’t know how many countries are in North America, and couldn’t name a single one of the newspapers she supposedly read?

    Being ignorant is one thing. But when someone is shown their ignorance (as Ms. Palin was by McCain’s campaign handlers) and does not see the need to decrease one’s ignorance (by learning what she doesn’t know) then that is not someone who should be trusted with a finger on the nuclear trigger.

  • http://thingsalongtheway.blogspot.com/ Cindy

    Her America with the real Americans is the epitome of what is wrong with the world. She’s a very sick human being as well as being superficial a liar and would make a great bully.

    Nobody would make a good president.

  • http://www.EurocriticsMagazine.com Christopher Rose

    Ruvy, if YOU find any fresh insight at all from that Dylan lyric, I would be utterly gobsmacked.

    It’s no surprise that you then go on to bleat about how Israel stands alone and friendless against the world, which would be impressive if it was actually true, but of course it isn’t. You just like to embrace a particularly unattractive blend of boastfulness and self pity.

    You’re also mistaken in your assertion that Dylan “was the inspiration for a whole generation of singers and poets”. I don’t particularly follow US music that closely these days but I don’t know of too many others ploughing his particular furrow. You don’t deal in facts, Ruvy, you deal in fantasies, wish fulfillment and hysteria.

    Pablo, I’m not really interested in your opinions, most of which are prejudices and/or presumptions rather than based on any actual information. Do you know Ruvy?

    Ruvy, take two: you most emphatically do not deal in measured tomes as opposed to hysterics. You might think you do but, if so, that would be yet more of the self-serving mindset you buy into in order to keep justifying your decision to move to Israel. No wonder your own family won’t listen to you anymore.

    Clavos, I’d largely agree with you there. He has made a few good songs over the years and I’ll always be happy that he wrote “All Along The Watchtower” so Jimi Hendrix could cover it, but yeah, if I wanted to listen to a real groaner/poet, give me Leonard Cohen anyday.

    Ruvy, take three: surely if anyone has a dysfunctional political system in your eyes, it is Israel. Don’t you believe they are almost all corrupt or traitors or both?

  • Glenn Contrarian

    Clavos –

    Nixon did pull us out of Vietnam…but do you really think he would have done so if the nation hadn’t been so torn apart by anti-war sentiment?

    But as I’ve said before, the president gets the credit for what happens on his watch – for good or ill. Nixon did a lot of wrong things (he also escalated the war even further, among other things) but in the end he did learn the lesson that history was forcing down his throat, and pulled us out of there.

    Therefore he gets the credit for getting us out of Vietnam – just as he gets the credit for opening up China (which benefit is greater than all his faults combined), but he gets the blame for Watergate and for using the CIA and FBI to spy on Americans that he didn’t like.

  • http://ruvysroost.blogspot.com Ruvy

    But when someone is shown their ignorance (as Ms. Palin was by McCain’s campaign handlers) and does not see the need to decrease one’s ignorance (by learning what she doesn’t know) then that is not someone who should be trusted with a finger on the nuclear trigger.

    You know Glenn, I picked my analogies carefully. Sarah Palin is not the most edumacated broad running around. But, on the other hand, when Truman was stealing money for the Prendergast machine in Missouri, he was not the most edumacated guy around either. When you need to solve a problem, you find out what you need to know, make your decisions and attempt to solve the problem: that is what he did when faced with whether his finger would have to pull the atomic trigger. It didn’t require knowing how many prefectures there were in Japan, or how many countries there were in Asia. That is what advisors are there for. It did require something Truman had – executive experience, and balls.

    Palin was the attack dog kept under a bushel by the McCain campaign, and they messed up her opportunities to score big. Her job wasn’t to be the brilliant, bright lady – her job was to do what McCain could or would not do – tear Obama to shreds. They didn’t let her. Her job was not to be the resident wonk. That is what experts – like Dave Nalle – are for.

    How many countries are in Africa, Dave?

  • http://ruvysroost.blogspot.com Ruvy

    Ruvy, take three: surely if anyone has a dysfunctional political system in your eyes, it is Israel. Don’t you believe they are almost all corrupt or traitors or both?

    After reading several (thousand) of my comments, you seem to have finally gotten the idea. Yes, that is my point of view. But the mere fact that Israel’s politics are nearly dysfunctional does not mean that America’s – or Britain’s, for that matter – are functional. One’s dysfuntionality does not exclude the other.

    Given that Chief Rabbi Sachs of the United Kingdom has excoriated Brits for being too selfish to have children (no low blows aimed at commenters here) it would strike me that more than just the UK’s politics are dysfunctional. But, that is not for me to say.

  • http://jetspolitics.blogspot.com/ Jet Gardner

    Havoc

  • John Wilson

    The US public voted to get out of Vietnam in 1968. That’s why we elected Nixon, who had a “secret plan” instead of Humphrey, who refused to separate himself from LBJ. I guess the secret was that there was no plan.

    The American public had one foot out of Vietnam in 1968. It was the egos and vanities in DC that kept the war going. And Nixon succumbed. The childish notion of “domino theory” mesmerized them all.

  • http://jetspolitics.blogspot.com/ Jet Gardner

    And it took Gerald Ford to selflessly sacrifice his career to accomplish what Nixon couldn’t.

  • http://jetspolitics.blogspot.com/ Jet Gardner

    Republicans are anti war? That should come to the surprise of a lot of Iraqis!

  • http://jetspolitics.blogspot.com/ Jet Gardner

    By the way Mr. Wilson, Nixon was president as long as LBJ was-lest you forget Cambodia?

  • http://www.republicofdave.com Dave Nalle

    Jet, historically the GOP has generally been opposed to war. It’s true.

    The faction in the GOP which promoted our recent wars were all former Democrats.

    Dave

  • http://jetspolitics.blogspot.com/ Jet Gardner

    Bush Sr. & Jr. were both former democrats??? and invaded Iraq because of that?

    It amazes me how the right wing finds it so easy to rewrite history and science to fit their purposes… and can get away with it!

    The pilgrims, George Bush and George Washington were sent by God to start a religious state in the new land.

    The U.S. is falling way behind in Science and Technology because more than a decade’s worth of school kids were taught to believe right-wing religious dogma instead of Science in the classroom.

    The world is only 5000 years old, so there are no stars more that 5000 light years away. Kids that believe that the sun revolves around the Earth! Hurricanes, earthquakes and floods are “acts of God” instead of natural occurances! People that would rather pray at disaster sites than pitch in to help the victims recover!

    People who believe that it’s better to let GOD look over their childred than medicine because medicine is based on science which opposes the teachings of the Bible. Thus children are dying daily because some asshole on the radio said not to get the kids vaccinated even though there’s no difference between the ingredients in a normal flu shot that’s been used for decades and the H1N1 except the strain of DEAD virus that’s used.

    People who firmly believe that what happens in a bedroom hundreds of miles away is going to effect their lives. It is an immoral sin and sodomy for a wife to give her husband oral sex because it doesn’t produce children. People who feel powerless until they discover that they can supress the rights of others as a bandaid for their own helpless egos.

    Jetks like Arch Conservative who maintain that since all members of NAMBLA are homosexuals, then that means that all homosexuals chase little boys… making as much sense as saying most bigots are Republican, therefore all republicans are bigots.

    Obama has to repair a decade and a half of damage in the blink of an eye and if he doesn’t he’s a fascist or a socialist or worse yet a dumb nigger that never should have been elected to office… or at least that what busloads of school children were taught to chant after he was elected.

    …He typed, shaking his head in wonder and sadness.

  • http://jetspolitics.blogspot.com/ Jet Gardner

    “”The faction in the GOP which promoted our recent wars were all former Democrats.””

    Bush Sr was ambasador to China under a republican administration, Bush Jr. was a republican governor of Texas (you know Texas, that place where you live?)

    What fucking history book are you reading? or do you just look at the pictures?

  • Clavos

    Obama has to repair a decade and a half of damage

    So the Clinton administration was destructive?

  • Clavos

    He’s talking about the Neocons, Jet.

    You should know better than to bring a knife to a gun fight.

  • http://ruvysroost.blogspot.com Ruvy

    The faction in the GOP which promoted our recent wars were all former Democrats.

    Dave, guys who talk about having been history professors should not make mistakes like that. Some folks are liable to take you apart like an artichoke….

  • http://jetspolitics.blogspot.com/ Jet Gardner

    No the Republican majority of the U.S. Congress obstructing any kind of progress (like they’re doing now en mass) is responsible.

    They opposed everything Clinton tried to do, and rubberstamped everything Bush did.

    As for “former” Democrats and war-I suppose you forgot Bush Sr. was Reagan’s vice president too?

  • http://jetspolitics.blogspot.com/ Jet Gardner

    –Nixon was elected to get us out of Vietnam… and we spent the next 7 years ther… longer if he hadn’t been forced out of office

    –Neocons are former democrats-former democrats are war-mongers… George Sr got us into Iraq in the first place then fucked up by not taking out Hussein. Bush Jr. made up a bunch of lies-or was stupid enough to believe faulty intelligence to use as an excuse to put the U.S. back in Iraq. Congress went right along with him because we were dumb enough to believe at the time that the President of the United States had the best intelligence in the world, so OF COURSE we BLINDLY believed him.

    In actual face we went there to cover his inept father’s ass, instead of taking out the taliban’s multibillion poppy fields in Afghanistan that were financing the terrorist fight against the U.S.

    Dump enough a bunch of perfume on your shit but it’s still going to smell like shit.

  • http://delibernation.com Silas Kain

    Ruvy, with all due respect, I don’t consider AlJazeera to be the network of Allah. I have found their English website to be a great source of information. While I don’t agree with many of the positions taken by the extremists in Islam, let me once again point out that I don’t like extremism from any faction be it religious or secular. Extremism breeds intolerance, ignorance, fear and war.

    We have had many great prophets in antiquity from Abraham (the father of the three ‘great’ religions), Moses, Jesus and Mohammad (PBUH). Islam and Christianity were born out of political necessity more so than some silly search for salvation. Jesus Christ, the Man, had a message which he delivered to his followers. Somewhere along the way that message was skewed, dissected, sanitized and modified to fit the politics of the time. The same can be said for Islam.

    I’ve had an interesting weekend. I watched that documentary produced by Edward Norton on Barack Obama’s rise to the national stage. I then watched Sean Penn’s brilliant portrayal of Harvey Milk. And in digesting all of this, I watched the debates on the floor of the House. I’m over 50 now and most certainly am closer to the cradle than the grave. It’s not a very happy thought but I came to realize all too well this weekend that life is indeed short and the time each of us spends on this planet is but a blink in the eyes of God. But more on that later once I get my thoughts organized.

    Ruvy, you have descended from a great people and in your observance of your faith you believe, without question, that the Jews continue to be the “chosen people”. That’s OK. Believe what you will. Thew bottom line is that all of us are mere temporary guests upon this round rock. We are born. We live our lives. And we die. What is beyond that finality of death is the question which has eluded us since the dawn of humankind. While we may not question our respective faiths and believe in some type of hereafter, none of us really know for certain do we? In the meantime we must live our lives, find common ground, and try to leave this place a wee bit better than we found it. If each of us just followed that one basic precept, so much could be accomplished in this world.

  • Clavos

    Umm, Silas I think you meant “closer to the grave than the cradle.

  • http://delibernation.com Silas Kain

    I stand corrected, Clavos, and thank you for reminding me of my mortality. Obviously my juxtaposition of words was a subconscious manifestation of my fear of dying. Once I am dead, however, I hope that I’ll have the ability to send word back to you guys from the other side.

  • Clavos

    I’m afraid I’m excessively fixated on mortality these days…

  • http://ruvysroost.blogspot.com Ruvy

    Silas, may you live to be 120, and thus presently be closer to the cradle than the grave.

    I realize that I do not often crack jokes here. But every now and again, I like to crack a joke. This was one of those times.

    Considering the source, al-Jazeera is reasonably informative. I’ve used it and relied on it occasionally. But, it is a Moslem station, and this means that it views itself as the station of Allah. My opinions are irrelevant. Nevertheless, they have had Israelis on their shows and allowed them to argue vehemently in favor of our nationalist positions there.

    But, if someone says he views al-Jazeera as his major source of news (as did Jet), I feel obligated to consider the source and weigh carefully how valid I view his views on matters concerning Israel and the region.

  • http://delibernation.com Silas Kain

    What’s worse — fixation on mortality or oral fixation? I guess excessive or extreme fixation in both cases is counterproductive.

  • http://ruvysroost.blogspot.com Ruvy

    Silas,

    The joke I was referring to had to do with al-Jazeera, not my wishes for your longevity. That may not have been clear.

  • http://delibernation.com Silas Kain

    You were clear, Ruvy, and thank you. Every day is a gift as far as I’m concerned. I should have expired long ago. That being said, I’ll be happy if I get another decade or two as I have yet so much more to do before I depart.

  • http://jetspolitics.blogspot.com/ Jet Gardner

    When in the hell did I even mention al-Jazeera much less say I watched it-which I don’t?

  • http://jetspolitics.blogspot.com/ Jet Gardner

    Ruvy I just did a F3 scan of all comments and the only one mentioning it was you-APOLOGIZE

  • http://jetspolitics.blogspot.com/ Jet Gardner

    The comment you quoted in #85 was made by Silas-not me.

  • http://jetspolitics.blogspot.com/ Jet Gardner

    #134 ‘fess up:
    “But, if someone says he views al-Jazeera as his major source of news (as did Jet),”

  • http://delibernation.com Silas Kain

    I do visit the al-Jazeera website and for that I do not apologize. And, Jet, thank you for your Book of Isaiah reference. I’m going to retool my mantra now:

    …They shall beat their swords into campaign war chests and spears into coat hangers…

  • http://jetspolitics.blogspot.com/ Jet Gardner

    I’m not going at you Silas, and you’re welcome to do whatever you darn well please, but Ruvy directed a bunch of venom at me I didn’t deserve.

    Normally I wouldn’t care, but I like Ruvy, or I did until he became so anti-american

  • http://jetspolitics.blogspot.com/ Jet Gardner

    And clothes hangers in back alleys and infections will what we’ll have do deal with after the antiabortionists have their way.

    Their so concerned with morals until after the girl has the baby, then they could care less.

  • http://delibernation.com Silas Kain

    A few things, Jet. I knew you weren’t going at me. And, like you, I do like Ruvy. What I admire most is his passion. I don’t agree with a lot of it but I understand from where he comes. You, Ruvy and have more in common than not if you look at the struggles each of us have experienced in our lives. I also don’t believe that Ruvy’s as anti-American as he is anti the status quo in diplomacy. We’ve got no business trying to dictate that which occurs in the Middle East. If we kept out of their affairs I honestly believe that Israelis and Arabs alike can come together — especially if they are educated to all the facts without the religious sanitation.

    I am VERY concerned that the abortion battle is about to come front and center in our national discourse once again. And I’ll guarantee this — Republicans and ultra conservatives alike are about to demonize the LGBT movement once again. Fags are a great scapegoat when we want to take focus away from issues that count. While some may be offended by my using the “slang” let me offer comfort. I never used that word very often and found it offensive. And one day a gay friend of mine was like fag this and fag that. I called him out on it and he replied, “Darling, every time I say FAG I am saying Fabulous And Gay!” If it’s good enough for him, it’s damn good enough for me!

    And now let’s digress back to the subject matter of this thread. I honestly wonder how many GOP members of Congress actually believe the swill they spew. They’re just playing to their base because that’s the only way they perpetuate their pipeline to special interest cash. Want to stop the Congressional sellout of the American people? Campaign finance reform and term limits, period. No member of the House should serve more than 5 terms (10 years) and no member of the Senate shall serve more than 2 terms (12 years). It’s time to shake up the seniority system and get the political process more interactive.

    Their so concerned with morals until after the girl has the baby, then they could care less.

    The only time they do care is when they can use it as a weapon of mass distraction. Case in point, John & Cindy McCain’s adopted daughter Bridget. Bush’s machine with Comrade Rove at the helm did a smear campaign in South Carolina back in 2000. It was that smear campaign and the aftermath that caused me to walk away from the GOP. George W. Bush and the team around him don’t care about Republicans or Conservatism. They’re focus is on the politics of fear and their capitalization of the same.

  • http://jetspolitics.blogspot.com/ Jet Gardner

    I agree with everything but term limits Silas, and here’s why. By the time anyone’s elected, it’s time to campaign to be re-elected, which leaves very little time for learning the ropes of how to get significant legislation through.

    Now if there were reform that allowed free TV time to each candidate and covered a lot of the expenses, then it wouldn’t be necessary for politicians to constantly be attending fundraisers instead of doing the people’s business.

    Also if a congressman can gain his constituant’s trust and loyalty, I see no reason why he/she shouldn’t continue to serve as long as they want him/her to.

    Of course that’s only my opinion.

  • http://delibernation.com Silas Kain

    Good points, Jet. I would only go for term limits as long as there was a campaign finance system in place that was publicly funded. We also need to get away from our primary system. To allow states like Iowa and New Hampshire to set the tone for a national campaign is insane. We should have a national primary day in September. The endorsed candidate of each party should have to be in a primary with his/her peers, period. Then we have the general election in November. That’s it, a 10 – 12 week election cycle.

    Term limits are very key, Jet. The system in its current configuration affords lots of centralized power to a few. Several years ago there was a Congressman from Rhode Island that we knew as Freddy St. Germain. He was Chairman of the House Banking Committee, got millions in donations from the banks, and when he was defeated he moved from the poor community in Northern Rhode Island which he represented to the opulence of Newport.

    We don’t elect OUR representatives to Congress so they can come home and move out of our neighborhood. We elect them to represent our interests and insure that our respective district gets a rightful piece of the Federal Creme Pie. We tend to shy away from the truth — it’s the “not my kid” syndrome. It’s always the other guy’s member of Congress and not our own.

  • http://www.republicofdave.com Dave Nalle

    I am VERY concerned that the abortion battle is about to come front and center in our national discourse once again. And I’ll guarantee this — Republicans and ultra conservatives alike are about to demonize the LGBT movement once again.

    Silas, if this is the way things are going to go, I’m going to do everything I can to stop it and to hold accountable those who attempt it. The RLC now has hundreds of people in elected office nationwide and our chapters are growing rapidly. One way or another we’re going to keep the GOP on topic and make politicians pay a price for focusing on distractions instead of real issues. The situation we face is too serious for people to be wasting time on these social and religious issues.

    Dave

  • http://ruvysroost.blogspot.com Ruvy

    I’ll be jiggered! Comment #80 was by Silas and not you, Jet I do humbly apologize. I was wrong. A whole bunch of my comments and perceptions were wrong, therefore. For that too, I apologize, Jet. I can’t unsay what I said. The universe don’t work that way. But I am big enough to admit when I’ve said wrong.

  • http://delibernation.com Silas Kain

    I agree, Dave, and I’m comforted in the fact that you’re going to be one of the folks fighting to keep the GOP on topic. I can smell it in the air up here in Massachusetts. We have a fight about to take place over Ted Kennedy’s seat. None of the Democrat candidates are worth a doggie piss hole in the Alaskan snow while the Republican “alternatives” are just as undesirable. It won’t matter much. Martha Coakley will be elected and she’ll head to Washington. She’ll be as ineffectual as Senator as she is as Attorney General. I’d rather see George W. Bush in the Senate than Martha Coakley and, as a result, I will cast my ballot in the Democrat Primary. Only this voter is writing in his candidate of choice: Victoria Reggie Kennedy.

    Meanwhile, back in the Lone Star state, Dave, what’s shaking in the gubernatorial race? Will Perry be the first president of the Republic of Texas or will Kay Bailey Hutchinson become Governor? Anybody consider digging up Ann Richards?

  • http://ruvysroost.blogspot.com Ruvy

    I also don’t believe that Ruvy’s as anti-American as he is anti the status quo in diplomacy. We’ve got no business trying to dictate that which occurs in the Middle East.

    Someone here gets it clearly. That’s good to see. But, no matter how much I like my former compatriots, there is no getting around the Jew-hatred that infests the State Department, and the FBI. That’s institutional and generational stuff that goes beyond idiots like Bush or Obama to the control exercised at State by the CFR, and the Jew-hatred of J. Edgar Hoover.

  • zingzing

    j. edgar hoover?! for fuck’s sake. do you know what century it is?

    if the state dept hates you so much, why are there so many jews in positions of power here? your logic eats itself and shits and eats its own shit. oh yeah, we put jews in power so that we can shit on them when stuff goes bad, that’s right. jesus.

    it’s clear that the leadership of the united states does NOT hate jews or israel. otherwise we wouldn’t be involved in TWO wars that came about directly because of our backing of israel. (oh, alright, one is a direct result. the other is about oil.) we’re fighting your fucking fight and you accuse us of hating you? you are an ingrate. and it’s a good thing most people aren’t so deluded.

    at least we agree that the us should back the fuck out of the middle east at the earliest opportunity. even if we disagree about the reasons, we do aim for the same end. at least in that part of the goings on in the big old clusterfuck that is your part of the world.

  • http://jetspolitics.blogspot.com/ Jet Gardner

    Dave, unfortunately it is aborttion and homosexuality that is used to scare the ignorant in this country and if the GOP can make them believe that to vote Republican will prevent hoards of little boy recruiting fags and baby killers from chasing their children, that’s how they’ll vote.

    And when those hoards don’t appear, the GOP takes credit for keeping them from the castle gates… but only until the next election.

    I remember when the GOP was for the power of the State instead of a big federal Government, and that Washington stayed out of our lives under them, now they want to sit in our bedrooms, tap our phones and control things they have no right… or need to for that matter.

  • http://delibernation.com Silas Kain

    But, Jet, if the majority of the LGBT community was out in the open and treated with respect how would the ultra-right closet cases be able to hook up with other men? As long as they make gays feel inferior, public mens rest rooms will be open and ready for business. If you haven’t, do yourself a favor and watch Outrage. It’s an eye opening jaunt through the hallowed halls of Washington. After you watch it, tune in to FOX News. As the GOP side marches out for interviews, you will quickly be able to pick out the hypocrites and closet cases. I mean, not fo’ nuthin’ but FOX News is gayer than a bonnet full of parrots!

  • http://delibernation.com Silas Kain

    Here’s one for you: Trust the government? Heck, I’m in the government and I don’t even trust it. You don’t have to believe in your government to be a good American. You just have to believe in your country. – George W. Bush character from Harold & Kumar Escape from Guantanamo.

    Every word is true.

  • http://jetspolitics.blogspot.com/ Jet Gardner

    Sorry but I’m warm for Anderson Cooper on CNN

  • http://jetspolitics.blogspot.com/ Jet Gardner

    “(T)he feminist agenda is not about equal rights for women. It is about a socialist, anti-family political movement that encourages women to leave their husbands, kill their children, practice witchcraft, destroy capitalism and become lesbians.”

    Pat Robertson

  • Glenn Contrarian

    Silas –

    #154 – ROTFLMAO!

    Nice!

  • http://delibernation.com Silas Kain

    FOX News gayer than a bonnet full of parrots? Is that the one, Glenn? That’s OK, the Conservative Congressional Caucus is gayer than Barney Frank at a sausage factory.

  • Neal Mc Clung

    The only comment that I thought needed repeating was this.—-
    “When the people fear their government, there is tyranny; When the government fears the people, there is liberty.”
    This is why our Government was created the way it was from the very beginning and this is why we have our Constitution that was written to protect us from this “tyranny” but now we have so called electorates that think that our “Constitution” Is too old and does not apply to this age so they twist and distort it to fit their own selfish endeavores and desires to aquire the neccessary results such as the “Healthcare plan” and the Government take over of private companies and Banks.
    Isn’t it time for America and Americans to wake up?
    We need conservative independent thinkers and conservative independent leaders to take control over our totally out of control Government and return it to the original concepts of our forfathers— “that this nation, under God, shall have a new birth of freedom — and that government of the people, by the people, for the people, shall not perish from the earth.”

    Thank you