Damn you, Dave Nalle. Damn you to hell with your facts and figures. You don't know how it FEELS being poor. You should have seen me gazing longingly this weekend at a big screen tv on which to watch my Sinead O'Connor and Vanita Smythe video - but no. Thanks to the likes of Dave Nalle, George Bush and the Jew banker conspiracy, I can't afford a good tv or a real iPod.

I WANT. I WANT. I WANT!!!

Al, I knew it was just a matter of time until you went over to the darkside and joined the "Nation of Whiners".

BTW, late last night while driving throughg the rougher part of Austin, I got to watch TV while driving, because I happened to be behind a pimped out cadillac whose open trunk was a fully functioning 52 inch flat-screen TV.

If our local homeboys have the money to spend on silly stuff like that then I'm not too worried about the economy.

Dave

Um, aren't those homeboys making the big buckaroos from the girl toys and chemical toys and coyotes?

Hey, we're Americans, we can whine--even bitch--if we want to.

The fact is that what's whining to the Phil Gramm
"I Got Mine, Screw You" school of economics is, to others, legitimate criticism of the Bush-McCain borrow, spend and waste, falling-dollar economic policies.

Can Gramm say Deficit?

"Hey, we're Americans, we can whine"

Absolutely right - it's what Americans do best these days - crybabys.

""I Got Mine, Screw You" school of economics..."

Not at all what he said, but hey, he's just a Fascist Republican; who cares?

Throughout his time in the Senate Gramm was a dedicated budget hawk. He never would have stood by for the Bush spending excesses.

And Lee, the average consumer is hardly sophisticated enough to make a complex economic protest against the administration. They live in the now, in the low-end version of the 'I've got mine' mentality, even if their 'mine' is less impressive.

Gramm's point is about the media-promulgates misrepresentation of the economic situation as far more dire than it really is, which cuts to the political advantage of whoever offers the most bullshit chicken-in-every pot bribes to the public.

Dave

"I WANT. I WANT. I WANT!!!"

Close but not exactly right Al.

It's more like.....

I'M ENTITLED. I'M ENTITLED. I'M ENTITLED.

If a Democratic administration were presiding over the current economy, failures and policies, Gramm's glasses wouldn't have quite as much of a rosy tint as they do when he's ignoring the mess a Republican admin. is overseeing.

And, ignoring for a moment whether he's hearing whines or yelps from those suffering real pain, it's arrogant, patronizing, and dumb to call people names and beg for their votes at the same time.

I agree that the rest of the country isn't in a recession. However, I invite all of you, including Phil Gramm, to move to Michigan, where you can find yourself in an economic situation bordering depression. And no, it wouldn't be a "psychological" one, it would be damn real.

It's not a coincidence that McCain was in Michigan when he tried to distance himself as much as possible from Gramm's comments.

Dave

The local homeboys? Bitch, please.

Dave,

The truth is the Republicans have made a mess of this nation and dare call the Americans that they have been pretending to cherish for the past two decades, whiners. When we are averaging $500 for gas a month, having to bail out some of our oldest institutions and people are loosing their homes at alarming rates because Republicans told everyone that greed was good... for this rich man to say such a thing is mean and YES it reflects a user's mentality. When Republicans want power they fawn all over the American people, looking for every chance to call any one who doesn't do the same, unpatriotic. When it counts, after they've had more than a good go at things and created a DISASTER, they blame the masses for whining about thier miserable failure. They don't think twice about sending our children off to die on some god forsaken soil on a meaningless mission.

Republican politicians are users, from Regan on to Bush II. It is a party for the suckers among us; the easy to lull and draw into a malaise of championing the non cause and supporting convoluted graphs, mega churches, shoot em up stories, MGM fantasies and smart sound'n stuff. Fools! All for the fulfillment of some rich brats fantasy of being top dog.

Zedd,

This is exactly the sort of diatribe directed against the puny buck-toothed Japs and the vicious barbaric Huns during WWII to stir up a patriotic frenzy against them. That's what we do during a war. The enemy must be dehumanized. Are the Republicans and Democrats currently at war? Somehow, I can't imagine that yours is a persuasive argument any more likely to convince any Republican to vote for a Democratic candidate than it was likely to convince the cowardly and dastardly enemies during WWII to abjure their wicked ways and surrender.

Dan

Truly bigoted and reprehensible, Zedd. I guess I should not have expected any better from you.

Dave

I'm feeling vindicated...

Dan,

The goal was not to convince Republicans to do anything. It was simply a rant and retort. I am exasperated at the ridiculous nature of Newt Republicanism. It is a blatantly manufactured, falsely sentimental, condescending fawn over the masses. Underneath it all is a major disrespect for the American people. The layers of play on the public are sickening. For those who have not gained access to good information, the "trick" has worked and they believe heavily and believe in NOTHING. They are caught up in a revelry over non issues; a non ideology, simply fervor over themselves (being American... neck breaking eye roll). This has proven to be dangerous and we are weaker in many respect for it. The revolution flopped and we are stuck with high food and gas prices and get to be called whiners.

When the chips are down these same fawners dare call Americans whiners, when in fact the public has behaved like troopers. It is the business world that has been whining. The sentiment on the ground is that of pragmatism, readjustment and innovation. Our trains are jammed pack with commuters. Scooters are selling like hot cakes. People are scared. I am.

Dave,

As a single parent who is trying to keep food on the table; who watches the gas needle with trepidation, it is me who finds my former Senator reprehensible. I find it perplexing how you always seem to either ignore the obvious or twist the apparent to fit whatever wishful notion you have. I still wonder how much they pay you for the bad propaganda job.

It seems as if you have victim envy. You clearly don't know what a bigot is.

Clav,

If you've got something to say, do so. Sounding a bit chicken to me. Bring it hombre.

While general cumulative figures for 'the economy' have been up, the rewards for that have disproportionately gone to the execs who have the power to determine where the rewards will go, while people low on the management chain have been getting shortchanged. They haven't been rewarded for their accomplishments.

This has been documented and written about so many times that it's a wonder that anyone still doesn't know about it.

On the other hand, Nalle cheerfully keeps offering stats to show that certain aggregate phenomena are improving, which is hardly surprising since it appears that we are eating our seedcorn while starving our future.

"Clav,

If you've got something to say, do so. Sounding a bit chicken to me. Bring it hombre."

Already have, repeatedly, girl; especially to you. That was my reference.

Damn it, I thought it was my turn to pick on Clavos-That's what I get for missing one staff meeting?

Phil Gramm is frantically bailing water out of the sinking ship of his friends bankrupt administration.

These are politicians who have furiously sought power for their peculiar political ideas and have resorted to every trick and force to get power, and they have succeeded. For the last 14 years the crazy wing of the Republican party has controlled political policy in this country to a breathtaking extent, without equal in our history, as near as I can tell. They achieved power by riding roughshod over better, more capable, men in their own party, and then inflicted this mess on the rest of the country by the same methods.

Now it appears that all their dreams are crashing.

We are engaged in an unending expensive war far from home and without apparent strategic interest. It can't even solve the tactical problem of 9/11 since OBL is still running around and the little pirate tribe of Al Queda is getting stronger as a consequence of our military/political failures.

The economy is tanking as one after another of our stalwart financial institutions falls like some sort of monstrous dominoes collapse, enabled and captained by the Ken Lays celebrated by these cowboys.

So Gramm does what many Generals have done in history: he blames failure on the troops. It's not HIS fault or the fault of his officers corps, it's the fault of the foot soldiers.

Gramm is a coward. He's irresponsible. He is not alone.

How did we come to allow so many irresponsible cowards to dominate our country?

Gramm's training in economics seems to be about as good as Bush's in business. Neither of them have anything to say about the U.S. debt of nearly $10 trillion dollars.

That's on the books. Off the books we have have promised another $50 trillion to be paid in the future--"unfunded liabilities"--a number that has almost doubled in Bush's eight years.

Gramm doesn't want to hear any of us complain about how he and his buddies have cooked the books on us by borrowing everything they could and blowing it all--that's "whining."

But Bush is the compassionate conservative. Remember, he told us once he knew how hard it is to put food on your family.

In #21, to clarify, I was referring to Gramm's lobbying Congress on behalf of UBS in the mortgage crisis, to get more concessions/financing for the industry he's now a part of.

The sentiment on the ground is that of pragmatism, readjustment and innovation. Our trains are jammed pack with commuters. Scooters are selling like hot cakes. People are scared. I am.

Zedd, you are contradictory as always. Are the people pragmatic and innovative or are they scared and panicking? I think you may be avoiding the reality here. You see that most of the people around you are rising to the challenge and being creative to deal with new challenges, but you find yourself panicking for reasons I can't fathom and unable to deal with reality the way that they can.

I see great things happening in this country. I see people reacting to a crisis with intelligence, creativity and resourcefulness. It's not a big crisis, but it's a wakeup jolt of reality. And it's about time Americans woke up and took some control of their lives. Certainly not something to be scared of.

Dave

Dave,

You are being imbecilic as usual. How is being pragmatic in ones fearful state a contradiction?

" I see people reacting to a crisis (WHAT CRISIS??... speaking of contradictions) with intelligence, creativity and resourcefulness."

Let me see if I can recall who just said that..... hmmmmmmmmm.

"in fact the public has behaved like troopers."

"It is the business world that has been whining. The sentiment on the ground is that of pragmatism, readjustment and innovation. Our trains are jammed pack with commuters. Scooters are selling like hot cakes."

Wonder who said that???

If you would kindly do all of us a favor and fight hard to break through that thick plaque of denseness which has obviously crippled your abilities. Fight it Dave.

I am one of multitudes, a person who commutes an hour and 10min every day each way on the train AND..... (drum role) is scared about the economy. I know, you haven't seen that movie yet so its difficult for you to imagine. YES those startling contradictions exist. OMG. Ooooh. Put me in a museum. I can DO one thing while FEELING something else. Clone me. I am a train riding miracle (too hot to walk so I am not a walking miracle...) I am motivated by fear and concern, cautiousness and responsibility. Where is the BBC. Oprah here I come girl!

Also Dave, I don't know if you know that you lie a lot. You just attributed statements to me which I never said. You do that often. Its embarrassing. We call it being disingenuous but its actually lying. I get embarrassed. Stop.


Clav,

Nice dream pequeñito! Hug.

You are being imbecilic as usual. How is being pragmatic in ones fearful state a contradiction?

Fear suggests panic and suggests irrationality. Pragmatism is a rational and considered response.

"It is the business world that has been whining. The sentiment on the ground is that of pragmatism, readjustment and innovation. Our trains are jammed pack with commuters. Scooters are selling like hot cakes."

Wonder who said that???

You did, and it's a direct contradiction of your prior claims that we're in the midst of a disaster and that people are scared. Make up your mind. Are people scared and in the midst of a disaster, or are they dealing with problems and adjusting?

I am one of multitudes, a person who commutes an hour and 10min every day each way on the train AND..... (drum role) is scared about the economy.

Is there a rational basis to your fear. Gas prices are high. Yet you have public transporation available to you, therefore those high gas prices are presumably not harming you. Why are you scared?

I know, you haven't seen that movie yet so its difficult for you to imagine. YES those startling contradictions exist.

No idea what you're talking about here. I commuted by bus for years when gas was cheap. It's a lifestyle choice.

OMG. Ooooh. Put me in a museum. I can DO one thing while FEELING something else. Clone me. I am a train riding miracle (too hot to walk so I am not a walking miracle...) I am motivated by fear and concern, cautiousness and responsibility. Where is the BBC. Oprah here I come girl!

Ok, so what's the problem? What's the "DISASTER"? You're not making any sense.

Also Dave, I don't know if you know that you lie a lot.

Bullshit, and a personal insult. Show me one example.

You just attributed statements to me which I never said. You do that often. Its embarrassing. We call it being disingenuous but its actually lying. I get embarrassed. Stop.

I don't call it anything. I didn't do it. Show me where I attributed anything to you which you didn't say. I used direct quotes from comment #16. And don't dare to say that my interpretation of your hysterical tone was a lie, because your tone of irrational hysteria is clear and manifest to any reader.

If you want a lie, how about your statement the "people are scared" when all you demonstrate is that YOU are apparently scared while other people are coping in more mature ways.

Dave

Fed Chief Bernanke appearing before Congress has said "Families are facing hardships ... this is clearly a rough time," Bernanke said. "It is clear (economic ) growth has been slow and the labor market is weak. So conditions are tough on average families."The Fed chairman told lawmakers the central bank is grappling with "significant" risks that the economy could slow more than expected even as the odds of higher inflation have "intensified."

A year ago, the financial virus seemed confined to subprime mortgages, loans given to those with less-than-perfect credit. Now, much of the banking system appears rickety, and the U.S. economy has slowed to a crawl.“I fear that we're sitting on a financial powder keg,” Bernanke was told by Sen. Richard C. Shelby of Alabama, senior Republican on the Banking Committee.

Administration officials and politicians are the last to admit that there is a problem.Wonder if Dave Nalle lives in some other world with his blame the victim endorsements.

OMG! Stagflation returns!

What next? The resurrection of Richard Nixon?

Dave,

Stop yourself.

Phil Gramm continues to embarrass himself and his unfortunate supporters: now he claims he didn't KNOW that UBS had mortgage securities even though he was vice-chairman. In that he's representative of the New Wave of corporate officers who have no idea of what the underlying business is that they are part of. All they pay attention to is the financial layer of the corp, where they hope to find a bonus opportunity not yet exploited by their predecessors.

Phil Gramm and his cohorts Bill Clinton and Bob Rubin can fairly be held responsible for the current economic catastrophe because they fought vigorously for repeal of the Glass-Seagel act which was passed in 1933 as part of the cure for various business abuses, scams and frauds. Glass-Seagel separated investment banking and commercial banking, thus protecting peoples meager little savings accounts from the vicissitudes of market speculators and, by the way, insuring that federal taxpayer funds would not be used to copper the bets of those same speculators.

Glass-Seagel was repealed in 1999 and investment bankers rubbed their hands together in glee because that meant their careless and risky bets would be backed by the US treasury. What a deal! Even better, they didn't have to pay premiums to the FDIC.

And Gramm claims he's an "Economist"! Where did he get his degree? From some diploma mill in Mexico? The famous Dave/Maurice/Clavos School Of Egregious Bogosity?

A native of Georgia, Gramm holds a B.B.A. and a PhD, both from the University of Georgia.

He taught economics (as a full professor) at Texas A&M University from 1967 to 1978.

Bliff, apparently wherever you got your economics degree they neglected to inform you that it is the Glass-Steagall act, not the Glass-Seagel act. Or maybe only historians remember the names of 70 year old acts correctly.

Dave

"Or maybe only historians remember the names of 70 year old acts correctly."

But only young ones, not yet in the throes of dementia.

Clav,

The demented are deserving of our respect. Where would we be without us them?

Dan (I think)

Looks like I stirred up the family of Jonathon Livingstone Steagall. Woe is me.

University of Georgia? One of my kids has one of those. I've been trying to figure out why she can't get a job.

Phil Gramm and his equally crooked wife Wendy should both be arrested and promptly sent to prison for influence peddling and violating conficts of interest since both used their government jobs to promote the interests of companies they work for.


Slimy icky people

Their actions are simply indefensible.

Bliff, I have to point out that the article you link to actually lays the primary blame for the problems with subprime loans to unqualified recipients on Bill Clinton, not on Phil Gramm. And ultimately 90 senators voted for the bill in question, including a majority of Democrats.

Dave

Bliffle,

You know you've got them when they get nit picky over minutia OR that you are dealing with small minds OR both.

So? I have no love for Bill Clinton.

Nevertheless, Phil Gramm was the prime mover, with able assistance from Bob Ruben, who had a similar interest in aiding a business associate.

So, this is the way it goes: before 1933 and the Glass-Steagall act there was no separation betweeen traditional Savings and Home Loan banks and investment banks, and small investors got screwed by irresponsible investors and a depression resulted, so we separated the two kinds of banks and got out of the depression in 1933, then in 1999 we allowed deposit banks and investment banks to mingle again and now we have another depression coming on.

Can you connect the dots?

What did you learn?

Well argued, Bliffle.