http://blogcritics.org/ A sinister cabal of superior bloggers on music, books, film, popular culture, politics, and technology - updated continuously. en Copyright 2005-2007 by the authors Mon, 1 Dec 2008 13:10:59 EST http://backend.userland.com/rss Blogcritics.org custom software /archives/2008/07/04/111507.php#comment-782972 Alright yall, lets say youre wife is on her way home and gets carjacked. Then suspect decides shes too hot to get away and rapes her, do you keep the child? 2 1/2 months later youre told that if she goes through with the birth her kidneys will die, giving her less than a year to live on dialasis, do you still keep them? Please keep in mind donor lists are YEARS long. Now fast forward to 6 1/2 months later,said child is diagnosed with AIDS, still happy about youre choice? Sounds far-fetched? Its not,every day hundreds of women are raped and left with longer lasting effects than abbortion, like disease and mental illness. Thats not to say abbortion doesnt have a list of side effects as long as my arm, but givin the correct information any and all women are perfectly capable of making an informed, healthy deciscion about there body, child, and life. To "outlaw" abortion is not the way to handle this debate. Information is. 782972@blogcritics.org Mon, 1 Dec 2008 13:10:59 EST /archives/2008/07/04/111507.php#comment-782938 Strike the god comment. But pro-lifers do like to throw that around alot and they need to stop 782938@blogcritics.org Mon, 1 Dec 2008 11:55:05 EST /archives/2008/07/04/111507.php#comment-782936 You know what? Whatever! Obviously you really believe you're right and you are entitled to your opinion. Don't you dare take me missing my BABY as guilt. I did what I had to. All that crap you said as if you been though what I had I don't see anything that actually lead you to a life or death situation. As far as knowing god, I only brought him up because YOU started in with jesus. Also I was raised by a religious fanantic just like you, so I do KNOW about your terroristic beliefs. Yes somewhere in your twisted little brain somehow I'm the terrorist bringing death and destruction, even though I'm not the one who believes that some invisible guy is going to punish me because of some choices I made. I'm by no means saying you shouldn't feel the way you do about abortion but pulling dumb senerios out of your butt and telling people about god is NOT going to get what you want accomplished. I didn't tell the people on this site about my abortion so you(the pro-closed minded) could say "got what you deserved." I'm trying to show you how people like you are actually hurting your own cause. You keep preaching to everyone and no one wants to hear it because you're more worried about the baby they don't want instead of what they're going through, so naturally they don't care what you have to say and the baby will die anyway. It will always remain so as long as pro-lifers keep sticking their noses where they don't belong without first trying to understand why a person feels that that's the option that they have. As much as we as a society try to pretend we've made so much progress, we really haven't. What about the girl that has sex with someone outside of her race and is now afraid her family will disown her? Shelfish? Yes, but it's a real problem that many girls still have to face. What about the girl who was told by some jerk that he'd be there so she leaves everything behind to raise his child only to find out that he's married to some other woman and never intended to help her and her child out at all? This stuff happens everyday and it's easy to sit around and judge when you haven't been through it. I know these women and call us all what you will but this was what we did and somehow we can all be better for it because we KNOW what happens before, during, and after and we can really help people whatever they decide. 782936@blogcritics.org Mon, 1 Dec 2008 11:42:58 EST /archives/2008/07/04/111507.php#comment-780290 #160 Why? On what authority are you basing your argument? It sounds as if you are stating that they are alive and should have rights. Is that correct? Who gives them rights? Embryo cannot verbally speak to request this, so is silence a vote in favor of or against birth? If against, we cease to exist, if for then ALL should be born. Correct? Your logic is so feeble that I hesitate to repsond, but let's see it through shall we. Let's just say your married, and your wife is pregnant. The baby (embryo) cannot audibly speak or gesture in an agreed upon manner for or against birth. What do we do? Please respond... your baby, and millions of others hang in the balance. 780290@blogcritics.org Mon, 24 Nov 2008 13:30:25 EST /archives/2008/07/04/111507.php#comment-777048 Every embryo in the early stages of development within the womb should be aborted unless the embryo itself agrees to be born. No one should be forced into to being born. 777048@blogcritics.org Mon, 17 Nov 2008 12:07:16 EST /archives/2008/07/04/111507.php#comment-777020 Pink Girl, Who's proving who's point? "....you know absolutly nothing about me or my life experience so get off your soap box cause you don't know squat." In one breath you talk about God as if you KNOW Him, but then rail against me because I presume to know you. I guess use it if it works for your argument right? If you read my comments before that was my point exactly...you shouldn't bring God into it if you don't actually want to try and KNOW Him. But I can hear them now, for me when I speak about this topic, it's a soap box, but when you or pro-choicers talk about it...it's passion. I'M not trying to guilt you. Also, don't blame me for things God has said. I simply CHOOSE to believe Him. If you feel guilt that's not MY doing. The tragedy is that you would feel and carry that guilt around for another second when you don't have to. Furthermore, you speak as if you acknowledge that "it" was a "baby". So which is it? I don't doubt that it was a very painful and emotional experience for you, as it should have been. When you speak about "...NOT being able to provide a safe enviroment for that baby" that is a slippery slope. What if my wife and I had a child, and then 6weeks later we got into a horrible accident. My wife dies, and I am a quadrapelegic. I am no longer able to work, or AT ALL provide a safe enviroment for my baby. Can I kill it? That kind of logic to support abortion falls apart before it even gets started. If you are going to have the debate then it must be on "what is life?" Then we can talk about who has the right to do what. 777020@blogcritics.org Mon, 17 Nov 2008 10:34:31 EST /archives/2008/07/04/111507.php#comment-774680 Floyd, Thank you so much for proving my point. You tried to use jesus' CHOICE to insult me but he and god both made a CHOICE. As far as god doing things for me, you know absolutly nothing about me or my life experience so get off your soap box cause you don't know squat. The point i'm trying to get across is that NO ONE has the right to stop anybody from making a decision about what's going on INSIDE their body whether it's alive or not. As far as anyone that says an abortion is like getting a haircut is seriously misguided and anyone who believes that people who get an abortion truely believe that is misinformed. When I had my abortion do you honestly think I believed the counsler that told me that it was just tissue? NO!!! If I believed it was just tissue I wouldn't have cared about the situtation that I was in and exposed that poor child to it. Yes it hurts because I miss my baby, but I know that at the time I was NOT able to provide a safe enviorment for that baby. And if anyone tries to tell me that adoption was an option, one of my own family members became a ward of the state because of abuse and instead of putting her with safe family they put her in a foster home with people who beat and raped her. So I'm not handing my kid over to strager who could very easily fake the process and be an even worse fate than death. 774680@blogcritics.org Thu, 13 Nov 2008 17:27:37 EST /archives/2008/07/04/111507.php#comment-770508 Les, "...disenfranchisement of real people." Who are real people in your opinion? Those that by modern science have been declared "real people"? You sound like a thinking person, so I am genuinely interested to hear what you have to say. 770508@blogcritics.org Thu, 6 Nov 2008 13:06:11 EST /archives/2008/07/04/111507.php#comment-769996 Really relieved, after the last month passed discovering your beautiful colorado state, and listing radio/TV, seeing you have rejected amendment 48. For those who still have regrets : Please dear american cousin, listen your mother, sister, daughter, friends.... and allow her decided -herselseves- what they want to do with their own belly, and their resulting lives. A child must be desired. If after a long thought (and the night are clearly long when it's happened : long time to think) the potential mother (and the "father") doesn't feel in herself the courage to make and educate the child, (and even if it's for you a wrong choice), .....it's HER choice. In every church, you grant forgiveness for the mistakes, and for those who believe in god you're proud of it (I don't believe in old legends, sorry, but I let the others done, if they fell better with), ; But.....why this "mistake" (or drama, in case of rape) should be definetly unforgivable ? Vincent (France) 769996@blogcritics.org Wed, 5 Nov 2008 18:22:53 EST /archives/2008/07/04/111507.php#comment-769916 Floyd, "...Les assumes that if a majority votes to pass something, that immediatley means it is the right thing." We are not talking abstract arguments here. We are talking specifically about an amendment conferring personhood to an undivided cell. The argument does not stand up to any notion of modern science. The sponsors were not able to sell this to a relative well educated population. Your argument put this informed decision in the same category as supporting disenfranchisement of real people. I think you will find a better positive correlation with those that tend to support disenfranchisement and those that backed this amendment. In a long average of things, this has to be seen as a moment of progress and enlightenment. Les 769916@blogcritics.org Wed, 5 Nov 2008 16:29:33 EST /archives/2008/07/04/111507.php#comment-769894 "Take a history lesson (not the bible, it doesn't count) and the try some compassion and not knee-jerk handwringing." #143 - There in lies the real issue. What gives you the authority to say that the Bible doesn't count? Are you a historicity professor? I majored in European history at a secular college. What I discovered is that there are 4 major tests to discover whether or not a document is historically accurate. These tests remember were taught at this institution that for the most part ridiculed me for being a Christian. So you can trust that they weren't trying to make me feel good. Did you know that the Bible has been proven, by those 4 independent tests, to be the most hisorically accurate document ever. This is widely accepted by even most non-Christian historians. So again, why not allow it to get into the debate. Unless, for the obvious reasons. Also, the previous comment by Les assumes that if a majority votes to pass something, that immediatley means it is the right thing. I know that you didn't quite think that through Les, because for a long time the majority didn't let women, or african-americans, vote in this country. So, unless you support that view, which would now put you in the minority, then the majority at that time must have been wrong. So simply because something was not allowed to happen through voting, like the instances I just mentioned, doesn't make it the wrong thing do to. Sometimes it can be quite the opposite. You would agree with that right? #146 - Well God's got it made it's us mortals that have to stuggle day to day with these horrible living conditions... Pink girl let me ask you this. Would you consider someone being hated by his own family, made to wander without a home, being falsely accussed, beaten within an inch of his life, nailed to a cross naked for all to see, stabbed in the side, and then buried with no funeral, not struggling and good living conditions?? Before you talk about God having it made, you should understand what He has done, and continues to do, for you. He knows about the horrible living conditions, He knows about how we all struggle daily. I, personally, had a very difficult childhood (4 different dads, alcholism, abuse, you name it), and I used to look at God and say "where the hell are you man!" Until I fully understood how much He has done for me, and how much He truly loves ALL of us, I felt just like you do. Maybe what I just wrote is just a bunch of foolish trash to you, but I hope not. 769894@blogcritics.org Wed, 5 Nov 2008 16:08:22 EST /archives/2008/07/04/111507.php#comment-769864 OP HERE! AMENDMENT 48 WAS SOUNDLY DEFEATED! Thanks, any of you who happened to live in Colorado. :D 769864@blogcritics.org Wed, 5 Nov 2008 15:44:59 EST /archives/2008/07/04/111507.php#comment-769634 Life, You certainly have a right to your opinions, but Colorado voters rejected the 'embryonic personhood' amendment by a 3 to 1 margin. Les 769634@blogcritics.org Wed, 5 Nov 2008 11:26:37 EST /archives/2008/07/04/111507.php#comment-769620 For those who believe a fetus or embryo isn't a "sentient being" and that the unborn fetus is not a child, watch the video on www.durarealidad.com and tell me what you think. If you really think there is nothing wrong with abortion, then this video won't disturb you any more than "cutting your hair" does. After all, it's "just a clump of cells" like your hair follicles, right? 769620@blogcritics.org Wed, 5 Nov 2008 11:10:29 EST /archives/2008/07/04/111507.php#comment-769570 Less than 1% of abortions are due to rape and incest. Lets kill the rest of the 99% because of the 1%. To me it is unbelievable. I love it that most people that are for this are also against killing animals. Wow, what has this world come to, Lord please help our nation, we do not know what we do. 769570@blogcritics.org Wed, 5 Nov 2008 10:08:17 EST /archives/2008/07/04/111507.php#comment-768942 There's a lot of talk about the abortion spect of this, but what impact will this have on juvenile law? Currently, juveniles cannot legally speak for themselves and are not technically guaranteed the same legal rights as adults. Now you want to give those rights to a fetus? Do you then take them away when the kids reach a certain age or do you completely rework the legal system -- which would involve removing a parent's right to do what he or she feels is in the best interest of the child. Further, I strongly appose abortion, but the fact of the matter is that a fetus simply is not a viable life form until at least 20 weeks. If you remove it from the woman's body it will simply die. Regardless of what you feel the intent for this action may be, remember there is always someone more radical than you... Someone WILL use it to challenge the legality of contraception and quite possibly win depending on how the judge reads the intent. What happens then? People (esp kids) will not simply stop having sex because we want them to. The abstinence only approach has actually seen an INCREASE in teenage sexual activity since the Bush administration imposed it on the schools in 2001. (See the CDC reports) Finally, let's not forget every day each of us kills millions of single celled organisms that CAN exist by themselves why don't we protect them while we're at it? Remember that God made those as well, and loves them too! 768942@blogcritics.org Tue, 4 Nov 2008 20:13:31 EST /archives/2008/07/04/111507.php#comment-768716 I am a christian and I grew up in the church. Almost two months ago my boyfriend and I found out that we were pregnant and decided to have an abortion. It was the right decision for us. I can honestly say that there was no suffering for me. I was at work the next day feeling like I was having regular cramps. If this amendment passes then we are telling women all over Colorado that their views, their opinions, their feelings, and most of all, their rights no longer matter. I was not and am not ready for a kid and with all of the defective foster homes and adoption agencies out there, there was no way that adoption was an option. Honestly, I think that anyone who has never been in a position of having to make that decision has no idea what they believe. In September I did the opposite of what I lived my whole life telling myself I would do and I don't regret making that decision in any way. If you haven't voted yet, please vote no. Let women keep their rights. 768716@blogcritics.org Tue, 4 Nov 2008 16:30:07 EST /archives/2008/07/04/111507.php#comment-768638 Amendment 48 gives Colorado a bad name. I hope black-and-white thinking, 21 year-old Cristy Burton feels just as strongly if she's gang raped by a pack of hoodlums and is forced to bear a child with severe physical and mental disabilities. I hope she is prepared then to stand before everyone with her child in pride. But I doubt it - she'd run off quietly to abort that child straight away. Hypocrites, the whole lot of them! 768638@blogcritics.org Tue, 4 Nov 2008 13:47:54 EST /archives/2008/07/04/111507.php#comment-768552 I am against 48 just because it forces people to do "the right" thing. I know this sounds heartless but if you know you don't want to have a baby you don't want to have a baby. Whatever's on the inside of you is YOUR business and your bussiness alone. In the case of an unborn baby the father has a right to know so he has the chance to stand up and take on his responsibilty as a man. If he doesn't then he loses his say so in the matter and it's NO ONE else's business what the woman does after that. That's the problem with the Pro-Life side, because THEY think life is precious they think everyone should and not everyone does. That's why some people commit suicide. They try to make a law against killing YOURSELF by saying God doesn't approve. Well God's got it made it's us mortals that have to stuggle day to day with these horrible living conditions that have to worry about the people we bring into this world and why we might choose not to. So bottom line we all need to agree to disagree because you have no idea of what someone else is going through AND it's none of your business what someone else does with what's INSIDE their body!!!! 768552@blogcritics.org Tue, 4 Nov 2008 11:43:17 EST /archives/2008/07/04/111507.php#comment-767954 Wow, almost 150 comments in such a short time. I'm touched by the amount of controversy and discussion my article has been able to bring about, I still feel that this is the most important amendment in quite a long time on the Colorado ballot. It's the day before the big election day, so I'm making my final plea to the people with a couple of points that I would've put into the original article. * Bar none, you cannot argue that if something happens with the baby where the mother dies or something similar, the baby won't be charged of anything. There is no "except for" or "unless" included in the amendment's wording. If a baby kills it's mother while being born, it'll have to serve a life sentence like any other murderer. I'd just love to live my life like that, eh? * This amendment will still clog up the law system something awful. New laws and exception attempts all based on this one amendment will pop up daily for long amounts of time, stopping actual crimes from getting reported and stuck through the system. This is the dumbest thing since illegal drugs. * Finally, even if you were considering voting yes on this amendment, please consider what America is supposed to be, and that is secular. Forcing your religious beliefs upon everyone else is not only unconstitutional, but incredibly selfish on your part. If you'd just consider that and only that... perhaps people will make the right choice. * Vote Libertarian :D 767954@blogcritics.org Mon, 3 Nov 2008 21:25:49 EST /archives/2008/07/04/111507.php#comment-767916 Another yahoo idea from some radical right wing religious nut job who feels the need to force their ideals upon the whole world. This is yet another example of these idiots not only ignoring but blatantly disregarding everything that scientists have worked hard to teach us for years. A fertilized egg is just that, a fertilized egg....not a human by any means, a developing embryo. This is stupid, utterly stupid and I am shocked that anyone with any kind of education beyond the 3rd grade would conjure up such nonsense let alone support it. Despite the fact that I am surrounded by so many retarded ones, I am actually proud to be a human...however I find the thought of me being considered the same life form as a fertilized cell hanging out in some random chicks uterus highly insulting. 767916@blogcritics.org Mon, 3 Nov 2008 20:28:40 EST /archives/2008/07/04/111507.php#comment-767908 to Susan @ #142: Just exactly how do you think there would be no "charges" against a miscarraige? Because of the findings of the investigation? Going in to "knowingly" kill the "infant" "consciencely(-- you didn't even use the correct word there,) is not what abortion is. I know you feel bad for the babies. I am sure most people who are against abortion are really fighting for what they think is right but in reality they are having a major break from reality. The fight against abortion is the fight to control the uncontrollable, at the expense of freedom and liberty. Take a history lesson (not the bible, it doesn't count) and the try some compassion and not knee-jerk handwringing. 767908@blogcritics.org Mon, 3 Nov 2008 19:57:17 EST /archives/2008/07/04/111507.php#comment-767822 And to comment #140- You are reading into this! The obscure stories of miscarrying is completely different then mudering the baby knowingly! If you consciencely go into murder the infant then the right of personhood comes into play, but if the mother miscarries from unknown causes then of course the mother isnt going to be charged with murder. The differences is nature causing the miscarriage of the hands of a doctor robbing the child of the chance to face nature and have the run of it himself. Dont be ignorant and make wild hair brain questions like that seem even plausible, BECAUSE THEY ARENT! This is pandoras box, this is a child life. 767822@blogcritics.org Mon, 3 Nov 2008 18:02:44 EST /archives/2008/07/04/111507.php#comment-767812 I would just like to say that I find your thoughts to be unjustified. How on earth is it equal rights to kill a baby yet it isnt fair if the mothers life is possibly at risk?! There is a definite death if abortion is committed, yet a possible death if the mother carries. And it is far more traumatizing to abort a baby and face all the pain and guilt of killing your own child then it is to carry the baby of incest. Please do not assume that your opinions are what's believed by people who have lived though the pain and guilt of having an abortion. 767812@blogcritics.org Mon, 3 Nov 2008 17:55:05 EST /archives/2008/07/04/111507.php#comment-765736 So, if a fertilized egg is a "person" with the same rights as you and I then if a pregnant woman get's in a car accident that is her fault, but an accident and has a miscarriage, she would be charged with Vehicular Manslaughter, even if she didn't know she was pregnant. It would be just like if she killed someone in another car. If she rides a horse while pregnant and has a miscarriage, would that be murder? If you see a pregnant woman picking up something heavy, would you charge her with endangering a child? You see the Pandora's box this could open? 765736@blogcritics.org Fri, 31 Oct 2008 10:48:18 EDT