Blogcritics Comments on Rush to Judgment Perpetuates Virginia Tech Tragedy

Comment by Dave Nalle on Rush to Judgment Perpetuates Virginia Tech Tragedy

Sat, 5 May 2007 02:56:46 EDT

until this past monday, someone in cho's mental state could legally get a gun, passing all of the background checks and such. no problem. the only reason that his mental health records didn't show up was because his COURT-ORDERED TREATMENT was as an outpatient. technically, it was voluntary. of course, the court ordered part of all that ought to have made it involuntary, but that's the way the law was written. so, the governer closed that little loophole. that's gun control. you got a problem with it? That's not what most people call gun control, that's more on the lines of loony control. But I think we can agree that keeping crazies from buying guns is a lot better than just punishing the entire society indescriminately. Dave

Comment by Anna Creech on Rush to Judgment Perpetuates Virginia Tech Tragedy

Thu, 3 May 2007 19:50:23 EDT

"Even if I *had* said campus, rarely would you ever hear anyone address a K-12 building as a "campus" either." Both high schools I attended in Ohio referred to the grounds as the campus. Most high schools are more than just a building.

Comment by Clavos on Rush to Judgment Perpetuates Virginia Tech Tragedy

Wed, 2 May 2007 20:56:46 EDT

You done? I was referring to (and you mention) the extremists who immediately started demanding total bans of guns in reaction to the VT shooting. And I was referring to the generalized American penchant for hysterical calls for more government intervention anytime something (anything) scary happens in our society. I'm done.

Comment by zingzing on Rush to Judgment Perpetuates Virginia Tech Tragedy

Wed, 2 May 2007 20:44:44 EDT

controlling guns isn't hysterical. it's rational. rational means not hysterical, in case you hadn't noticed. there are those that are calling for the banning of all guns in all circumstances. that's hysterical, not because it doesn't make some amount of sense... but because it just won't happen. not with all you fucking gun nuts around anyway. do you not advocate controlling guns? of course you do. just in a different way. you don't want known felons on the streets with guns. that's gun control. you don't want nut jobs who just haven't been put in the asylum carrying guns around either. that's gun control. until this past monday, someone in cho's mental state could legally get a gun, passing all of the background checks and such. no problem. the only reason that his mental health records didn't show up was because his COURT-ORDERED TREATMENT was as an outpatient. technically, it was voluntary. of course, the court ordered part of all that ought to have made it involuntary, but that's the way the law was written. so, the governer closed that little loophole. that's gun control. you got a problem with it? but! say cho had been court ordered to stay in a mental hospital for a while. he still could have gone to a gun show. or bought a gun from a one-on-one dealer. no background check! nutcases can get guns so easily. do you like that? what would you do about it? how about a little law or two saying that gun show purchases are subject to the same background checks as gun stores are? would that be going over some line? i wouldn't say so. how about making one-on-one deals illegal, so that there is some sort of government oversite into who can purchase a weapon? fair? there is tons of stuff that we can do to make the 2nd amendment a safer amendment. we don't have to get rid of all guns. people who can be trusted (to some small degree) with guns could still own them. they can stay the fuck away from me, but whatever. what's hysterical is fucking gun nuts screaming "you're taking away my rights, you're taking away my freedom! from my cold dead hands, grumble grumble..." you know as well as we do that that is impossible. but you also know that several layers of oversite is a damn good idea. and that background checks for gun purchases should be mandatory IN ALL CASES! and that states should be forced to make all records pertinant to purchasing a gun (mental health records, felony records, violent crime records, all fo that) available to those who run said background checks. damn it!

Comment by Clavos on Rush to Judgment Perpetuates Virginia Tech Tragedy

Wed, 2 May 2007 20:22:28 EDT

...but hysterical. But then, hysteria is as American as apple pie.

Comment by zingzing on Rush to Judgment Perpetuates Virginia Tech Tragedy

Wed, 2 May 2007 19:50:58 EDT

oh, it's pretty rational.

Comment by Dave Nalle on Rush to Judgment Perpetuates Virginia Tech Tragedy

Wed, 2 May 2007 15:52:16 EDT

you're making it seem that the "'Hate America' crowd" (as you put it) is just being hysterical Are you seriously claiming that all this renewed clamor for gun control isn't the result of irrational hysteria? Dave

Comment by Dr Dreadful on Rush to Judgment Perpetuates Virginia Tech Tragedy

Wed, 2 May 2007 14:25:35 EDT

I know what you said, John, and I'm not necessarily disagreeing with you. What I was trying to put across is that by specifically excluding non-college massacres, you're making it seem that the "'Hate America' crowd" (as you put it) is just being hysterical. Clearly there have been school massacres since 1966 - just because these were not at institutions of higher education does not invalidate such concerns. This may seem like a minor point, but I think it exhibits on your part just such a "rush to judgment" as you are condemning in your article. And I don't know about yours, but in my part of the country (central California), the buildings and grounds of K-12 schools are indeed commonly referred to as campuses.

Comment by John Bambenek on Rush to Judgment Perpetuates Virginia Tech Tragedy

Wed, 2 May 2007 14:02:57 EDT

I never said campus massacre, I said college massacre. Stop changing my words to try and show deception. Even if I *had* said campus, rarely would you ever hear anyone address a K-12 building as a "campus" either.

Comment by Dr Dreadful on Rush to Judgment Perpetuates Virginia Tech Tragedy

Wed, 2 May 2007 11:40:05 EDT

8 million years between massacres would still be bad. But that wasn't my point. I was simply concerned that John was misrepresenting the facts, making it seem as if there had been no campus massacre at all since 1966.

Comment by Dave Nalle on Rush to Judgment Perpetuates Virginia Tech Tragedy

Wed, 2 May 2007 10:47:06 EDT

Damn, you mean it's not 2017? But my point still stands. 8 years between massacres isn't so bad, now is it? Dave

Comment by Deano on Rush to Judgment Perpetuates Virginia Tech Tragedy

Wed, 2 May 2007 09:30:47 EDT

Dave I think you mean eight (8).... Columbine happened in 1999, so unless I've time-slipped and its actually 2017, you might want to correct yourself.

Comment by Dave Nalle on Rush to Judgment Perpetuates Virginia Tech Tragedy

Tue, 1 May 2007 22:07:30 EDT

Dr. D., Columbine was 18 years ago. I bet we can survive a campus massacre every 18 years when so many other parts of the world are under the threat of constant violence. We're spoiled, but we don't have to be dumbasses about it. Dave

Comment by John Bambenek on Rush to Judgment Perpetuates Virginia Tech Tragedy

Tue, 1 May 2007 22:02:13 EDT

You got me... 3 people out of 300 million went off the deep end... obviously America is the worst nation on the planet now.

Comment by Dr Dreadful on Rush to Judgment Perpetuates Virginia Tech Tragedy

Tue, 1 May 2007 20:03:03 EDT

"The Hate America crowd condemns an American society that produces violent killers (forgetting that the last college massacre was way back in 1966)." College, maybe. Campus... remember Columbine? Or is the American society that produced Harris and Klebold somehow a different American society than the one that produced Cho? Not rushing to judgment makes perfect sense, Mr B, but you weaken your argument and betray your partiality by indulging in this kind of hair-splitting.

Comment by John Bambenek on Rush to Judgment Perpetuates Virginia Tech Tragedy

Tue, 1 May 2007 15:58:02 EDT

I think there is a rush to judgment just on what mental illness diagnosis there was. As far as I know, those records are not public. But his writing is really how much different than a Tarantino flick? I have no problem, in principle, of keeping the mentally ill from owning weapons. The problem I have is practical. What's mentally ill? Sure, schitzo is obvious, but what about depression? Anorexia? Claustrophobia? And what about misdiagnoses? You get 5 shrinks in a room, you have 14 opinions, and probably 23 personalities. I'd also like to know exactly what the verdict was in his exam before I characterize what would have worked or not.

Comment by Pope Silas I on Rush to Judgment Perpetuates Virginia Tech Tragedy

Tue, 1 May 2007 15:38:29 EDT

Mr. Bambeneck, I have to admit, I agree to a point about what you present. The tragedy in Virginia is being used by Left wing nuts to take guns out of the hands of law abiding citizens. That being said, we need stricter control in the sale of guns and the types of weapons sold; NOT a ban across the board. Law abiding citizens of sound mind should be afforded the right to bear arms, period. That's a founding principle in this democracy and it's not about muskets and other ancient weapons. It is however, about sound mind. One of the most powerful lobbies in Washington is fighting hard to insure that those who suffer from mental illness are protected by privacy laws. Sorry, folks. There has to be a line drawn in the sand and perhaps the best way to do that is to have any and all gun applicants get a signature from their family physician and one other medical professional attesting to their mental state. No invasion of privacy, no drama, just plain, common sense approach is what is required. Mr. Cho was sick. He never should have been allowed to buy a gun. Let's not punish everybody for the acts of one sick man.