Incredible article. I'm not sure how happy I am with your characterization of Israel, but, what the hell, nothing else has worked. The problem is that the Arabs don't want peace...but the brilliance of supporting the anti-Semetic Mel Gibson against all the available pols is so wonderfully bizarre that I won't even make an issue of it.

I think except for the extremists, you probably captured the mood of most Americans more than you know. Think Readers Digest would reprint this, LOL.

In Decaf Veritas

There is probably no more noble person in politics today than Dick Cheney. Vice president is a thankless job, and I'm sure he wasn't expecting to be treated well. But the level of abuse heaped on the man is unbelievable.

At first it was jokes about his heart condition. Because, you know, that's funny. He might die. Then after Ashcroft stepped down, the left needed a new demon, and they chose Cheney. It's not an exaggeration to say that Cheney was demonized; he's literally been called the devil. He's been blamed for the war; he's been accused of torture and profiteering.

In 2004, Kerry and Edwards tried to tarnish his image by broadcasting his daughter's sexual preference.

Dick Cheney has endured the Vice presidency for eight years with no intention of higher office. That's like training as poop boy and turning down the chance to be jockey. He has served nobly, only once tearing into Senator Leahy (and it's difficult to blame him). He was a strong hand on 9/11. He's been loyal to his president even in disagreement.

I don't know if I'll live to see Cheney get the recognition he deserves, but he should be remembered as a man of the caliber of Clay or Marshall.

Baronius: There is probably no more noble person in politics today than Dick Cheney... I don't know if I'll live to see Cheney get the recognition he deserves, but he should be remembered as a man of the caliber of Clay or Marshall.

Wow.

Just... Wow.

Adam,

From your safe haven in America, you can lecture all you want on how we Israelis should be good steers and make peace with Arab butchers, the PLO and Hamas, and now HizbAllah. Let's hear what song you sing when you hear Arabs snickering how they are going to rape you before they kill you as you walk along the road from Ma'aleh Levona to 'Eli.

Our weakness is not that we're willing to make peace. That was what Oslo (Aslá in Hebrew - toilet) was all about. But do you want to know that? Of course not! Those genocidal Israelis want to harm the poor innocent Arabs! You buy thir lies like you buy a Mars Bar, sweet bullshit that tastes good but is worthless.

I want to see the day when our government deals with Arab terror and the way it should be dealt with. Killing off all the Arab prisoners in Israeli jails - so the bastards don't ever get the idea that we will feed them if they go to jail here; by castrating the mukhtar of the village that commits a terror act against us - that will be needed only once; no Arab will want to lose his balls; by exiling the family of the terrorist to a different village - where the different clan will feel free to rape the women and terrorize the men. That will end Arab terror here.

Finally, I want to see an Israeli government that will give your government and all the governments of the EU the middle finger they deserve and tell them to get the fuck out of our business before we use our nukes on their oil supply. That will be the day we tell the Americans to take their money, their soldiers, their fleet, and their interfering CFR, and get the hell out of here before we kill them and destroy their embassy, ambassador and embassy workers included.

The day I see such a government take power here will be the day I tear up my American passport and happily renounce my US citizenship. For such a government, I'd gladly learn how to use any weapon they gave me to use, and gladly fight any battle they send me into.

Sorry Adam, what you write about Israel disgusts me and balances out any intelligent ideas you may have expressed in the article elsewhere.

i think most sensible people in the world hope that all the militant arabs and all the arab-hating jews kill each other off.

it's only when there is no one left who is willing to kill someone for a chunk of dirt that this thing will be over.

You have an extremely deranged view of Israeli-Arab problems Adam.
The arabs tried that 'second holocaust' bullshit a long time ago and got their heads handed to them.
Sorry, pal. I'm kind of tired of arab apologists.

the israeli-arab problems themselves are extremely deranged, so an extremely deranged view is completely compatable.

these religious things... so crazy, so crazy.

LOL, if you say so, Zing. I still think it was just a bit harsh and extremely arab biased.

Good line though!

well, you have to admit that if we cut israel loose to take care of their own problems with the arabs, the arabs would probably have less of a problem with us.

i mean, shit, it's totally our (u.s. and wwII allies) fault that all this shit is going on, but fuck, they've had 60 years to find some way of co-existing, and i'm just tired of their complaints.

arab: "the jews stole our lands!"
jew: "it was ours to begin with!"
arab: "but i had a house, and a nice picket fence and a little tree..."
jew: "too bad, mine now! god says so!"
arab: "fuck you! i kill you!
jew: "god is on my side!"
arab: "allah is on mine!"
jew: "we shall compare our gods through nasty cycles of violence!"
arab: "agreed!"
jew: "hmm, i see your god compares to mine..."
arab: "i know! uncanny, isn't it?!"
jew: "yes... wait! fuck you! mine!"
arab: "mine!"
jew: "we agree again... we are so similar... and yet, fuck you!"
arab: "fuck me? fuck you!"
jew: "... we're just going around in circles here."
arab: "how do we get out of this circle?"
jew: "escalation!"
arab: "yes, escalation!"
jew: "i kill you twice!"
arab: "bring it on!"

zingzing: you almost made me laugh and cry simultaneously then! Good work.

zing,

it's only when there is no one left who is willing to kill someone for a chunk of dirt that this thing will be over.

Isn't that pretty much what all wars have been about?

It'll be a pretty frigid day you-know-where if (not when) that happens...

Re Baronius, #2;

You left out chickenhawk Cheney's draft-dodging during the Vietnam War...five deferments due to "other priorities." But he sure doesn't seem to have any problem these days sending those braver than he overseas to pay the ultimate sacrifice.

Oh, hell. Some damn fool let emmy out of the rubber room again...

jew: "we shall compare our gods through nasty cycles of violence!"

Damn, ok, I admit it, I laughed.

Ruvy in Jerusalem

Ruvy,

I am sure you know some Arabs living in Israel. Is there any "common ground" found between you on anything, and if so, what is it?

Franco, the common ground is that we want to make money, live in peace and stop paying bribes to thieves; and one other thing that you guys always like to dismiss: WE BOTH BELIEVE IN G-D, AND IN A REDEMPTION, AND THAT A DESCENDENT OF KING DAVID WILL RULE HERE!

Where's good old Jeshua bin David when you need him?

Dave

Where's good old Jeshua bin David when you need him?

Poor guy is dead and gone. Been that way for a couple of thousand years now. Don't get me wrong - we Jews are all family. But its just bad form to worship your relatives. G-d frowns on that kind of stuff.

Just have a little patience. Descendants of Khalif Daoud el Nebi are around, and when the right time comes, he'll make himself known.

We've only waited for 2,500 years... We're patient.

Ruvy:
How does public opinion in Israel break down these days?
How many still back Olmert?
How many think the Lebanon War was a good thing?
How many still want to start peace talks with Palestine?
Are there any Israelis who think Hamas is worth talking to?
How has the Lebanon War changed opinion in Israel?
What is the outlook for peace?

Not that I wanted this thread to develop into an Israeli discussion. I was hoping for people to at last vent about those two US fuckups we call the Democratic and Republican Parties.

Adam

I want to see the day when our government deals with Arab terror and the way it should be dealt with. Killing off all the Arab prisoners in Israeli jails

Ruvy you claim to be a devout Jew, and yet you neglect a commandment that came straight from God's mouth. What you propose, the murder of all Arabs in Israeli prisons, is really not that different then the genocide you suffered in the Holocaust.

As far as i am concerned, anyone who propogates violence in the name of religion is a terrorist.

You are so convinced that your religion is the one true religion, and you base that on what? A manuscript written and edited by people of your own faith? Anyone can call themselves a "chosen race," and attribute it to God. I believe the Germans did that with the Ayrian race.

Now, this isn't a religious debate, but I am gonna let you into a little insight. God's salvation and grace is open to all of his creation, which, is everybody. Not one group over another.

Baronius, I'd be happy to give Cheney the recognition he so richly deserves: first by torturing him according to his own rules, and then at the end of a rope. And he can take Junior with him.

Adam, you're SO dead on about the characterization of both parties, except you left out the utter lack of ethics, morality, or anything except the total mindless, unending greed & arrogance of all of them, starting at the top. I do wish someone or something would wipe out every single one of them, every one.

MCH, I left out a couple of things, like how hard he hit the bottle as a kid. I find that much more disturbing than the legal deferments he received. I also didn't mention his years of government service, his humble beginnings, his management of the Gulf War, or his 42-year marriage.

Nancy, I really expected to win you over.

"I left out a couple of things, like how hard he hit the bottle as a kid"

In my understanding, he still does hit the bottle. At least before hunting expeditions.

Baronius: Dick Cheney has endured the Vice presidency for eight years with no intention of higher office. That's like training as poop boy and turning down the chance to be jockey.

I could "endure" a personal fortune of $94 million, more influence on U.S. policy than the president himself, and not being the guy who takes the bullet when it all goes bad. Though I must admit, I'm at a loss as to how to run up $186,000 in electricity bills in my own home, even if someone else is paying for it. That kind of self-sacrifice is beyond my abilities.

Nancy, I've been thinking about your comment about torture. It's a perfect example of what I admire about Dick Cheney.

Many people aren't interested in distinctions. The use of duress under strict guidelines is labelled torture. The criminal activities of Abu Ghraib guards are confused with administration policy. A legitimate reading of the Geneva Accords is called a treaty violation.

Most politicians would avoid the topic of torture, or use it for grandstanding. The lowest type of politician would put himself first, play to the cameras, and remind everyone that he was held in a Vietnamese prison. Cheney dared to tackle the issue. He spoke out in favor of a defined US policy, knowing full well the political cost.

The Kennedy Library gives out "Profiles in Courage" awards to politicians who do the right thing for the country in spite of the prevailing wind. Dick Cheney deserves such an award.

JR, I don't know the $186,000 reference, so no, I don't know how to run up an electrical bill that high. Tell me, did you know how to donate $6,870,000 to charity in 2005? If the answer is no, don't worry. Al Gore couldn't figure out how either. According to the most recent data I could find online, Gore missed that mark by 99.995% with 1997 charitable donations totalling $353. I didn't adjust for inflation, so maybe it's more like 99.992%.

Well, I suppose one of my pet causes would be helping to buy land to conserve habitats; I don't think I'd have any trouble spending tens of millions of dollars in such donations. Whether I would is unproven, but I certainly know how, so I'm not worried.

I haven't seen anyone call Al Gore the most noble man in politics. I wouldn't, so I'm not sure why I should defend his donations (or lack thereof).

Personally, I don't consider torture "the right thing for the country", but if Dick Cheney really believed it was necessary despite the fact that it belies this country's values, he can go ahead and authorize it and defend his actions in court, just as the rest of us have to do when we decide the ends justify the means. THAT's taking responsibility, and if I were on his jury, I'd give him a fair hearing.

Trying to change the law so he can torture in the name of all the rest of us is pure chickenshit.

Kind of like a young, able-bodied man supporting a war which he seeks deferments from fighting himself.

The man seems to have looked out for himself rather well in this life. And he's paid the price by... being called names. What a martyr!

One good thing about Mel Gibson is that you know where he stands. Drunk and sober.

Profiles in courage is NOT what anybody sane thinks of in connection with Chickenhawk-in-chief Cheney, the coward who had "better things to do" & got 5 deferments and then got married in order to avoid the draft. He's yellow through & through. He only has courage when he's safe behind the utter security of vast wealth & the Secret Service, safe in the knowledge he & his will NEVER be in danger or have to suffer or bear the results of his own bloody policies, even in a court of law. Yeah, that's courage all right. God damn his scheming, cowardly, vicious, psychopathic soul to eternal hell where it belongs.

Zing #9 that IS pretty funny. Don't often get a laugh on such a sobering line of blog. Thanks! Baronius, you may very well win me over on other aspects, but never on the world-class villanies of Bush & Cheney, especially the latter. Bliffle, LOL - how true!

Adam,

The rocket therapy of the Hizballah changed a lot of minds. A lot more people think a lot more like me.

To summarize;

Olmert's support has been reduced to his family and the members of the Knesset who do not think they'll be re-elected - like Peretz.

A lot of people would rather not think about the Lebanon War, indicating to me that they do not think it was a good thing.

The loony left in this country are still willing to start peace talks with the butchers who run "Palestine."

Presently, the only "talking" going on with Hamas is taking place with missiles and tanks. The "Palestine" government barely exists.

Peace?

The only time there can be peace is when the pigs who control the Arabs and the thieves who run Israel have been ditched - literally. At this point, there are two avenues to peace. The one I have outlined in my articles elsewhere on this site and foreign takeover of Israel.

I'm betting on the latter.

Mike, - (comment #20)

I have no trouble killing murderers and people who have attempted murder. An awful lot of the Arabs in jail are held for that precise reason.

When we have about twenty or thirty million Arabs in our jails to be killed held there for the sole reason that they are Arabs, then if we kill them, can we accurately be compared to Nazis.

If you want to call me a terrorist, that's fine. It does tell me a lot about what you do not know about terrorism.

Finally, the debate for the fate of my country is a debate over destiny, and that debate is framed within a religious context. That is a reality that all your fancy talk can't get around.

This means that the search for a solution to the destiny of this country needs to be conducted within the context of religion, whether you or others like it or not.

Adam,

I do not mean to attempt to hijack this article.

Given the choice between cowardice and uselessness, it strikes me that you have little choice at all. It also strikes me that the pathetic choices you have are the ones you'll be stuck with...

It ain't any better here.

My elder brother Ruvy, sometimes I think we're the only people keeping this site interesting.

Adam, I LOVE YOU. That is the most rational, unsentimental, clear thing that I have read in ages!! Not to mention funny as heck!!

I thought, THERE IS HOPE. There is a brain cell left in this great land of ours. There is a person who understands irony, inuendo, rhetorical banter, humor, cause and affect, deductive reasoning. I thought who is this person and who bread him??? Did they make more like him? Where are they bread?? Then I read that you were from the RSA originally and I nearly wept. Hopes for rearing children with good reasoning skills or them finding partners with half a brain cell were dashed. Offcourse you are from South Africa..... sigh

Lekker broer!

JR:

Baronius: There is probably no more noble person in politics today than Dick Cheney... I don't know if I'll live to see Cheney get the recognition he deserves, but he should be remembered as a man of the caliber of Clay or Marshall.

JR: Wow.

Just... Wow.

I feel you so deeply. What else can be said.

Zedd:
I love you.
Check out my blog
Leave a comment, maybe we can email.
Baie lekker broer
Adam

Ruvy:
WE BOTH believe THAT A DESCENDENT OF KING DAVID WILL RULE HERE!

Whats wrong with believing that the most popular person that has EVER lived on the planet, who happens to be a descendent of King David, could have been that person?? Why couldn't Jesus have been that person.

I mean he's:
1. Jewish
2. Out of the house of David
3. The most popular person to have EVER lived.

I cant imagine a greater "king". Is it because you missed it when he came so you don't want to go along with the idea that he was IT.

I mean bigger then Jesus in todays skeptical society? You think that people will go along with anyone who says "hey guys I'm the messiah". He'd have to come as a rock star or something.

I'm just asking.

But it looks sorta like you've hit the big one already.... now can we move on now and stop holding the rest of the world hostage with your silly wars.

Ruvy wrote: "Mars Bar, sweet bullshit that tastes good but is worthless."

Does taste good bloody mate, and this is completely off topic, but are Mars Bars available in Israel and if so, I assume they are kosher. They are not quite worthless as they do give you a decent burst of energy in readily useable form. That's my excuse, anyhow. Since giving up smoking, I am going through a few Mars Bars (stopped the KrispyKremes) so if I ever get to Israel, I need to know this.

Asking about why Jesus can't be King of Israel, Zedd writes,

"I mean he's:
1. Jewish
2. Out of the house of David
3. The most popular person to have EVER lived."

You have a tiny problem with the grammar there, Zedd, and it has nothing to do with speaking or writing Afrikaans either. Jesus, like the Lubavicher Rebbe, is dead. So insteas of "he's", you need to write "he was". You need to be breathing to sit on the throne. One of them little technical points.

Please don't throw Biblical passages at me trying to prove that the guy is still aive. It sounds funny reading a Habadnik citing all your arguments to prove that the Lubavicher Rebbe, a man who had a very public funeral, is really alive. They sound just like Christians in their arguments, and it really pisses them off to be told so. But from you guys, it's just boring. I mean after five decades of listening to the stuff...

The next king of Israel is someone that you haven't met yet or read about. I may have, but I wouldn't know it. G-d keeps His Own counsel...

Stan,

We have Snickers bars, Klik bars and Élite candy bars. You can buy m&m's but they are very expensive here. You would think they were selling them to jet pilots in X-15's or something...

My personal favorites are the Snickers bars tossed in the freezer for a few hours. It would be nice if'n I could afford them, though...

If you ever do get here, be sure to give me a shout. I know at least one Aussie here, a great guy. I thnk he's a Sidneysider. He talks like an Englishman, though...