Quack's take was highly amusing, in a scary and prophetic way... Thanks for the news and amuse.

I don't know why it took the pirated copy of Revenge Of The Sith for more action to shut down these torrent sites. Plus, the FBI were more on track by locating the hardcore hackers that actually found the real copy of the movie and uploaded it. Wired! Magazine had a great article on the hackers that find the master copies of movies, cds and stuff to upload and share between each other.

Actually most of those works were created by people who did not consent to have their stuff stolen and pirated. Movies, books, articles, songs, computer games are the property of their creators who have the right to make income off them. If someone came into your room and took your computer, would that be ok? It's not ok to steal other people's stuff.

What you described was clearly widescale, organized stealing. That site wasn't innocent. I'm not sure why some of those law enforcement agencies got involved, but the FBI could have jurisdiction.

I have a relative who makes part of his living writing text books. While they should bring down the price of text books, the authors deserve to be paid.

If people lacked even the possibility of profiting from their creative works you could watch the output of music, movies, and writing that you enjoy plummet.

Mozart IS dead, but all the music of his you heard was performed by live musicians who barely can make ends meet. They deserve their payment. My cousin was a classical musician and she had to have her parents pay her health insurance until she was forty, when she gave up to do something else.

Although greedy middlemen have helped create some of these problems, there seems to be something more going on here.

I guess I don't really understand this whole entitlement thing. We are talking about Star Wars, which was released on the internet before it hit the theaters. That is wrong.

Are movie prices too high? I think so, but that doesn't give me the right to supplant the system by stealing a copy.

You can protest by not going to the theater. That is your right. Stealing a copy of the movie that is being shown there is not.

I think there is a little more wiggle room on music, where you can try it out and buy it if you like it after downloading it, because music has the replay factor, but with movies, it is hard for me to think that it is some kind of civil disobedience. It looks like stealing.

very interesting Quack, thanks - I lean toward your side but also agree that there has to be a balance and no, "we" don't deserve to have access to a film before it even hits the theaters

Seems to me that BitTorrent is designed for people who "have something terrific to publish," not for people who "have something someone else published that they want to give away illegally."

I don't think that BitTorrent sites should be shut down, though. The individuals who are violating copyright laws should be tracked down, instead.

Two More Specific Thoughts:

1a) Something I didn't mention is that Elite Torrents was located in The Netherlands. Copyright laws are different in different countries, and some don't have any at all. Theft to America isn't theft to the world. So what are American authorities doing in The Netherlands? World Police Go!

1b) BitTorent sites don't host copyrighted files. They only "allow" the downloading of copyrighted material in the same way that telephones "allow" the organization of bank robberies. BitTorrent is only a technology, and BitTorrent sites are collections of links to whatever files people want to share, exchange, upload or download. In a democracy, what the people want goes, I think. Although I'm not sure because it's been a while since I've opened up a text book on Ancient Rome, or is it the Mayans who discovered it?


Some More General Thoughts:

2a) If you want to get all philosophical and stuff, BitTorrent doesn't allow for the stealing of other people's works. What is made available are digital reproductions of these works. A whole bunch of 1s and 0s it is. If I describe a movie or book to someone in extreme detail, am I guilty of copyright infringement?

2b) Many people are against abortion or gay marriage or the hunting of animals or the availabilty of guns. But the FBI doesn't raid abortion clinics or shops that sell hunting licenses. Let alone ones that are in other countries. Guns "allow" for the murder of people! And I say it's a screwed up society that values copyright law and the health of business (because unlike doctors and gun retailers, BitTorrent sites are free) over the health and lives of people. Take away the guns, then talk about BitTorrent.

3c) As to the business aspect, most people assume that P2P decreases profits despite independent research that has shown it increases them. And yet it is the handful of studies that suggests a decrease in sales that is trumpeted. Revenge of the Sith had something like the biggest opening day ever and second biggest opening weekend! You can blame the leap in popularity of older shows like Dr. Who on P2P too. And hordes of downloaders buy what they discover through P2P. But the problem is that no group controls what's popular and what's not, if everything's available all the time. And the whole world might collapse if alternatives to the Britney Spears reality show are found and the "creativity" behind them forced to actually produce something good to good to keep people's attentions.


It's my wild idea that what's best for society should come before what's best for individuals or companies. That means if there's a medicine that everyone needs then screw the patents and give it to them. That's what the government is for. Elected by the people to serve the people. Government isn't the red right hand of the MPA[A] or RIAA or any other acronym. And frankly, I just hope the war on information will be as effective as the war on drugs.

But I'm a duck. I'm stubborn and I quack.

Quack!

>>2a) If you want to get all philosophical and stuff, BitTorrent doesn't allow for the stealing of other people's works. What is made available are digital reproductions of these works. A whole bunch of 1s and 0s it is.


And the alphabet has just 26 letters.

EVERYTHING on the internet is a digital reproduction.

The 1st CD "printed" is a digitalreproduction.

i'm heartened by the support I see in this thread for "creators' rights" in all this. Artistic labor deserves to be rewarded, if that - such as a living - is one of the goals.

>>If people lacked even the possibility of profiting from their creative works you could watch the output of music, movies, and writing that you enjoy plummet.<<

This is agross oversimplification. Since when is art neccesarily tied to capitalist functions?

We've been screwed over in recent eyars, and more importantly, struggling artits have been screwed over. A more democratic means of distribution like that of Bittorrent is far far closer to being "just" than is the current system of distribution and marketing.

So far, the entertainment industry hasn't suffered from downloading, why should this change? However, their rate of growth has dropped and this is the best thing possible.

what i find really funny is, these guys don't seem to have found a way to go after the torrent sites that charge people to get the torrents. Yeah, you read that right - i don't mean some legit operation that gives royalties to the relevant parties, i mean the rip-off merchants that don't even host the torrents themselves! they just link to other, FREE torrent database sites. The they charge people for the privilege! i guess that's why they can't be got - no direct involvement.

"if there's a medicine that everyone needs then screw the patents and give it to them. That's what the government is for."

And then you will see vastly-decreased amounts of money spent on R&D for horrific diseases...Yea! :-/

the copyrighted works that these people present us with do not deserve to be stolen, however, the music and movie industries play a dirty game. If you go to a clothing store and buy a pair of pants, get home and don't like them you can take them back and get a money back. The stealing of copyrighted material is wrong, but every person who has posted in here has bought a cd that after they listened to once got filed away forever, or seen a movie that they felt was a waste of 2 hours. In that matter i feel a satisfaction gaurantee from movie/music studios wouldn't be a bad idea.

My comments to this whole thing is simply this. I dislike commercialized america that believes that they can charge an arm and a leg for things that never even costed that much on the whole. Companies want more and more, infact too much for what they give. They give you a stone and want your first born. Unfortunately, this leaves all the musicians, writers, artists, et cetera at the mercy of the company which is an unfortunate event for them when their works get distributed freely on the internet due to the high cost of their creativeness. I believe in the lowering of cost and since not even online books are cheap (still rediculous in price and they aren't even published) sometimes eggs have to be broken in order to get a point across which is be reasonable companies, your prices are getting out of hand! I would, for all purposes, consider this a war to try and force the companies to control and lower their retail price as we should now boycott fuel companies for their inflated prices on fuel. We have reserves for 60-90 days ahead of time and 4 days after a few platforms get destroyed prices sky rocket... hmm... fishy.. perhaps they want us to pay for their loss when it should be them paying for the damned platforms without killing us.

And then you will see vastly-decreased amounts of money spent on R&D for horrific diseases...Yea! :-/

As far as this, no you wouldn't. You'd actually see less government needed spending in R&D to drug companies. The government pays companies to research diseases, without this money pharmaseutical companies would lose a good chunk of revenue. Plus, they have cures for things. I read something briefly then the information was destroyed that they had found a cure for diabetes. However, pharmaseutical companies would lose a good chunk olf revenue by releasing this information and cure as opposed to treating diabetes which brings in great revenue when the testing supplies, insulin, and glucose are rediculous. Creating a cure for a disease is bad business, lets face it we are a cash crop for big business all the way around and all they do is leave us suffering.

"And then you will see vastly-decreased amounts of money spent on R&D for horrific diseases...Yea! :-/"

Yes, I resound the last comment. If they did find a cure, why would this country, or any other, make it available when they make so much money on the care needed to take care of it? I'm diabetic, and pay out several hundred a month for the equivalent of air.

File sharing makes it possible to try before you buy. If technology caught up, then the artists would be guaranteed their money. For instance, gaming communities that are online, require you to buy the game to be able to play online. Why not do the same for music or movies?

Dudes,

I hate to mention this but two years after the publication of this article, my son downloads stuff off of Bit Torrent and Mu Torrent, though he has low regard for Bit Torrent. Morpehus, which was a killer app, has been knocked out of operation.