Blogcritics: Comments on Be honest

Comment by Steve S

Fri, 17 Dec 2004 15:20:52 EST

That's too bad because that's not how you win elections.

Comment by Eric Olsen

Fri, 17 Dec 2004 11:31:09 EST

Steve and P6, I think the drop off in political activity is just cyclical residual reaction to the election and will start to pick up after the holidays and probably be back to normal by the inauguration. But barring the unforeseen, it won't return to pre-election levels for another three years or so.

Comment by P6

Fri, 17 Dec 2004 11:17:48 EST

Oh, and to Steve S.:

Double sigh. Sorry, just been listening to my own echo in the empty chambers of the Left blogosphere for over a month now.

Do not go gently into that good night. Rage, rage against the dying of the light. (Works well with politics, too)

Comment by P6

Fri, 17 Dec 2004 09:52:55 EST

If that's the case, they're certainly going about it the wrong way. "Starve the Beast" has been a Conservative philosophy for how long? It is totally incompatible with a willingness to help. And is it coincidence that the leadership who has convinced you all of their totally moral reasoning supporting Starving the Beast tends to profit personally from the changes they suggest?

Comment by Eric Olsen

Fri, 17 Dec 2004 09:27:40 EST

no, I think the effort is to convince all of the importance of keeping transitional transitional

Comment by P6

Fri, 17 Dec 2004 09:12:06 EST

I would split my own answer: yes, "personal responsibility" does mean that your problems are yours to fix, but I, and it seems our system, certainly is willing to qualify the last part - society is willing to help out under a variety of circumstances.

Wouldn't you say there's a concerted effort to change both your and the system's mind about that qualification?

Comment by P6

Fri, 17 Dec 2004 09:08:31 EST

Oh. Talking out loud in frustration? Letting off steam?

Issuing a challenge. Forcing a direct look at it.

Comment by Eric Olsen

Fri, 17 Dec 2004 08:50:42 EST

I would split my own answer: yes, "personal responsibility" does mean that your problems are yours to fix, but I, and it seems our system, certainly is willing to qualify the last part - society is willing to help out under a variety of circumstances. The problem with this "help" is the tendency for people to become dependent upon it, the answer is to keep "transitional help" actually "transitional" rather than permanent and even intergenerational

Comment by andy marsh

Fri, 17 Dec 2004 07:24:34 EST

I go with the Eagles song "Get Over It" Steve - it's Merry Christmas! Just kidding. Happy Holidays to you too, you, liberal you! And why are the rights fears irrational and yours sane?

Comment by Steve S

Fri, 17 Dec 2004 07:14:26 EST

Oh. Talking out loud in frustration? Letting off steam? Sigh. I might be wrong, but I wouldn't be surprised if that is what you are doing. That seems to be all that's left to do anymore. I really don't even know in what context you were asking your question. People think responsibility is hard to bear. But it's not. It's a lack of responsibility that brings us down. It gives us a feeling of hopelessness and creates a weight from which we cannot escape. Double sigh. Sorry, just been listening to my own echo in the empty chambers of the Left blogosphere for over a month now. Have a good night and Happy Holidays. ---- "If we wish to free ourselves from enslavement, we must choose freedom and the responsibility this entails." - Leo F. Buscaglia

Comment by P6

Fri, 17 Dec 2004 05:28:51 EST

I wasn't expecting an answer at all.

Comment by Steve S

Fri, 17 Dec 2004 00:33:33 EST

I don't know what you mean. Ask a conservative and you might get the answer you want.

Comment by P6

Thu, 16 Dec 2004 22:37:12 EST

Hm. I stand corrected.

Comment by Steve S

Thu, 16 Dec 2004 21:31:01 EST

Not to me. But to a conservative, I'd say yes. I'm pretty liberal, moreso after this great divide that has hit our country. I've always been an advocate of personal responsibility, which seems to attract conservatives in conversation, until the conversation gets more in depth. Then when they find out I am dead serious, they realize I am nothing like them. I believe in the moral obligation to uphold social programs that help the poor, I believe people are not always personally responsible for the situations they end up in, but they do need to take some personal responsibility to get out of the situation, no matter how they got there. Life isn't fair and you can't always look to the person responsible for putting you in a bad situation to get you out, you need to take the personal responsibility to do it yourself, then take the extra effort to correct the situation so it doesn't happen again. Life isn't fair. In the last two days, I have given 10 dollars to people on the street while I was out Christmas shopping. It was money I didn't really have, but I have a personal responsibility to do what I can, in whatever small way I can, to make this world a better place for myself and my family. That goes beyond these 4 walls we call our home. I believe that means giving the poor financial help while they are getting extensive required education to show them how to get on their feet, then I believe once that can be proven, they should be on their own. However that certainly doesn't involve shutting welfare programs down. I believe in holding people personally responsible for their offspring (no deadbeat dads) and that also includes not blaming video games, tv, modern culture and whatnot for their bratty, irresponsible violent behavior. I believe in character and faith coming from within and not needing a reinforcing value system having to be promulgated from the government or society in general. I believe when you advocate having a public school system which is supposed to be diverse, teach your religious and social value system (i.e. creationism is right and homosexuality is wrong), then you are abdicating your own personal responsibility to put values into your child and you are looking to society to do it. I believe most of America has abdicated the right to think for themselves and allows the Right to do the thinking for them, then they go around parroting those irrational fears. I believe the more to the Right you go, the more you have given up on personal responsibility and the more you look to outside factors for your salvation. I believe in raising your children with enough self esteem and principles so that they will not be swayed by anorexic models and the immense peer pressure out there to look, act, and be a certain way, but have the inner strength to find their own path and to find happiness in their own path. I believe that someone who succumbs to outside peer pressure (who becomes anorexic or who joins an ex-gay group for example) was not raised with enough sense of self-worth and that is a failing of the personal responsibility of the parent. I believe racism, homophobia, anti-religious bias, sexism, prejudice against the disabled, the overweight, etc. will always exist. I believe in holding a person directly accountable for the bias and terrorism that they promote via the pulpit and via the airwaves. I support free speech but I do not believe that means someone can say ANYTHING with NO accountability. You are free to do what you want with your actions, but there can be a price for it. I believe the same principle should apply to speech. I favor capitalism over socialism, but I also adhere to the values of Jesus and when you reach the point where your income is ridiculous (60 million in stock options and benefits) when compared to your employees (1 dollar an hour kids overseas), then you have approached a despicable status and should not be admired or looked to as a successful role model, if you make millions to play a sports game then you are not a role model, and you have abdicated your personal responsibility to humanity. I believe a person is personally responsible for their own bodies (pro-choice, pro-gay, pro-legalization of marijuana, pro-right-to-die, etc.). The key here is that for me personal responsibility involves not your own body, but your responsibility to humanity too. Social responsibility is a matter of character and that is very personal indeed. Like the teachings of Jesus, true personal responsibility is a trait of the Left that has been co-opted by the Right. When they say it, yes, it means 'go f*ck off and don't bother me with your problems'.