Got this as a gift and haven't been able to get into it. I had the same reaction to DS9. Saw Firefly in Best Buy and was joking with wife that it would probably still be there the next time we returned, but to my surprise all four copies had been sold. So maybe there will be (or already is) a cult Firefly following.

I'm not sure about the western motiff. I liked Westworld, but that's about the only sci-fi/western backdrop I can think of at the moment to compare to.

What you have to realize is the story and the genre are distinct. For example, look at Elmore Leonard, he writes both westerns and crime fiction, sometimes together (Cuba Libre). Or as I linked, "Outland" and "High Noon", they are both the same film.

You should just watch the series and appreciate it for what it is. After all do you distinqush "Seven Samurai" from "The Magnificent Seven" because the original is Japanese?

I'm not sure about the western motiff. I liked Westworld, but that's about the only sci-fi/western backdrop I can think of at the moment to compare to.

Jim with all due respect I'm not sure if you understood where I was coming from.

I watched it and couldn't get into it on the first pass with a completely open mind. I wasn't trying to compare it to anything until I wrote those comments here earlier.

The first time I watched Westworld I had no frame of reference and I think that show would have made a cool TV series. I enjoyed the Planet of the Apes TV series for the very short time it was on the air.

Imagine, every week a new cast of tourists with problems with the machines in the park. Yes, logic would suggest but why would anybody go to a park which kept having malfunctions? My guess is even Disneyland is filled with malfunctions and problems every day. And they wouldn't always have malfunctions that killed people and in fact the malfunctions could have provided some interesting/humorous backstory.

I'm not sure why Firefly would ever air its episodes out of order ... that's kind of weird and probably contributed to its early demise. Take a premise that is somewhat new and different and then mix up the chronology? Yeah, that's a recipe for success.

If you listen to the commentary on "Serenity" and "The Train Job", you'll hear Joss Whedon explain why Fox sabotaged the series. It wasn't the people who created it, it was the network who did the dirty work.

Also Joss Whedon is about serials, not the same old thing every week. The series grows from episode to episode each week.

Which is why Spike got all redeemed and all that with an onion flower.

So we see the betrayal by Jayne, the romance arc between Captain Tightpants and the Space-Whore, and the ongoing obstruction of the Doormen of Doom.

But maybe I'm just a fanboy like Bobby Phett.

Ahh, so it was the network's fault? I have been disappointed with Fox execs ever since they pussied out and cancelled one of the best game shows ever created: The Chamber.

Listen to Joss Whedon and Tim Minear on the commentary on "The Trainjob" about how they had to write the script over a weekend when Fox told them they weren't airing the two-hour pilot (and then have to re-do all the exposition they had in the pilot in a single episode, plus tell a story).

The commentaries on the set are great, esepecially Joss' undergrad thesis on existentialism on "Objects In Space".

Plus, if you search for the easter egg, you get to hear and see Adam Baldwin sing "The Ballad of Jayne".

I will do that, Jim. Thanks for the suggestion.

Jim - I'm glad you encouraged me by your passionate feedback to revisit this DVD set with more keen, renewed interest. I've enjoyed all the episodes I've viewed on the second pass and I must withdraw my earlier comments where I doubted their show formula (mixing a western motiff with sci-fi). The characters and stories are solid.

Still, on a somewhat negative note, I find the character of River to be more than a bit annoying, but I like the rest of the characters especially the female mechanic. I'll have to look for Jayne and that easter egg of The Ballad of Jayne song becaue that episode was pretty humorous. I didn't know that was him singing that. Was he playing the guitar also? I still haven't gotten to the commentary tracks, but I've watched 11 of the 13 episodes and am enjoying them.

Thanks again.

Yes, River is annoying, and the problem is that because the series was truncated, the character couldn't develop over 22 eps. The commentary by Joss on "Objects In Space" talks about this. Also, she was meant to be annoying. Real teevee shows have characters you can't like.

"The Ballad of Jayne" wasn't performed by Adam Baldwin, but the easter egg on the fourth disc (go to dvdeastereggs.com for your complete easter egg hunt) is him singing the song accapella and wearing the hat from "The Message".

An interesting observation, on this western, the bad guys wear hats, Jayne wears a hat, but it is a really goofy one (a touque with a pompom).

And Kaylee became my new teevee girlfriend (I had to let C.J. Craig go), the actress, Jewel Staite, had a role on "Dead Like Me" playing a goth girl who is turned on by Reapers (them being dead and all).

22 episodes? The "complete series" only comes with 13 episodes, 3 of which are noted as "never airing". Are there 9 more episodes somewhere in the can that haven't been made available?

22 eps, no, that what it _should_ have been, that's a standard US Network season, and that is what Mutant Enemy plans for when they block out a series. Unless Fox cancels in mid-season (which they do more often than they renew quality series -- bastards).

Fox never picked up the rest of season, so there are no more eps. However, the plans for the characters will probably be in the movie.

According to recent interviews look for a darker Captain Tightpants (hmm, that didn't come out quite right). and some resolution on River.

I'm glad to see Dead Zone got picked up by USA for another season, even if it's only a half-season.

A releated show to "Firefly" and "Angel" is "Wonderfalls", which unfortuneatly will be on Fox.

While I have complaints about it being filmed in Canada with Canadian actors but being set in the States (and if you've been to Niagra Falls, you know there is a huge difference between NF NY and NF ON -- Canada is the tacky huckster side, the exception which proves the rule) the pilot is great.

Anyways, it is run by Tim Minear, and from the pilot I've seen is very wonderful and funny. Which probably means it's doomed since they've avoided a firm schedule date.

The dialogue here about "Firefly" warms the cockles of my heart! Glad to hear I'm not the only person who finds River annoying. I love her, but wouldn't want to be stuck on a little freighter with her, but that's part of the drama! Real life: people who drive us nuts (or who ARE nuts).

Anyway, it was the only reason we ever turned on the TV after X-Files finished up. Now we just turn it on to put on a movie or other recording.

Neb